View Full Version : The gun show...
TacticalTyler
06-24-12, 13:07
Now, before I get started I know how a lot of you feel on here about gun shows. They have a bad rep, an chinese crap galore..
Well I usaully go to them because my father goes and like most sons I like to spend time with my dad now and then.
I was trying to keep my eye out for a certain dealer that has tons of daniel defense barrels and dd lower parts kit, dd upper recievers an so forth. I actually bought a dd lower parts kit off of him last year.
Well, found him and he had the dd stuff BUT, no lower parts kits. He said he had a hard time selling them and found out that Daniel Defense gets their lower parts from the same place as dpms,cmmg an other brands. So he didnt like that because he can just get cheaper parts that are the same thing and make a better profit.
He now sells "his" lower parts kits for around 60 bucks and says there no different. Well, needless to say I didnt buy them and wasnt too sure if he was bullshitting like most dealers or found somthing out and it was legit.
I havnt really looked into Robs "new chart" so that proble says otherwise.
What to you guys think? BS, or is there some true to most brands getting certain parts from one source?
No, they aren't all the same. A lot of LPK's are using some parts from the same manufacturers, etc but they are not all identical. I'd much rather have a DD LPK than a DPMS or CMMG which are among some of the worst LPK out there... So yeah, some parts may be the same but not all. It's worth it to pay an extra $20-$50 for a known quality LPK -- without a doubt. I'd just get one from gandrtactical.com if they're currently in stock.
polymorpheous
06-24-12, 13:14
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=39291
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=40715
Use the search function:
https://www.m4carbine.net/gtsearch.php?cx=003496919632624929056%3Adhiwgm0hbaa&cof=FORID%3A10&ie=UTF-8&q=DD++daniel+defense+lower+parts+kit+LPK&siteurl=www.m4carbine.net%2Fsearch.php%3Fsearchid%3D4484671&ref=www.m4carbine.net%2Fsearch.php%3Fsearchid%3D4484662&siteurl=www.m4carbine.net%2Fsearch.php%3Fsearchid%3D4484671&ref=www.m4carbine.net%2Fsearch.php%3Fsearchid%3D4484662
Historically speaking, gun show vendor's are typically a little unreliable for information. What they sell tends to be swap meet standards and neither reliably genuine or reliably good. That DD rail or part may or may not be genuine as what recourse do you have with "some guy" who sells stuff out of the back of his van and took your cash? There are some decent and ethical gun show vendors, but they are the exception and not the rule.
For your question: Many small parts (pins, springs, screws, etc.) come from companies that make these type of parts for various applications, but there is a huge difference in quality between a good manufacturer an cheap one. If DD, BCM, Colt, FN, etc. have something built to their spec (or US Gov TDP) using materials and manufacturing methods that they specify (or to TDP) as well, you really don't have to worry about quality.
There have been many posts about small parts suppliers and source of parts. Search is your friend
I think the dealer is doing what a lot of dealers are doing when they can't get certain highly in demand parts. They're going to try and sell you what they can get as "something as good as....". I'm sure many of the quality manufacturers will get certain parts from a single source due to the fact that the source provides the part to their specifications and passes their quality controls. Which I'm sure is held to a higher standard than other manufacturers. I do chuckle at the dealers statement that he had a hard time selling DD LPKs. A hard time getting them in stock, that I believe. Hard time selling them? I don't think so.
TacticalTyler
06-24-12, 13:28
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=39291
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=40715
Use the search function:
https://www.m4carbine.net/gtsearch.php?cx=003496919632624929056%3Adhiwgm0hbaa&cof=FORID%3A10&ie=UTF-8&q=DD++daniel+defense+lower+parts+kit+LPK&siteurl=www.m4carbine.net%2Fsearch.php%3Fsearchid%3D4484671&ref=www.m4carbine.net%2Fsearch.php%3Fsearchid%3D4484662&siteurl=www.m4carbine.net%2Fsearch.php%3Fsearchid%3D4484671&ref=www.m4carbine.net%2Fsearch.php%3Fsearchid%3D4484662
I know the search function. Been on here for years.
