Vehicle maintenance schedules - Legit? Or Bogus?

[Eurodriver]

I have an '06 Mercedes C230 (Hence the username!)

I've taken mercilessly good care of it. Its always rinsed down both the body and underneath (I've never lived more than a mile from the ocean)

I change the oil and air filters regularly, keep my tires inflated properly, the cabin air filter is replaced frequently, I get alignments done etc etc.

Aside from at 30,000 miles when a balance shaft became worn which required removal of the entire engine (Thank God for warranties) I have never had any issues with.

When I went in for an oil change recently, which I normally do but because I sold all of my tools on craigslist I can no longer, they told me a bunch of stuff that I needed to have done.

They said I needed to have the injector system cleaned, the brake fluid needed to be flushed, tranny fluid replaced, along with other things.

Now I grew up a poor Florida cracker and my daddy always told me that all of those "Replace XXX fluid every 20,000 miles was hogwash". But we drove Ford cars and 30 year old Chevy trucks. I really believed him that if we changed the tranny fluid it would knock some gunk loose that was holding everything together and cause it to slip.

My question:

Are these things legitimately necessary? I did get my brake fluid changed, only because I know that attracts moisture and it was relatively inexpensive. But is the ~$500 pricetag worth changing out transmission fluid and differential fluid and some others?

Oh, and I'm well aware I can save a boatload of money doing it myself. Thats not the point. I just want to know if these legitimately increase the life of the parts or if it is a snake oil treatment mechanics use to make money.

[Honu]

unless you only bought non detergent gas cant see how your injectors are dirty already ? but ya never know ? that seems funny but maybe guys on benzworld can share more ?

tranny and dif replace fluids I know in the 4x4 world is a good thing at about 40-50K and some do it at about 10K for initial junk that wears out of the gears
and many over the long haul swear its a way to save issues later on

check our ATF if not red replace ! and for MB use MB fluid !
the transfer case is not as big deal about MB oil ? but might as well ;)

if I remember when I had a MB it was every 50K for tranny change ?

head over to www.benzworld.org

see what some of them say maybe ?

[An Undocumented Worker]

The injector cleaning won't be necessary, and isn't even listed as a regular mantenance item from any manufacturer. It can help on cars that have plenty of miles from short trips and easy driving as any carbon deposites don't get hot enough to get burned off or blown out from aggressive driving in those situations.

The brake fluid is a fluid that need to be replaced regularly because it is hygroscopic, aka it absorbs moisture from the air or any that makes it's way into the brake system. This is on purpose because any liquid water will boil if system gets over 212 degrees where the water is. The fluid absorbs the moisture and boiling point of the fluid lowers in relation to it's moisture content. This moisture can break down the fluid and also contribute to corrosion of certain components in the brake system. This is typically noted by a greenish tint to the fluid indicating the presence of oxidized copper. There are test strips out there that specifically test for this to determine if that concentration has reached an unacceptable point.

In short change your brake fluid every 3-4 years. A flush from an independant shop should run around 100 dollars or so.

The Trans fluid is less cut and dry. Yes it should be changed at some point as it is used to lubricate the trans as well and transfer torque in the torque converter, so it does experience breakdown similar to engine oil, but at a much slower rate. On a mercedes it probably takes a synthetic trans fluid, so either use the mercedes fluid or a highquality alternative such as BG with the appropriate friction modifier additive.
That Merc probably has a cap on the trans dipstick tube with no dipstick actually in there so any shop flushing one of those needs the proper dipstick with the proper information on how to use it. If the trans is overfull the fluid could foam and result in a lack of lubrication, we all know what happens when a trans doesn't have enough fluid. Either way get that done at a shop that you trust, and knows what they are doing, or take it to the dealer.

I have also seen a vast quantity of higher mileage mercs with leaky power steering hoses and related components, so get that fluid changed sometime before 100k if not a bit sooner, also it uses a different fluid than your standerd power steering system so make sure the appropriate fluid is used.

As for the old ford truck, yeah really old and burnt trans fluid can cause problems if changed, the idea is to never let it get to that point. And occasionally some transmissions like to blowup no matter how they are mantained, Honda, Ford, Chevy, Toyota it doesn't matter.

[usmcvet]

The dealer changed my tranny fluid in my 2005 Silverado at 30K & 60K. When my tranny blew at 80,000 it was covered 100% by the transmission flushing machines warranty saving me $2,500+.

[buckshot1220]

The injector cleaning is likely unnecessary. I would, however, recommend running a fuel system/injector cleaner roughly every other oil change. Some of the two best products (not gimmicks) are Seafoam and Lucas. Both can be found at WalMart for around $7.

Yes, the brake fluid needs to be changed out every so often for the same reasons others have mentioned.

