View Full Version : AR15 and S12 together forever
Finally finished my first AR15. I was going for a Riflegear midlength upper but I got a good deal for a PSA upper that just came in. I need to clean and lube it up for the range next weekend. I've never shot an AR15 before so I'm excited. I won't be buying optics anytime soon so I'm excited to learn how to shoot with iron sights. It's just for paper targets only.
Also will this cheek riser work with a charging handle? I'm using a 4 position stock? I can pull the charging handle back but I'm not sure if this will interfere.
Currently watching youtube vids on how to deal with common AR15 malfunctions.
Purchasing an ARMS 40L rear BUIS.
Also I did the conversion myself on the Saiga 12.
PSA Complete upper 16" carbine
Spikes Lower (Spider)
BCM BCG
BCM C/H Mod 4
Magwell grip
CASV clone
Raddlock button
Magpul
AFG
MOE stock
Cheeck Riser
DPMS LPK
DPMS buffer tube
PMAG 10/30
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hotbiggun42
06-22-12, 12:14
Have fun with it. Shoot the shit out of it and update your post with your results.
The cheek riser looks unnecessary and will be in the way. I am not sure if i would use the magwell for a handgrip either. For safety concerns.
The S12 looks like it would be a blast to shoot:)
Failure2Stop
06-22-12, 12:16
The second this thread gets out of line I am going to hand out infractions and delete posts.
There is some clear montoring opportunity here, but don't be rude.
Have fun with it. Shoot the shit out of it and update your post of the results.
The cheek riser looks unnecessary and will be in the way. I am not sure if i would use the magwell for a handgrip either. For safety concerns.
The S12 looks like it would be a blast to shoot:)
im comfortable with the magwell grip but ill be using this with my .22 CMMG conversion kit.
i understand that its bad to use a magwell grip with .223 for a possible kaboom which can blow off my hand. ill be using the AFG when i shoot .223 rounds instead of the magwell grip.
yes i know i dont have 3 hands. ;)
ya i wasnt sure if i needed a cheek riser because i thought it would interfere with the charging handle. ill find out if i can chamber a round with the cheek riser on. i honestly got it because i thought it looked good. ill learn after i shoot it.
also its comfortable with the stock fully extended at the 4 position. i can pull the charging handle back.
will be purchasing a real CASV if a used one pops up in the market.
MaTech
http://lh6.googleusercontent.com/public/GXSdJr1OB6UsVq8Gp_A9Z1cCQodLHDlyhR6ehd_rANEzszvlUcc1l83se09sNbZEX1FsRBUO6CNmySKsroynugsVhFS-AZ5s5bPmidZRckuEgSoiOlecTqut8h54ChQvP919kQ_vRvqqHpalPFIPmz_bM5qmbjlUIqGHam2Ldxk
KAC 600M Rear flip up
http://www.airsoftglobal.com/shop/images/DB-RS-K600M-AG-1.jpg
fallenromeo
06-22-12, 12:45
Do you mind telling us how much the setup cost you?
Buying something b/c it looks good isn't a wise choice. At this point all it has done is add weight. Same with magwell grip. DPMS would not be my first choice. Or second. But, live and learn. That's why this site is great. Except that F2S has stopped the fun before it could begin.:D
Do you mind telling us how much the setup cost you?
$1100 with tax
The cheek riser is intended to be used with optics that are raised well above the plane of the upper.
Like a scope on top of a carry handle or very high risers.
With it in place and using no items like that, I'm fairly certain you're literally not going to be able to get a good line of sight through the irons.
The magwell grip is kinda unloved not for the chance of an explosion, but because it isn't a very stable hold as it leaves the whole of the barrel, handguards etc. unsupported.
It also it transitions poorly between point targets. You can get things moving easily enough, but you'll never get it stopped in time without literally overshooting the target and having to pull back.
Both can be emulated to an extreme degree using a golf club or baseball bat.
Hold by one end with one hand with it straight out horizontal and look at the other end. Not too stable is it.
