View Full Version : Finished and less than 1 MOA
My 1903A3 is done and firing. New park job,new Kreiger match barrel,new walnut C-stock and High marine site protecter. The rifle is a Remington 1943 era rec. I allso used a milled trigger group for smoother feed and use Swedish Mauser strippers. Its old school ,but a nice precision rifle in good old 30-06 American. Use 165gr sierras BT.
Animal_Mother556
03-11-12, 07:50
Okay, this is your third post. You haven't asked any questions...which is fine, I suppose.
But, you are giving the feel that you are just showing off and wanting this site to provide a pat on the back.
:confused::confused::confused::confused:
Moving this to general bolts. The intent of this section is scoped precision bolt guns.
And where's the pics of this gem?
Deputy Dan
03-11-12, 08:33
A 1 moa 03A3? Don't tell me, let me guess... it shot one really good 3 shot group, right? Just want to clarify something... one single moa group or does this thing shoot every group to one moa? There is a huge difference... try it with 5 to 10 round groups. That is a true measure of what the rifle and shooter are capable of.
With a factory 03A3 rear sight? How many front sight blades did you have to go through to get the rifle to zero? How did you bed the stock and deal with fitting the upper band and handguard so that it doesn't impinge on the barrel?
Do us a favor and post photos of those targets.
Brother, I have been collecting and shooting M1903s for about 32 years and I have never seen a 1 moa M1903 or 03A3 in it's original form (meaning not glass bedded, free floated, scoped with aftermarket triggers). A really good one can hold the 10 ring of an SR-1 target if the rifle and shooter are up to it... and it helps to have superb eyesight. A consistent one moa 03A3, sorry... have to call horseshit. The Army tried making the 03A3 a NM rifle post WWII, and it was a total failure... with all their resources, they couldn't make it work.
http://www.fototime.com/86E66CEB352AB51/medium.jpg (http://www.fototime.com/pictinv/86E66CEB352AB51)
http://www.fototime.com/55092747DF3925C/medium.jpg (http://www.fototime.com/pictinv/55092747DF3925C)
A 1 moa 03A3? Don't tell me, let me guess... it shot one really good 3 shot group, right? Just want to clarify something... one single moa group or does this thing shoot every group to one moa? There is a huge difference... try it with 5 to 10 round groups. That is a true measure of what the rifle and shooter are capable of.
With a factory 03A3 rear sight? How many front sight blades did you have to go through to get the rifle to zero? How did you bed the stock and deal with fitting the upper band and handguard so that it doesn't impinge on the barrel?
Do us a favor and post photos of those targets.
Brother, I have been collecting and shooting M1903s for about 32 years and I have never seen a 1 moa M1903 or 03A3 in it's original form (meaning not glass bedded, free floated, scoped with aftermarket triggers). A really good one can hold the 10 ring of an SR-1 target if the rifle and shooter are up to it... and it helps to have superb eyesight. A consistent one moa 03A3, sorry... have to call horseshit. The Army tried making the 03A3 a NM rifle post WWII, and it was a total failure... with all their resources, they couldn't make it work.
...did you read the OP at all?
He's done some work to it.
With a Krieger barrel and milled trigger, I can see a 1MOA three shot group being pretty reasonable in the right conditions.
While it may not be a precision bolt rifle in modern terms, it sounds like exactly the sort of hybrid nostalgic tack driver the OP was looking for...
Beyond that, this thread is worthless without pics. Well, not totally, but I'd like to see pictures of this thing, and target pics wouldn't hurt either.
Deputy Dan
03-21-12, 15:23
...did you read the OP at all?
He's done some work to it.
Yes, I read the OP.
There is a LOT more to getting an 03A3 to shoot than screwing in a Kreiger tube and putting on a C stock. Most of the new C stocks require a lot of work to correct the bedding (read-they suck). The "work" you take note of in the OP is a Kreiger tube... the rest of it-parkerization, a stock and a front sight protector- is cosmetic. If the OP would elaborate on how he accurized the rifle, I would be keen to listen.
I stand by my call of horseshit on a sub MOA Iron sighted 03A3.
Deputy Dan
03-21-12, 15:26
Double hit
Curious as well...
Too bad we didnt even get pictures.
Littlelebowski
03-25-12, 14:29
Unless pics show up, I'm thinking DD's words have the ring of hard won truth.
Oh, nice rifles BTW Deputy Dan.
I have a 1918 receiver still attached to and old and worn out 1915 tube; I don't have the time or money, but I hope that someday, my buddy and I can rebuild the receiver...
Deputy Dan
03-29-12, 19:19
Oh, nice rifles BTW Deputy Dan.
I have a 1918 receiver still attached to and old and worn out 1915 tube; I don't have the time or money, but I hope that someday, my buddy and I can rebuild the receiver...
When ordnance was rebuilding the M1903 service rifle, many older barrels made it onto later receivers. This is discussed in depth in the July-August 1928 issue of Army Ordnance Magazine Vol. VIII, No. 49(pg 36-42) by Lt. J. E. McInerney of Springfield Armory. I would venture to bet your rifle received it's current barrel during the massive post-WW1 rebuild program. It originally would have been fitted with a 1918 dated barrel.