Ahh, the "flush that transmission and it will leave you stranded" thing. Like another member said, if you let the fluid go too far and the gunk starts to build up, yes, flushing it MAY cause particles to come loose and lead to problems(specifically in the valve body of the transmission). Assuming, however, the you haven't racked up a ton of miles on the car and don't drive like Mario Andretti, it should be just fine to flush it. $500 seems way overpriced though, I don't even think the dealers get that much for a transmission flush.

[GTifosi]

All the 'in tank' injector cleaners do is free up then pick up junk from the tank and line(s) and move it to the injectors where it clogs them up due to the orafices in the inectors being so miniscule.

Liquid fuel can clog them after sitting for a while and creating residue staining like the stuff you see in/on a carburettor over time, what do you think an actual chunk of something will do?

Additionally the micron flowthrough level of pump and inline fuel filters is nowhere near as fine as injector ports, so they are useless for stopping fouling clots.

Truth be told its better to do nothing than pour shit in you tank (at the other end of the car) and expect it to have positive effect.
'Shit in your tank' would be Lucas, that 3 step Valvoline 'process' that many shops offer for WAY too much $, seafoam and any other that involves literally pouring something into the fuel tank.

*side note on seafoam: if going for the 'pour it in the intake with engine running' type, all that does is mabe clean the exterior tip of injectors if it happens to actually come in contact with them in the high velocity intake stream (injectors clog from the inside out anyway, so moot point) and knock residue off the back of the intake valve heads so it can drop into the cylinder. Sometimes harmless, sometimes it scratches the hell out of the cylinder walls or jams a piston ring.

Removal and professional cleaning is the only way to properly clean injectors.
Doing such involves sonic cleaning and/or tank cleaning along with pulsing the injectors during same, new caps/o-rings/seals installed also before/after flow volume and spray pattern testing at proper pressure for the given injector type along with a written report returned with them showing those pre and post rates.

Runs about $130 or so depending on number of injectors and whether rail and regulator are included if you remove the parts yourself and send them off. Add a couple hundred if you have a shop remove and reinstall them for you.

Depending on a few variables, every 40-50k would be about right.
Some go 100k and never even need it, others might only make it to 20k.
Fuel quality has bearing. Quality, not octane.
Additives are the issue, not combustability.

OK Injectors and Cruzin Performance are a couple of the more highly rated professional cleaning services.
Turnaround is under a week in most instances.

[turdbocharged]

This!

We had our 06 G6 with 105,000k miles throttle body and injectors cleaned at the dealer. WHAT A DIFFERENCE. I will never use pour in the tank injector cleaner again.



All the 'in tank' injector cleaners do is free up then pick up junk from the tank and line(s) and move it to the injectors where it clogs them up due to the orafices in the inectors being so miniscule.

Liquid fuel can clog them after sitting for a while and creating residue staining like the stuff you see in/on a carburettor over time, what do you think an actual chunk of something will do?

Additionally the micron flowthrough level of pump and inline fuel filters is nowhere near as fine as injector ports, so they are useless for stopping fouling clots.

Truth be told its better to do nothing than pour shit in you tank (at the other end of the car) and expect it to have positive effect.
'Shit in your tank' would be Lucas, that 3 step Valvoline 'process' that many shops offer for WAY too much $, seafoam and any other that involves literally pouring something into the fuel tank.

*side note on seafoam: if going for the 'pour it in the intake with engine running' type, all that does is mabe clean the exterior tip of injectors if it happens to actually come in contact with them in the high velocity intake stream (injectors clog from the inside out anyway, so moot point) and knock residue off the back of the intake valve heads so it can drop into the cylinder. Sometimes harmless, sometimes it scratches the hell out of the cylinder walls or jams a piston ring.

Removal and professional cleaning is the only way to properly clean injectors.
Doing such involves sonic cleaning and/or tank cleaning along with pulsing the injectors during same, new caps/o-rings/seals installed also before/after flow volume and spray pattern testing at proper pressure for the given injector type along with a written report returned with them showing those pre and post rates.

Runs about $130 or so depending on number of injectors and whether rail and regulator are included if you remove the parts yourself and send them off. Add a couple hundred if you have a shop remove and reinstall them for you.

Depending on a few variables, every 40-50k would be about right.
Some go 100k and never even need it, others might only make it to 20k.
Fuel quality has bearing. Quality, not octane.
Additives are the issue, not combustability.

OK Injectors and Cruzin Performance are a couple of the more highly rated professional cleaning services.
Turnaround is under a week in most instances.

