View Full Version : HD weapon advice for a friend
I have a friend who's getting married in a few months and he approached me not long ago about wanting to get a gun primarily for HD, but maybe also for CC. I recommended Glock, M&P, and HK to him, in either 9mm, .40, or .45. I feel like this is pretty sound advice, the only issue is that he sent me a picture today of a Heritage Rough Rider .22 SA cowboy gun that he likes.... I told him it looked like a fun toy, but that I wouldn't defend myself with it and he responded that he didn't want a "hand cannon." :rolleyes: I told him that none of these constituted that, but then he replied "they're so damn expensive!" I'm an HK guy, but I obviously wouldn't recommend that to him if money's an issue for him. But I told him I could help him shop around for Glocks or M&Ps in the $500 range and that it would be worth it to save a little more to get something proven and of high quality/reliability/durability, etc. (not to mention stopping power).
So, my question is: do you guys have anything else that I should recommend to him that's reasonably priced (maybe no more than $500) that would fit his needs, that I haven't mentioned to him?
Thanks!
My dad has a Taurus 9mm. I think its a PT111 or something like that. Its been a great gun. The trigger is a little heavy for my liking but it has a few thousand rounds through it with no issuse. Itll eat anything you feed it. Trust me we have tryed it. I think theyre under $400 still.
Tell him to pick up a Mossberg 500 for HD.
If it has to be a pistol, I always try to recommend 9mm and something with a safety to a first time pistol owner.
IMHO, striker fired pistols with "safe actions" are a recipe for disaster for pistol newbies, but I'm pretty conservative by nature.
How serious is your friend about shooting? and how serious is he about HD? Two questions you need to ask him. If he approached you and asked for advice then turned around and talked about a SA .22 because he likes it. Seems like he didn't really take your advice. Is he a new shooter and will he put the money and time in to get better and become confident in his skills? I would go with a Gen 3 Glock 19. I carry mine on duty for all operations and Off duty as well. Perfect size weapon as long as you do not have extremely thick fingers and hands as those will get in the way during stress reloads and even normal reloads sometimes. I have no problem manipulating the gun with gloves on and im 6'8 with big ole hands haha. HD and protecting yourself is very serious and I know the chances are very small that he will need to use the gun, But taking a saying from an instructor. everyone will have that one percent in life where they either have to draw or dispatch a target. If he's just looking to shoot on the weekend occasionally and sling some lead downrange then steer him in that direction with a pistol he would like. But if he is serious about training and defense then explain to him what he needs and how he needs to get there.
Guns-up.50
03-22-12, 19:57
It seems as though you pretty much have it covered, look for used glocks, m&ps ect.
Its kind of funny someone wanting a cheap gun for self defense. Its his life though, right! This is a big one to go cheap with :confused:
I'd say a 12G shotty is perfect for HD. However, if $500 is too much try looking for LEO trades. That's how I pick up most of my guns. G3. Glock w/nightlights $350, Cleveland PD S&W 5946 $350 and another for $250. Colt A3 $650....
If this is going to be mainly a HD weapon and MAYBE one day a CC piece then I recommend the last gen S&W steel autos such as the 5906, 5946, 4006...very tough, durable guns. Built like tanks. The **06 have a DA/SA trigger and a slide mounted safety. Avg price $300.
Tell him to pick up a Mossberg 500 for HD.
If it has to be a pistol, I always try to recommend 9mm and something with a safety to a first time pistol owner.
IMHO, striker fired pistols with "safe actions" are a recipe for disaster for pistol newbies, but I'm pretty conservative by nature.
He asked me about a shotgun, but then mentioned he also wanted a pistol to carry so I told him he'd be better off putting the money he'd spend on the two on a good pistol he could use for both HD and CC.
And I recommended a G19 as many have talked about it being a perfect size for duty and CC; and a good combo of size and firepower. But I do think that something with a safety would probably be best for him, so I also recommended the M&P9c. Grant has them for $480 I believe.
Its kind of funny someone wanting a cheap gun for self defense. Its his life though, right! This is a big one to go cheap with
This is exactly what I told him. :/
Jaxx, I don't think he's that serious at all about shooting. He's just concerned about being able to protect himself and his soon-to-be wife. Understandable for sure, but still, I see that to be no reason to not get something reliable and of good quality.
