Palmetto State Armory Lower Receiver as a SBR host

[22_Shooter]

I'm not married to/a fanboy of any specific brand so could someone fill me in on why the brand names are worth the extra $?

Things are worth what people are willing to pay for them.

Functionally, there's literally no difference between a PSA lower (which are made by Aero Precision) and a lower from a more commonly known company. Basically, forged lowers are forged lowers. Like I said, if it's in spec and runs, you're golden.

Some people will pay extra for a roll-mark. That's fine. To each his own. I have lowers of numerous brands. I like Mega's rollmark the best out of mine, but I realize it's functionally no different than a PSA lower. In the event that something is wrong with your PSA lower, PSA has great customer service and will take care of you, no doubt.

The only real advantage I see with a "name brand" lower is re-sale value. But since we're talking specifically about SBR'ed lowers, this is really a non-issue for the most part.

I paid over $100 for a DD lower, even in these times of sub-$100 lowers. Why? Just because those are my initials and I'd never had a DD lower before. In that case, the extra $$ was worth it to me.

Go with whatever brand you feel like, for whatever reasons. But don't kid yourself into thinking you're getting something functionally extra by going with more expensive lower.....because you're not.

[BCmJUnKie]

However, I know that BCM does it just as good as I do, probably better.
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Thanks buddy!
I think I can build a better lower than you as well

[ucrt]

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I believe there is a difference in Lowers.
For a company like BCM and Noveske to have cosmetic seconds is the result of the fact that they are actually inspecting their lowers and rejecting them. A Noveske rep told me they inspect with magnification and generally reject 25%+ of new Lowers.

Reports from people that have bought these "seconds", most have said they could not see a blemish of any kind. So, if a company is going to that extreme for just the finish and machine marks...what are their tolerances for pin-hole placement accuracy, hole diameters, etc.

A "lower is a lower" is jaga ignorant assumption, escpecially if you have no clue to the QC a maker puts his lowers through. If a company rejects 25% of their lowers, that is a significant revenue loss, which will make the "passed inspection" lowers cost more. If Noveske and BCM did not cull out "seconds" they could sell their "firsts" for less money.

If a company is blatantly calling a seemingly fine lower a "second" because of the finish, don't you think they would have pretty high standards on pin-hole placement?
MarkM posted that he has a Lower that works but the FCG pin-holes are not correct. If a company has a high criteria on the finish quality, what do you think their criteria will be for tolerances on pin-hole placement?
I guess it just boils down to how much "not perfect" are you willing to accept in your Lower.

With the thinking that all lowers do the same job, then, just go get a Carbon lower and be done with it. Hmmm...so there is a limit to how low you will stoop?

It is more than just a rollmark...

All I'm saying is I am sure PSA, Mega, etc. lowers will work and might be just fine but forever is a long time.

But maybe it's just me...

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[wahoo95]

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I believe their is a difference in Lowers.
For a company like BCM and Noveske to have cosmetic seconds is the result of the fact that they are actually inspecting their lowers and rejecting them. A Noveske rep told me they inspect with magnification and generally reject 25%+ of new Lowers.

Reports from people that have bought these "seconds", most have said they could not see a blemish of any kind. So, if a company is going to that extreme for just the finish and machine marks...what are their specs inspecting for pin-hole placement accuracy, hole diameter tolerances, etc.

A "lower is a lower" is jaga ignorant assumption, escpecially if you have no clue to the QC a maker puts his lowers through. If a company rejects 25% of their lowers, that is a significant revenue loss, which will make the "passed inspection" lowers cost more. If Noveske and BCM did not cull out "seconds" they could sell their "firsts" for less money.

If a company is blatantly calling a seemingly fine lower a "second" because of the finish, don't you think they would have pretty high standards on pin-hole placement?
MarkM posted that he has a Lower that works but the FCG pin-holes are not correct. If a company has a high criteria on the finish quality, what do you think their criteria will be for tolerances on pin-hole placement?
I guess it just boils down to how much "not perfect" are you willing to accept in your Lower.

With the thinking that all lowers do the same job, then, just go get a Carbon lower and be done with it. Hmmm...so there is a limit to how low you will stoop?

It is more than just a rollmark...

All I'm saying is PSA, Mega, etc. lowers may work and might be just fine but forever is a long time.

But maybe it's just me...

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Don't confuse fit and finish with overall quality. The vast majority of Blems are culled out for cosmetic reasons not because they are out of spec.

[22_Shooter]

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I believe there is a difference in Lowers.
For a company like BCM and Noveske to have cosmetic seconds is the result of the fact that they are actually inspecting their lowers and rejecting them. A Noveske rep told me they inspect with magnification and generally reject 25%+ of new Lowers.

Yeah, due to cosmetic blemishes, like you go on to say below. Notice, I made it very clear in my posts that functionally, there is no difference between an in-spec running forged lower from X brand or Y brand. If cosmetics are such a concern for some, then that is something they need to figure out if $$ plays a role on which they choose.

Reports from people that have bought these "seconds", most have said they could not see a blemish of any kind. So, if a company is going to that extreme for just the finish and machine marks...what are their tolerances for pin-hole placement accuracy, hole diameters, etc.

Pin-hole tolerance issues, etc, is something that would be discovered when throwing an LPK into the lower. Like I said, PSA has great CS. As long as you're smart enough to actually run some rounds with the lower before you "marry" it, then you're fine. If something's out of spec, PSA will replace it.

