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View Full Version : Screwed up, need advice please



toddackerman
01-11-08, 09:45
Man, I'm such a putz sometimes!

Was loading on my 550, and wanted to make an adjustment on one of the dies. After I adjusted, I went on my merry way, and realized that my powder bar wasn't actuating. The result is that I have about 15 cartridges with no powder in them. The bigger problem is that they're mixed in with about 300 rounds of reloads.

How can I determine which loads have powder and which ones don't? I have weighed some known good, loaded sample lots, but the deviation on cast lead 200 gn. SWC is very close to the powder charge of 5.8 gns. meaning that any loaded round may or may not weigh out light, and there's still powder in the case.

I'm fearing the answer is to pull them, but I'd probably opt to trash them before going to all that problem. I could also fire them and then hammer out the slug from the barrel, but again, that's a major PITA.

Thanks for the help!

Kurt Reifert
01-11-08, 10:04
With a cast bullet and light powder charge you probably won't be able to seperate by weight.
The only safe thing to do is pull them.
It's never a good idea to throw out live rounds in the trash.

PaigeB
01-11-08, 10:09
If the case loads are not compressed there is a sound check you can do. Hold each round to your ear and shake it. You will be able to hear the powder moving back and forth. I do this to each round during my post-reload check.

tiger seven
01-11-08, 10:26
If the case loads are not compressed there is a sound check you can do. Hold each round to your ear and shake it. You will be able to hear the powder moving back and forth. I do this to each round during my post-reload check.

This is what I was thinking as well. With most of my handgun loads I can hear the powder moving around inside the case.

It's the only thing I can think of short of pulling them.

Derek

markm
01-11-08, 11:20
I had a veteran reloader tell me about doing something similar once.

I now have my 550 set up so that I can see the powder charge every time I put a bullet on top of it. It gives me a much higher level of confidence in my ammo.

toddackerman
01-11-08, 11:29
I had a veteran reloader tell me about doing something similar once.

I now have my 550 set up so that I can see the powder charge every time I put a bullet on top of it. It gives me a much higher level of confidence in my ammo.

Yeah...I hear ya'. All I need to do is raise my chair up about an inch to do this. Good point. It was getting late, and I inadvertently screwed up the powder measure so it was binding on the control rod and not actuating. I wouldn't have had to do this, but the seater die can't come out without either taking off the powder measure, or loosening it and turning it around a little so the seater lock ring can clear the powder measure collet area.

I'm going to try the shake and listen method, If that doesn't work...it'll make for some good transition drills!

I'm just glad I only have 10-15 rounds to look fo...and not 87!

I just could not resist. :)

toddackerman
01-11-08, 12:13
If the case loads are not compressed there is a sound check you can do. Hold each round to your ear and shake it. You will be able to hear the powder moving back and forth. I do this to each round during my post-reload check.

I've tried this and can't determine of it's the powder or the movement of my hand and arm. Do you think a stethoscope or Peltor Electronic hearing protectors would help. The Peltors seem to magnify normal noise on the range. I'll try them, but still need some advice on the stethoscope.

Thanks!

markm
01-11-08, 12:19
Yeah...I hear ya'. All I need to do is raise my chair up about an inch to do this. Good point.

I used to think people were being overly anal when they said they did this. But now that I'm a slightly wiser reloader, I give up speed for quality everywhere I can.

I've never had a problem with any of my loads. I once double charged a 45 acp when my 550 jammed up, but looking at the powder charge made me catch it before I seated a bullet. :eek:

Kurt Reifert
01-11-08, 12:51
You've just discovered the real value of the Dillon 650.
It allows the used ofthe powder check system that immediately tells if you have too much or too little powder after the drop.

PaigeB
01-11-08, 12:55
I've tried this and can't determine of it's the powder or the movement of my hand and arm. Do you think a stethoscope or Peltor Electronic hearing protectors would help. The Peltors seem to magnify normal noise on the range. I'll try them, but still need some advice on the stethoscope.

Thanks!

It can be a subtle sound, so being in a quiet room is helpful. You might try it with an empty case in your hand first, to check for extraneous sounds. The Peltors may be helpful, too.

markm
01-11-08, 13:00
You've just discovered the real value of the Dillon 650.
It allows the used ofthe powder check system that immediately tells if you have too much or too little powder after the drop.


How does that work?

I've found that I've ditched many of the gadgets that Dillon offers as fail safes. The Primer buzzer for example. Batteries would corrode and rot in there, and the cheap piece of shit wouldn't buzz anyway. That thing hit the trash can over 10 years ago.:mad:

My philosophy has shifted towards slowing down a little and paying greater attention to the task at hand.

PaigeB
01-11-08, 13:09
My philosophy has shifted towards slowing down a little and paying greater attention to the task at hand.

An experienced CMP shooter and reloader, told me he weighs the powder of each 20th round. And, checks the OAL at the same time. I wish I had his patience :(

markm
01-11-08, 13:35
If I were loading competition ammo, I might be that vicious. But for bulk practice ammo I fall somewhere in between.

toddackerman
01-11-08, 17:57
I got out today and bought a $20 Stethoscope. After playing with it to find the best diaphragm to use (use the small one as it picks up higher pitches) I can easily hear if there is powder rolling around in there by holding the case side on the diaphragm with one finger on each side of the case to make sure it doesn't move and cause extraneous noise from friction on the diaphragm. I've gone through about 100 so far and found 3 empties. It really goes pretty quick. i have about 200 more to go. (I forgot about the ones i boxed and loaded into my Wilson ETM and Cobra test Mags that are suspect, and already in the bag in the truck.)

Thanks for your inputs. I definitely need to slow down a bit.

Kurt Reifert
01-12-08, 11:10
How does that work?

I've found that I've ditched many of the gadgets that Dillon offers as fail safes. The Primer buzzer for example. Batteries would corrode and rot in there, and the cheap piece of shit wouldn't buzz anyway. That thing hit the trash can over 10 years ago.:mad:

My philosophy has shifted towards slowing down a little and paying greater attention to the task at hand.

It's battery operated with a finger that goes into the case after powder drop and if the finger doesn't index properly, the buzzer sounds.
Anything that is battery operated needs to be inspected periodicly to keep an eye on corrosion. I use quality batteries and inspect all of my battery operated gear once a month to look for signs of corrosion. It only takes a minute.
All of my low primer indicators and powder warning sensors work just fine.

5pins
01-13-08, 14:29
That is a good idea. Where did you get a stethoscope for $20? I could take all my SHTF ammo and make sure there is powder in them. It’s easy to see if there is a bullet, primer and case.

ST911
01-13-08, 21:13
That is a good idea. Where did you get a stethoscope for $20? I could take all my SHTF ammo and make sure there is powder in them. It’s easy to see if there is a bullet, primer and case.

5-pins- Lots of $10 chicom import scopes on the web. A home-medical store may have some. Even a low-end sprague will only be $25-30.

toddackerman
01-16-08, 11:09
That is a good idea. Where did you get a stethoscope for $20? I could take all my SHTF ammo and make sure there is powder in them. It’s easy to see if there is a bullet, primer and case.

Look in your yellow pages for Medical Supply Stores. You can pay more, but the $20 one works well. Again, use the small diaphragm side as it picks up higher pitches better than the large end.

It's easy, but time consuming. You have to practice the technique a little so you learn what to listen for. Try using some dummies along with known good ammo and you'll quickly learn to hear the difference.

If I was using quality factory SHTF ammo (Black Hills or Hornady 75 Gn BTHP Match or TAP), I would probably be GTG.