View Full Version : Wilson Combat AR?
I have a Wilson 1911 on the way (any day now...). I have a bone stock 6920, put maybe 200 rounds through it. It's a great combat weapon, just not what I need. I cruise the farm and plink varmints and hunt with my rifles.
A coworker wants to buy my 6920, and I thought about putting that towards a WC Recon AR. I'll get the 1-7'' 16'', Trim rail, etc. Probably toss a 3-9 or 4-12 on it.
Wanted M4C's opinion on current WC AR builds.
Thanks!
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=14325
heres some thoughts from a few years ago. Seems like a waste of money for the WC name, I cant find any info that they've changed their tune.
To quote Iraqgunz : "Addtionally I would compare their specs with that of well known performers like Noveske, etc..."
for that amount of coin I'd follow his advice......
Good luck
davidjinks
05-29-12, 22:44
Just my opinion…
You have a Colt LE6920 already (Enough said)
Drop the carry handle, add a flip up rear sight, drop a 1-4 or 1-6x scope and be done with it.
With the amount you'd spend on the Wilson you could get yourself a nice piece of glass and MAYBE some ammo.
I had an M4-T back in the day. Nothing but problems with it. It was back to Wilson 4 times within a month. Worst part being, they Armor Tuffed the chamber……...:rolleyes:
Oh no wait, it was the crap trigger they put in it that ended up tripling and quadrupling on me after 500 rounds……..:rolleyes:
Oh no wait, it was the total shit ass attitude from the Wilson employees regarding the actual deficiencies of said rifle….:rolleyes:
Alright, I'm off my box. Again, purely my opinion, you'd be better off spending that money on glass and ammo.
DeltaSierra
05-30-12, 00:27
Just my opinion…
You have a Colt LE6920 already (Enough said)
Drop the carry handle, add a flip up rear sight, drop a 1-4 or 1-6x scope and be done with it.
With the amount you'd spend on the Wilson you could get yourself a nice piece of glass and MAYBE some ammo.
I had an M4-T back in the day. Nothing but problems with it. It was back to Wilson 4 times within a month. Worst part being, they Armor Tuffed the chamber……...:rolleyes:
Oh no wait, it was the crap trigger they put in it that ended up tripling and quadrupling on me after 500 rounds……..:rolleyes:
Oh no wait, it was the total shit ass attitude from the Wilson employees regarding the actual deficiencies of said rifle….:rolleyes:
Alright, I'm off my box. Again, purely my opinion, you'd be better off spending that money on glass and ammo.
hmmm...
some of the best advice i have ever heard...
I love my Wilson 1911's, but i really think they need to stay with... well 1911's.
So Wilson makes some of the best pistols in the world, but they go stupid when building rifles? What they forget basic gunsmithing principles when working on ar's? Of course not. I have shot there ar's along with with every other brand out there and believe me they are as good as any.You will here people say there are no good because why? Because they own another brand, or even better yet because they read it on the internet.
You are way off track. It's called look at the price, look at the specs and then compare them. It's not rocket science and is pretty easy to understand.
Building AR's has jack shit to do with building a 1911.
So Wilson makes some of the best pistols in the world, but they go stupid when building rifles? What they forget basic gunsmithing principles when working on ar's? Of course not. I have shot there ar's along with with every other brand out there and believe me they are as good as any.You will here people say there are no good because why? Because they own another brand, or even better yet because they read it on the internet.
hotrodder636
05-30-12, 06:38
Just my opinion…
You have a Colt LE6920 already (Enough said)
Drop the carry handle, add a flip up rear sight, drop a 1-4 or 1-6x scope and be done with it.
With the amount you'd spend on the Wilson you could get yourself a nice piece of glass and MAYBE some ammo.
I had an M4-T back in the day. Nothing but problems with it. It was back to Wilson 4 times within a month. Worst part being, they Armor Tuffed the chamber……...:rolleyes:
Oh no wait, it was the crap trigger they put in it that ended up tripling and quadrupling on me after 500 rounds……..:rolleyes:
Oh no wait, it was the total shit ass attitude from the Wilson employees regarding the actual deficiencies of said rifle….:rolleyes:
Alright, I'm off my box. Again, purely my opinion, you'd be better off spending that money on glass and ammo.
Go with this advice. You have a known good quality carbine. Yank the carry handle and get some good glass on top and you will have what you are looking for.
http://www.laruetactical.com/rifle-scope-combos
Here is a start.
jonconsiglio
05-30-12, 06:58
You will here people say there are no good because why? Because they own another brand, or even better yet because they read it on the internet.
Not unlike when someone is a member for a couple years and only finally posts when people give honest opinions on a rifle likely his first choice in ARs?
Obviously you must own one and have some heavy rounds through it without an issue, likely in an advanced training environment, right? I mean, you wouldn't go giving advice like this without vast experience with the rifle in question.