I wasnt trying to look for DD lower parts kits. I can do that myself. I started this thread for peoples opinions on the situation I was in and wanted their thoughts.
Now continue to get your post count up shitting on peoples threads. Also giving the typical "search function"
You already ripped apart this new guy, guess your making your rounds?
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=107821
TacticalTyler
06-24-12, 13:34
interfan, 3ae
thanks for giving me an a decent response. Your opinions is what I wanted.
I know most guys on here are thinking this place is turning into twitter or the other site.
Ya I know what he said about having a hard time selling them, that threw up red flags instantly lol.
Hard time selling them? I don't think so.
You better believe they are hard to sell. As is any other high quality firearm.
That masses want a safe full of cheap guns, rather than a few quality, dependable firearms.
Cheap sells, why do you think there is so much cheap shit at gun shows/shops?
TacticalTyler
06-24-12, 14:15
You better believe they are hard to sell. As is any other high quality firearm.
That masses want a safe full of cheap guns, rather than a few quality, dependable firearms.
Cheap sells, why do you think there is so much cheap shit at gun shows/shops?
Thats true too. I would say they go out of stock quick online.
At a gun show not soo much..
Noodles McGee
06-24-12, 14:56
You better believe they are hard to sell. As is any other high quality firearm.
That masses want a safe full of cheap guns, rather than a few quality, dependable firearms.
Cheap sells, why do you think there is so much cheap shit at gun shows/shops?
Agree with this 100%
I have a lot easier time finding good parts locally than online(for the most part)
Many dealers will say whatever it takes to make a sale. Then once the supply comes back in and things "normalize" they will justify it with another story.
I would never compare a DD kit to a kit from CMMG or DPMS. I have no idea as to their pedigree, but you can often times compare them and see differences.
Pistol Shooter
06-24-12, 16:12
I know the search function. Been on here for years.
I wasnt trying to look for DD lower parts kits. I can do that myself. I started this thread for peoples opinions on the situation I was in and wanted their thoughts.
Now continue to get your post count up shitting on peoples threads. Also giving the typical "search function"
You already ripped apart this new guy, guess your making your rounds?
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=107821
+1
:lol:
Maybe whoever HE got his LPK's from was getting knockoffs and told him that, but I don't think they are the same.
Many dealers will say whatever it takes to make a sale. Then once the supply comes back in and things "normalize" they will justify it with another story.
I would never compare a DD kit to a kit from CMMG or DPMS. I have no idea as to their pedigree, but you can often times compare them and see differences.
Most of their customers can't tell the difference, or know the difference between a DD LPK and a DPMS failure parts kit.
Most customers don't know that there licensed copies of DD made in Taiwan for airsoft that will fit real rifles, not to mention three times as many unlicensed copies made in China that may or may not.
All they need to do to make a sale is have their goods look like what you want, at a price that's in line with what you're expecting. From then on, all the above issues become the buyer's problem - hence why I wait for the good stuff to get back in stock, and really only waste my time at gun shows when I'm bored, and would be spending that money at a crap movie anyway.
I go to lots of gun shows. I was at the Pasadena Texas gun show yesterday and saw just the opposite. Saw all the top tier AR's: Noveske (3), Daniel Defense (6), BCM (4), and Colt (Lots of them). Even more lower end brand rifles, they were everywhere.
Most of the Dealers actually seem to care and know the products better then you would think. Overall I was amazed at how many AR rifles and accessories were available and the prices were extremely competitive. Maybe its because I Live in Texas were most folks still love their guns.
The great LPK dilemma. Which ones are good? Which ones are the same as company XYZ for less money?
We had these same questions many years ago when we were tired of low quality LPK's for our custom builds.
