ALG Defense's new ALG Combat Trigger (ACT)...

TRIDENT82 · #1 01-19-12, 19:50

Hi guys, I wanted to share a brand new trigger option that I'm trying out. It's from ALG Defense which is a new company started by Amy Geissele, and they will be distributing defense products to local LEO and the U.S. Gov't. With the help of Bill Geissele, they have developed two new triggers one of which is featured in this thread...the ALG Combat Trigger (ACT). Both of these new triggers are enhanced mil-spec triggers. ALG Defense purchases semi finished castings from the same Tier 1 supplier that makes Colt’s triggers, and then they apply the now famous Geissele magic on the sears and include the much higher quality Geissele pins and springs.

The ACT trigger features:

Advantages for the shooter include....

• The ALG Defense ACT trigger pull is smoother and sharper than a stock trigger. This is accomplished by
polishing the sear surfaces smooth and HardLubing the trigger components.

• Sear geometry has not been changed from the standard profile so the high reliability that the stock trigger is known for is unchanged.

• Trigger and hammer are made from true 8620 alloy steel military specification castings, correctly carburized, quenched and tempered for high surface hardness.

• Disconnector is 1070 High Carbon steel properly Austempered into the spring range of hardness.

• Springs are corrosion resistant and meet military specifications.

• A full force hammer spring is used for positive ignition of all type of ammunition.

• Trigger and hammer pins are improved over stock mild steel by using 4140 Chrome-Moly steel that has been quenched and tempered. Pins are centerless ground to a fine finish and a diameter 0.001” larger than stock to reduce play in the trigger assembly while retaining a slip fit into the weapon lower receiver. Both pins are Nickel-Teflon coated.

• Pull weight is above the U.S. Military minimum pull weight of 5.5lbs but does not reach near the upper limit of 9.5lbs. Generally the pull is around 6lbs.

Advantages for the Armorer include....

• The ALG Defense ACT trigger is an enhanced standard trigger so maintenance and installation procedures
are unchanged.

• Trigger assembly parts may be interchanged between triggers, there are no matched sets.

• As a trigger meeting the essential U.S. Military trigger specifications for the M4 Carbine, the ALG Defense
ACT can be substituted for lower performing stock triggers while still staying in compliance with Unit or Departmental requirements.

Notes about Hardlubing....

HardLubing is ALG's term for electroless Nickel plating with an integral modifier to the base nickel plate. Either Boron or Teflon is used to enhance surface hardness, wear resistance and corrosion resistance and also create favorable tribological properties of the trigger components.

Testing has shown that differential coating of the trigger parts contributes to the sharpness of the ACT's single stage pull. The trigger component is plated with Nickel-Boron which has a high surface hardness combined with excellent wear resistance. The color is a pleasing matte light grey that may be painted on non-functional
surfaces if the shooter so desires (such as the trigger bow that is visible outside the lower receiver). The hammer, disconnector and trigger/hammer pins are plated with Nickel-Teflon which combines a low coefficient of friction with good wear resistance. The Teflon impregnation colors the metal a mottled, greyish/green. Parts coated with Nickel-Teflon cannot be painted. Both coatings are highly corrosion resistant eliminating the oil seal of traditional phosphated firearm components.

The retail price for these will be $65

I just installed it this afternoon, so my personal thoughts are brief. I'm already certainly impressed with this trigger considering what it is by nature, and the price point it's set at.

Super simple installation with great directions.

It has easily the nicest pull I've ever felt on a mil spec g.i. type single stage trigger. The pull has an ever so small amount of creep, and then breaks extremely clean. Nice, and loud audible reset as well.

Some really nice touches on this trigger are for sure the hardlubing on the parts, the typical Geissele trigger pins, and lastly but not least the included slave pin that makes the installation process so much easier.

This trigger will be a huge seller!

Inkslinger · #2 01-19-12, 19:59

Sorry Trident, you were beat to the punch.

Jsop · #3 01-19-12, 20:08

He's the first one to do more than just announce it.

Did i miss when these are being released?

