View Full Version : Follow up on GEN3 G19.
DAVID RICHARDS
03-11-12, 12:09
I posted a thread about my Glock problems (Can you get a reliable recent production GEN3 G19). Here's the short version,
1. First gun GEN3 G19 to avoid GEN4 problems. No good. Threw brass everywhere and damaged cases. Couple of times at Glock replaced with a GEN4 G19.
2. Replacement GEN4 G19. All the new parts. Good for 2000 rounds then brass everywhere. Back to Glock.
3. Sent me a GEN3 G19 that was NIB but built before my first GEN3 G19. Old 336 ejector and 336 extractor. Called and asked why they didn't send me my GEN4? Whoops mistake. They test fired some ammo through it and said "yeah it threw some rounds forward and to the left but we found no problem". Why a GEN3 without the updated extractor? After a pause "well what if it works with the 336"? If it works with the 336 why are you changing the ejectors on the new guns? Another bullshit answer.
So they said they'd return my GEN4 G19 that throws brass forward and to the left ( and of course my head) if I wanted to return the GEN3. Which as I mentioned they said throwing the brass all over and they said it was not a problem. Even though they gave me a call tag for it.
Against my better judgement I fired the GEN3 yesterday. Speer Lawmam 115gr. and 124gr.. Within the first 30 rounds it started hitting me in the head! So I can have a GEN3 or GEN4 G19 that hits me in the head! Looked for a S&W M&P 9c to replace it. Can't find one without the manual safety. And I've tried LWD extractors, HRED's and all the other fixes. So I guess I take a loss and be done with it. 3 guns and none work right. Just digusting!
trackstar55
03-11-12, 12:28
I have a new Gen 3 Glock 17 with the slick back finish and frame made in Austria....Serial number SSL range. It throws brass everywhere including my face. I can't believe it won't eject in a consistent pattern. It had the 336 ejector.
I am a Glock Armorer and called them up. It took two phone calls before I was able to speak with a tech person who wasn't a grumpy smart ass.
He sent me the new ejector and a a dot connector. The new ejector I installed "30274" made things worse!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I am so fed up. I am a LEO and I can get these things for $400 all day long and all I have been doing lately is looking for used Glocks from 2008 and earlier.
What happened to Glock??????? Where is the "Perfection"
This is killing me. I have carried a glock for 9 years of service and I hate to admit it, but I am about to give up on them for good.
DAVID RICHARDS
03-11-12, 13:33
Yes it really sucks. I've owned a bunch over the years. Never a problem. Nada. All my old ones are fine. One's twenty years old and still works. Changed my springs and all but it's as fresh as the day is long. I guy next to me was firing a new GEN4 G19. In the first mag 3 out of 15 hit him in the head! From what I've seen a lot may work. But from one on one experience with myself and friends it's real hit or miss.
Maybe the reason the guy at Glock (Anthony) said if it did work with the 336 the 30274 might cause problems is like you it happens. He's speaking from experience evidently. The 043 spring and 37024 in my GEN4 didn't stop it from puking and dying at 2000 rounds. They seem to be swapping parts in each individual gun to try to get them to gt each gun to work. Either it's a bunch of problems, a combined group of problms with each individual gun, they don't know what the problems are, or they do and it's to expensive to fix. Although all these guns, parts, shipping, and so on can't be cheap. They are basically telling me pick a flawed GEN3 or GEN4. We can't find any problems except for spent brass going everywhere. So now it's not a problem???
Lots of folks here recommend keeping the GEN3 and waiting on some aftermrket fixes. Seems the GEN4's are getting the most attention from the company. Broght side my 2-3 month old PPQ has become a faithful, loyal companion. 3700 trouble free rounds. Superb gun!
On my G17 (Gen 3) upper assembly I installed an old style Gen 1 extractor and bearing. It's run like a house afire ever since. Prior to that it was multiple stovepipes and failures.
Worked for me, you guys might give it a try.
Glock seriously needs to get their shit together. I am currently on the look out for an older Gen 3 Glock 19 as a back up to my carry gun because I don't trust any of the recently manufactured models.
What truly sucks is that the root cause does not seem to have been positively identified yet. I really thought it was out of spec/new spec MIM extractors that was causing this issue but now I have no idea anymore...:confused::mad:
mkmckinley
03-11-12, 14:07
I don't know your background or shooting experience, so take this in the manner in which it's intended: are you sure it's not your technique that's causing the errant ejection?
trackstar55
03-11-12, 14:17
I don't know your background or shooting experience, so take this in the manner in which it's intended: are you sure it's not your technique that's causing the errant ejection?
