Roggio Arsenal Nightmare

broseidon615 · #1 04-30-11, 20:10

BLUF: Think TWICE about Roggio Arsenal's AR15s before purchase.

After weeks of attempting to guide my friend in the right direction for his first AR purchase (I told him to get a BCM mid length with a Spikes lower), he decided to trade in his two shotguns for an AR near his dad's location. First glance at the Roggio it seemed decent but some immediate "WTFs?" came up. The biggest immediate thing noticeable was that the castlenut did not have any stake indents for the endplate to be securely staked....ok...no biggie, get a new endplate, or put some locktite on it and drive on. However, the biggest issue was my friend could NOT zero his rifle, and the rifle was shooting way to the right. Even with the windage knob moved all the way, he still could not zero his rifle. I figured maybe the detachable carrying handle was whack, so I tried to put my ARMS 40L-SP sight on to his rifle. to my surprise it would not even fit. The ARMS sight requires you to slide it on the rail, but the cut on the flat top receiver was too thick and could not clear the sight. later on, using a digital caliper, we were able to see that the cut on the flat top receiver was inconsistent and not made to spec. My theory is that it allowed the rear sight to be canted and causing zero issues. A HUGE FUBAR that fell through Roggio's Quality Check.

Castlenut issues...my BCM on the right

In addition to those issues, the Roggio lower had a hard time with fit with Pmags (gen 1 and 2), and Lancer Mags. fed USGI fine. Although some might consider this a "who cares?", it is a bit of an issue when you can't properly use all the mags readily available out there.

However, when I did open up the roggio, I was a bit impressed to see that the bolt carrier group was a M16 carrier, and the bolt was MPI inspected. and the barrel was a 1/7 twist. not bad, but that still can not make up for the other issues

Fortunately my friend got his money and shotgun back. It seems he learned the "buy once, cry once" lesson now, and says he's going to get a BCM instead.

SWATcop556 · #2 04-30-11, 20:16

I'll hold back my shock.

ohiorifleman · #3 04-30-11, 21:59

Unless I am totally mistaken the only thing Roggio on that rifle would be the lower.- I only ever heard of them making stripped lowers and they had some huge QC issues including undersized magwells and mis-aligned receiver ext. threads which I believe caused them to go under. My guess is that whole rifle is a assemblage of the cheapest parts someone could find lucky he walked away from it.....

broseidon615 · #4 04-30-11, 22:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by ohiorifleman

Unless I am totally mistaken the only thing Roggio on that rifle would be the lower.- I only ever heard of them making stripped lowers and they had some huge QC issues including undersized magwells and mis-aligned receiver ext. threads which I believe caused them to go under. My guess is that whole rifle is a assemblage of the cheapest parts someone could find lucky he walked away from it.....

http://www.roggioarsenalusa.com/index_files/Page537.htm
Roggio does make complete firearms, and complete uppers

broseidon615 · #5 05-01-11, 20:49

To make matters worse, the gunstore owner was a complete dumbf*ck.

he preceded to tell me that there aren't any standards for picatiny rails. Thinks Colt is a stupid company, tried to push a bushmaster as top of the line AR....then said that no one uses iron sights on ARs anyways....

, and didn't even want to acknowledge there was an issue with the rifle.... when I emailed him the post above, he simply said that "he's a working man, he has no time for emails"

Overall, the guy was a scmuck, and really just tried to rip my friend off.

The_War_Wagon · #6 05-01-11, 21:13

Didn't they go out of business already?

Spiffums · #7 05-01-11, 21:27

Well this is a new maker on me. I hadn't heard of them before. Probably a good sign right there.