Inkslinger · #4 01-19-12, 20:12

On the upside, your title is a little more cut and dry. The other one is about "more choices..." or something. Sounds good though. For the price I may have to try one.

TRIDENT82 · #5 01-19-12, 22:13

Jsop, I will see about finding out when these will be available, and which vendors will be carrying them.

It's also important to clarify what this trigger is most appropriate for. The following is a quote from Bill Geissele that best summarizes that ...."The ACT is not a match trigger. It is a "less bad" mil spec trigger....It's for guys who don't want to spend the scratch on uber triggers. Or for police who are not allowed to put other triggers in."

Here is a quick video showing the ACT trigger's pull/reset up close....

ALG Defense ACT trigger pull...

CGFS · #6 01-19-12, 22:18

I'm thinking this will be good option for those who want a decent trigger but can't swing the price tag on a one of the $100+ options. Or folks who want a decent trigger in some of their backup ARs.

ForTehNguyen · #7 01-19-12, 22:31

good for people in departments that dont allow match triggers. I am interested in this too since its just a tuned milspec trigger. I wasnt really interested in the 2 stage stuff they had. I wanted plain jane single stage

Jsop · #8 01-19-12, 22:31

Thanks Trident keep us posted.

Quote:

Originally Posted by CGFS

I'm thinking this will be good option for those who want a decent trigger but can't swing the price tag on a one of the $100+ options. Or folks who want a decent trigger in some of their backup ARs.

Ill probably get one just becasue I don't want a match trigger, Im very used to standard triggers. I wouldn't mind having a nice clean one though.

TRIDENT82 · #9 01-19-12, 22:33

Exactly, so many folks own numerous ARs these days that it's not feasibly to buy a SD-C/E, or SSA/E for every one of them.

I honestly never envisioned trying or shooting with another mil spec single stage trigger again after I removed a couple of absolutely horrendous colt triggers that came in my 6520s.

You can be assured that in terms of staying within the parameters of the mil-spec single stage trigger design, the ACT has incorporated everything possible to refine it and make the pull as clean and smooth as possible. Most importantly for myself, this ACT trigger is actually predictable....not the case in the vast majority of mil spec single triggers I've tried that come stock in BCMs, Colts, DDs, LMTs, Noveskes, etc.

newyork · #10 01-19-12, 22:41

Rich wants...

m1a_scoutguy · #11 01-20-12, 00:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Inkslinger

On the upside, your title is a little more cut and dry. The other one is about "more choices..." or something. Sounds good though. For the price I may have to try one.

Yea,,thats my fault,,

It was late and I came across the link on another Forum,(Not TOS) and tossed it up,,I should of mentioned Geissele in the title !! I guess I was so excited and amazed that I beat Trident to the punch on these I was beside myself,,LOL !!! Bottom line though I'm sure Trident knew about them and was waiting to gather ALL the info and Spec's instead of just throwing it out there like me !!!!

Anyways,,THANKS for the Full scoop on these buddy,,keep us posted on these as I'm sure you will !!!!

markm · #12 01-20-12, 08:26

This looks very promissing!!

Duffy · #13 01-20-12, 08:41

I know we'll be carrying them and bundling them with our selectors

UDT · #14 01-20-12, 11:10

TRIDENT82, how does this feel as compared to a stock KAC SR-15
trigger?
TIA.

OldGreg · #15 01-20-12, 11:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by UDT

TRIDENT82, how does this feel as compared to a stock KAC SR-15
trigger?
TIA.

Good question, i'd also like to know the answer.

TRIDENT82 · #16 01-20-12, 12:45

UDT, OldGreg....I'll try to compare the two the best I can, however its important for me to note that I'm a very strong advocate for 2 stage trigger designs vs. single stage trigger designs, and these triggers are really totally different designs.

