Need some opinions......

Hawkeye · #1 06-20-06, 21:04

My current carbine that is always with me, is my A1 carbine that I put together. Its a Bushmaster lower, Bushmaster A1 upper, Bushmaster 1/7 twist M4 profile barrel with a Phantom, Magpul MIAD, standard 6 position stock, Surefire rail and a Surefire Scout light. This gun usually rides secured in my truck, and is one of those little "insurance policy" type things, in case I am ever out somewhere and happen to need a long gun. I built this gun to be as rugged and "Murphy proof" as possible.

Its a GREAT gun. Functions great and is plenty accurate. My problem is, I have developed a stigmatism in my right eye. Sight in it is still 20/20, but it used to be 20/15 which is what my left eye is at, and the stigmatism makes it hard to focus clear on some things. In the last class I did, I ran this gun, and while I could see the front sight post, I could'nt quite focus clearly on it. This hampered both my accuracy and speed. I have become so accustomed to how fast and accurate I am with my Aimpoint on my other gun, that it was a bit annoying. I have since done some more practice with it, and just cant see a way around it. As much as I like the simplicity and ruggedness of the gun, I am just faster with an Aimpoint.
Another point here, is that I found in shooting a friends midlength, that I could see the front sight post much clearer. I alos have really come to like midlength barrels.
So, here is my thoughts/questions. I am considering doing a couple of things. One of the barrels that interests me is CMMG's 14.5" midlength barrel with a Phantom on it. This would keep me at pretty much the identical length I am now, but with the midlength gas system. My other option is either a BCM or Sabre 16" barrel. I like both. In addition to deciding on a new barrel, I need to decide on the sighting system. While I can see the front sight post on the midlength barrel better, I still dont think I can be as good with it as I am with an Aimpoint.
My thoughts are as follows:

A. Rebarrel my existing A1 upper using the CMMG 14.5/Phantom midlength barrel.

B. Rebarrel my existing A1 upper using a Sabre or BCM 16" midlength barrel.

C. Do an entire new upper using a flat top receiver with either of the 3 mentioned barrels, and Larue Fixed rear sight, thus giving me durable iron sights, and eventually adding an Aimpoint.

D. Do an entire new upper using a flat top receiver with either of the 3 mentioned barrels, and a Troy flip up rear sight, and eventually adding an Aimpoint.

One other point of consideration.... I do plan on building a dedicated GP gun using a BCM 16" midlength barrel. This will be my main go to gun. If I decide to go with either the BCM or Sabre barrel on this build, then It could do double duty as my all the time gun and GP gun.
I also have plans for at least one or two other dedicated builds, but they are top secret at the moment

.

So, I am open to thoughts and comments if anyone has any.

bigbore · #2 06-20-06, 21:11

Leave it as it is, you're being too dramatic. For what it is and could be used for, the target will be close enough that a "crisp" front sight wont matter, and if the target is far enough away that you need a crisp front sight, you shouldnt be shooting, but moving yourself in the opposite direction

my eye sight is no where near as good as yours and I also have a stigmatism. I know what you're dealing with. Do you shoot with both eyes open?

Leave it as it is and spend the money on practice ammo.

Hawkeye · #3 06-20-06, 21:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigbore

Leave it as it is, you're being too dramatic. For what it is and could be used for, the target will be close enough that a "crisp" front sight wont matter, and if the target is far enough away that you need a crisp front sight, you shouldnt be shooting, but moving yourself in the opposite direction

I know what your saying, but thats not a route I can personally go. I have to be able to make that 100 yard shot if need be, and better than I can at the moment with this setup.

Quote:

my eye sight is no where near as good as yours and I also have a stigmatism. I know what you're dealing with. Do you shoot with both eyes open?

Leave it as it is and spend the money on practice ammo.

Yes, I always shoot with both eyes open. Only time I MAY close one, is if I am taking a shot outside of 100 yards, or if I am trying to be super precise and not worrying about speed, movement, etc.
Pratice ammo isnt a concern. I usually do 3-4 classes a year and lots of private practice time in between.

bigbore · #4 06-20-06, 21:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hawkeye

I know what your saying, but thats not a route I can personally go. I have to be able to make that 100 yard shot if need be, and better than I can at the moment with this setup.

I still say leave it as it is, and buy practice ammo. YOU are changing, you have to change the way you do things. Does the front sight come into better focus when you use the smaller aperture? Did you consider a bigger front sight? Did you consider a tritium front sight post? 100yds is nothing, I'd be willing to bet you could hit a threat sized target without the post, and using just the ears.

