building a full auto M16

[Rebel Rifle Ordnance]

I thought this would get your attention. I'm a new FFL 07 / SOT and I want to build a post sample M16.

Where is the best place to order a lower receiver parts kit for an M16?

Also looking for a good receiver to convert. I'm thinking Spike's since they already have the receiver marked for full auto. Any recommendations on where to order? Thanks.

[amd5007]

I am not knowledgable in the FFL 07/SOT area at all, but can't you purchase a Colt R0921 and go from there? Rather than purchasing a lower and machining it to spec.

I know my local class 3 dealer bought a full auto post 86 Colt.

[fixit69]

What exactly are you wanting? Stripped lowers, parts kits, both? If you have your SOT/FFL stamp/paperwork, I can point you in the right direction. PM me for details.

[Rebel Rifle Ordnance]

For the record, got the full auto lower parts kit here: http://www.mapartsinc.com/ for $90.

Now I'm looking for a lower that has the full auto markings and preferably doesn't have the shelf that will need to be milled out.

[machinegunbob]

I think you can go with the older Colt Sp1 lower with out milling the lower self.

[fixit69]

Quite a few using low shelfs nowandays. When your slapping a posts ample together, you want the cheapest mil spec-ish lower you can find. Remember, at some point you might you might have to chop it up. And chopping up a colt would suck.

[99HMC4]

Buy the m16 FCG parts from Brownells, it's like $60.00 shipped. Buy a cheap ass AR lower from AIM or PSA for $60.00. Get a auto sear hole jig for $35.00. Clamp in mill, 1/2"-3/4" bit and chop away. Engrave lower. It's VERY strait forward. Here's mine:
http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e187/Hypercomp01/cb3e8cd4.jpg
http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e187/Hypercomp01/060a4b15.jpg

[rcpd34]

Whose lower is that? What do you charge for engraving? I have a couple of lowers I need engraved.

Brian
07/02 FFL/SOT

[Sparky5019]

Sorry for the resurrection but who makes the best AS hole jig? I assume a Colt AS and selector and a Geissele SSF trigger would do fine. Thoughts?

Sparky

[Renegade]

Sorry for the resurrection but who makes the best AS hole jig? I assume a Colt AS and selector and a Geissele SSF trigger would do fine. Thoughts?

Sparky

I used Bowers.

[Sparky5019]

Any chance you have contact info or a link?

Thanks so much!

[Renegade]

Any chance you have contact info or a link?

Thanks so much!

Bowers is Tom Bowers - subguns.com

[Sparky5019]

Awesome! Thanks!

[trackmagic]

I was under the impression you could only use a pre-86 reciever. How do you convert a modern reciver to FA?

[Renegade]

I was under the impression you could only use a pre-86 reciever. How do you convert a modern reciver to FA?

He is FFL/SOT

[markm]

Does the Bowers jig work good? Are you all just using a drill or reaming? Or a combo of both?

[Renegade]

Does the Bowers jig work good? Are you all just using a drill or reaming? Or a combo of both?

Mill & Drill. The Bowers kit works good and also specs out the milling requirements.

[markm]

Sorry to be a pest, but this stuff is interesting... do you anodize the machine work, or just roll with it in the white?

[Sparky5019]

Now I'm going to be a pest...

What's the difference between an M16 and an M4A1 lower (both FA)?

[Renegade]

Sorry to be a pest, but this stuff is interesting... do you anodize the machine work, or just roll with it in the white?

Beater M16 gets rattle can paint job inside.

[Renegade]

Now I'm going to be a pest...

What's the difference between an M16 and an M4A1 lower (both FA)?


If you are only comparing the dimensions of the FC Pocket there is no difference AFAIK.

[markm]

Beater M16 gets rattle can paint job inside.

Cool. I've seen people get so assed up about anodized finish, but the dings on my lowers' exteriors have never oozed out alloy like melted butter.

[Sparky5019]

Thanks! I didn't think there was much difference.

Markm,

I would think AlumaBlack would work ok too. That's what Gray Laser uses post marking.

[BWT]

Cool. I've seen people get so assed up about anodized finish, but the dings on my lowers' exteriors have never oozed out alloy like melted butter.

It's something that can distinguish a factory MG and a cheap conversion.

It's kind of like the finish under the gas block. Quality MFG's do it. In reality will it matter with performance? Ultimately, not really. It's just shoddy workmanship. Also, if you were a factory, you'd have all of your holes drilled from the beginning. So it wouldn't be a factor to re anodize one.

To me, if I was buying a $16,000-18,000 MG. I might get wrapped around the spokes with that issue. I'd be more concerned honestly about a Form 1'd conversion by some guy being machined properly.