Try selling the reasons why you need something in a more substantial caliber than .22 by talking about how there are standards that must be met and that is why police, FBI, military, etc carry pistols in the range of 9MM, 40 S&W, and 45 for a reason and make sure its clear that it isn't a death ray as LE and Mil both use much more substantial weapons when things go down when they can and that pistols are more "better than nothing" even if 9MM.
From there work on the major brands where you should be able to (once again) use real world examples and give reasons why quality is important.
Going after a particular pet model is one of the last things and your "give" point to show there is compromise. Best have compromise at something not as crucial as caliber and good vs bad quality.
He asked me about a shotgun, but then mentioned he also wanted a pistol to carry so I told him he'd be better off putting the money he'd spend on the two on a good pistol he could use for both HD and CC.
And I recommended a G19 as many have talked about it being a perfect size for duty and CC; and a good combo of size and firepower. But I do think that something with a safety would probably be best for him, so I also recommended the M&P9c. Grant has them for $480 I believe.
This is exactly what I told him. :/
Jaxx, I don't think he's that serious at all about shooting. He's just concerned about being able to protect himself and his soon-to-be wife. Understandable for sure, but still, I see that to be no reason to not get something reliable and of good quality.
Roger that and I know your trying to be a good friend, but just make sure he knows he will be accountable for every bullet that leaves his weapon if or when he discharges it. He needs to know especially how ammunition works and how they penetrate (walls, cars, flesh, etc..). Maybe if you have a few handguns. take him to the range and let him try them out and try and teach him some things he needs to know. especially if he's not to into shooting. Still needs to know which end to point at the bad guy haha. also I'd recommend to him getting a nice flashlight to go with the handgun.
John Fritz
03-22-12, 21:13
CDNN has the Beretta 92FS on sale right now for $499.00 and that's a smokin' gun for a smokin' price.
Or how about one of those Smith 5906 trade-ins for three hundred?
How abut a CZ75BD? Or a Taurus PT92? A SIG P6?
Does he want a revolver? Does he want plastic fantastic? Has he been to a range and rented anything to try out? About the only thing I would insist on were he my friend would be that he start out with a 9mm whatever make/model gun he decides to go with.
And I would probably recommend that he stay away from striker fire / 1911 style pistols for his first gun.
Try selling the reasons why you need something in a more substantial caliber than .22 by talking about how there are standards that must be met and that is why police, FBI, military, etc carry pistols in the range of 9MM, 40 S&W, and 45 for a reason and make sure its clear that it isn't a death ray as LE and Mil both use much more substantial weapons when things go down when they can and that pistols are more "better than nothing" even if 9MM.
From there work on the major brands where you should be able to (once again) use real world examples and give reasons why quality is important.
I've already done some of that, though I'm sure he could do with hearing some more. And I'm not trying to force any one gun on him, just trying to steer him in the right direction of some good brands/calibers. When he very first approached me, he said he wanted a 1911 (I was thinking he'd come to the wrong place as I know very little about 1911s, for the most part) and next thing I know he's gone the complete opposite direction and wants a SA .22 revolver. :rollseyes:
I'm trying to point him in the 9mm direction as he has very little experience with pistols and I can also see him not liking the price of .40 and .45 ammo. Also, I can see wanting him to have a hammer fired gun with a safety from a cautious perspective, but I can also see him getting hung up with the more controls that a gun like the M9 or CZ has, as opposed to something like a Glock or even an M&P with a safety. I'm fine with stuff like that, but I grew up shooting a Browning Hi-Power and a Walther P22, and I now carry a P30S, but for someone like him who has minimal experience, I'm inclined to think simpler is better. Just me.
Again, I'm trying not to push him in any direction. Just trying to give him help as he asks and let him make his own decision, but I just don't want him to settle, when he may be staking his or his wife's life on the purchase.
Glock 17 or 19 + NS + SF X300 + 3 spare mags + RCS Phantom holster and carriers + 500 rounds of practice ammo + reputable 2-3 day class = the perfect entry to the handgun world.
Glock 17 or 19 + NS + SF X300 + 3 spare mags + RCS Phantom holster and carriers + 500 rounds of practice ammo + reputable 2-3 day class = the perfect entry to the handgun world.
I won't refute that. Unfortunately, if I showed him this, I think he might have a heart attach. At least after he saw how much all of that would cost him haha.
How about an fnp 9. Can be had pretty cheap now a days, and has a safety.
Sounds like he needs to gain some more experience before cc. For a solid HD pistol I would reccomend several pistols; ruger sr9/40, sig pro, SW sigma, almost anything from Taurus.
