View Full Version : What do you look for?
ironman2284
04-30-12, 08:16
Hi all - I'm beginning my quest to purchase my first AR.
I've read The Chart and various threads on this site -- very informative; much appreciated.
My primary reason for purchase is for home protection. Given that, reliability is my number one concern. I do not mind paying a bit of a premium for quality. I see on The Chart that Colt and BCM rate well. I have also heard good things about RRA.
I'm interested in your thoughts on what I should consider beyond my number one concern: quality/reliability. What do YOU look for when you are buying an AR for home defense?
Ouroborous
04-30-12, 08:23
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=7376
I looked for several years before finally buying one. I was considering BCM, DD, LMT, Noveske, LWRC, and even considered building a high end. I read pages and pages and pages of articles toting one over the other, read every review I could find, watched youtube videos till wee hours of the morning, talked to every guy or gal behind the counter of a dozen or so gun shops, and friends who owned these rifles. Shot all but the Noveske, none of my friends own one. I finally decided on the LMT CQB MRP, it has a fantastic reputation, as do the others but it seemed to me to be the best choice. When I shot it the first time I knew it was the one I would probably buy.
Do your research, read this forum, it has an immense amount of Knowledge within it's pages, I would endorse any of the rifles I listed above, I know for a fact that they all have a great record (through real research). I'm not saying not to buy a RRA, I'm sure it's a great rifle, I just didn't really include it in my research. So do this, READ, HANDLE, and ASK PEOPLE.
I know that's a bit of a ramble, but it's all I got:-)
HAHA just noticed this is my first post here:-)
Good luck Sir, I wish you luck in your journey!
Fetep
doubleajaybrock
04-30-12, 08:34
Pay the extra money ($100-150) and avoid RRA, It will be worth it in the long run!
Hello and welcome to the forum! I see that the members are already giving you good advice.
For a quality defensive tool, I would look at BCM, Colt, DD, KAC, Noveske, etc.
C4
ironman2284
04-30-12, 10:06
Thank you all for your input and suggestions so far.
Is it fair to say that each rifle will cycle similarily ... it's more important how they "feel" vs action?
I ask because it could be a challenge finding rifles from each brand lineup to actually squeeze some rounds off.
I've shot RRA and Stag ... both stock A2 variants and although they felt slightly different, the action seemed very comparable - to my untrained hands.
Is it fair to say that each rifle will cycle similarily ... it's more important how they "feel" vs action?
Not sure what you mean by "cycle similarly", but all of the brands mentioned above will serve you well and are known to be extremely reliable. From there it is really a matter of price.
As far as "feel" goes, just buy a reputable rifle and make changes as deemed necessary. It doesn't have to be accessorized right away, take the time to make it the most comfortable and also most practical for your needs.
They will feel similar. Slight changes will be noticed depending on gas length, buffer system, comp/brake, etc.
ironman2284
04-30-12, 10:41
Thanks for your response. To clarify, I meant does the cycle action ... the recoil, the cartridge ejection, the loading of the next round, etc, feel the same across all brands - assuming you're firing the same variant?
If so, I would imagine that going with one of the better brands, and then from there the most comfortable feel when holding it is the way to go.
If not, then I'd imagine you would want to fire some rounds from many of the top manufacturers to note the subtleties?
polymorpheous
04-30-12, 10:46
The feel will all depend on variables in the gas system.
Length of gas system.
Bolt carrier weight.
Buffer weight.
Action sprig weight.
Also consider muzzle devices.
Some comps will soften the recoil considerably.
Hello and welcome to the forum! I see that the members are already giving you good advice.
For a quality defensive tool, I would look at BCM, Colt, DD, KAC, Noveske, etc.
C4
These are the only brands I look at when I buy a rifle
Thanks for your response. To clarify, I meant does the cycle action ... the recoil, the cartridge ejection, the loading of the next round, etc, feel the same across all brands - assuming you're firing the same variant?
If it is really that important to you and you have a little extra to spend, KAC is known to make the softest and smoothest firing AR variant. Normally however the factors are as stated by Polymorpheous and pretty much typical across the board.
These are the only brands I look at when I buy a rifle
Same here.
Colt, DD, BCM, Noveske....
I dont know who told you RRA was good to go - or under what context, if you are just plinking on the ranch - great. If you ever plan on using the firearm as a self defense weapon then stick with the weapons above. RRA is fairly well known amongst those who really know these rifles for using inferior parts and sketchy quality control. Good luck!!
ironman2284
04-30-12, 11:01
Thank you, all. This was exactly what I was hoping to find out.
Same here.
Colt, DD, BCM, Noveske....
I dont know who told you RRA was good to go - or under what context, if you are just plinking on the ranch - great. If you ever plan on using the firearm as a self defense weapon then stick with the weapons above. RRA is fairly well known amongst those who really know these rifles for using inferior parts and sketchy quality control. Good luck!!
And LMT :p
ironman2284
04-30-12, 12:56
Some comps will soften the recoil considerably.
Polymorpheous - what are comps?
Do you have a preferred gas system set up that I should consider?
I look for a roll mark that says LaRue, KAC, Colt, DD, BCM, or Noveske.
Ouroborous
04-30-12, 13:21
Compensators. Check out the Battlecomp 1.5 or 2.0 for reduced recoil if that's what you're after.