Then, pick a light switch and wall outlet on the same wall in the same room, and with the same horizontal hold try to point quickly from one to the other.
Slow to get moving, hard to stop and must be drug back onto the target, right?
Those issues will assuredly happen to some degree or another when using a magwell grip.
Having such occur constitutes poor muzzle control.
Poor muzzle control = danger to everyone around.
Buying something b/c it looks good isn't a wise choice. At this point all it has done is add weight. Same with magwell grip. DPMS would not be my first choice. Or second. But, live and learn. That's why this site is great. Except that F2S has stopped the fun before it could begin.:D
weight isnt an issue. its just for paper targets. i have no interest in taking classes or doing competition.
what would be a better choice over DPMS?
SomeOtherGuy
06-22-12, 13:15
weight isnt an issue. its just for paper targets. i have no interest in taking classes or doing competition.
what would be a better choice over DPMS?
This site tends to be focused on more demanding uses and you may find that many topics discussed here aren't very relevant to your intended uses.
That said, I would encourage you to take some sort of class, even if all you want to do is shoot paper. It's more fun to shoot small groups at long distances! You might consider a basic "Carbine class" which tend to be more focused on fast shooting like in combat, or something like an Appleseed event or CMP match which focuses more on accuracy from conventional positions at relatively slow paces of fire. The latter two don't cost much - maybe $20-25, plus your ammo. That's little compared to the value you might get out of it.
As has been said, you probably don't need or want the cheek riser for use with iron sights. Also, most people who use the Magpul AFG use it quite far out (farther than you have room for) and you may want to experiment both with and without it, as it provides little or no benefit when used on a shorter forearm like your rifle has.
Failure2Stop
06-22-12, 13:35
weight isnt an issue. its just for paper targets. i have no interest in taking classes or doing competition.
what would be a better choice over DPMS?
If that's your application, you are just fine, though I probably would have recommended an M&P 15-22 for around $500.
Let us know how the conversion works out after you have a few thousand rounds through it.
If that's your application, you are just fine, though I probably would have recommended an M&P 15-22 for around $500.
Let us know how the conversion works out after you have a few thousand rounds through it.
when i got my lower from my FFL, he asked me what my plans are for the AR15 and i told him nothing serious. i told him i just want to show off to my friends, family and just shoot paper targets. he then recommended the DPMS LPK.
i was looking at a MP15-22 but i really wanted a 5.56.
This site tends to be focused on more demanding uses and you may find that many topics discussed here aren't very relevant to your intended uses.
That said, I would encourage you to take some sort of class, even if all you want to do is shoot paper. It's more fun to shoot small groups at long distances! You might consider a basic "Carbine class" which tend to be more focused on fast shooting like in combat, or something like an Appleseed event or CMP match which focuses more on accuracy from conventional positions at relatively slow paces of fire. The latter two don't cost much - maybe $20-25, plus your ammo. That's little compared to the value you might get out of it.
As has been said, you probably don't need or want the cheek riser for use with iron sights. Also, most people who use the Magpul AFG use it quite far out (farther than you have room for) and you may want to experiment both with and without it, as it provides little or no benefit when used on a shorter forearm like your rifle has.
ya i kinda figured this forum was different that TOS. you guys are definitely more into functionality.
i thought these classes would go for a couple of hundred which is why i didnt consider it. $20-$25 sounds good.
i agree. ill get a better feel after i get some range time.
SW-Shooter
06-22-12, 15:05
Is this a joke?
I like what you did to the S12 I did a Conversion Myself on One I had they are a Blast to shoot
Is this a joke?
i dont get it?
SomeOtherGuy
06-22-12, 15:28
ya i kinda figured this forum was different that TOS. you guys are definitely more into functionality.
i thought these classes would go for a couple of hundred which is why i didnt consider it. $20-$25 sounds good.
i agree. ill get a better feel after i get some range time.
Typical "carbine classes" start in the $150 range and go up towards $1000 or more for multiday courses with nationally known names. And what you describe as your goals doesn't require that type of instruction.
