Anybody have a Webley?

Entropy · #1 09-30-10, 14:08

Lately I've been intrigued by the .455 Webley revolver. Particularly, the shorter barreled MK1-MK4 models. Does anyone have any experience with them? Thoughts? Tips? I'm wanting a collectors pistol that I can still take out to the range on occasion and fire a few rounds through it. Perhaps the later MK6 models are more durable?

There is a MK3 that I've found that is in fair condition for about $1000.

Inuvik · #2 09-30-10, 15:15

A friend of mine has one, althought it has been quite a while since I have shot it. As i recall, we used .45 ACP in half-moon clips, rather than the original british rounds. I think this is an acceptable practice, although inspection of some of the cast bullets (post firing) revealed that they were not exiting the barrel completely square as evidenced by the rifleing imprints.

It was fun to shoot, but not nearly as heavily built as a modern S&W or Ruger revolver. I wish I remember what model it is, but I think it was WWI vintage. I know he did not pay anywhere near $1K for it.

tiger seven · #3 09-30-10, 16:49

I have a brace of Mk VI's. Just the thing for a boarding party!

They are fun to shoot and very robustly made. Ammo is hard to find (only Fiocchi and Hornady make it as far as I know) and expensive when you do find it; and while brass is available for reloading, bullets are extremely difficult to find in my experience. Bullets for .45 ACP are undersized and .45 Colt bullets are too long.

I believe the latch on the MkVI is much sturdier and constituted the major improvement over earlier models, but I'm not certain. The MkVI is certainly the least expensive of them all, though I share your fondness for the shorter, earlier ones. I love the MkV with the bird's head grip, but could never find one in decent shape I can afford.

My only tip is to find one that hasn't had the cylinder ground down to allow for the use of .45 ACP in moonclips. Yes, it makes it more affordable to shoot, and a great many Webleys were modified this way, but it largely robs it of the classic collector feel you're looking for.

Derek

Entropy · #4 09-30-10, 17:02

Thanks for the input. Unfortunately, the MK3 that I was looking at was sold under my nose. However, I'm going to keep my eyes open for another one.

TOrrock · #5 09-30-10, 17:26

The Mk. VI was the pinnacle of Webley service revolvers.....

I'd highly suggest staying away from any that were converted to .45 ACP, it's a safety issue.

.455 Eley is a much lower pressure round than .45 ACP, and while lots of people have been shooting .45 ACP in their Webleys, lots of people have also blown them up. .45 ACP is basically above proof load for .455 Eley and the Webleys weren't designed to handle that pressure.

I'm a sucker for old iron myself. I'd love to have a Mk. I or a Mk. III Boer War issue.

Here's a link for a better explanation and warning than I could give on the dangers of using .45 ACP in a revolver designed for .455 Eley.

Caution Against Shooting .45 ACP in .455 Eley designs!

The guys on that forum have forgotten more than any of us would ever know about British military firearms....

Now, on the cool side of Webleys.....the British actually designed a speed loader for the Mk. VI and earlier Mk's during WWI....

Webley Speed Loading Device Video

Entropy · #6 09-30-10, 17:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Templar

The Mk. VI was the pinnacle of Webley service revolvers.....

I'd highly suggest staying away from any that were converted to .45 ACP, it's a safety issue.

.455 Eley is a much lower pressure round than .45 ACP, and while lots of people have been shooting .45 ACP in their Webleys, lots of people have also blown them up. .45 ACP is basically above proof load for .455 Eley and the Webleys weren't designed to handle that pressure.

I'm a sucker for old iron myself. I'd love to have a Mk. I or a Mk. III Boer War issue.

Here's a link for a better explanation and warning than I could give on the dangers of using .45 ACP in a revolver designed for .455 Eley.

Caution Against Shooting .45 ACP in .455 Eley designs!

The guys on that forum have forgotten more than any of us would ever know about British military firearms....

Now, on the cool side of Webleys.....the British actually designed a speed loader for the Mk. VI and earlier Mk's during WWI....

Webley Speed Loading Device Video

Thanks. I would never use anything other than .455 Eley in a Webley. I would be getting one not only as an occasional shooter, but a collector's piece. I agree that it seems that the MK6 is the pinnacle of British revolver technology, but the MK1-MK4 just have the uniquness about them. We'll see what I decide to do. There appears to be a lot more MK6 pistols on the market than the earlier models, so supply is better.

TOrrock · #7 09-30-10, 17:52

I'd actually really like to get an earlier Victorian era British revolver like a Tranter, Adams, or Webley Pryse......

.450 Boxer or .476 Enfield.....Fiocchi actually does make .450 Boxer ammo and you can use it in revolvers chambered in .476 Enfield.

Pryse revolver in .450 Boxer for sale

tiger seven · #8 09-30-10, 18:33

You can get repro bayonets to fit the MkVI too! The fool in me wants one but I know I'll never spend $150 to indulge him.

https://www.atlantacutlery.com/p-156...roduction.aspx

There was a dealer who used to be at all the big gun shows around here in the '90s that had a Webley-Fosbery. Wanted $5K for it but it was in fantastic condition and a true rarity.

Derek

TOrrock · #9 09-30-10, 21:00

Anyone see the Cohen brothers' movie "Miller's Crossing"?

The Dane uses one to great effect.......

larryp · #10 09-30-10, 21:02

I own a MK II Webley that I bought a few years ago for $300.00. It's in excellant mechancial condition. The cylinder has been ground for .45acp. I handload .45 auto-rim cases with 1 cc ( Lee powder scoop) of pyrodex and a Hornady .454 cowboy bullet for the 45 Colt. This bullet is soft with a concave base that upsets and expands into the rifling making for an accurate, soft shooting load that's easy on the gun. I can shoot 4" groups at 25 yards with this load plus it gives that satisfying 19th century puff of smoke. My friends love shooting this pistol.

