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Thread: LDI OTAL-A with Surefire Rapid Transition Sights QUESTION

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    LDI OTAL-A with Surefire Rapid Transition Sights QUESTION

    Ok, so I have a Colt M4 LE6940. I am currently running a Trijicon ACOG TA31F-G (http://www.trijicon.com/na_en/produc...hp?pid=TA31F-G) as my primary optic. As for my iron sights, I installed the Surefire Dueck Defense Rapid Transition Sights (http://www.surefire.com/tactical-equ...d-rts-set.html). I couldn't use a standard pair of BUIS because I can't "co-witness" them through the 4x magnification on the ACOG. See pictures below...





    My question is if I installed a LDI OTAL-A (http://www.laserdevices.com/index.cf...OTAL_A_161.htm) on the twelve o'clock position, would it clear my Surefire RTS? I tried contact LDI, Optics Planet and TNVC via telephone and explained to them what I was planning on doing. I wasn't able to get a straight answer. They did a great job trying to help me out but fortunately no one was able to give me a definitive yes it would work or no it wouldn't work.

    I already search this forum to see if this topic was ever covered... no luck. Maybe I am the first person to run this setup? As for the people who are going to ask me why I need all this furniture on my M4... I just want the most badass M4 possible.

    Has anyone tried this setup yet? Did it work? Any help is greatly appreciated. Thanks!
    Last edited by ddnguyen9; 08-14-12 at 02:44. Reason: grammar
    "All cops have to make judgment calls they hope they won't regret. No cop ever bats a thousand." - Southland

    "The only reason you're still conscious is because I don't want to carry your body." - Jack Bauer

    "And maybe remind the few if ill of us they speak, that we are all that stand between the monsters and the weak."

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    If you're planning on mounting the OTAL to the 12 o'clock rail then where are you going to mount the pressure pad for the laser?

    Where are you going to move your existing Surefire pressure switch pad?

    Between the ACOG, the MRDS on top of the ACOG, the RTS and the factory flip up front sight you've got 3 and a half sighting systems and you want to add a laser in addition to all of that?

    If you absolutely want all of that on there then I would suggest getting a different upper with a longer rail system minus the flip up front sight and consider an ITAL.

    Or get a DBAL and run one of the Unity Tactical Fusion mounts when they come out.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Treehopr View Post
    If you're planning on mounting the OTAL to the 12 o'clock rail then where are you going to mount the pressure pad for the laser?

    Where are you going to move your existing Surefire pressure switch pad?
    I can always move the current pressure pad to the 3 o'clock or 9 o'clock location. That's not a big deal.

    Quote Originally Posted by Treehopr View Post
    Between the ACOG, the MRDS on top of the ACOG, the RTS and the factory flip up front sight you've got 3 and a half sighting systems and you want to add a laser in addition to all of that?
    Yes. Like I said I wanted to make the most badass M4. I saved up the funds and have the ability to do this. Is it overkill to have that many sighting systems... yes, but who cares?
    "All cops have to make judgment calls they hope they won't regret. No cop ever bats a thousand." - Southland

    "The only reason you're still conscious is because I don't want to carry your body." - Jack Bauer

    "And maybe remind the few if ill of us they speak, that we are all that stand between the monsters and the weak."

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    Quote Originally Posted by ddnguyen9 View Post
    Yes. Like I said I wanted to make the most badass M4.
    then you need the DBAL, not the OTAL; otherwise you'll never have the most badass M4, as the DBAL is bad-asser than the OTAL.

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    True, I totally agree with you. Unfortunately, I do not have the funds for the DBAL. Also I don't think I will ever use the IR function of the DBAL. My M4 might be overkill but I actually use all "bling-bling" I currently have on it in some way or another.

    Sigh, I guess I have to just have settle with the 2nd (?) most badass M4...
    "All cops have to make judgment calls they hope they won't regret. No cop ever bats a thousand." - Southland

    "The only reason you're still conscious is because I don't want to carry your body." - Jack Bauer

    "And maybe remind the few if ill of us they speak, that we are all that stand between the monsters and the weak."