[Honu]

I would never use any pour in tank cleaner either ;)


some costco and a few other places use fuels with no cleaners or detergent additive according to some in the sports car area this has led to quicker fowling ?
costco many stations now have cleaner/detergent additives ?
some say its all bull ?

again big dif with gas that has cleaners than in the tank junk :)

also if a station you buy from has crappy tanks and does not keep filters clean etc.. that can have some issues some say ?

gas is pretty much all the same from the refineries its just each company tends to have its own additives and special detergents etc..

to me I think its a tough one to nail down injectors get dirty over time but part of me still thinks that low miles ? should not have issues unless you have been getting nasty gas ? again not sure :)

buying gas from costco or who is cheapest non top tier vs some who swear only a certain brand ?
I dont know ??? what to think so much info now its over load :)


most of my nicest cars Porsches and BMWs were all owned when I lived on Island and they are all top tier gas companies ? on the islands so never had the chance to buy non top tier as they call it gas ? so my experience was good on all my cars ? was it the top tier gas ? dont know
the MB S class I owned here on the mainland I put in costco ? never had engine issues just other issues and got rid of it ? but its not a performance rig ?
my toyota FJC I put in costco quite a bit ? at about 40K the injectors were perfect when I had my other fluids changed so lucky me maybe ? dont know



for grins search for BMW top Tier Gas its interesting to hear all the talk about it ?
or
http://www.toptiergas.com/

but its interesting and again I dont know anymore what to think :)
but BMW and the other car companies think it matters ? again its fun to read all the conspiracy theories and the pros and cons etc.


bottom line to me if the cleaning is not to much you have a nice car keep it nice maintenance is what keeps nice cars nice

[chadbag]

I would never use any pour in tank cleaner either ;)


some costco and a few other places use fuels with no cleaners or detergent additive

All the Costcos I have ever gotten gas at have had additive and detergent packages (in fact they claim to have 5x the average detergent). It may be that originally they didn't have as much (supposedly it is Federal Law to have the detergent in the gas since 1995)

Here is the Costco gas FAQ

http://shop.costco.com/en/In-The-Warehouse/Gasoline/Q-and-A.aspx

[Honu]

All the Costcos I have ever gotten gas at have had additive and detergent packages (in fact they claim to have 5x the average detergent). It may be that originally they didn't have as much (supposedly it is Federal Law to have the detergent in the gas since 1995)

Here is the Costco gas FAQ

http://shop.costco.com/en/In-The-Warehouse/Gasoline/Q-and-A.aspx
Thanks :)

Here they started advertising it ? Have to wonder again to much noise not sure maybe the no detergents was bogus info that somehow became legend :)
also why not sure what to believe so much noise around it !

Good to know since I use it a lot as its so much cheaper

[Avenger29]

I can tell you first hand experience that the transmission change is NOT BS. $1200 worth of first hand experience.

We used to never change trans fluid in older cars. The newer stuff has a lot of electronics right in the fluid/trans body. I wouldn't do a "power flush" to change it, though. What I do is unhook the line where it goes into the radiator and hook an extension hose up to a bucket to catch the old fluid and hook a funnel up to the intake line and pour fresh fluid in. Takes one person to manage the fluid and the other to start and shut off the car.

[An Undocumented Worker]

I can tell you first hand experience that the transmission change is NOT BS. $1200 worth of first hand experience.

We used to never change trans fluid in older cars. The newer stuff has a lot of electronics right in the fluid/trans body. I wouldn't do a "power flush" to change it, though. What I do is unhook the line where it goes into the radiator and hook an extension hose up to a bucket to catch the old fluid and hook a funnel up to the intake line and pour fresh fluid in. Takes one person to manage the fluid and the other to start and shut off the car.

That is essentially how the BG trans fluid flush machine works, not sure about other manufactures and how they do it.

On that machine there is a tank that you fill with new fluid, in that tank is an inlet and an outlet with a bladder seperating the inlet side and outlet side. The new fluid is on the outlet side. So you hook it up to the trans cooler lines and the old fluid flows into the inlet under whatever pressure the transmission on that car produces. This old fluid pushes on the bladder and thus pushes the new fluid into the end of the trans cooler line that is hooked up to the outlet of the tank at the same pressure and flow rate as the old fluid is leaving the trans. So essentially with that machine hooked up the transmission is flushing itself.

Many independant shops and dealers use that machine and other systems and fluids from BG. http://www.bgprod.com/products/transmission.html

I guess what I'm trying to say is that you can have a transmission flushed in a manner that removes more old fluid than dropping the pan, but still doesn't run the risk of creating a condition that could damage the trans by overpressurizing something.

[orionz06]

I have seen few cars have many issues when the maintenance schedules are followed and many issue when they were not. Fluids degrade, replace as suggested. Perhaps not at the dealer but rather an enthusiast shop, but still do it. The effectiveness of the scheduled work is apparent when many car companies are offering free scheduled maintenance as part of the deal. It saves them money in the long run too.

[Thomas M-4]

I am always amazed how automatic transmissions are negleticted.
Most people get that the engine oil needs to be changed, hell engine oil primary purpose is just lubrication, But an automatic transmission oil has too lubrication , friction modifier for the wet cluches, Hydraulics for the shifting and is cooler for the trans but no one thinks they should change the fluid:rolleyes: In most mordern automatic transmission there can be over 1200 parts the engine has around 100+ [some odd] parts hmm lets think that would be a clue...