I am tired of this^
and sir, I appreciate you tell me that because you don't know my level, but this is a broken record post, but I appreciate you taking time to post in order to help....others who post that are I think trying to be smart asses.
I am a 10 year LEO...I know how to hold a handgun...I know how to shoot 9mm....I do not limp wrist. No offense intended, but everyone across all sorts of forums feels like its their duty to post "Are you sure you aren't limp wristing."
And, NO, its not the ammo. I have tired numerous different brands of ammo. All brands give me the same result.
Its like every time I walk into a public place where friends are drinking in a group when I am on duty. If I had a penny each time someone holding a beer yells at me, "HE DID IT!" as they point to their shit faced buddy,......I would be a billionaire and just buy Glock outright and fix this crap once and for all.
Its like every time I walk into a public place where friends are drinking in a group when I am on duty. If I had a penny each time someone holding a beer yells at me, "HE DID IT!" as they point to their shit faced buddy
So true.
This is disturbing to hear. I have not bought a Glock for some years and most of mine were police turn-ins even then, so I have one Gen 1 G22 and a couple Gen3 G23 and a Gen3 G19. They all run well, but I would be leery of buying anything new from Glock. Is there any Gen4 models that are solid? Are all new Gen3 and Gen4 models susceptible to these erratic ejection problems?
As a side note, random pathways reminds me of complexity theory. If the observed pattern appears erratic or chaotic it may be due to cases hitting a complex shape and bouncing off unpredictably. Did Glock change the geometry of the ejection port or shape of the ejector's tip or something? I mean, a cartridge is fired, it is pulled straight out of the chamber and hits the ejector. Given the same ammo it should land fairly predictably unless it hits another surface such as one of the sides of the ejection port. That is the only thing I can see that would cause weird trajectories.
I recently encountered a new problem with a late 2011 3rd gen G19 w/all Glock OEM parts. It worked fine for the first 500 rounds of Federal AE training ammo. However, from the 500th-600th rounds fired, the trigger shifted from normal Glock "feeling" to at least triple the trigger pull weight. I thought I was getting a cramp in my arm muscles or a CVA at first, as I could not pull the trigger back smoothly. After picking up another Glock, I quickly realized it was the pistol, not me. I swapped the "bad" slide from the effected G19 to a known good frame--no issues. Then I took a known good G19 slide and put it on the bad lower receiver--same problems. Thus I isolated the problem to the lower receiver. (Note this is a good reason to have a couple of identical pistols on hand). After that it was simply a matter of swapping known good parts, one at a time until the problem went away. First tried the connector, then the trigger return spring--still bad. Next was the trigger bar--problem solved. Why it was bad I do not know, as it looked "normal" on gross visual inspection. Nonetheless, an old non-dog leg trigger bar made the gun run right again...
SW-Shooter
03-11-12, 19:37
I am tired of this^
and sir, I appreciate you tell me that because you don't know my level, but this is a broken record post, but I appreciate you taking time to post in order to help....others who post that are I think trying to be smart asses.
I am a 10 year LEO...I know how to hold a handgun...I know how to shoot 9mm....I do not limp wrist. No offense intended, but everyone across all sorts of forums feels like its their duty to post "Are you sure you aren't limp wristing."
And, NO, its not the ammo. I have tired numerous different brands of ammo. All brands give me the same result.
Its like every time I walk into a public place where friends are drinking in a group when I am on duty. If I had a penny each time someone holding a beer yells at me, "HE DID IT!" as they point to their shit faced buddy,......I would be a billionaire and just buy Glock outright and fix this crap once and for all.
Chip meet shoulder.
ROUTEMICHIGAN
03-12-12, 02:52
I have a Gen 3 G19-- June 2011 production date. Just hit 1,960 rounds. Shoots great. No issues whatsoever. Knock on wood.
I am tired of this^
As I read it, what you're tired of is giving polite answers to politely-asked, legitimate questions, as asked by folks that have no way of knowing what you have or have not eliminated as a factor, because they lack the requisite internet mind-reading skills needed to keep from BOTHERING you.
You could simply have said "no," and been done with it, but deliberately chose not to. Pump your brakes.