Personally, if he really needs some hd, there's nothing better than a pump shotty. I'm sure that once that intruder hears that thing pump, he knows to get the eff out!
I figure if a guy isn't willing to spend more than what he pays for car insurance a year on a handgun/ammo/training than he is hopeless.
For a solid HD pistol I would reccomend several pistols; ruger sr9/40, sig pro, SW sigma, almost anything from Taurus.
I'm going to respectfully disagree with a couple of your recommendations. On second thought, I would not recommend any of those.
A stock Glock, M&P, or PPQ is about as cheap as I get when it come to the tools that will protect my life.
I won't refute that. Unfortunately, if I showed him this, I think he might have a heart attach. At least after he saw how much all of that would cost him haha.
Then start with the stock Glock and ammo which should run him about $600-700. He can use it as a HD gun until he gets the training and other accessories needed to carry concealed in a responsible manner. Consider a gently used pistol if cost is still a concern. All of the other accessories can be added at a later date after the training.
Bottom line, resist the urge to by a cheap pistol.
CDNN has brand new full size M&P 9 / 40 for $425. For that price you get a lot of pistol and much more reliable than a Taurs (no offense retaks).
In the motorcycling world there's a saying
"buy a $50 helmet for a $50 head"
If he's unwilling to spend what it costs to purchase a pistol of sufficient quality to defend himself and his new family then he's not really interested in what he says he is.
I don't waste a lot of time with these people. I have helped multiple friends purchase firearms over the years. This involves going with them to the store, having them look at multiple guns, and then spending several hours at home going over the fundamentals prior to going to the range and learning to shoot. If I get grief at any point along the way, I tell them "good luck" and move on.
You can't make someone get their head right, and trying will just make you want to bash your own in with a hammer.
Honestly, dont worry about it, you already told him your opinion, let him decide.
l tried for years to get my friends and family from buying retarded guns as well as all other types of shit. 95% of the time they still buy something retarded.
For whatever reason, smart gun purchases are hard to choose, for even otherwise logical people. In my experience with guns people either "get it" or they dont and usually no amount of reason really helps. They either end up with a few glocks and a good AR or 10 completely different cheap CC pistols a high point carbine and an sks.
Let him read actual cases of armed self defense (like the Ayoob files) and ask if he would like to face such an event with a .22.
polymorpheous
03-23-12, 05:19
Why the hell are posters recommending Taurus and Sigma?
Tell him to get a G19.
Why not look at a XD? I feel the extra safety [backstrap] on a XD might help a new shooter from shooting himself in the leg while holstering, etc, like we have ben seeing lately with the glocks.
Plus they come in in the $500.00 range.
Just the .02 from a new guy.
JB
How about the S&W 6906? About the same size as a G26 or an M&P9c so they are small and dont look like "hand cannons". They are cheap, $350+/-, double stack 12 rounds and have 2 safeties. The first is the slide thumb safety/decocker and the second is the mag disconnect safety. With the mag safety he can keep one in the chamber and the mag separate but close by that way all he has to do is insert the mag and he's ready. Thats if he "feels unsafe" with a loaded gun laying around.
Tell him to look around for used guns. I routinely find used Glocks, XDs, M&Ps, Berettas, etc for under $500 and they are as good as new!
Personally, if he really needs some hd, there's nothing better than a pump shotty. I'm sure that once that intruder hears that thing pump, he knows to get the eff out!
Or it just tells the intruder that you're armed, and where you are in the house. Spend more time reading around here in the Training section. Plethora of reasons as to why you shouldn't rely on the sound of the action to drive off an intruder.
Why the hell are posters recommending Taurus and Sigma?
Probably because they are career criminals who want to minimize the chances of facing a functional weapon on their next home invasion. ;)
I made those reccomendations because this guy thinks $150 is already a lot for a pistol.
If he already wants to use some cheaply made .22 left for HD, a Taurus or low end sig would be 5 steps in the right direction.
Hard to take someone from 150 to 600 who wil think a .22lr is "good enough" for HD
JackFanToM
03-23-12, 08:52
i picked up an M&P 9mm for $210 used. The gun is in great condition, and I have slowly been replacing parts that I planned to replace anyway. This may be a viable answer for you buddy.
Have him look at used J or K frame revolvers. Based on what you have told us, unless he gets bit hard by the shooting bug... he won't be practicing at all.
And forget about him not wanting to spend money to protect himself... what about his new bride??? People never cease to disappoint me.