As far as I can tell, no OEM manufacturer (the kind that sells to companies like BCM, DD, etc) makes every single part for a lower. So that means that some companies source LPK's from 3 or 4 different places or simply make the easier parts in house.
To my knowledge, ONLY Colt makes all the parts in house. They also sub out parts to manufacturers that they trust. Since they have the TDP, I rate their LPK's the best. This is why people will say that they are selling the same LPK's as company XYZ, but might only be buying ONE of the items in that companies LPK's.
My second choice is LMT. They make many components in house and is why we use many of their items in OUR LPK's.
I believe companies like DD and S&W are making more and more items in house (which is a positive thing) and I think we will have more and more quality LPK's to choose from in the future.
C4
I find it hard to see, from a purely buisness sense, that a company would have 2 complete seperate lines that produce 2 different grades of pins, springs etc. I tend to think of LPK items as I do generic foods. Made by the same company, but marketed to a different buyer. Some people buy a product and some buy a name. But both buy the same thing, just the company makes more per unit off the name.
polymorpheous
06-24-12, 18:50
Did you read the threads I linked to?
If you had you would have found info as to the quality and parts sources for DD's LPK.
Try not to be an emotional reactionary on this board.
Otherwise it won't work for you.
As for the other thread.
Well it disappeared, and I wonder why.
Must have been me racking up my post count!
:sarcastic:
ETA: If there is a perceived problem with my posts on this board, I encourage you to use the report button.
charmcitycop
06-24-12, 19:14
.....
I find it hard to see, from a purely buisness sense, that a company would have 2 complete seperate lines that produce 2 different grades of pins, springs etc. I tend to think of LPK items as I do generic foods. Made by the same company, but marketed to a different buyer. Some people buy a product and some buy a name. But both buy the same thing, just the company makes more per unit off the name.
Companies make different quality of parts all the time.
A friend of mine is helping a start up AR builder get parts. So he calls up a company that makes bolts. He places his order and during the conversation, he says to the manufacturer; "Those bolts are 158 carp. steel right?" The manufacturer stated, "They can be."
As we have seen with generic drugs, they can be wildly different than the name brand versions.
In some instances, yes, parts are parts and what you get in our LPK is the same as what Colt uses. With that said, many people don't know the industry well enough to know where the quality parts come from and where they don't.
C4
TacticalTyler
06-25-12, 14:03
thanks for the replys grant. THATS exactly what I was looking for.
Also, My gas tube fits well. ( I was the one that sent you the gas tube box pictures lol)
TacticalTyler
06-25-12, 14:26
Did you read the threads I linked to?
If you had you would have found info as to the quality and parts sources for DD's LPK.
Try not to be an emotional reactionary on this board.
Otherwise it won't work for you.
As for the other thread.
Well it disappeared, and I wonder why.
Must have been me racking up my post count!
:sarcastic:
ETA: If there is a perceived problem with my posts on this board, I encourage you to use the report button.
Ya im sure I couldve read through all those threads. But they all were about DD lower parts kits.
I was just pointing out that it looks bad just goin around looking for new threads to rip on.
Thats the moderators job to take care of un-needed threads, and he took care of the last thread for you. He could have easily done that without your insults.
I cant stand the twitter or arfcom type threads either. Hell, even in the picture threads is getting a little repetitive. That said, I dont want to make it worse by spreading hate around about it either lol.
Failure2Stop
06-25-12, 14:35
I find it hard to see, from a purely buisness sense, that a company would have 2 complete seperate lines that produce 2 different grades of pins, springs etc. I tend to think of LPK items as I do generic foods. Made by the same company, but marketed to a different buyer. Some people buy a product and some buy a name. But both buy the same thing, just the company makes more per unit off the name.
Different companies also have different acceptance standards, testing, and tolerance, and failure to meet those criteria have different consequences with different companies. This can, will, and does result in certain companies having a better product than others though their source is the same.
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