I recently encountered a new problem ...the 500th-600th rounds fired, the trigger shifted from normal Glock "feeling" to at least triple the trigger pull weight...Next was the trigger bar--problem solved. Why it was bad I do not know, as it looked "normal" on gross visual inspection. Nonetheless, an old non-dog leg trigger bar made the gun run right again...
My Aug '11 Gen4 19 did the same thing.
After about 2K rounds (of semi-erratic ejection anf a few FTFeeds) I noticed that my trigger pull was gritty and about 10 lbs. The bump on the trigger bar that lifts the firing pin block is rough and deformed, indicating that the metal is too soft.
Nothing done to the gun or parts, I've never even detail stripped the frame. Just absolute shit quality.
I'm back to a 1911....
Wow sorry for everyone's troubles. This is why I traded my gen3 for
something else. Always on the lookout for a gen2 though...
Beat Trash
03-12-12, 10:33
There was a time that if asked for a gun that could be counted on to function out of the box, the answer was a 9mm Glock. If your Glock was lost, destroyed, loaned to a friend or ended up sitting in evidence for 6 months, no problem, you just run out and buy another one.
Now buying a new Glock has turned into a crap shoot at best!
I own gen3 Glock 19's and a Glock 17. My newest one was bought in 2004. I'm hesitant to use them any more. If I needed to replace them with a reliable Glock, that may be tough to do.
I really wish Glock would get their shit together...
DAVID RICHARDS
03-12-12, 11:05
If I can't find an M&P 9c minus the external safety I might look for an older GEN2 or GEN3 and let Cold Bore Customs do a grip reduction for me. 3rd gun is boxed up and ready to go back to Glock. Like I said I'm just sick of it. To earlier poster about limp wristing. I know you're probably just getting into this whole thing with the new Glocks.
No offense to you but I think the other poster is just feeling like a lots of us are. Everytime you go over to Glock Talk or some other forum and bring up the problem several die hards will jump in and tell you that you are either shooting " weak range ammo" or are limpwrisitng.
Or "Glocks aren't target pistols. They are made to shoot NATO spec ammo". A dirct quote from a Glock Rep. I've heard nwbies repeat like a Mantra. This isn't Glocks first time using this excuse until it is forced to fix their guns by the sheer weight of complaints. Glocks should shoot any SAMMI spec ammo. They always have before.
All of my other older 9mm Glocks shoot any SAMMI spec ammo imcluding Federal Champion to the right and betwen 3:00-4:00. One is twenty years old. I can take one of the problem Glocks and one of my old ones to the range and load both with the same ammo. The old one fires fine. The problem child chokes. Same when you let other
people shoot the two of them.
Add to that the number of different parts tried, money spent in ammo, shipping guns back and forth. Well it gets pretty old! By the way I've been shooting for 42 years. When I was younger I worked in the private security sector. I teach defensive shooting classes. Many of us are far from "johnny come lately's". You have no way of knowing that. But I think you just hit a sore spot. Again your's was an innocent, honest question. Some folks without knowing the shooters background, having never seen them shoot, are proclaiming they are limpwristing. That's kind of like a doctor diagnosing an illness without ever seeing or much less giving you an examination.
I think that's what came out. Also these people ignore Glock has gone through 5 different RSA's, a new ejector, and plays around with changing out extractors. Add to that replacing guns (this is my third), cost of shipping, a recall (voluntary update), and getting a different stories form different people at Glock as to what's wrong it has gotten old. Like I said folks with the problem guns know it's not ammo or limpwristing. Glock knows it's not limpwristing. Certain people just insist in spite of all evidence to the contrary it can't be the gun. I think that's where the frustration and anger come out. Use the search and read about what some of us have been through.
Some even have had 2nd degree burns from hot brass getting caught betwen their shooting glasses, dents in shooting glasses, stovepipes, cuts on the forehead. It's just gotten to the point of being beyond belief of some peoples denial. And of course the "my gun works so your's should to" ignorance. No one is saying none of the guns are working. To many aren't though. Hope this puts things in perspective.
SW-Shooter
03-12-12, 13:34
Well since you seem to already know everything I just wanted to add my lack of intelligence. Fact, S&W has had problems with their M&P line. Fact, Glock Perfection isn't always the case but when you produce firearms in that quantity there are bound to be a few bad apples. There isn't a firearm manufacturer on this planet that has released a 100% perfect production line. If you fail to allow the manufacturer to remedy the problem then it will be a long journey for you to find the perfect gun.