But the Appleseed and CMP are more club or nonprofit type events, run by volunteers. $20-25 is just a ballpark but should be accurate in much of the US. (You seem to be in California and I have no idea what's the norm there.) There may also be other basic rifle marksmanship instruction offered by local shooting clubs or ranges - worth looking into. If you aren't already a member of a private shooting club, I would look into joining one.
Typical "carbine classes" start in the $150 range and go up towards $1000 or more for multiday courses with nationally known names. And what you describe as your goals doesn't require that type of instruction.
But the Appleseed and CMP are more club or nonprofit type events, run by volunteers. $20-25 is just a ballpark but should be accurate in much of the US. (You seem to be in California and I have no idea what's the norm there.) There may also be other basic rifle marksmanship instruction offered by local shooting clubs or ranges - worth looking into. If you aren't already a member of a private shooting club, I would look into joining one.
yep im in southern california. i would be definitely interested if there are $20-$25 events. ill look around
yep im in southern california. i would be definitely interested if there are $20-$25 events. ill look around
nm.. reading comprehension fail
Cali laws are so confusing but are those two legal out there?
i had to install these stupid bullet buttons to make the magazines fixed. then it becomes legal to have the evil features of a pistol grip, forward pistol grips(AFG/VFG), collapsible stock, flash hiders, etc
10 round magazine limit
no suppressors
no full auto
30" overall length
16" minimum barrel length
i had to pin my stock on my S12 even with my bullet button
weight isnt an issue. its just for paper targets. i have no interest in taking classes or doing competition.
what would be a better choice over DPMS?
Be careful, when you get the bug for an AR-15 for serious usage (a disease known to be transmitted through just about any AR-15 platform) make sure you check in here before you buy, read the stickies on the subject and ask any lingering questions.
As far as punching paper - just enjoy shooting it, you will know sooner rather than later if that cheek riser gets in the way.
SW-Shooter
06-22-12, 17:17
i dont get it?
A riser with iron sights.:stop:
oh man i'm so jealous of that saiga 12. I want one so badly! I like that rail on it too, which rail is it?
A riser with iron sights.:stop:
its not that bad.
oh man i'm so jealous of that saiga 12. I want one so badly! I like that rail on it too, which rail is it?
its a Chaos Titan quad rail.
its not that bad.
Here is the potential issue - and its hard for me to see if it will actually BE an issue:
Where is the rear sight being mounted? if it mounted on the rifle's rail then you are good to go as far as actually being able to shoot the rifle - however if you had planned on mounting the rear sight on the riser (like it appears to be on the Saiga 12) then the rear sight is going to be to high for the front sight and you will never be able to zero the weapon.
Like I said I can not tell from the pictures if you will be able to mount a rear sight in the correct spot or not - but it will do you no good to mount one on the riser.
Good luck.
Here is the potential issue - and its hard for me to see if it will actually BE an issue:
Where is the rear sight being mounted? if it mounted on the rifle's rail then you are good to go as far as actually being able to shoot the rifle - however if you had planned on mounting the rear sight on the riser (like it appears to be on the Saiga 12) then the rear sight is going to be to high for the front sight and you will never be able to zero the weapon.
Like I said I can not tell from the pictures if you will be able to mount a rear sight in the correct spot or not - but it will do you no good to mount one on the riser.
Good luck.
the rear sight will be mounted on the flat top of the rifles rail. i have one slot left which can fit a ARMS 40L or a troy's rear sight. i never intended to put the rear sight on the riser because it wouldnt be leveled to the front sight. i agree. it wouldnt make sense to put the rear sight on the riser.
Cleaned it up.
Added a troy rear sight
Removed the magwell grip, cheek rest, and side rails
I'm ready for the range!
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That looks like a more common sense build, well done on the modifications. I think you will find that this site is centered around the more serious shooter, those who do it for a living, and not the average end user. It is definitely a good place to be if you want honest answers, and are willing to leave the butthurt at the door.
I hope you enjoy the rifle, and by god... GO GET SOME TRAINING!!!!!
Love that S12!
They complement each other well.
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