Have him look at a S&W revolver, mossburg 500, or used glock.
The XD is not a good choice. I have seen too many issues with three of them I have had close friends buy and shoot over the years.
Also the grip safety on the XD won't save any one from an ND.
I think this place called jetguns is selling Walther PPQ's for around $460ish.
And I'm not trying to force any one gun on him, just trying to steer him in the right direction of some good brands/calibers.
I actually sort of advocate putting pressure towards a poison of choice (as long as its a good one of course). When done right it creates ground to give and should increase the chances of ending up in a general direction (pushing for an HK can lead them to getting a Glock) vs going general and having them stop shy of it (advocating HK, Glock, S&W, etc and them ending up with a hi-point).
Of course starting smaller and working your way up also works fairly well (get him onto some cheaper 9MMs then work up to something like a Glock).
Starting where you want to be is more hit or miss. Goes along with what others have said "they either get it or don't" where you rely more on them getting it by starting at the end.
Anyone who purchases a firearm for SD/HD without some type of training is stupid! You have to learn how to drive, take a road test, buy a reliable car and keep a decent record to drive a vehicle because you can kill someone! Same applies to a firearm!
Good Luck!
Have him look at a S&W revolver, mossburg 500, or used glock.
The XD is not a good choice. I have seen too many issues with three of them I have had close friends buy and shoot over the years.
Also the grip safety on the XD won't save any one from an ND.
I think this place called jetguns is selling Walther PPQ's for around $460ish.
I own 4 XD's and shoot the competitively and am consistently in the top 5, without as much as a FTF. I have never seen a issue with a XD.
I also hold a FFL and we sell XD's at a rate of 20 to 1 over glocks. In my area glocks just dont sell.
Do a search on ND's and see what comes up. You will see that the people shooting themselves while holstering, or most recently while hitting the seatbelt release, were carrying a glock and not a XD. The extra safety WILL add a extra element of safety when it come to a holster flexing and hitting the trigger and going BOOM like it does on a glock. I can see this is a glock fan boy forum by the overwelming ammount of glock threads, but I refuse to jump on that band wagon. Sorry to go against the grain but a XD is a quality handgun.
http://i215.photobucket.com/albums/cc235/911JB/030-2.jpg
I own 4 XD's and shoot the competitively and am consistently in the top 5, without as much as a FTF. I have never seen a issue with a XD.
I also hold a FFL and we sell XD's at a rate of 20 to 1 over glocks. In my area glocks just dont sell.
Do a search on ND's and see what comes up. You will see that the people shooting themselves while holstering, or most recently while hitting the seatbelt release, were carrying a glock and not a XD. The extra safety WILL add a extra element of safety when it come to a holster flexing and hitting the trigger and going BOOM like it does on a glock. I can see this is a glock fan boy forum by the overwelming ammount of glock threads, but I refuse to jump on that band wagon. Sorry to go against the grain but a XD is a quality handgun.
No offense, but most of your customers probably dont shoot enough to see problems. I'd rather listen to LAV who sees many and all type of handguns in his classes or David Bowie who spends more time repairing XDs than enhancing them. Also, the glock has no safety issues, this forum is geared towards knowledgeable shooters who take the time to learn proper weapons manipulation, to most here the extra XD safety would be a hindrance.
No offense, but most of your customers probably dont shoot enough to see problems. I'd rather listen to LAV who sees many and all type of handguns in his classes or David Bowie who spends more time repairing XDs than enhancing them. Also, the glock has no safety issues, this forum is geared towards knowledgeable shooters who take the time to learn proper weapons manipulation, to most here the extra XD safety would be a hindrance.
No offense taken, However just because a person is not as experienced with a weapon really don't matter when it comes to a ND such as I am talking about. Yes we can say that a experienced shooter probably wont shoot themself in the hip . Yes we can blame the holster, yes we can blame any number of things, but when it all boils down the gun still went off when it should not have. In this case the backstrap safety of a XD probably would have saved this from happening. If that backstrap safety was not engaged when the holster failed and hit the trigger the gun would not have went off period. Now I am not saying that a glock is junk, after 40+ years of firearm experience I know better than that, I am just saying that a XD is far from junk.
If this small item is going to be a issue with the members here I can see that I am in the wrong place. I joined this forum because I enjoy the M-4 and thought this would be a good place to chat with like minded individuals. However with this glock is king attitude I am seeing here I may have ben mistaken.