You sir have definitive issues that are far beyond normal non-medical assistance. If you think your M&P 9c will be the end all of all of your handgun needs, I've got some land for sale on Mars.
SW-Shooter
03-12-12, 13:40
Yes it really sucks. I've owned a bunch over the years. Never a problem. Nada. All my old ones are fine. One's twenty years old and still works. Changed my springs and all but it's as fresh as the day is long. I guy next to me was firing a new GEN4 G19. In the first mag 3 out of 15 hit him in the head! From what I've seen a lot may work. But from one on one experience with myself and friends it's real hit or miss.
Maybe the reason the guy at Glock (Anthony) said if it did work with the 336 the 30274 might cause problems is like you it happens. He's speaking from experience evidently. The 043 spring and 37024 in my GEN4 didn't stop it from puking and dying at 2000 rounds. They seem to be swapping parts in each individual gun to try to get them to gt each gun to work. Either it's a bunch of problems, a combined group of problms with each individual gun, they don't know what the problems are, or they do and it's to expensive to fix. Although all these guns, parts, shipping, and so on can't be cheap. They are basically telling me pick a flawed GEN3 or GEN4. We can't find any problems except for spent brass going everywhere. So now it's not a problem???
Lots of folks here recommend keeping the GEN3 and waiting on some aftermrket fixes. Seems the GEN4's are getting the most attention from the company. Broght side my 2-3 month old PPQ has become a faithful, loyal companion. 3700 trouble free rounds. Superb gun!
While the PPQ may be a very good firearm, Walther or should I say S&W by proxy has had numerous issues in the past as well. Hence the there is no perfect gun. One of the things we do as enthusiasts is find the platform that suits you as a shooter and make it perform in the manner you require.
DAVID RICHARDS
03-12-12, 14:48
Sw Shooter,
thank you for the interesting post although it comes about as far from left field as I've ever seen! So I've related my true and factual experiences with the latest gneration of Glock products. Matter of fact I gave the short version. Most specifically I've spoken of the late model GEN3 and GEN4 G19's. Not just my experiences but by the number of posts on this and other forums the experience of a lot of other folks. Included are several who have experienced similar problems on my range.
I think the young poster who brought up the question of limpwristing did so out of lack of knowledge of the problem. Not like others out there who's inability to accept the fact Glock has a major problem is amazing. The purpose of this thread was to relate to others my ongoing experiences with Glock Inc.. If you are unfamiliar with the similar denial of the problem with G19's that the N.Y.P.D. got from Glock I suggest you do a search and read it yourself. Glock has a history of blaming ammo and shooters when problems arise. This is just another repeat performance.
Only when N.Y.P.D. sought pricing on guns from Ruger did Glock get off it's butt and do something about it. They in fact set up a machine shop in an N.Y.P.D. facility to correct this problem on site. Changes were made in all G19's as a result. Check out the E-Series problems.
I don't have a problem with Glock per say except for the current situation. As I said I own several that I trust my life to.
What angers me is Glock has in fact had several recalls over the years and will never call them that. It is always an "upgrade". An upgrade is by definition an improvement on a product. Not something necessary to make it run. I know of several recalls by S&W, Ruger, and other companies. Ruger and S&W took out ad's in gun magazines and sent letters to people with the troubled guns. In the case of the SR9 Ruger fixed the guns, paid shipping, and sent folks an extra mag for their problem. That's what should happen in these instances.
The fact that so much time and effort has been put into recalling....er ....upgrading these pistols as I detailed above (5 RSA, new ejector, and so on) shows the level of problem is far beyond the scope of a normal failure rate for the product. If not regular warranty and repair policies could handle it. Some of the guns like the ones I've dealt with are so bad they can't be fixed. By the attempted design changes by Glock it shows their is a flaw in the new guns. You don't fix what isn't broken. Or maybe they tried and it lead to the current situation.
Evidently you take offense at my follow up on my Glock problems. I don't understand your anger. Unless your ego is somehow tied to the Glock product so closely that you take personal offense at what you perceive as an attack against Glock. That's your right. As far as knowing everything about the situation if I did I would have resolved my guns problems. As far as needing medical help I'm curious as to your qualifications to make such a diagnoses.
