Stuck Barrel Nut

[LongRider]

I have a Bushmaster carbine with the welded on flash suppressor and am trying to remove the barrel to install a free float railed hand gaurd but the barrel nut appears to be stuck. I am using Bushmaster's Barrel Vise Jaw Blocks to hold the barrel and Armorer's Barrel Wrench but the barrel spins in the barrel vise when I try to remove the nut. It is as if the nut is welded on. If I tighten the vise on the barrel any tighter I am afraid I will start to crush the barrel. I have already broken one vise tightening it down on the barrel. What the hell am I doing wrong am I missing something?

Please no BS about the Bushmaster or I should have bought a better AR, it is what I have and what I am working on. Any help with getting this freaking nut loose would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.

[SpankMonkey]

Wrap the barrel in some rough leather, then reinsert into barrel vise jaws and close in vise.

Good luck.

[az doug]

You will need an upper receiver action block or a barrel extension torque tool. (Let me know if by some chance you live in the Phoenix/Valley area of AZ as I have both)

You will not crush your barrel with the barrel jaw blocks, but yes you can break a vise by over tightening it.

Another possibility is a free float tube that does not require you to remove the barrel nut. Midwest Industries 2 piece and the Samson Evolution come to mind. There are others.


http://www.brownells.com/.aspx/pid=22385/Product/AR-15-M16-UPPER-RECEIVER-ACTION-BLOCK


ETA: You can also wrap you barrel in a thin lead sheet and/or use rosin to try and keep it from slipping. I gave up on barrel blocks except for very limited uses. At that point I normally use a real barrel vise mounted to the floor.

http://www.brownells.com/.aspx/pid=27452/Product/AR-15-M16-BARREL-EXTENSION-TORQUE-TOOL

[LongRider]

Thanks gents, I am being told that Bushmaster has used red loc-tite on their castle nuts and may have may have it on the barrel nut as well. Sound at all familiar to anyone? Also being told to apply heat to loosen the red loc-tite. If so any idea of how much heat? Smokin or Red Hot

[ryr8828]

Thanks gents, I am being told that Bushmaster has used red loc-tite on their castle nuts and may have may have it on the barrel nut as well. Sound at all familiar to anyone? Also being told to apply heat to loosen the red loc-tite. If so any idea of how much heat? Smokin or Red Hot

I was able to loosen the loctite on the castle nut of my bushmaster with a heat gun.

[Iraqgunz]

Sounds about right. They used something on the ones we had. You should be able to apply low and slow heat and then break it loose.


Thanks gents, I am being told that Bushmaster has used red loc-tite on their castle nuts and may have may have it on the barrel nut as well. Sound at all familiar to anyone? Also being told to apply heat to loosen the red loc-tite. If so any idea of how much heat? Smokin or Red Hot

[LongRider]

You will need an upper receiver action block or a barrel extension torque tool. (Let me know if by some chance you live in the Phoenix/Valley area of AZ as I have both)

You will not crush your barrel with the barrel jaw blocks, but yes you can break a vise by over tightening it.

Another possibility is a free float tube that does not require you to remove the barrel nut. Midwest Industries 2 piece and the Samson Evolution come to mind. There are others.


http://www.brownells.com/.aspx/pid=22385/Product/AR-15-M16-UPPER-RECEIVER-ACTION-BLOCK


ETA: You can also wrap you barrel in a thin lead sheet and/or use rosin to try and keep it from slipping. I gave up on barrel blocks except for very limited uses. At that point I normally use a real barrel vise mounted to the floor.

http://www.brownells.com/.aspx/pid=27452/Product/AR-15-M16-BARREL-EXTENSION-TORQUE-TOOL

Thanks already have the YHM "Tactical" light weight freefloat quad rail (http://www.bravocompanyusa.com/Yankee-Hill-Machine-Tactical-Free-Float-Carbine-p/yhm-9631%20ff%20carbine.htm). It's "tactical" so it should be bad A :sarcastic: joking. Seriously its what I have so I am going with it. Does not look like a bad piece of kit. Light weight and sturdy anyway. Maybe next time, I'll look into a two peice this is a learning experience for me. The AR-15-M16-UPPER-RECEIVER-ACTION-BLOCK (http://www.brownells.com/.aspx/pid=22385/Product/AR-15-M16-UPPER-RECEIVER-ACTION-BLOCK) looks like a far better option than the vise block. So thanks on that probably pick one up for the next go round. Especially since it is on sale with a mag block as well. How does the AR-15/M16 BARREL EXTENSION TORQUE TOOL (http://www.brownells.com/.aspx/pid=27452/Product/AR-15-M16-BARREL-EXTENSION-TORQUE-TOOL) work does it slip on over the barrel? I can't tell from looking at it. Thanks for the input

[az doug]

The barrel extension torque tool replaced the bolt carrier group in the upper receiver and the splines engage the barrel extension. The other end of the tool accepts a half inch ratchet/breaker bar... You are suppose to clamp your barrel nut wrench in a vise and turn the receiver/barrel.