Suwannee Tim · #8 05-01-11, 21:50

I go to Roggio's web site and follow the Map To Location link to Google and look at 822 Shannon Drive, a small low building. Roggio's interior photo shows a large building with at least a twenty foot ceiling and seemingly enough machine tools to turn out hundreds of ARs a day. Yet nobody has ever heard of them. Very strange.

eternal24k · #9 05-02-11, 08:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by The_War_Wagon

Didn't they go out of business already?

thats what I thought.
Also remember some of their lowers having the finish come right off with brake cleaner

Lumpy196 · #10 05-02-11, 10:21

What THE hell is a Roggio Arsenal??

KAC Lover · #11 05-02-11, 10:41

I thought this thread was about an Italian guy with an AK. Sticking with BCM/LMT/Other known quantities is the way to go.

markm · #12 05-02-11, 11:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lumpy196

What THE hell is a Roggio Arsenal??

And NEVER trust someone who has a name ending in "I" or "O".

Ironically the OP's AVATAR could have saved him from a lot of ass ache.

broseidon615 · #13 05-02-11, 11:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by markm

And NEVER trust someone who has a name ending in "I" or "O".

Ironically the OP's AVATAR could have saved him from a lot of ass ache.

I guess you didn't read the OP....this was not my rifle

markm · #14 05-02-11, 11:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by broseidon615

I guess you didn't read the OP....this was not my rifle

Sorry... I missed that!

I just jumped into the pics/descriptions!

broseidon615 · #15 05-02-11, 11:34

Regardless if Roggio is in business or not, there rifles are roaming around somewhere. for my friend, he found it at some scrub gun shop in bumf*ck nowhere..The gun owner also said he has 50 of them in the back...and that he ordered them from Roggio not too long ago....So the point of this thread was, if for some reason a Roggio comes across someone that has what seems like an excellent price, to save their money and walk out the door.

markm · #16 05-02-11, 11:39

No doubt. There's a lot of pitfalls in the AR realm for a guy who buys without researching first. And a lot of guys (like this one) don't listen anyway.

Beat Trash · #17 05-02-11, 11:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by broseidon615

To make matters worse, the gunstore owner was a complete dumbf*ck.

he preceded to tell me that there aren't any standards for picatiny rails. Thinks Colt is a stupid company, tried to push a bushmaster as top of the line AR....then said that no one uses iron sights on ARs anyways....

, and didn't even want to acknowledge there was an issue with the rifle.... when I emailed him the post above, he simply said that "he's a working man, he has no time for emails"

Overall, the guy was a scmuck, and really just tried to rip my friend off.

Whenever I'm in a gun shop that I've never been to before, I will ask questions about what I'm looking at to get a feel of the response. I have no issue if the answer is, "I'm not sure, or I don't have any personal experience with that product." If the sales person uses slander, or starts to bash a product in order to sell me what he currently has in stock, then I turn and walk out the door. Quickly.

My favorite gun shop is owned by two guys who are low pressure salesmen. They try to sell new customers what the customer wants. I the customer asks for advice, they give it. But only after asking some basic questions as to experience, and intended usage. It's rare they have a dissatisfied customer.

They've created a good business over the years due to a loyal customer base.

Your friend got screwed by the same type of individual who 100 yrs ago would be selling snake oil to little old ladies. Unfortunately, too many first time buyers go to gun shops like this.

Suwannee Tim · #18 05-02-11, 16:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by markm

And NEVER trust someone who has a name ending in "I" or "O".....

I didn't say it 'yall!

Quote:

Originally Posted by KAC Lover

.....Sticking with BCM/LMT/Other known quantities is the way to go.

Now how's Guido supposed to learn the machine work trade is no one buys his stuff?

KAC Lover · #19 05-02-11, 16:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Suwannee Tim

I didn't say it 'yall!

Now how's Guido supposed to learn the machine work trade is no one buys his stuff?

Needs more hair gel and a roid rage then we'll be getting somewhere.

bo-hoss · #20 05-02-11, 18:17

Roggio did no machining in house. They used a machine shop in NC who had 0 experience with arms manufacturing. Most of the lowers we ran across here at work were out of spec. It appears little to no QC was performed on the parts prior to release.