See in my earlier post about "like a doctor trying to diagnose a patient without examining said patient". That is exactly what you are doing. Whatever medical credentials you may or may not have I would not go to see any medical professional who would attempt to diagnose me based on an internet post. Anyways Sir you have a nice day anyways.
Why dont you just get a lonewolf extractor?
Man all this talk of even Gen 3 Glocks having issues has me a bit bummed. The first pistol I bought was a Glock 19 years ago and it was a wonderful firearm that gave me zero issues. I sold it during a tough time(and wish I hadn't)and just this past Friday I decided to go get another 19. It's a new production Gen 3 and I am hoping to not have these issues.
SW-Shooter
03-12-12, 16:56
Sw Shooter,
thank you for the interesting post although it comes about as far from left field as I've ever seen! So I've related my true and factual experiences with the latest gneration of Glock products. Matter of fact I gave the short version. Most specifically I've spoken of the late model GEN3 and GEN4 G19's. Not just my experiences but by the number of posts on this and other forums the experience of a lot of other folks. Included are several who have experienced similar problems on my range.
I think the young poster who brought up the question of limpwristing did so out of lack of knowledge of the problem. Not like others out there who's inability to accept the fact Glock has a major problem is amazing. The purpose of this thread was to relate to others my ongoing experiences with Glock Inc.. If you are unfamiliar with the similar denial of the problem with G19's that the N.Y.P.D. got from Glock I suggest you do a search and read it yourself. Glock has a history of blaming ammo and shooters when problems arise. This is just another repeat performance.
Only when N.Y.P.D. sought pricing on guns from Ruger did Glock get off it's butt and do something about it. They in fact set up a machine shop in an N.Y.P.D. facility to correct this problem on site. Changes were made in all G19's as a result. Check out the E-Series problems.
I don't have a problem with Glock per say except for the current situation. As I said I own several that I trust my life to.
What angers me is Glock has in fact had several recalls over the years and will never call them that. It is always an "upgrade". An upgrade is by definition an improvement on a product. Not something necessary to make it run. I know of several recalls by S&W, Ruger, and other companies. Ruger and S&W took out ad's in gun magazines and sent letters to people with the troubled guns. In the case of the SR9 Ruger fixed the guns, paid shipping, and sent folks an extra mag for their problem. That's what should happen in these instances.
The fact that so much time and effort has been put into recalling....er ....upgrading these pistols as I detailed above (5 RSA, new ejector, and so on) shows the level of problem is far beyond the scope of a normal failure rate for the product. If not regular warranty and repair policies could handle it. Some of the guns like the ones I've dealt with are so bad they can't be fixed. By the attempted design changes by Glock it shows their is a flaw in the new guns. You don't fix what isn't broken. Or maybe they tried and it lead to the current situation.
Evidently you take offense at my follow up on my Glock problems. I don't understand your anger. Unless your ego is somehow tied to the Glock product so closely that you take personal offense at what you perceive as an attack against Glock. That's your right. As far as knowing everything about the situation if I did I would have resolved my guns problems. As far as needing medical help I'm curious as to your qualifications to make such a diagnoses.
See in my earlier post about "like a doctor trying to diagnose a patient without examining said patient". That is exactly what you are doing. Whatever medical credentials you may or may not have I would not go to see any medical professional who would attempt to diagnose me based on an internet post. Anyways Sir you have a nice day anyways.
My response should have been addressed better, there seems to be another person that has a real defensive nature when responded to, because I did not call any particular person to task, "if the shoe fits", is a better scenario.
Man all this talk of even Gen 3 Glocks having issues has me a bit bummed. The first pistol I bought was a Glock 19 years ago and it was a wonderful firearm that gave me zero issues. I sold it during a tough time(and wish I hadn't)and just this past Friday I decided to go get another 19. It's a new production Gen 3 and I am hoping to not have these issues.
Its never been a generation issue, its been a production date issue. All generstions were affected after a certain production date.
It really seems to be hit or miss with the Glocks. They either run or they flat out don't. I got a Glock 19 in April of 2011, production date of March, and have just shy of 1000 rounds down range. Almost all the ammo has been Winchester white box. The only problem that occurred was in the first couple hundred rounds where brass would fling at your forehead. Fortunately it has not done it in the last 600 or so rounds. Go figure.
I have even tried to get it to jam or stovepipe by limpwristing, firing upside down, tilted to the side right and left and it has performed. It has also been shot by my eight year old son, a my older daughters, and my wife. No problems!