So, can you please tell us how it has performed for you as a work rifle or how many thousands of rounds you have through it in a training environment?
Personally, I won't spend the extra money for a hunting rifle when my Colts and BCM will do just as well. I can get a BCM with a stainless barrel and my choice of hand guards for less. At the same time, I'm buying from a company fully invested in making these rifles and knows why it's advisable to not stray too far from the TDP.
I have a Wilson 1911 on the way (any day now...). I have a bone stock 6920, put maybe 200 rounds through it. It's a great combat weapon, just not what I need. I cruise the farm and plink varmints and hunt with my rifles.
A coworker wants to buy my 6920, and I thought about putting that towards a WC Recon AR. I'll get the 1-7'' 16'', Trim rail, etc. Probably toss a 3-9 or 4-12 on it.
Wanted M4C's opinion on current WC AR builds.
Thanks!
I notice the WC comes in a few different calibers. Is it the 5.56 that isn't doing what you want and want to move tot eh 6.8? The are other rifles you might want to look at in the WC price range in those other calibers as well. If you are staying with 5.56 there is nothing the WC does that the 6920 can't.
So Wilson makes some of the best pistols in the world, but they go stupid when building rifles? What they forget basic gunsmithing principles when working on ar's? Of course not. I have shot there ar's along with with every other brand out there and believe me they are as good as any.You will here people say there are no good because why? Because they own another brand, or even better yet because they read it on the internet.
I like that they are innovative with the AR platform as far as hunting and pushing / being proponents of the other calibers like 6.8. We need that. They even have some cool doo-dads like rails and cans, but after shooting and handling them, there's simply nothing extraordinary about them to justify the cost. Wilson is Wilson in the 1911 world, they are not Wilson in the AR world, if that makes sense. They are not bad rifles at all, they're just not at the same level their handguns are. I see a lot of Wilson 1911 owners step into the AR world by buying a Wilson AR FWIW.
HOWEVER, their triggers are a different story. I've got 5 of the TTUs in various flavors and I'd put them up against any trigger out there any day of the week.
I notice the WC comes in a few different calibers. Is it the 5.56 that isn't doing what you want and want to move tot eh 6.8? The are other rifles you might want to look at in the WC price range in those other calibers as well. If you are staying with 5.56 there is nothing the WC does that the 6920 can't.
My dad has a Recon in 6.8 haven't even shot it yet.
The way I figure, I sell my 6920 for a grand, and buy the Wilson with all the stuff I'd end up putting on my Colt but with a more accurate barrel. I'd be paying a hair more for the name to match my 1911 but most of the money would be spent on the Colt anyways.
I did consider a 300 AAC but I don't have any suppressor plans in the near future and 5.56 is perfect for people, coyotes and other varmints.
I've already seen people post in here about "training environments", this gun will strictly be for paper punching and varmint hunting. Maybe deer this fall if I ever get around to loading some 77 gr rounds.
With good trigger/optics/ammo just how accurate could my 6920 barrel be?
I can't imagine an M4 mass produced barrel shooting under 1 in at 100. But I could be wrong
My dad has a Recon in 6.8 haven't even shot it yet.
The way I figure, I sell my 6920 for a grand, and buy the Wilson with all the stuff I'd end up putting on my Colt but with a more accurate barrel. I'd be paying a hair more for the name to match my 1911 but most of the money would be spent on the Colt anyways.
I did consider a 300 AAC but I don't have any suppressor plans in the near future and 5.56 is perfect for people, coyotes and other varmints.
I've already seen people post in here about "training environments", this gun will strictly be for paper punching and varmint hunting. Maybe deer this fall if I ever get around to loading some 77 gr rounds.
Another option would be to simply swap out your barrel for something better if you're looking for 1moa. Lots of good barrels out there ranging from $250-550. I wouldn't sell a Colt to buy a Wilson. No need to spend $2k on a custom AR for the role you outlined.
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With good trigger/optics/ammo just how accurate could my 6920 barrel be?
I can't imagine an M4 mass produced barrel shooting under 1 in at 100. But I could be wrong
If you're dead set on getting rid of the Colt, a LaRue, KAC or stainless Noveske is in the same "tier" as your WC 1911. Take a look at LaRue, seriously. The Colt is an extremely solid rifle, but there are better performing ARs out there, if that's your quest.
Getting a thousand bucks for your 6920 won't happen, you can buy new for around 900. Even if your gun hasn't had may rounds its still a used gun.
For the price Wilson charges you might as well look at Noveske and Larue for some accurate critter management.
Getting a thousand bucks for your 6920 won't happen, you can buy new for around 900. Even if your gun hasn't had may rounds its still a used gun.
For the price Wilson charges you might as well look at Noveske and Larue for some accurate critter management.