The KAC 2stage trigger's second stage wall (closest thing comparable to a single stage pull like the ACT), and then the actual break of the trigger is very clean, and relatively crisp...however not nearly on the level of the SD-E or SSA-E triggers, it's almost the same as the SSA and S2S trigger's break. It's first stage is about 3lbs, and then the second stage is about 1.5lbs. In terms of comparing how crisp, smooth, and clean the trigger pulls are between the ACT and KAC triggers...no questions asked, the KAC trigger feels significantly better. That said, it better considering it's a $300+ trigger, and has the benefit of abandoning the mil spec single stage trigger design which is so limiting in terms of refinement.

Now, if were comparing long term durability/reliability....no questions asked, the ACT trigger will far exceed the life of the KAC 2stage trigger that has been known to go tits up in rifles used in combat. The ACT trigger also has a non adjust design, whereas the KAC does have an adjust design.

A month or two ago, both the ACT and QMS triggers underwent 50,000 dry fires. Both units still felt good after testing was concluded. Both had a hammer spring break at about 30K.

I'd bet heavily that the KAC 2stage match trigger would fail well short of those totals above.

Jsop....I was told these triggers will be available in about 3 weeks from ADCO

SomeOtherGuy · #17 01-20-12, 13:19

As I posted on the other thread I think this is a great idea and I'm surprised it took this long for someone to really do it right. But I couldn't be happier than with Geissele (or technically ALG) doing it. I'm sure I'll be getting one of these to try out.

Quote:

Originally Posted by TRIDENT82

Nice, and loud audible reset as well.

That's because the original GI style hammer was intended for pounding railroad spikes into solid rock. If ALG ever feels like a further evolution of this design I would chop off the unneeded hammer tail (not needed for semiauto, at least) and change springs as needed to get a faster lock time and less harsh operation.

gun71530 · #18 01-20-12, 14:40

Looks real good, I will be looking into one of these.

TRIDENT82 · #19 01-20-12, 15:59

Wow, if you'll note above...I mentioned that the ACT unlike the vast majority of mil spec single stage triggers Ive ever shot, is actually predictable. After reliability, I value predictability secondly. Not only did I hate having to fight the hell out of 9.5lb-10.5lb triggers in my colt 6520s, but even more importantly, there was no way to tell when exactly the shot would break. This by extension made me focus tons of attention on thinking about pulling the trigger and when it would be actually breaking vs. keeping my attention on the target through the sights which is where all my attention should be. A great trigger is one in which you don't even know it's there.

So anyway, I was excited to check the pull weights on this trigger to get some actual data to support the statement I made above that was based purely on the feel of the trigger. I was quite surprised, and impressed with the 10 pull weight numbers. I also wanted to show the effects that properly greasing your contact surfaces will have upon the pull weight. I started of by removing all the grease on the surfaces that I had installed it with, and performed five pulls like that. Then I properly greased the surfaces, and performed another 10 pulls.

First five pull weights w/o trigger grease:

1.) 6.29
2.) 6.61
3.) 6.36
4.) 6.24
5.) 6.33
________
Avg. pull weight: 6.366lbs Standard Deviation: .14363

Ten pull weights w/ trigger grease:

1.) 5.81
2.) 5.85
3.) 5.93
4.) 5.98
5.) 5.76
6.) 5.92
7.) 6.04
8.) 5.74
9.) 5.91
10.) 6.08
__________
Avg. pull weight: 5.902lb. Standard Deviation: 0.11331

I will have to refer back to my notes to be positive on the pull weight averages I recorded on 3 different S2S triggers, but I'm pretty sure that this ACT actually had a lower standard deviation than any of the S2S. Again, that pull weight avg. amount and the low standard deviation in the string is awesome to see.

I'm not sure if a vial of grease will come with these triggers since I didn't receive any, so that is one thing to be aware of.....do yourself a favor and pick up a small amt. of Aeroshell 6 or Mobil 28.

UDT · #20 01-20-12, 18:40

TRIDENT82;1203351]UDT, OldGreg....I'll try to compare the two the best I can, however its important for me to note that I'm a very strong advocate for 2 stage trigger designs vs. single stage trigger designs, and these triggers are really totally different designs.

TRIDENT82, thanks for the reply and the info.

UDT