I feel like I got lucky and got a good gun. For those who are having problems, I hope you are able to get them resolved. Nothing sucks worst than having a gun that doesn't run. From what I have read lately that maybe the newer production guns are getting to be more reliable. Time will tell.
Glock needs to stick to what got them here and just make guns that run and run 100%!
DAVID RICHARDS
03-12-12, 21:43
I tried both 9mm and .40 Lone Wolf extractors. Two other Glock dip extractors, two older Glock non-dip extractors, HRED, about everything you could imagine to get the guns to work. Somethings made it better. Some made it worse. None including Glocks rebuilding the first gun helped. I could write pages on what I tried. Polishing extractor parts, you name it, I tried it. Just tried too many things to list in you detail.
did they only rebuild the gun? or had they given you a new slide? perhaps the slide just isn't capable of letting the extractor bite the case rim.
Its never been a generation issue, its been a production date issue. All generstions were affected after a certain production date.
The date on my spent case envelope is 2/9/2012 and I just checked that it has a 336 ejector. Fingers crossed I'll be able to make it to the range this week and see how it shoots.
don't get your hopes up, that's in the trouble range. prepare a solution.
Glock needs to stick to what got them here and just make guns that run and run 100%!
Precisely!
The reason I standardized on Glocks was the dead nuts reliability, good accuracy, simplicity of operation, and inexpensive and easily available parts and accessories.
Erratic reliability, and a plethora of versions of parts that may work or may not takes away from two of the key shining attributes that make a Glock a GLOCK.
Not sure at this point if I get another semi-auto if I would take a chance on a new Glock, try to find an old Gen3 trade-in, or what other brand I would switch to to get those original attributes I liked about the Glock models. Rugers are generally good and have great CS but most parts are only by sending your gun to Ruger for repair. I don't like that. OK for a sporting gun but not for any I would depend on. M&P? XD? FN? CZ? Or cough up a nut and pay for a SIG or HK, and I think the parts situation might be as bad or worse than the Ruger. I would get a SIG in a heart beat if I could get cheap spare parts as easily as for the Glock.
Or wait a couple more years and see if Glock sorts this out for good?
The reason I standardized on Glocks was the dead nuts reliability, good accuracy, simplicity of operation . . .
. . . wait a couple more years and see if Glock sorts this out for good?
The fix is easy on Glocks side. Do what you did in 2007. They'll come full circle eventually. Sometimes engineers are ambitious beyond the realm of common sense; don't "improve" something that most consider already flawless.
don't get your hopes up, that's in the trouble range. prepare a solution.
Oh they aren't up at all. Actually quite the opposite.
davebee456
03-13-12, 00:23
If it is not the extractor, ejector, recoil spring, what the hell could it be ? Extractor spring pin ?, bad polymer flex from a new formula ?
I am starting to think it is from the new crappy grey finish they have on the slides and barrels, I know it sounds crazy but else could it be ??
Beat Trash
03-13-12, 09:22
If it is not the extractor, ejector, recoil spring, what the hell could it be ? Extractor spring pin ?, bad polymer flex from a new formula ?
I am starting to think it is from the new crappy grey finish they have on the slides and barrels, I know it sounds crazy but else could it be ??
Could be tolerance stacking. Each or any one of those items now made just a tad different. If two or more are at one end of the what is considered the acceptable range to be within it's spec, but paired together in the same gun they now create an issue.
I have an Oct 2011 made Gen 3 G19 and no problems (except it shooting to the left, which is probably me) so far. Crossing fingers, toes, paws, straws, swords....etc..etc..
Could be tolerance stacking. Each or any one of those items now made just a tad different. If two or more are at one end of the what is considered the acceptable range to be within it's spec, but paired together in the same gun they now create an issue.
Ooh - "tolerance stacking" hits me right in the six sigma! You're right, I bet - its all about first pass yield. Small errors compound in each step to induce failures. Each of the multitude of steps in the case of a handgun firing, ejecting and loading takes fractions of a second though!
Beat Trash
03-13-12, 14:47
Sorry about your Sigma Six.
I was never issued Glocks, so my experience is limited to the few personally owned Glocks I have. All of which are old enough to not have any issues.
Our Armors have had occasions where tolerance stacking was a problem with the guns issued. Granted it's only an Agency of about 1,200 guns so we don't see patterns that larger agencies would.