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    All the LDI lasers have the same mounting pattern, so the Unity Tactical FUSION should work with the OTAL in addition to the DBAL.

    That said, no idea if it will work.

    As for co-witnessing through the optic... you do understand that co-witnessing enables you keep your same cheekweld regardless of the sighting system used. With your setup it might be best to just use a folding rear sight under the back of the ACOG instead of having 1 and a half BUIS setup. If you suddenly find your ACOG rendered useless due to square-range combat, you can pull it off via the LT QD mount.
    Last edited by TCBA_Joe; 08-22-12 at 20:47.

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    If you don't have a 12 o'clock FSB there's no reason to get the OTAL over the ITAL. All it does is add complexity to your lasers zero as you are adding another offset to account for. All of the offset lasers are designed specifically to get around the FSB. With no FSB, you don't need an offset laser.

    ETA:just saw you already have a flip-up FSB. And .45 degree offsets. And a top-mounted MRDS. That is not badass, that's silly. You should probably swap the MRDS for a 1.5x ACOG, and mount the MRDS on top of that so you cover all possible magnification ranges. Also get an Aimpoint T-1 in the LaRue offset mount so you can co-witness your offset BUIS with it.
    Last edited by JohnnyC; 08-14-12 at 20:17.
    I'm not cool. I just do this stuff for fun.

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    Quote Originally Posted by TCBA_Joe View Post
    As for co-witnessing through the optic... you do understand that co-witnessing enables you keep your same cheekweld regardless of the sighting system used. With your setup it might be best to just use a folding rear sight under the back of the ACOG instead of having 1 and a half BUIS setup. If you suddenly find your ACOG rendered useless due to square-range combat, you can pull it off via the LT QD mount.

    I really appreciate your advice (seriously). With my current setup (ACOG and Surefire RTS), I am able to maintain the same cheekweld. All I have to do is rotate the M4 at a 45 degree angle and the RTS lines up perfectly. I love this set up since it gives me the ability to have 1x (BUIS) and 4x magnification (ACOG) with a flick of the wrist. I prefer the flick of the wrist instead of removing the ACOG and flipping up the rear BUIS.

    As for have the 1 1/2 BUIS... the front BUIS on my Colt M4 LE 6940 is built in. Removing it wil create more problems so I left it as is.
    "All cops have to make judgment calls they hope they won't regret. No cop ever bats a thousand." - Southland

    "The only reason you're still conscious is because I don't want to carry your body." - Jack Bauer

    "And maybe remind the few if ill of us they speak, that we are all that stand between the monsters and the weak."

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnnyC View Post
    If you don't have a 12 o'clock FSB there's no reason to get the OTAL over the ITAL. All it does is add complexity to your lasers zero as you are adding another offset to account for. All of the offset lasers are designed specifically to get around the FSB. With no FSB, you don't need an offset laser.

    ETA:just saw you already have a flip-up FSB. And .45 degree offsets. And a top-mounted MRDS. That is not badass, that's silly. You should probably swap the MRDS for a 1.5x ACOG, and mount the MRDS on top of that so you cover all possible magnification ranges. Also get an Aimpoint T-1 in the LaRue offset mount so you can co-witness your offset BUIS with it.
    When I contacted LDI, TNVC and Optics Planet about the OTAL and ITAL. They explained the same idea you said (adding complexity). Then I told them about the FSB. LDI stated the lasers on the ITAL sit very close to the actual rail and probably won't clear the FSB. I would say my FSB sits about 1/2 inch above the rail.
    "All cops have to make judgment calls they hope they won't regret. No cop ever bats a thousand." - Southland

    "The only reason you're still conscious is because I don't want to carry your body." - Jack Bauer

    "And maybe remind the few if ill of us they speak, that we are all that stand between the monsters and the weak."

  10. #10
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    Joe, yes the OTAL will work with FUSION. If you have a specific setup you would like to see, let me know and I will post a render of it. It should give you a good idea if your offset BUIS will work.

    Thanks

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