I've got a buyer at $950
What specific Noveske rifle should I be looking at?
jonconsiglio
05-30-12, 08:36
You will here people say there are no good because why? Because they own another brand, or even better yet because they read it on the internet.
Not unlike when someone is a member for a couple years and only finally posts when people give honest opinions on a rifle that is likely his first choice in ARs, or at a minimum, a rifle with which he has an emotional attachment?
Obviously you must own one and have some heavy rounds through it without an issue, likely in an advanced training environment, right? I mean, you wouldn't go giving advice like this without vast experience with the rifle in question.
So, can you please tell us how it has performed for you as a work rifle or how many thousands of rounds you have through it in a training environment? Even though it'll still be an example of one, it would be nice to hear.
Personally, I won't spend the extra money for a hunting rifle when my Colts and BCM will do just as well. I can get a BCM with a stainless barrel and my choice of hand guards for less. At the same time, I'm buying from a company fully invested in making these rifles and knows why it's advisable to not stray too far from the TDP.
As for the trigger, I don't want one. In another thread on 1911forum about this same topic, a Wilson rep posted that their triggers have proven themselves in service all over the world. I still have no idea where they are in "service".
Having handled the WC AR's (and knowing something about them), I would say that they are mostly geared towards the HUNTING crowd. So in this context, I think they make a very good rifle.
Their new (or refinded) TRIM rail is one of the best out there IMHO.
C4
jonconsiglio
05-30-12, 08:56
That's exactly what I was saying on 1911forum about the Wilson. I think it's a great rifle for the hunting crown as it has a few "accurized" options that aren't the best choices for a "fighting rifle".
I basically said it wouldn't be a bad choice for the "fit and finish" guys who love their Wilson 1911's and want a nicely finished AR for the bench or hunting.
Most agreed, but the Wilson rep (whom I like, by the way even if I don't agree with him about their ARs) seemed to believe the Wilson trigger group (and barrels) will stand up to the same abuse and hard use as mil spec triggers and barrels.
Where I have a hard time with it is I can get a LaRue or something like a Centurion, BCM or Noveske with a stainless barrel for about the same price or less, but have my choice of hand guards and other components.
The TRIM rail is a nice hand guard. I'm not very familiar with the mounting system, but from the little I've personally seen and what i've read, it's a high quality contender with other tubular hand guards.
crusader377
05-30-12, 09:19
IMO, There is no way that I would sell a Colt 6920 unless if I absolutely had to. The Colt is still considered the gold standard amoung ARs. I think a better idea is to save your money and build/buy a second AR geared more towards precision work. To start, I would be looking at either a Noveske or a stainless barrel BCM.
IMO, There is no way that I would sell a Colt 6920 unless if I absolutely had to. The Colt is still considered the gold standard amoung ARs. I think a better idea is to save your money and build/buy a second AR geared more towards precision work. To start, I would be looking at either a Noveske or a stainless barrel BCM.
Anything comparable in Noveske is actually more expensive than the WC...
That's exactly what I was saying on 1911forum about the Wilson. I think it's a great rifle for the hunting crown as it has a few "accurized" options that aren't the best choices for a "fighting rifle".
I basically said it wouldn't be a bad choice for the "fit and finish" guys who love their Wilson 1911's and want a nicely finished AR for the bench or hunting.
Most agreed, but the Wilson rep (whom I like, by the way even if I don't agree with him about their ARs) seemed to believe the Wilson trigger group (and barrels) will stand up to the same abuse and hard use as mil spec triggers and barrels.
Where I have a hard time with it is I can get a LaRue or something like a Centurion, BCM or Noveske with a stainless barrel for about the same price or less, but have my choice of hand guards and other components.
The TRIM rail is a nice hand guard. I'm not very familiar with the mounting system, but from the little I've personally seen and what i've read, it's a high quality contender with other tubular hand guards.
Yup, he kept putting emphasis on all the "bells and whistles", such as NP3-finished BCG and the trigger group. He also mentioned that the "fit and finish" is better than a standard AR. But there wasn't anything on the Wilson AR that would make it more reliable than a Colt, BCM, DD, Noveske, et al.
I felt a definite attitude of "ours is the best, because it is a Wilson", not "ours is the best, because of rigorous real-world use and testing". But to be fair, the person buying the Wilson openly stated that it was going to a "look at what I spent my big bucks on" gun.
Anything comparable in Noveske is actually more expensive than the WC...
Are you saying you can find a WC AR for under $2k?
Which model are you looking at? They are all listed at $2250.
You can most certainly find a Noveske for less than that.