I do not use it that way. I have a piece of 1/2 inch square stock that I clamp in a vise. I set the barrel extension torque tool on it and turn the barrel wrench by hand.

The big advantage of the barrel extension torque tool is that it fits all "AR-15" uppers regardless of the external dimensions. The receiver action block will not work with most of the billet uppers.

Also, sorry, I did not mention the use of heat but even with heat I have had barrels slip in barrel vise blocks.

What type of gas manifold/block/fsb do you have? Will your YHM barrel nut slip over it or do you have a split manifold that clamps around the barrel? Just curious.

[LongRider]

What type of gas manifold/block/fsb do you have? Will your YHM barrel nut slip over it or do you have a split manifold that clamps around the barrel? Just curious.

The YHM barrel nut slips over the flash hider I checked, by sliding it over, no problem there. I am replacing the front sight gas block with a two part YHM Clamp-on Folding Front Sight Gas Block (http://www.brownells.com/.aspx/pid=21446/Product/AR-15-M16-CLAMP-ON-FRONT-SIGHT-GAS-BLOCK)

[AR15barrels]

Thanks gents, I am being told that Bushmaster has used red loc-tite on their castle nuts and may have may have it on the barrel nut as well. Sound at all familiar to anyone? Also being told to apply heat to loosen the red loc-tite. If so any idea of how much heat? Smokin or Red Hot

400 degrees will defeat any color loctite.

You can also machine off the barrel nut if you have already removed the front sight...

http://ar15barrels.com/tech/barrel-nut-removal2.jpg

http://ar15barrels.com/tech/barrel-nut-removal.jpg

http://ar15barrels.com/tech/barrel-nut-removal3.jpg

[az doug]

The YHM barrel nut slips over the flash hider I checked, by sliding it over, no problem there. I am replacing the front sight gas block with a two part YHM Clamp-on Folding Front Sight Gas Block (http://www.brownells.com/.aspx/pid=21446/Product/AR-15-M16-CLAMP-ON-FRONT-SIGHT-GAS-BLOCK)

That will work. It sounds like you have all the bases covered once you get the barrel nut off. Good luck.

[LongRider]

400 degrees will defeat any color loctite.

You can also machine off the barrel nut if you have already removed the front sight...

So if I stick the barrel and all into the oven at 500º for half an hour or so that will defeat the loctite? Would I need to get it to a vice while it is still hot? If so I may try that if the heat gun does not work. Do not have access or the skill to machine it off but have thought about taking a dremel to it and seeing if I could cut it off without ruining the threads on the barrel.

[LongRider]

That will work. It sounds like you have all the bases covered once you get the barrel nut off. Good luck.

Thanks have planned this ever since I got the gun. Its my first AR so I ran it a year stock with just iron sights. Now I want to add a pistol fore grip, light and Aim point with BUIS. Thought it was going to be a whole lot easier than this and am disappointed that the stock parts are being destroyed in the process.

[Mike Miller]

You can ruin the anodizing if you leave it in the oven at 500

[bobsolla]

get a mapp gas torch and heat up the barrel nut(apply heat evenly) with a wet cloth around the upper receiver and one around the barrel,then use your barrel nut wrench to remove the barrel nut.

[LongRider]

Dirty MOTHER #^*%!! I am so ticked off. Dinged the crap out of my Delta ring and the barrel nut is still stuck. Looks like I will have to cut the barrel nut off once it is unscrewed as it will not fit over the flash hider. Way more complicated than I expected any way end of rant and sniveling.
Need a suggestion on an Action Block/Vise Block Set I found two. Any suggestion on which to get?
ProMag Armorer's Upper & Lower Receiver Action Block Set AR-15 (http://www.midwayusa.com/product/310152/promag-armorers-upper-and-lower-receiver-action-block-set-ar-15)
Brownells Action Block/Vise Block Set (http://www.brownells.com/.aspx/pid=22385/sku=080-000-659/Product/Action-Block-Vise-Block-Set)
Also any Delta ring suggestions? Any reason any would not fit on a Bushmaster?