Best regards to this forum and apologies to the OP for hijacking this thread.
JB
Have him look at used J or K frame revolvers.
^
This. You may have to help him find one, but ratty Model 10's and Model 13's are still out there for $200 or so. J-frames are usually more expensive, and they're harder to shoot well. Try to keep him in a 38 Special or 357. Other J- and K-frame calibers can be too expensive for a newlywed to shoot.
Okie John
No offense taken, However just because a person is not as experienced with a weapon really don't matter when it comes to a ND such as I am talking about. Yes we can say that a experienced shooter probably wont shoot themself in the hip . Yes we can blame the holster, yes we can blame any number of things, but when it all boils down the gun still went off when it should not have. In this case the backstrap safety of a XD probably would have saved this from happening. If that backstrap safety was not engaged when the holster failed and hit the trigger the gun would not have went off period. Now I am not saying that a glock is junk, after 40+ years of firearm experience I know better than that, I am just saying that a XD is far from junk.
If this small item is going to be a issue with the members here I can see that I am in the wrong place. I joined this forum because I enjoy the M-4 and thought this would be a good place to chat with like minded individuals. However with this glock is king attitude I am seeing here I may have ben mistaken.
Best regards to this forum and apologies to the OP for hijacking this thread.
JB
I'm not saying the XD is a terrible weapon just that there are certainly better(quality) options out there. I don't think this is a glock is king forum, of course glock has a great track record both in durability and reliability but I for example prefer other handguns(P30). This forum is not about putting down manufacturers or a products unjustly, we are about quality gear and training, the criticism given to products is only to help others and to hopefully change of influence some of the manufacturers products into becoming better.
As for the holster thing, it is a non-issue if you buy a quality holster(i.e. RC phantom), there is a reason many instructors have banned serpa or serpa like holsters from their classes.
As for the OP, what about trying to get a police trade-in glock or similar the usually run @ or under $400.
Nephrology
03-23-12, 19:22
Just get him to buy a Glock. There are millions of the things floating around used. An old Gen 2 or Gen 3 G22/G17s out there. Get him to get one of those. It'll be fine.
^
This. You may have to help him find one, but ratty Model 10's and Model 13's are still out there for $200 or so. J-frames are usually more expensive, and they're harder to shoot well. Try to keep him in a 38 Special or 357. Other J- and K-frame calibers can be too expensive for a newlywed to shoot.
Okie John
JG sales still has some smith & wesson dao model 64s for sale. I think if I remember right they were in the $300 to $35o range.
I can see this is a glock fan boy forum by the overwelming ammount of glock threads, but I refuse to jump on that band wagon.
I find that most folks here jump on the reliability bandwagon. Yes, that means Glock, but it can also mean Beretta, SIG, S&W, HK, and a bunch of other names.
People here also jump on the bandwagon of getting lots of serious training from ex-SOCOM shooters. Many of them compete, but they take matches with a grain of salt since matches tend to lead people toward winning matches instead of winning fights.
And finally, I find that people here jump on the bandwagon of shooting a LOT. I know for a fact that I'm far from the only guy here who shoots over 10k rounds through his carry gun every year.
Between us, we've tried just about everything out there. We've earned our opinions on the range and on duty. In the spirit of fairness, I'd like to ask you to keep the same open mind that you're asking of us. Read the Glock threads more closely. You’ll find that people here have very serious questions about them, especially about reliability and accuracy. Then do search for XD threads—there are plenty of them. You may find that we have pretty good reasons for our choices.
Good shooting,
Okie John
I find that most folks here jump on the reliability bandwagon. Yes, that means Glock, but it can also mean Beretta, SIG, S&W, HK, and a bunch of other names.
People here also jump on the bandwagon of getting lots of serious training from ex-SOCOM shooters. Many of them compete, but they take matches with a grain of salt since matches tend to lead people toward winning matches instead of winning fights.
And finally, I find that people here jump on the bandwagon of shooting a LOT. I know for a fact that I'm far from the only guy here who shoots over 10k rounds through his carry gun every year.
Between us, we've tried just about everything out there. We've earned our opinions on the range and on duty. In the spirit of fairness, I'd like to ask you to keep the same open mind that you're asking of us. Read the Glock threads more closely. You’ll find that people here have very serious questions about them, especially about reliability and accuracy. Then do search for XD threads—there are plenty of them. You may find that we have pretty good reasons for our choices.