Which may be a factor. However, a sample gun that you're going to convert and engrave yourself for fun. Not a post sample with a ton of value.

I'd say anodize if you desire, but like renegade said, rattle can or bluing pen would work great.

[markm]

I was more curious to know if it was worth the effort of anodizing. And do you have to strip the whole lower and re-anodize from scratch, or can you just do the exposed surfaces, etc. I have a rough idea how anodizing works from some DIY thread I read on TOS a few years back... Just didn't know how it works on a finished receiver that's been modified since.

[mstennes]

Whose lower is that? What do you charge for engraving? I have a couple of lowers I need engraved.

Brian
07/02 FFL/SOT
I’m also a 07/02, from my understanding, you can also use the original manufactures marking, or are required to add yours as well?
https://www.atf.gov/firearms/docs/atf-national-firearms-act-handbook-chapter-7/download

[Renegade]

I’m also a 07/02, from my understanding, you can also use the original manufactures marking, or are required to add yours as well?
https://www.atf.gov/firearms/docs/atf-national-firearms-act-handbook-chapter-7/download

Throw that document away. It is old, out of date and riddled with errors.

If you are an 07/02, you should absolutely know cold you have to mark what you make. I would suggest you stop making anything till you fully understand the laws.

[mstennes]

I have not made anything, just pondering my options. I have been a 07 for a while, I just recently did my SOT. I thought it was messed up, because when I did a couple SBR’s before I got my 07, they had to be engraved. That was one of the reasons I did this because I like to buy and sell, figured I could make some $$ which I have, all transfers in Washington require a FFL now and there are none close to where I live, that will do it for less than 40.00. I charge 25.00, for people I don’t know and 20.00 for friends. I want to do some SBR’s and I figured a MK18 or M4 would’ve fun. Which actually brings my question, Where exactly are the exact requirements, are they the same as when I did my SBR’s? My business name, city and state, use the original serial number? File it on a Form 2, within 24 hours of manufacturing? On my SBR’s I did the engraving on the mag lip, is this still ok, or should I do it larger on the side of the lower? I also looked on Bowers site and did not see his jig for sale. I know I’m missing things but I’m in no huge rush, I do have a engraver that does the work per atf specs.
Thank you in advance.

[Renegade]

I have not made anything, just pondering my options. I have been a 07 for a while, I just recently did my SOT. I thought it was messed up, because when I did a couple SBR’s before I got my 07, they had to be engraved. That was one of the reasons I did this because I like to buy and sell, figured I could make some $$ which I have, all transfers in Washington require a FFL now and there are none close to where I live, that will do it for less than 40.00. I charge 25.00, for people I don’t know and 20.00 for friends. I want to do some SBR’s and I figured a MK18 or M4 would’ve fun. Which actually brings my question, Where exactly are the exact requirements, are they the same as when I did my SBR’s? My business name, city and state, use the original serial number? File it on a Form 2, within 24 hours of manufacturing? On my SBR’s I did the engraving on the mag lip, is this still ok, or should I do it larger on the side of the lower? I also looked on Bowers site and did not see his jig for sale. I know I’m missing things but I’m in no huge rush, I do have a engraver that does the work per atf specs.
Thank you in advance.

Well this thread is almost 5 years old. Bowers sold subguns.com. He now has his own site, try this https://bowersgroup.com/product/ar15-to-m16-class-2-drilling-and-check-fixtures/

CFR regulations wrt markings:


https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/27/part-479/subpart-G

[mstennes]

Well this thread is almost 5 years old. Bowers sold subguns.com. He now has his own site, try this https://bowersgroup.com/product/ar15-to-m16-class-2-drilling-and-check-fixtures/

CFR regulations wrt markings:


https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/27/part-479/subpart-G

Thanks, that helps allot. I do have a couple more questions if you don’t mind, once the paperwork is sent in can you test it? Does the ATF send confirmation back? On the marking, either I missed it or it wasn’t there, location, and I can reuse the original manufacturers, model and serial correct, I just need to add my FFL company name, plus city, and state.

[mstennes]

Well this thread is almost 5 years old. Bowers sold subguns.com. He now has his own site, try this https://bowersgroup.com/product/ar15-to-m16-class-2-drilling-and-check-fixtures/

CFR regulations wrt markings:


https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/27/part-479/subpart-G

Thanks, that helps allot. I do have a couple more questions if you don’t mind, once the paperwork is sent in can you test it? Does the ATF send confirmation back? On the marking, either I missed it or it wasn’t there, location, and I can reuse the original manufacturers, model and serial correct, I just need to add my FFL company name, plus city, and state.