[bobsolla]

i would trust the set from brownell`s more,especially if you ever plan on more ar work!did you try heating the barrel nut with a torch and using wet towels on barrel and upper receiver?you will have to cut off your delta ring first!not sure if you need it or not,but they`re cheap.hope this helps!

[agr1279]

At this point why don't you chalk this up to a lesson learned and buy an upper from Grant and be done with it. Yes it sucks to have to spend even more money but do it right.

Dan

[LongRider]

You can ruin the anodizing if you leave it in the oven at 500
Guess I won't be doing that. Thanks.


i would trust the set from brownell`s more,especially if you ever plan on more ar work!did you try heating the barrel nut with a torch and using wet towels on barrel and upper receiver?you will have to cut off your delta ring first!not sure if you need it or not,but they`re cheap.hope this helps!
I did heat the barrel nut and the barrel still spun me. Not quiet sure what you mean about the wet towels, what is the purpose of doing that? I'm game just curious as to why. Why cut off the delta ring? Not that it really matters as it is being replace anyway since I dinged the crap out of it. Again just curious.

Any reason to not trust the ProMag Upper & Lower Receiver Action Block Set? I have bought from Brownells and Midway never had a problem with either, that I recall. But in this case Brownells prices for the Delta Ring Assembly Kit, and Upper & Lower Receiver Action Block Set is nearly double Midways price.

Thanks for the input

One idea I had. I have the removable carry handle that mounts on the top rail. Can I mount that on the receiver and stick the carry handle in the vise to hold the receiver? My concern is that I may torque the receiver. Anyone have any thoughts or opinions?

[bobsolla]

Guess I won't be doing that. Thanks.


I did heat the barrel nut and the barrel still spun me. Not quiet sure what you mean about the wet towels, what is the purpose of doing that? I'm game just curious as to why. Why cut off the delta ring? Not that it really matters as it is being replace anyway since I dinged the crap out of it. Again just curious.

Any reason to not trust the ProMag Upper & Lower Receiver Action Block Set? I have bought from Brownells and Midway never had a problem with either, that I recall. But in this case Brownells prices for the Delta Ring Assembly Kit, and Upper & Lower Receiver Action Block Set is nearly double Midways price.

Thanks for the input

One idea I had. I have the removable carry handle that mounts on the top rail. Can I mount that on the receiver and stick the carry handle in the vise to hold the receiver? My concern is that I may torque the receiver. Anyone have any thoughts or opinions?

the reason for the wet towels is to keep the barrel and upper receiver cool while heat is applied to the barrel nut.the reason i had for the delta ring being cut off is because you typically cant heat up the barrel nut without damage to the delta ring.the promag will work,but is of lower quality.without using a upper receiver block on a vise and trying to remove the barrel nut is not advised because it can cause damage to your upper receiver.you say your barrel is spinning.are you just trying to remove(undo)the barrel nut only by using an ar armorer `s wrench to the barrel nut?there is a raised metal nipple which fits in the upper receiver that is built into the barrel(i forget the technical name)that aligns the barrel into the upper receiver.this prevents the barrel spin when removing the barrel nut.the barrel should not spin at all!for the barrel to spin.the alignment nipple would have to be broken off. otherwise,if the barrel only is spinning,you would have to be trying to remove the barrel by just using a vise or clamping device on the barrel only causing it to spin off from the chambered part of the barrel put together by the barrel maker. obviously,that is not the correct way to remove the barrel.if this is the case,stop!bring this in to a qualified gunsmith that does ar work!this all should really be no big deal to remove.the couple of dollars for the gunsmith to do this for you will be nothing compared to the stress you`ve already been through!just tell the gunsmith what you tried,what it`s doing,and what you want accomplished.this may be your cheapest route also.i really wish you luck and hope anything advice i send will help!

[LongRider]

the reason for the wet towels is to keep the barrel and upper receiver cool while heat is applied to the barrel nut.the reason i had for the delta ring being cut off is because you typically cant heat up the barrel nut without damage to the delta ring.the promag will work,but is of lower quality.
OK that makes sense thanks, I'll go with Brownells as well, rather pay a few bucks more and have quality. If I can save a few bucks apples to apples I will but not at the expense of quality


twithout using a upper receiver block on a vise and trying to remove the barrel nut is not advised because it can cause damage to your upper receiver.
That is what I figured, which is why I asked. If it was a matter of only marring the carry handle in the vise that would have been an acceptable to me. I'll get the right tool for the job.


