When did people start hating high quality Americans?

[KUSA]

I think that this liberal victim culture coupled with an epidemic level of the Dunning–Kruger effect is the cause.

[MegademiC]

I guess where I was going is if I can do my job better than he can AND I can also do HIS job better than he can, then why the hell is he my boss? Is it because he's been here longer and still isn't as talented as me? I know the answer of course is usually who you know and what you know about them, but it still annoys me.

Politics can certainly be a factor. His boss, if hes good, will see it and correct.

That said, im sure some of my reports think they can do my job, but they dont see what goes on while im “sitting at my desk all day”. They are incorrect.

Like i said, your situation could be different, based off your posts, im pretty sure you have an idea whats going on... but for most people, “ you dont know what you dont know” very much applies.

I think that this liberal victim culture coupled with an epidemic level of the Dunning–Kruger effect is the cause.

Absolutely. People need to be more self-aware. They also need to realize intelligence is useless if you dont put it to use. They also need to plan ahead, it seems no one has foresight.

[SteyrAUG]

Politics can certainly be a factor. His boss, if hes good, will see it and correct.

That said, im sure some of my reports think they can do my job, but they dont see what goes on while im “sitting at my desk all day”. They are incorrect.

Like i said, your situation could be different, based off your posts, im pretty sure you have an idea whats going on... but for most people, “ you dont know what you dont know” very much applies.

Actually "my situation" is I got fed up with it about 20 years ago and walked. I'm not especially adept at office politics and lack the critical skill of pretending to like people I actually find reprehensible. Been doing my own thing and being my own boss ever since.

At least now when I make a mistake, it's actually my fault and not somebody else with the capacity to throw me under the bus just because they can.

[ramairthree]

OK, I'm confused are you saying that these individuals are people you know who were rock solid guys when you knew them in a different career field, who are now displaying jealousy of others in their new career field?

I was in a very high quality density environment in the military.
Guys that stood out even in that environment were sought after, groomed, etc.
Say, everyone was a pilot of jet aircraft. Some were fighter pilots. And in a group when you talked about guys that were a SEAL before they were a pilot and later became a trauma surgeon, or became an astronaut you spoke of them as being a top notch, great dude.

I am retired from the military and in a field with highly educated and highly paid people.
So, to make an example like the above, let’s say everyone is a large passenger airline pilot. But when you mention someone like that, they assume those people must be assholes, or only good on paper.

I knew some people that played serious level college ball, truly 99 percentile athletes. But not the 99.99th percentile ones that went to a pro career. They never talked smack about the true pro level guys, unless it was something true. But it did not occur to them to act like those guys were not really that good.

What is the shift in society that made that switch?

[ramairthree]

Maybe you are simply a Lifer awash in a sea of normies.

Most people are lazy and not worth a shit.

My counter ultimately is why do you care?

Richard P. Feynman built the A Bomb and didnt go on about how retarded people were. Some nookie, some brew,,some tunes, and a warm place to pitch a loaf were all he needed.

I guess I care because when I was a kid if someone in your county went off to be a green beret in VN, came back, went to West Point, then became a trauma surgeon,
Or if some guy was a seal, got out, went to college and then was an aviator if the most kick ass jet,
Grown ups pointed them out as a role model.
Like astronauts on TV were a role model, etc.

Their ability, hard work, persistence, and accomplishments pointed out as role models are Part of the American Dream.

Who are these people pointing out as role models to their kids?

[Averageman]

I guess I care because when I was a kid if someone in your county went off to be a green beret in VN, came back, went to West Point, then became a trauma surgeon,
Or if some guy was a seal, got out, went to college and then was an aviator if the most kick ass jet,
Grown ups pointed them out as a role model.
Like astronauts on TV were a role model, etc.

Their ability, hard work, persistence, and accomplishments pointed out as role models are Part of the American Dream.

Who are these people pointing out as role models to their kids?

Jay z or maybe one of those Football Player's taking a knee on the sidelines?
I've known, worked with, been friends with and have been mentored by some amazing people.
Some of them are as anonymous on the street as anyone else, but they are and are my heroes.
To a Man I don't think that they would give two sh+ts about the opinion others, especially some low T skinny jeans wearing, Prius driving half a queer who's simply a jealous Harpy.