Wulf50guy · #5 06-20-06, 22:06

Well I understand you plight Hawkeye.
I have astigmatism in both eyes and throw in near sightedness on top of that and well you get the picture.
I lean towards having the dot. Easier for me to shoot and sight with.
Maybe you might want to consider something along the lines of what I did with my last build.
It's an AR pistol (hard to get an SBR signed for here) with a 10.5" barrel.Samson midlength (instead of a car length) free float, low profile gas block and the flip front sight out there at the end. I did have a flat top where you have the A1 though,maybe not to your taste or plans but maybe it'll give you some different ideas.
here's a picture of it.

Hawkeye · #6 06-20-06, 22:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigbore

I still say leave it as it is, and buy practice ammo. YOU are changing, you have to change the way you do things. Does the front sight come into better focus when you use the smaller aperture? Did you consider a bigger front sight? Did you consider a tritium front sight post? 100yds is nothing, I'd be willing to bet you could hit a threat sized target without the post, and using just the ears.

No difference between apps. Yes, I thought about the Tritium FSP. Yes, I can shoot minute of man @ 100 yds without the front post, but not nearly as fast or accurately as I want.
Heck, I USED

to be able to make upper torso/head shots on man size targets @ 300m with my issue M16A1 & A2. I've had to accept that I just cant do that anymore. I can still hit 8" plates @ 250 yds with my Aimpoint carbine though

.

Hawkeye · #7 06-20-06, 22:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wulf50guy

Well I understand you plight Hawkeye.
I have astigmatism in both eyes and throw in near sightedness on top of that and well you get the picture.
I lean towards having the dot. Easier for me to shoot and sight with.
Maybe you might want to consider something along the lines of what I did with my last build.
It's an AR pistol (hard to get an SBR signed for here) with a 10.5" barrel.Samson midlength (instead of a car length) free float, low profile gas block and the flip front sight out there at the end. I did have a flat top where you have the A1 though,maybe not to your taste or plans but maybe it'll give you some different ideas.
here's a picture of it.

Thanks. I really dont want to go below 14.5" though. I can go SBR here, but for me, thats $200 I can better spend elsewhere, for now. Good lookin pistol though.

Wulf50guy · #8 06-20-06, 22:32

No problem, just throwing out some ideas.

Hawkeye · #9 06-20-06, 22:35

I do appreciate the thought.

BravoCompanyUSA · #10 06-20-06, 22:36

Just some thoughts . . .

You are obviously very good with your irons and have a significant comfort level with them. But from your description, it seems the farther out the FSP, the more comfortablely your eyes can focus.
How about this for an idea: (?) Flat top, with rifle length FF.
Use a fixed (LMT or LT) rear sight and a fixed (LMT) front sight mounted all with way down the rifle length FF. You would have your irons deployed full time, with the front sight even a bit farther down the barrel (might even be better for your eye condition), then with the flat top you would have the option to drop an optic on it when you wished. (Maybe the best and better of both worlds?)

Boom · #11 06-20-06, 22:42

All good ideas above but heres one. Why not build a Dissy?? Longer sight distance.

Wulf50guy · #12 06-20-06, 22:45

Got to thinking about it and actually I wasn't suggesting you go shorter than 14.5".
Just suggesting maybe a longer free float to were you could move the sights out.
Or yeah Maybe a dissy.

Hawkeye · #13 06-20-06, 23:04

I used to have a Dissy. Loved that gun, and could run it good.....But I never used the irons, just the Aimpoint on it.

I let it go though because I wanted to slim my rifles down a bit.
I had thought about a longer FF rail but I didnt want to use a flip up front. I forgot about the LMT fixed front sight. That is an idea....
Really though, I guess there isnt a good reason not to go with an Aimpoint on this gun since that is what I am the best with.

jmart · #14 06-20-06, 23:50

While everyone's offering equipment advice, I'm going to suggest a different angle. Do your eyes respond to prescription lenses? If so there are options.

This month's SWAT has an article on a company that offers bifocals with the near field insert positioned in the top of the lens so that when you line up behind the irons and are looking out through the top of your glasses, you get the benefit of the bifocal (in competition circles Bud DeCott has been offering this for years). They can also set the non-dominany eye to far vision. That may sound weird but users who use both eyes say they just naturally adjust -- dominant eye prescription set for near vision (actually set for a focus point just in front of the front sight) and the non-dominant eye set for far vision.