A "lower is a lower" is jaga ignorant assumption, escpecially if you have no clue to the QC a maker puts his lowers through. If a company rejects 25% of their lowers, that is a significant revenue loss, which will make the "passed inspection" lowers cost more. If Noveske and BCM did not cull out "seconds" they could sell their "firsts" for less money.

If a company is blatantly calling a seemingly fine lower a "second" because of the finish, don't you think they would have pretty high standards on pin-hole placement?
MarkM posted that he has a Lower that works but the FCG pin-holes are not correct. If a company has a high criteria on the finish quality, what do you think their criteria will be for tolerances on pin-hole placement?

MarkM would most likely receive a new lower if he was bothered enough, or if it was so far out of spec that it didn't run. He himself admits he should have tested it more before getting the stamp. Again, this could have been avoided by testing before "marrying". You're not guaranteed perfection by going with any brand.

I guess it just boils down to how much "not perfect" are you willing to accept in your Lower.

Nothing's perfect. Not even a Colt or BCM lower. There's always the possibility of a problem.

With the thinking that all lowers do the same job, then, just go get a Carbon lower and be done with it. Hmmm...so there is a limit to how low you will stoop?

You're comparing a carbon lower to a standard forged lower? Apples to oranges, my friend.

It is more than just a rollmark...

Functionally, no.

All I'm saying is I am sure PSA, Mega, etc. lowers will work and might be just fine but forever is a long time.

.....and a PSA or Mega lower will make it just as far into forever as a Colt or BCM. As long as you run your lower through it's paces before marrying into that forever, there's no worries.

But maybe it's just me...

Everyone's got their opinions and preferences. Nothing wrong with that.

For some reason, the forum's software is not reading anything I added to the above quote as my actual text, so it's making me enter text down here outside of the quote in order to be able to post it. That's what this small paragraph is for.

EDIT: Changed the text to white. The red was hard to read.

[Iraqgunz]

Not totally moot since the fact that once you remove and sell or otherwise take the upper out of the equation, it becomes a standard lower.

Some lowers are in fact better than others in that they are "in spec" from the beginning.

I would be concerened about the parts used to complete the lower.

Things are worth what people are willing to pay for them.

Functionally, there's literally no difference between a PSA lower (which are made by Aero Precision) and a lower from a more commonly known company. Basically, forged lowers are forged lowers. Like I said, if it's in spec and runs, you're golden.

Some people will pay extra for a roll-mark. That's fine. To each his own. I have lowers of numerous brands. I like Mega's rollmark the best out of mine, but I realize it's functionally no different than a PSA lower. In the event that something is wrong with your PSA lower, PSA has great customer service and will take care of you, no doubt.

The only real advantage I see with a "name brand" lower is re-sale value. But since we're talking specifically about SBR'ed lowers, this is really a non-issue for the most part.

I paid over $100 for a DD lower, even in these times of sub-$100 lowers. Why? Just because those are my initials and I'd never had a DD lower before. In that case, the extra $$ was worth it to me.

Go with whatever brand you feel like, for whatever reasons. But don't kid yourself into thinking you're getting something functionally extra by going with more expensive lower.....because you're not.

[munch520]

Good point IG about internal parts. That's why I get my parts kits from Grant

I haven't cared enough to look for finish issues on my PSA lower. I'll find the wife's superduper camera and get some pics in a sec. Maybe someone can point out something I'm missing as far as finish goes

[22_Shooter]

Not totally moot since the fact that once you remove and sell or otherwise take the upper out of the equation, it becomes a standard lower.

Some lowers are in fact better than others in that they are "in spec" from the beginning.

I would be concerened about the parts used to complete the lower.

You're right, re-sale value is not completely a non-issue. But talking specifically about SBR lowers, I think it's less of an issue since people wouldn't be as quick to sell an SBR lower, as they would a standard lower.

I was under the impression that once you SBR a lower, it's an NFA item forever and needs to be sold as such. Your first sentence implies otherwise? I don't have any NFA lowers, so I'm not up on that issue.

PSA lowers are as in-spec from the beginning as any other lower.

I agree, I'd be pickier about what LPK I threw into my lower, than the rollmark on the lower itself.

[Iraqgunz]

Incorrect and has been discussed and referenced numerous times here.

You're right, re-sale value is not completely a non-issue. But talking specifically about SBR lowers, I think it's less of an issue since people wouldn't be as quick to sell an SBR lower, as they would a standard lower.

I was under the impression that once you SBR a lower, it's an NFA item forever and needs to be sold as such. Your first sentence implies otherwise? I don't have any NFA lowers, so I'm not up on that issue.

PSA lowers are as in-spec from the beginning as any other lower.

I agree, I'd be pickier about what LPK I threw into my lower, than the rollmark on the lower itself.

[MrM4]

I see no reason not to use the PSA Lowers for a build, SBR or Title I. So far they seem to be in-spec, priced right and seem to be of good quality. As for resale, generally when I do a F1 I dont plan to sell the lower, many people dont want a lower that has someone elses name on it.

Today most lowers are cheap enough that is for alittle more coin one can own a new lower and add your own name to it. As for value when you choose to sell the gun off much of the time it is the other parts and condition that determine what the gun will bring when sold more often then not.

I am not a "fanboy" of any company but I see no reason to pay more for a lower based on whos name is on it. Show me the specs or a clear example of better quality that makes one lower better then next and I can see spend more for that lower. Right now PSA seems to have the right price for a good product that is up to par with most Manufactures making off the shelf guns today.

YMMV