9mm Subgun Viable for Home Defense?

[MadAngler1]

Does anyone have any data on the terminal performance and risk of overpenetration when using Federal HST or Winchester PDX rounds out of a 16”, 9 mm Colt AR? My suspicion is that the ballistics have improved compared to data 10-15 years ago.

I rather not use a NFA SBR in 5.56 NATO with a suppressor for home defense unless I had to for obvious reasons. A 9 mm or 45 ACP PCC with a 16” barrel with the right loads may be a good alternative that will get the job done.

[WillBrink]

Does anyone have any data on the terminal performance and risk of overpenetration when using Federal HST or Winchester PDX rounds out of a 16”, 9 mm Colt AR? My suspicion is that the ballistics have improved compared to data 10-15 years ago.

I rather not use a NFA SBR in 5.56 NATO with a suppressor for home defense unless I had to for obvious reasons. A 9 mm or 45 ACP PCC with a 16” barrel with the right loads may be a good alternative that will get the job done.

What are those obvious reasons? I'm not clear. Per the thread, that seems exactly the set up most recommend, which not to say a sub gun is not a viable option.

[MadAngler1]

What are those obvious reasons? I'm not clear. Per the thread, that seems exactly the set up most recommend, which not to say a sub gun is not a viable option.

I have no desire to lose a NFA item (SBR) in a police investigation, let alone have that used against you in a civil lawsuit. I guess I’m being paranoid, as ideally, a suppressed SBR is the best home defense weapon you could have (300 blk out or 5.56 NATO). Losing a $2-3k item costs less than losing your life of course.

Regardless, I would still like to see terminal performance data from a Colt AR9 in 16” with Federal HST or the like. If I get time, maybe I can try setting up my own test, but work and family prevents me from shooting much at all right now.

[1168]

Does anyone have any data on the terminal performance and risk of overpenetration when using Federal HST or Winchester PDX rounds out of a 16”, 9 mm Colt AR? My suspicion is that the ballistics have improved compared to data 10-15 years ago.

I don’t have any “data”, but consider that many 9mm JHP’s penetrate less, not more when velocity goes up. This is because they open earlier and larger. I would suggest looking at heavier varieties first, because their velocities change less with barrel length, thus keeping them closer to the manufacturer’s intended impact velocity. When I have a 9mm SBR next to my bed, I fill the mag with a 135-147gr load that tends to penetrate close to 18” from a service pistol.

[sndt1319]

Will,

I’m with Madangler. For me I would hate to lose a two stamp gun that is likely a $3,000 investment even in a “good” shoot which will help portray me as a gun nut out to kill someone in a civil suit. I’m unwilling to go a pistol brace route for the same reason. I would rock a braced Scorpion with 147’s for home defense if I thought it wouldn’t hurt me later.

[Apexodus]

The idea that a civil suit will go against you if using a scary SBR with silencer still applies for a 9mm sub gun. The average person will see any “tactical” gun as a man killer. If you are concerned about this, then you better stick to a pistol or wood stock shotgun.

9mm is fine for home defense. But my honest opinion is a good shotgun that you could easily point and shoot without worrying about the loss of fine motor skills is best for the LARGE majority. Unless you are some nerves of steel badass.

*Edit* I have a 5.56 pistol beside my bed for home defense, but I am in law enforcement and train/shoot often. If I were married and my wife had to possibly defend our home, it would be a shotgun.

[Iraqgunz]

Fine motor skills is nonsense. I have seen even so-called experience people induce a malfunction with a shotgun and that wasn't even a life or death situation. A properly built AR will still perform better in the hands of someone with a minimal amount of training than a shotgun.

The idea that a civil suit will go against you if using a scary SBR with silencer still applies for a 9mm sub gun. The average person will see any “tactical” gun as a man killer. If you are concerned about this, then you better stick to a pistol or wood stock shotgun.

9mm is fine for home defense. But my honest opinion is a good shotgun that you could easily point and shoot without worrying about the loss of fine motor skills is best for the LARGE majority. Unless you are some nerves of steel badass.

*Edit* I have a 5.56 pistol beside my bed for home defense, but I am in law enforcement and train/shoot often. If I were married and my wife had to possibly defend our home, it would be a shotgun.

[Iraqgunz]

Well I must say, that you must have the best hearing in the world, because I can't imagine neighbors being able to relay to someone where gunfire came from when it is indoors. In fact it would be pretty amazing to be honest considering that even gunfire outdoors that is relatively close would be hard to detect.

I could care less what gets confiscated and for how long, if I can wake up the next morning and breath air.

I think that the PCC with good ammo is viable for home defense. But, considering that whatever weapon you use in a self defense situation is probably going to be confiscated, I would leave the can off. Plus, I would want the noise so the neighbors hear it for those times you may be alone. It gives another source of a 911 call to get the cops moving.

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[Apexodus]

Fine motor skills is nonsense. I have seen even so-called experience people induce a malfunction with a shotgun and that wasn't even a life or death situation. A properly built AR will still perform better in the hands of someone with a minimal amount of training than a shotgun.

I’m glad you saw that one time, but it doesn’t make fine motor skills nonsense. I don’t even know what to say to that comment. If we are basing things on anecdotal evidence, I have seen LEO qualifying with shotguns and ARs for years with MANY more induced AR malfunctions.

It’s all just opinion anyway. My opinion is that a shotgun is better in the hands of the majority of people (not everyone).

And I just saw your other comment about hearing. You are giving some bad info today brother. Do you know how many times police he called to scenes due to people hearing gunshots? Some of you guys need to get out of the boxes you’ve built.

[WillBrink]

Will,

I’m with Madangler. For me I would hate to lose a two stamp gun that is likely a $3,000 investment even in a “good” shoot which will help portray me as a gun nut out to kill someone in a civil suit. I’m unwilling to go a pistol brace route for the same reason. I would rock a braced Scorpion with 147’s for home defense if I thought it wouldn’t hurt me later.

Using the best tool for the job to survive in your given situation and level of training should be the #1 priority I'd expect. Losing investment preferable to losing life. Quality sub guns are not inexpensive and cheap sub guns not worth risking your life over. With modern choices it seems the consensus is, a sub gun is not the optimal choice per se, but defiantly viable with the various caveats offered through this thread.