Just a different angle to consider.

yrac · #15 06-21-06, 08:57

If it were me, I'd opt for the flat top upper with fixed sights. (I prefer the LaRue rear BUIS, as I don't run a magnified optic and prefer my irons to be deployed at all times. Plus the LaRue, is cheaper than the Troy flip-up and is still of the highest quality. This saves money for training ammo or an Aimpoint.)

Even though my eyesight has not started to deteriorate noticably, I'd still prefer to add an Aimpoint because it greatly increases my speed and accuracy in conditions of low light. I don't think this should be underestimated in a rifle set up and carried specifically for defense rather than "range fun."

Yojimbo · #16 06-21-06, 14:51

Boy it sucks getting old, I know where you're coming from.

Of your choicies above I like option D the best. It's a personal thing but I like the option to be able to fold the sight out of the way if needed and the Troy sight is also rugged enough to leave up full time.

I would also choose the BCM 16" mid-length because of the extensive QC process they use but I wouldn't hesitate to use a Sabre barrel if the BCM was not availble. I currently have a Sabre 16" mid-length and it's a highly reliable and accurate shooter and it's on my primary go to gun.

I also like iron sights and do well with them and like you I am also much faster with my red dot optic.

One thing I've always wondered about the "truck gun" concept is why everyone want's to go iron sights with them. IMHO, since the truck gun will most likely be the one you will be using if the SHTF then it should everything on it that will give you maximum advantage in a fight. Maybe it's just me but I don't think it make sense to leave the gun you can shoot the best at home and use a mediocre weapon in it's place at a time of need.

If I were setting up a "truck gun" that would be with me all the time it would definitely have a BUIS, 1x red dot sight and weapon light. While I could make do with iron sights I would want every advantage if the SHTF especially since I will probably be already running in a degraded state due to the stress, adrenalin, anger, fear, etc...

Hawkeye · #17 06-21-06, 18:34

Yojimbo, I agree with your thoughts on the truck gun concept. The two things that made me go the route I did on the one above was it was fairly inexpensive to build, so IF by some odd chance it was taken from my truck without my permission, I wasnt out near as much $$ as my primary carbine, and also because I wanted something with as little to go wrong on it as possible with it being subjected to varying weather conditions and the associated vibrations/bouncing around that comes from being in a vehicle.
That said, I agree with your thoughts 100% on having the most effective thing you can with you as it will be the gun most likely with you in time of need. Thus my pondering and rethinking the setup to include an Aimpoint which I am definitely better with.

All good thoughts and comments from everyone so far. Thanks. I am still mulling over options....

Wulf50guy · #18 06-21-06, 18:43

Have you thought about just keeping what you have and adding the aimpoint via one of those Cantalever mounts ? I think that's the right name.
Mounts off of the carry handle and drops down so you can still use your irons if you want ?
It's an option.
I know arms makes a good one, I had it on a dissy I had.

mark5pt56 · #19 06-21-06, 18:48

Try one of the Ashley front sights-or pull off the front sight tower, use a low profile gas block, Larue 9.0 and an LMT rail mount fixed sight?

USMC03 · #20 06-21-06, 22:12

Hawkeye,

As I read your post, I would read your problem and come up with a suggestion in my mind. As I got to the next sentence you were suggesting the same thing that I was thinking.

Most people under most circumstances are faster with an electronic red dot optic than with iron sights.

The longer the sight radius, the more forgiving the sights, which equals better (or more easy) accuracy with iron sights.

1) A 16" mid-length with a non-folding BUIS like the LaRue or LMT, this gives you the option to us the gun as an iron sighted gun or you can use it with an Aimpoint. I currently have this set up as my "truck gun" (and I'm putting an extra Aimpoint that I have from a recent gun sale on it)

I would stick with a 16" mid-length barrel. Remember that a bullet traveling down a 14.5" CARBINE barrel, a 16" MID-LENGTH, and a 20" RIFLE barrel all have the same "dwell time". Dwell time is important in a gas operated gun. Shortening the dwell time *could* effect the reliability under adverse conditions.

If you can see the irons fine with the longer sight radius of the Mid-Lenght and don't want to go with an Aimpoint, you could leave the gun as is without an Aimpoint

2) Get a flat top upper / LaRue BUIS / Aimpoint for your current set up

3) Get a lightweight flat top dissipator upper with a LaRue BUIS. Aimpoint optional depending on how well you can see the sights.

I know you have a wide base of experience with several different configurations, and now it's time for you to sit down and access your situation and figure what works out best for YOU.

Take care and stay safe Brother

Jeff