This upper is $1272.15
http://www.rogtac.com/upper-parts/noveske-16-5-56mm-light-recce-complete-upper.html
And if you don't want the quad rail it's even cheaper with the new NSR $1118.70
http://www.rogtac.com/upper-parts/noveske-16-light-recce-lo-pro-upper-nsr-13-5-battlecomp-1-0.html
This lower with SSA trigger comes out to about $675-700
http://www.gandrtactical.com/cgi-bin/commerce.cgi?preadd=action&key=RCVR_BLEM&reference=/cgi-bin/commerce.cgi%3Fsearch%3Daction%26keywords%3D%26searchstart%3D0%26template%3DPDGCommTemplates/FullNav/SearchResult.html%26category%3DNRIF
Are you saying you can find a WC AR for under $2k?
Which model are you looking at? They are all listed at $2250.
You can most certainly find a Noveske for less than that.
This upper is $1272.15
http://www.rogtac.com/upper-parts/noveske-16-5-56mm-light-recce-complete-upper.html
And if you don't want the quad rail it's even cheaper with the new NSR $1118.70
http://www.rogtac.com/upper-parts/noveske-16-light-recce-lo-pro-upper-nsr-13-5-battlecomp-1-0.html
This lower with SSA trigger comes out to about $675-700
http://www.gandrtactical.com/cgi-bin/commerce.cgi?preadd=action&key=RCVR_BLEM&reference=/cgi-bin/commerce.cgi%3Fsearch%3Daction%26keywords%3D%26searchstart%3D0%26template%3DPDGCommTemplates/FullNav/SearchResult.html%26category%3DNRIF
$2-300 difference. My bad
Edit: If I do a parts gun, I'm going to to spend $1200 on a MK12 upper
crusader377
05-30-12, 12:06
Anything comparable in Noveske is actually more expensive than the WC...
Not really. I also mentioned BCM and you can build a very nice precision BCM for around $1400-$1600 minus optics.
hogfan1911
05-30-12, 12:44
With good trigger/optics/ammo just how accurate could my 6920 barrel be?
I can't imagine an M4 mass produced barrel shooting under 1 in at 100. But I could be wrong
I had a DPMS A-4 (before I knew better) that would group right at 1" @ 100 with 3-9x glass on it. My BCM 16" LW will stay at 2-3" @ 100 with an unmagnified EOTech, I'm sure I could drop that to 1", maybe a little less with the same scope on it, I just haven't bothered. Pull the handle off that 6920, put a decent scope on it, and try it out. You might be pleasantly surprised.
I had a DPMS A-4 (before I knew better) that would group right at 1" @ 100 with 3-9x glass on it. My BCM 16" LW will stay at 2-3" @ 100 with an unmagnified EOTech, I'm sure I could drop that to 1", maybe a little less with the same scope on it, I just haven't bothered. Pull the handle off that 6920, put a decent scope on it, and try it out. You might be pleasantly surprised.
You had a 1MOA rifle that is crap (before I knew better?) because of the roll mark on it? Yet the BCM is a 2-3 MOA and that's somehow better? Put the glass on the BCM and see how it does. An out-of-the-box DPMS 16" that holds 1MOA with a 3X9 is a keeper in my book. For whats it's worth, I'd take any Wilson Combat rifle for nothing more than the resale value. Lots of brand lovers out there that only see the WC logo.
LOLLERS - I see where this is going.
You had a 1MOA rifle that is crap (before I knew better?) because of the roll mark on it? Yet the BCM is a 2-3 MOA and that's somehow better? Put the glass on the BCM and see how it does. An out-of-the-box DPMS 16" that holds 1MOA with a 3X9 is a keeper in my book. For whats it's worth, I'd take any Wilson Combat rifle for nothing more than the resale value. Lots of brand lovers out there that only see the WC logo.
Depends on what you are after. I will take a more reliable weapon (that I know is chambered in 5.56, has proper gas port size, etc) that shoot 2-3" groups VS one that is virtually unknown that shoots 1MOA.
On a fighthing weapon, reliability is FIRST. Accuracy (as long as it shoot 4MOA or better) is second.
C4
DeltaSierra
05-30-12, 13:38
You had a 1MOA rifle that is crap (before I knew better?) because of the roll mark on it?
i don't care how "accurate" a rifle is if it is made from garbage components, as dpms rifles are.
i also don't live in a fantasy world where 1" groups at one hundred yards prove anything....
hogfan1911
05-30-12, 14:17
You had a 1MOA rifle that is crap (before I knew better?) because of the roll mark on it? Yet the BCM is a 2-3 MOA and that's somehow better? Put the glass on the BCM and see how it does. An out-of-the-box DPMS 16" that holds 1MOA with a 3X9 is a keeper in my book. For whats it's worth, I'd take any Wilson Combat rifle for nothing more than the resale value. Lots of brand lovers out there that only see the WC logo.
*sigh* And the runaway train toward thread lock rolls on......
Dude, I'm not gonna re-hash all the reasons again. OP, sorry if things go haywire from here.
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