you say your barrel is spinning.are you just trying to remove(undo)the barrel nut only by using an ar armorer `s wrench to the barrel nut?there is a raised metal nipple which fits in the upper receiver that is built into the barrel(i forget the technical name)that aligns the barrel into the upper receiver.this prevents the barrel spin when removing the barrel nut.the barrel should not spin at all!for the barrel to spin.the alignment nipple would have to be broken off. otherwise,if the barrel only is spinning,you would have to be trying to remove the barrel by just using a vise or clamping device on the barrel only causing it to spin off from the chambered part of the barrel put together by the barrel maker. obviously,that is not the correct way to remove the barrel.if this is the case,stop!
The barrel/reciever is spinning in the AR-15/M16 BARREL VISE JAWS (http://www.brownells.com/.aspx/pid=12470/Product/AR-15-M16-BARREL-VISE-JAWS). In other words the vise is not holding the barrel well enough to keep it from turning when I apply the amours wrench. That was what they used in the Bushmaster AR build DVD, to put the barrel nut on. I assumed incorrectly that is what you would use to remover the barrel nut. I have the vise tightened as much as reasonably possible, ( I broke one vise tightening it down) tried using both an old piece of rough scrap leather and than some tire inner tube to keep it from slipping as has been suggested. Still did not work. May try a gunsmith, though part of the reason for getting an AR was so I could familiarize myself with the weapon do a couple of mods than move on to build my own AR.

[LongRider]

It worked. I dunno what happened but it worked. Per your suggestions, I am waiting for the receiver vice block and barrel nut assembly I ordered from Brownells. I left the barrel in the vice. When I was out in the shop doing whatever I had given it a try, a couple of different times. Thursday evening I took another crack at the barrel nut and off it spun. I have no clue what happened it just came off like it had never been stuck. Checked the treads there was no sign of galling, loctite or anything else. So I am clueless what the hell happened but it is off.
I want to thank each and every one of you for your input and assistance. I especially want to say thanks for keeping this on topic without any negative carp about Bushmaster that is all to common on other boards. ON AR15 they'd have buried my OP in anti Bushmaster slams. For myself it looks like I have to retract my list of BushMaster complaints. Barring this weird bit of melodrama mine has served me well and gone bang each time I squeezed the trigger. Again thank you for sharing your knowledge and expertise with insightful well thought out posts.You are true gentlemen thank you for the help.

[bobsolla]

It worked. I dunno what happened but it worked. Per your suggestions, I am waiting for the receiver vice block and barrel nut assembly I ordered from Brownells. I left the barrel in the vice. When I was out in the shop doing whatever I had given it a try, a couple of different times. Thursday evening I took another crack at the barrel nut and off it spun. I have no clue what happened it just came off like it had never been stuck. Checked the treads there was no sign of galling, loctite or anything else. So I am clueless what the hell happened but it is off.
I want to thank each and every one of you for your input and assistance. I especially want to say thanks for keeping this on topic without any negative carp about Bushmaster that is all to common on other boards. ON AR15 they'd have buried my OP in anti Bushmaster slams. For myself it looks like I have to retract my list of BushMaster complaints. Barring this weird bit of melodrama mine has served me well and gone bang each time I squeezed the trigger. Again thank you for sharing your knowledge and expertise with insightful well thought out posts.You are true gentlemen thank you for the help.

cool!glad you you got it to come off without breakage!make sure when re- assembling the barrel to add a lubricant like whit lithium grease to the barrel receiver extension(where the barrel fits into the upper receiver)as to keep heat from seizing the barrel into the upper receiver in the future for future disassembly.also make sure to torque the barrel nut to the proper torque spec.(50-80in. lbs.) according to john noveske for my stainless steel 300 blackout barrel.i called noveske and john called me back with those numbers,but it may be different for yours,so i would call to make sure.good luck!

[DirectDrive]

cool!glad you you got it to come off without breakage!make sure when re- assembling the barrel to add a lubricant like whit lithium grease to the barrel receiver extension(where the barrel fits into the upper receiver)as to keep heat from seizing the barrel into the upper receiver in the future for future disassembly.also make sure to torque the barrel nut to the proper torque spec.(50-80in. lbs.) according to john noveske for my stainless steel 300 blackout barrel.i called noveske and john called me back with those numbers,but it may be different for yours,so i would call to make sure.good luck!
OP, you did the right thing clamping the barrel and not the receiver.
Barrel take-offs are what usually fuk up receivers if not restrained correctly.

The correct grease is molybdenum (moly) fortified grease such as Aero Shell 33MS
(Valvoline Moly (Ford) grease is close to spec and easily accessible, part #VV 632)
These moly greases are usually dark gray in color and contain no graphite.

The correct torque range for the barrel nut is 30 - 80 ft lbs.
Try to stay on the lower end of that.