Good shooting,
Okie John
Agreed John, I will keep an open mind while viewing these threads. However with the glock, glock, glock talk everywhere it will be a challenge.
A couple other points. I am far from a new shooter. I have ben pulling a trigger, either hunting, punching paper or in a comp for 40 years now and like you 10k rounds a year is a average year. That is one of the reasons I said that a XD is in the top tier of pistols. With that many rounds running through my firearms , many of them being my own reloads with my own cast boolits and not as much as a FTF I have the tendency of bragging on them.
While my XD is my preferred handgun, I also like my Beretta 96 as well a my Browning. With over 100 firearms in my personal stable and 800 in the shop, I do get the chance to test many different firearms. If I could ever get the glock to feel natural in my hand I may feel different about them, however every time I shoot one, even though they group well I feel like I am hunting for the sights after every shot.
What I tell every customer is to find the handgun that naturally fits you. For me that is the XD, for the next guy it may be the glock and the next a Sig. We all have different hands and what works for one may not work for the next.
Respects JB
I can see this is a glock fan boy forum by the overwelming ammount of glock threads, but I refuse to jump on that band wagon. Sorry to go against the grain but a XD is a quality handgun.
If this small item is going to be a issue with the members here I can see that I am in the wrong place. I joined this forum because I enjoy the M-4 and thought this would be a good place to chat with like minded individuals. However with this glock is king attitude I am seeing here I may have ben mistaken.
Right, the "small issue" of you calling people names and then getting bent out of shape when they take offense. Based on that alone, yes, I think you're in the wrong place.
Right, the "small issue" of you calling people names and then getting bent out of shape when they take offense. Based on that alone, yes, I think you're in the wrong place.
That wasn't even close to name calling and bent out of shape. If I got wound up every trime I have heard the term fanboy I would be wound up like a eight day clock.
http://i215.photobucket.com/albums/cc235/911JB/motorcycle.gif
Thanks for all the input guys. I'll try to pass most of this on to him.
Couple of things:
I can see if he's interested in a revolver, but I'm just not a revolver guy, so my knowledge as far as what to tell him on that (other than what I've seen here) is very slim. Also, I'm honestly probably not going to push the shotgun thing, and for this same reason:
Or it just tells the intruder that you're armed, and where you are in the house. Spend more time reading around here in the Training section. Plethora of reasons as to why you shouldn't rely on the sound of the action to drive off an intruder.
Also, I remember seeing a sticky on here talking about how shotguns aren't the quintessential HD weapon, and like anything else they require training and aren't just point-it-in-the-general-direction-and-blow-anything-away kind of guns. Just me though. My Mossberg 500 sits put away unloaded most of the time, and my P30 and BCM are my go to guns for HD. YMMV.
And all the debate over no safety, or grip safety, or thumb safety, etc would probably be something he would need to sit down and figure out after handling some different guns. Honestly, as he can probably count on one hand the number of times he's handled a handgun, I feel like simpler would be better (i.e. Glock, M&P with no safety), but then if he's nervous about no safety, then something like an M&P with a safety. I just think if he starts having to learn DA, or DA/SA, and cocked and locked, or safety on or off, etc. he's just going to get confused and frustrated. I could be completely wrong, but I don't see him spending tons of time practicing with it and getting used to more complex platforms. For him I think point and shoot may be best, but ultimately that would be for him to decide after trying different things.
I don't know what will come of all of this with him. We shall see. I'll give updates next time he asks me about it.
Sounds like he needs to gain some more experience before cc. For a solid HD pistol I would reccomend several pistols; ruger sr9/40, sig pro, SW sigma, almost anything from Taurus.
Personally, if he really needs some hd, there's nothing better than a pump shotty. I'm sure that once that intruder hears that thing pump, he knows to get the eff out!
Not sure if serious.....?
And yes, to the uneducated a shotgun is a do all weapon.
Check this gun out for your friend. Its by a Bulgarian company called Arcus. I have one with 400 rounds in it without any FTF or FTE.
http://www.gunetc.com/2010/02/01/arcus-98-review/
Look around, You'll find a lot of used Glocks at pawnshops for less than $400. AIM surplus has them in stock for like $360+ shipping. Not saying Glock is the best out there, but they work, parts are cheap, and accessories are easy to find. The Glock 19/23 are pretty good, all-around size.
If he feels like he needs a safety to safely operate the gun, he needs more training. Just my opinion.
Mossberg shotty at Academy is $189 last time I checked.
Case of 9mm is (used to be) $200.
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