[26 Inf]

I guess I care because when I was a kid if someone in your county went off to be a green beret in VN, came back, went to West Point, then became a trauma surgeon......Their ability, hard work, persistence, and accomplishments pointed out as role models are Part of the American Dream.

Who are these people pointing out as role models to their kids?

I think the first thing I would do is define to myself what I meant by 'high quality American' to ensure that I give my kids the understanding that it is more about how a person comports themselves than it is about what they've achieved.

The folks you've listed are high achievers in dramatic (for lack of a better word) fields, and, IIRC, comport themselves as regular guys. They are, no doubt, worthy role models.

Good role models don't necessarily have to come from dramatic fields. Mr. 'J' was a retired railroader, nothing special, that got involved in a reading program at the elementary school our daughters attended. He impacted every kid there in a positive way.

The thing I've always noticed about good role models is that they generally just see themselves as regular guys and don't want a lot of exposure.

[Firefly]

I may be adrift but 26 gave some food for thought.

My greatest ______ is kind of subjective.

Honestly, some folks were never revealed to have been hardcore until they had died.

Some guys litter a room with their vanity and others put it in a box because it was just a moment in time.

Honestly, it isn't the quality that people "resent", it's the arrogance.

I know people who are good at what they do but really are assholes about it. Doesn't make them less good but again, doesn't make them less asshole either.

Time can help mature some. I have been the smartest man in more than a few rooms but I wasn't the most tactful, mostly due to youth, and it came back on me where I was able to ameliorate aspects in which I had been deficient.

I dont know if you are begrudging the lack of hero worship or the lack of hooah or what.

I get that people are horridly unappreciated and others are fawned over because they cut an album, toss a ball, or are a piece of ass but really....

None of these people be it celebs nor commandos nor whatever affect most peoples everyday lives.

Talk to some much older people. WWII was not this zone troopers boogie woogie boy from Company B affair. A lot of people didnt care about Hawaii, got sick of rationing, and going out and blasting a Kraut or a Nip wasn't glamorous. More than a few figured it was to get people used to rationing permamently.

Most people had a different outlook. They were glad it was over. They thought "That won't happen again, Thank God. Time to live!". They weren't happy for fighting or even winning but glad it was over with.

Vietnam soured a lot of people. It was just a job to career soldiers and almost like a prison sentence to conscripts.

It was mismanaged, kinda pointless in retrospect and not easy.
Not a lot of guys from that era say "Boy oh boy I wish my son gets a chance to go through this!"

I think most people are, if they are involved with their kids, want to instill good ethics than lazily point to some other person and say "oh wow look at him".

Never meet your heroes because all you end up finding is a person.

Like I never had anyone say "So and So shot fitty chinese in Korea and got a pilot license after the war", but I HAVE heard "So and So keeps his word and is a good guy"

I try not to conflate deeds with character. I learned later in life than I would have preferred that they can be two very different things

[MegademiC]

I noticed also, the detractors went straight to character critiquing. A lot of great people are assholes, but only to those who deserve it, imo. Having a spine makes you an asshole these days.

When someone cant take mentoring and constructive critisism, the mentor becomes “an asshole” in their mind. I worked for one of those guys (demanding mentor) Best boss I ever had. I’ve seen him railroad people though, and they earned every bit. Honestly, i just dont pay mind to the complaining anymore.

[ramairthree]

It’s not so much a lack of hero worship I am critiquing.

It was the sense that, when describing someone of 99.99 percentile capability, who combined that with hard work and dedication, and had accomplishments commensurate with that combination...
They viewed them with hostility.

At my old job, 5 years ago, if I said,
Hey, that Keanu actor guy was on a video and he can fight.
He can shoot also.
Someone might respond,
Yeah, I saw that. He has put a lot of time and effort into it. His fighting is on par for all that hard work, solid but nothing awesome. but his shooting, even putting in that much time and effort the majority of people won’t be that good. That guy has some serious potential, he could get better than I ever hope to be.

That response might be coming from a double tabbed guy with SFAUC and SFARTEC under their belt, and a dozen or more three gun matches.

Now, if I brought that up,
The response would be more along the lines of “ whatever, must be nice to have all that time and money. It’s not like anyone else wouldn’t be that good. What kind of Asshole wastes times and money on stuff like that with so much more important stuff in the world.”-
Completely blowing off any factors of natural talent, hard work, dedication, etc.

I find it odd and unsettling.