I only brought this up because the only constant with the problems experienced by the gen4 and newer gen3 guns is that the issue is not consitant with every gun. That and no one has seemed to have successfully diganose the cause of the issues.
I really hope Glock is able to fix the issue at some point. I don't know of they will ever be able to fix the damage to their products reputation though.
DAVID RICHARDS
03-14-12, 00:03
Beat Trash,
I agree with you 100%. I don't think it is just one thing either. Nothing else would explain why some guns are fixed by replacing one or two parts. Some work right from the box but start to mess up after X amount of rounds. Some seem fine. Some minor work solving the problems of some. Others can't be fixed. I think if their was one answer Glock would have the problem solved by now. If it's one problem why all the different parts RSA's, ejectors, extractors, and so on to to try to fix the guns?
Or in the case of my first gun after replacing all the internals the gun still wouldn't stay working for more than a few hundred rounds? Several people have had GEN3 and GEN4 guns Glock couldn't fix so they simply after so many tries replaced them. In other words on some guns the maker could not solve the problem. Some are simply FUBAR. It scary when they replace all the internals and it doesn't do it. On first gun only the slide, barrel, and frame stayed. All other parts were replaced. So that would seem to point to a slide or frame problem. I would guess something amiss in regards to the slide.
Just I idea on the new production Glock issues. I have a 2011 man. G17 that I purchased used . It came with a KKM match grade fit barrel and the original barrel . I have ran the 17 with the KKM barrel 500 or so rounds with zero issues at all . I did however bring the factory barrel on one trip and the right of the back I was having FTF and FTE malfunctions . There was a total of 4 malfunctions within 50 rounds .I then threw the KKM barrel back in and back and running like a champ. I know there has been tons of talk about bad extractors but I am curious if anyone else has a upgraded barrel with or without malfuntions in a newer production Glock .
Beat Trash
03-14-12, 08:12
For those who have fixed their specific gun by substituting various aftermarket parts, I'm glad you were able to salvage your gun.
I just don't think one should have to replace new/newer parts in a gun just to get it to function reliably.
I feel the same about the current accuracy issues with some newly produced M&P 9mm's.
I really long for the dependability the 9mm Glocks displayed up to a couple of years ago.
Though as has been mentioned, even if Glock can get it's act together and permanently fix the issues, the damage to their company's reputation within the gun buying public will be tough to repair.
In your trouble shooting, you've either proven that a bunch of extractors are bad, or that something else entirely is the problem. Move on, try replacing the ejector or something. Unless I missed that in the thread....
DAVID RICHARDS
03-14-12, 09:22
It's strange. I've got a G22 police trade in that was made before the current situation. I've got a Storm Lake 9mm conversion barrel for it an an AA .22 kit. 9mm barrel dropped right in and has fired without a problem since I got it. Same with the AA conversion. So the older guns will fire fine even with an extractor and ejector made for adifferent caliber. Talk about the good old days! Wonder how conversion barrels have faired as a whole on the newer guns?
... from the 500th-600th rounds fired, the trigger shifted from normal Glock "feeling" to at least triple the trigger pull weight. ... an old non-dog leg trigger bar made the gun run right again...
I had this happen to me last night. Newly built Polymer80 G17 with Glock LPK. Shot fine for 250 rounds (plus a ton of dry firing) then all of a sudden got supper heavy on the trigger. I had a police armorer look it over and he couldn't diagnose the problem either. I performed a full strip at home and upon reassembly the trigger feels normal. But I am nervous that it could crap out on me when I least expect it. Now I will keep a spare trigger bar on hand, just in case.
bringing threads back from the dead, are we?
next time you have the trigger bar out, stone polish all the contact points. don't remove material, just polish to a shine.
bringing threads back from the dead, are we?
next time you have the trigger bar out, stone polish all the contact points. don't remove material, just polish to a shine.
Thank God for the wisdom of dead threads!
I did polish my trigger bar and connector, just yesterday, before the problem started. Maybe I took off too much material and the underlying metal, even though it looks pretty, gets "sticky" when it's hot causing the bar and connector to bind up.
I found a very similar description in another dead thread and they concluded that a drop of oil between the trigger bar and the connector makes everything right with the world. I can't wait to get back to the range now to test the theory...
https://www.glocktalk.com/threads/whats-up-with-my-trigger.1426977/page-2
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