Bizzarolibe
04-30-12, 13:21
Hi all - I'm beginning my quest to purchase my first AR.
I've read The Chart and various threads on this site -- very informative; much appreciated.
My primary reason for purchase is for home protection. Given that, reliability is my number one concern. I do not mind paying a bit of a premium for quality. I see on The Chart that Colt and BCM rate well. I have also heard good things about RRA.
I'm interested in your thoughts on what I should consider beyond my number one concern: quality/reliability. What do YOU look for when you are buying an AR for home defense?
If the AR is for home defense, my primary considerations (aside from reliability of course) would be weight, barrel length (the shorter the better), and gas system (preferably mid-length). Of course, there are other variables as well that will affect how the rifle shoots, such as buffer, buffer spring, muzzle device, etc. My home defense setup is a Spikes 14.5" mid-length with a light profile barrel w/ Vortex flash hider, an Aimpoint T-1, and a light. Also, I would avoid RRA if I were you. There are much better options out there for the money.
You will do fine with the brands mentioned, I own all of them. I used to own an RRA, but the only thing left that is indeed RRA is the receiver and thats it. Everything else has been swapped out and upgraded. Good luck.
I'm interested in your thoughts on what I should consider beyond my number one concern: quality/reliability. What do YOU look for when you are buying an AR for home defense?
Beyond the number one concern is all personal preference, and is based on personal use of the AR-type firearm. The only way to get there is shooting it. I would not consider any firearm a defensive tool until I had training, so it tends to work out well in that if you buy a basic carbine and get (quality) training you'll be more familiar and can adjust accordingly. Barring getting into successive gunfights, further training further refines the carbine and accessories. With experience also comes the ability to evaluate various products, to an extent, without seeing them. For example, if one has used 4-rail free-float handguards in the past but found them to be too fat with the rail covers installed, they might see pictures of a slick-side handguard with a smaller OD and identify that as something they might want to try. Or someone that was shooting with an A2 and found themselves to be outrunning the recoil of the gun might want to try a muzzle brake or compensator. Then they find out how obnoxious their brake is. Then they try one that's supposed to be less obnoxious. Then an instructor picks up their gun in the middle of malfunction clearance drill and shoots the piss out of it right next to the shooter. Then they get smoked on rapid-fire drills by guys running flash hiders in the same class. Then they go back to the A2.
:p
Without the training and experience all you have to go on are aesthetics. Some will tell you they can do "internet research" but that's hogwash. The least expensive route is to buy a basic carbine and shoot the piss out of it, and make changes as NEEDED.
ironman2284
04-30-12, 15:08
Fantastic. I've taken the NRA FIRST Rifle class with an AR (side note: this is where I was told to consider RRA), and am going to be looking for additional training from here.
I am not over-eager to start stripping down a factory-built AR and accessorizing. I'm glad to hear that sticking with the stock build is an appropriate way to start the rifle ownership.
Fantastic. I've taken the NRA FIRST Rifle class with an AR (side note: this is where I was told to consider RRA), and am going to be looking for additional training from here.
I am not over-eager to start stripping down a factory-built AR and accessorizing. I'm glad to hear that sticking with the stock build is an appropriate way to start the rifle ownership.
I think it's the best way to do anything. If you're going to buy a fast car, why not drive it until you've reached the mechanical limits of it the way it comes so that you have a baseline from which to build and compare any improvements later down the line? and then when you install those drag radials you can say "oh, my best 1/4 mile with street tires was 14 seconds and the DRs got me into the 13s!"
Same thing goes for this. People should really have a set of drills and performance standards that they know how they score on a regular basis so that when they do make changes they can have something to compare to. If an Eotech makes you faster than an Aimpoint, how do you know? and if you just feel faster, how do you quantify the improvement? Unless you know that your fastest ever time on the 1-5 drill was 4 seconds and the day after you install and zero the Eotech you do it in 3.5 seconds, how can anyone know (much less tell others) that they are faster? Accuracy is the same way. If you know that you can shoot a 3" group at 100 yards with a red dot from monopod prone and you get closer to 2" with a magnified optic, that tells you something useful you can have to validate the hypothesis.
Bloom's Taxonomy (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bloom's_Taxonomy) is a good process to apply to these things.
Great advice rob_s. I started out with a basic Double Star DS-4 carbine rifle kit and a stripped lower, ran it as a stock weapon for a few years then slowly accessorized.
Great advice rob_s. I started out with a basic Double Star DS-4 carbine rifle kit and a stripped lower, ran it as a stock weapon for a few years then slowly accessorized.
While I might not personally choose that brand, I think that's a great application of the lower-cost brands. Some guys buy a lower-cost rifle and then accessorize it up right out of the gate to be just as expensive as a better gun, all without ever firing a shot. Why not use the lower cost gun to get out and shoot with less money invested and really learn how to operate the firearm and get good with it and evaluate their own needs based on that direct use?
I couldn't agree more, the only reason I got that brand is because I didn't have a computer nor did I know about the better bcm, dd, Noveske etc. and its the only one the 3 gun stores In my area recommended. It served its purpose, and I didn't have a complaint with it, but now that I know of the higher quality guns out there, I'm going to stick mainly with those three
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.5 Copyright © 2024 vBulletin Solutions, Inc. All rights reserved.