Since you will have the barreled action out of the stock, check to make sure there is a stock bushing installed... it will be in the hole closest to the wrist where the trigger guard screw passes through the stock to the receiver tang. If there isn't one there, get one from Numrich or another source. Without the bushing the stock will more than likely develop a crack at the wrist if the rifle is shot regularly. For best accuracy, shorten the bushing 1/8 inch.
I have built a few for accuracy, and it is a pain in the ass. It is almost easier to shell out the funds for a mint original than to take the time and effort to build one. A really good M1903 can hold close to MOA (usually around 1.5 MOA) and any M1903 in very good condition will easily hold a little under 2 MOA with 5 shot groups if the shooter is up to it. A consistent sub-moa 1903 is a fantasy.
Yeah, I am a M1903 nut. I have probably had 35 or so pass through my hands over the years... I still have 18 in the safe.
Deputy Dan
03-29-12, 19:36
This one has shot to 1.1 inch with some M72 Match ammo...it doesn't get shot much. It is a Rock Island Arsenal 1919 National Match, one of 2,251 produced and one of three known to still exist. It is nearly mint. It is all still out there.
http://www.fototime.com/BF508A3F1902C86/standard.jpg
http://www.fototime.com/D82B12479C7C6D1/standard.jpg
http://www.fototime.com/9F7F01B768F2800/standard.jpg
Dan, here is the real skinny on "my" 1903.
One friend gave me a bag of parts (milled trigger guard and mag spring, trigger, front band, and a bolt body with shroud---besides that, I have a barreled action with a rusted out pipe, dated 8/15). The receiver itself is SA, with s/n 939xxx. I believe the receiver is cut for an A3 sight, and this is missing the original tangent sight.
The metal has some pitting, and some rust because some how part of this tube ended up submerged in water; as a result, the barrel is no good anymore.
Seeing how much money this would cost, I practically gave this bag of parts to my best friend because I know he wants to fix it up. We can still work on it and shoot it together and all that--so I don't feel like I am missing out. (I got other guns I need to buy--I don't own a single self loading rifle, for example).
Anyhow, I promised that I would help him get this thing together in whatever way I could and I can't wait until we get started with this.
The bolt body it came with is old and straight, and its missing parts. We decided its better to buy a complete bent bolt off gun broker or something since they'll be new and come with all the parts. We will have to track down a stock and possibly an entire new barrel (preferably with sights, or we can try to find an A3 rear sight if possible). I hope it's not a pain in the ass to find stock metal and action screws either.
If this is anything like the German Mauser 98 (closest gun I have actual experience with, we'll need new FCG parts as well).
I attached a couple of pics of what I have...
Here's hoping to this thing becoming a 1903 rifle once again!
Deputy Dan
03-30-12, 09:23
Hey Brother... here is the good new and bad news.
The good news: That receiver was manufactured from double heat treated Class C steel. From a materials standpoint, it is quite strong and there are no issues of brittle receivers.
The bad news: the receiver bridge and left receiver wall were drilled. That rifle would not have an 03A3 receiver sight because there is no dovetail to mount the sight to. I have no idea why the left receiver wall was drilled... if there were three holes, it could have been a sniper rifle receiver, the three holes would be for the Warner & Swazey M1913 prismatic rifle sight.
The deal breaker: there is a piece of the left receiver wall missing at the top of the rail... it looks like it was milled or filed off. It will interfere with the operation of the bolt because part of the bolt raceway is missing. The receiver strength is also compromised because the receiver rail is a structural component.
Can you take a close up photo of the top of the receiver wall where the mill cut is?
Also, email or post the markings on the safety lug of the bolt. More than likely it is a single heat treated bolt, and is generally considered unsafe to fire... there is a slight chance that it is a duoble heat treated or nickel steel straight handled bolt (very few were produced). The code on the safety lug will confirm what it is.
Sorry to be the bearer of ill tidings, but please don't sink any additional funds into it at this time. You will spend far more than if you found a decent complete example.
Thank you Dan.
Perhaps I'll get you the pics a little later...
Good to know, and what a shame.
Deputy Dan
03-30-12, 20:01
You are welcome... and I am sorry.
Keep an eye on Gunbroker and the other auctions.
You can find mildly sporterized 1903s that can be brought back... it will be a labor of love. It is expensive to restore an '03 in the end, but you can spread out your cost over time.
Dan, I apologize but this thread slipped my mind.
Here is a close up of the questionable area, anyway..
First one is top view, second is side view.
Thanks again.
At the worst, it will make a cool paperweight.
Deputy Dan
05-20-12, 18:35
Hey, no problem.
That receiver is a no go as a shooter, even if it wasn't hacked.
I'm kind of stumped as to why the material was removed from the receiver rail.
Too bad that it didn't have this hole pattern in the receiver rail:
http://www.fototime.com/07CCA7CC2224FD6/standard.jpg
That would have made it a WW1 sniper rifle.
It is all still out there, just be patient and keep looking.
Yup. That surely is a strange rough looking dovetail.
Oh well, too bad since it was a high nubmer WW1 type... Guess its time to turn it into a paperweight.
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