Entropy · #11 09-30-10, 21:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by larryp

I own a MK II Webley that I bought a few years ago for $300.00. It's in excellant mechancial condition. The cylinder has been ground for .45acp. I handload .45 auto-rim cases with 1 cc ( Lee powder scoop) of pyrodex and a Hornady .454 cowboy bullet for the 45 Colt. This bullet is soft with a concave base that upsets and expands into the rifling making for an accurate, soft shooting load that's easy on the gun. I can shoot 4" groups at 25 yards with this load plus it gives that satisfying 19th century puff of smoke. My friends love shooting this pistol.

Beautiful pistol. There's just something about those earlier short barreled models.

Entropy · #12 09-30-10, 21:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by Templar

I'd actually really like to get an earlier Victorian era British revolver like a Tranter, Adams, or Webley Pryse......

.450 Boxer or .476 Enfield.....Fiocchi actually does make .450 Boxer ammo and you can use it in revolvers chambered in .476 Enfield.

Pryse revolver in .450 Boxer for sale

Very nice. Quite a bit more pricey than the Webleys though.

CAVDOC · #13 10-02-10, 22:21

I have a webley -preyse I brought back from Afghanistan in 2008 pretty rough but would like to try and get it into better shape- anyone here know of a parts source

TOrrock · #14 10-03-10, 00:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by CAVDOC

I have a webley -preyse I brought back from Afghanistan in 2008 pretty rough but would like to try and get it into better shape- anyone here know of a parts source

You might get some hits on this forum, it's dedicated to British Militaria, I believe the admin is Canadian.

British Militaria Forum

Lots of good info.

Magic_Salad0892 · #15 10-04-10, 04:33

The Webley's are honestly my favorite revolver designs.

And the .455 is an awesome round. Anybody know anything about the .577 variants?

I'd love to find one under $1200.

TOrrock · #16 10-04-10, 09:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Magic_Salad0892

The Webley's are honestly my favorite revolver designs.

And the .455 is an awesome round. Anybody know anything about the .577 variants?

I'd love to find one under $1200.

I saw a Pryse patent top break in .577 at the Chantilly Gun Show yesterday.....showed a fair amount of wear, I didn't handle it though.

He had some rounds next to it in the case....quite impressive looking.

Nickle, about 60% finish left on it, and he had something like $1500.00 on it.

Magic_Salad0892 · #17 10-05-10, 07:28

^^

That's awesome!

I wouldn't buy it not being an honest Webley, but it's still really cool.

In another life, I'd be a revolver guy. If somebody produced reputable modern day revolvers in the old Webley calibers. I'd buy one.

A S&W full size in .577 would be tits. A Webley Mk. VI in .455 or .577 made by them would be ideal.

TOrrock · #18 10-05-10, 07:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Magic_Salad0892

^^

That's awesome!

I wouldn't buy it not being an honest Webley, but it's still really cool.

In another life, I'd be a revolver guy. If somebody produced reputable modern day revolvers in the old Webley calibers. I'd buy one.

A S&W full size in .577 would be tits. A Webley Mk. VI in .455 or .577 made by them would be ideal.

The thing is, the 19th Century was a very confusing time for manufacturers of the Pryse, Adams, Tranter, and Webley revolvers.....you had the companies farming out the work, but sold under the actual name....there were a lot of Pryse revolvers made by other shops than Webley that were just as good if not better made than Webley, they just didn't say Webley.....

Lots of authorized copies as well. And, lots of unauthorized copies made in Belgium and Spain.

Magic_Salad0892 · #19 10-06-10, 07:05

Were the others still made in Great Britain? Same factories?

Wealth of knowledge you are... thanks.

TOrrock · #20 10-06-10, 07:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Magic_Salad0892

Were the others still made in Great Britain? Same factories?

Wealth of knowledge you are... thanks.

Yes, Adams, Tranter, Webley would outsource manufacture of components or entire revolvers to authorized shops.

The big difference between US manufacturing of revolvers during the same time period is that over here, you had Colt, S&W, and Remington all following Sam Colt's pattern of heavy assembly line automation, whereas in Britain, the firearms manufacturers were keeping with a slower pace of more individual hand manufacture.

There were lots of these Brit revolvers made in Belgium. Some were authorized copies, some weren't. You'll see Belgian proof marks all over the place on those.

British officers weren't "issued" their handguns or sabers, they were expected to provide their own. There was not "one" standard service handgun throughout the Victorian period. As long as it fired a British Service round, it was OK, although even that wasn't as important if the officer could provide ammunition on his own. Wilkerson used to provide matched sword and revolver kits for sale to officers.

That settled down during the Edwardian period (Boer War) when the top break Webleys were pretty much standard.

A young Lt. Winston Churchill carried a Mauser C96 Broomhandle that he purchased from Mauser's agent in London to carry in Sudan with the 21st Lancers against Haji, and Kynoch loaded soft point .30 Mauser for him.

**Edited to ad.....The British government absolutely bought revolvers for issue to troops and some officers, the Adams Mk. II and Adams Mk. III, along with the Tranter M1878 were classic Zulu War issue, but by and large, in the 19th Century, Officers were gentleman from the upper classes who were expected to provide their own kit and uniforms. That means that there are a large number of revolvers from this period that were used to defend and expand the Empire that weren't "officially" issued.