View Full Version : Woman hugs off-duty cop from behind, accidentally gets shot and killed...
Here's the story:
http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/police-hug-triggers-officers-gun-kills-woman-16737471
What do you think happened?
I'm guessing it had to be a horizontal shoulder holster. Why do people still wear these things?
Not only that, but what kind of shitty holster allows a weapon to be fired while IN the holster. Really curious what kind of firearm was involved as well.
Not only that, but what kind of shitty holster allows a weapon to be fired while IN the holster. Really curious what kind of firearm was involved as well.
Yeah. So many of those ridiculous holsters are made out of flimsy fabric that I can't believe this doesn't happen more often. It wouldn't take much pressure, especially if the flimsy fabric was loose around the pistol, to fire off a round.
According to Stephens, the woman "embraced the officer from behind, causing the holstered weapon to accidently discharge." The bullet punctured Miller's lung and hit her heart, and she died at a hospital.
Shoulder holster would be my guess.
Even with high quality leather holsters, years of sweat and heat will take its toll on the leather. They have to be looked at as expendable items which should be inspected and replaced.
There was a pic floating around of a guy who shot himself in the leg when his weapon discharged as he got into a car. IIRC, it was either his shirt which got into the holster when placing the weapon in it, or the leather folded over placing pressure on the trigger.
The article has an incomplete picture of what happened. It may have been pressure on the holster, or the gun falling out of the holster, or a combination.
There's something to be said for handguns with external safety devices, but there has to be consistency and training involved obviously.
This seems to be conclusive evidence that guns are, in fact, dangerous.
Yeah. So many of those ridiculous holsters are made out of flimsy fabric that I can't believe this doesn't happen more often. It wouldn't take much pressure, especially if the flimsy fabric was loose around the pistol, to fire off a round.
I was thinking more in terms of an enclosed trigger guard. Even a shitty $4 koplin holster should prevent any firearm from being discharged.
I used to carry a 1911 and frequently things like getting in and out of a car would knock the safety OFF and I had a cocked and locked 1911 without the safety on. However because the trigger guard was completely enclosed I didn't shoot my foot.
It also helped that I usually heard it click off and had a pretty obsessive compulsive habit of visually inspecting the safety after the first time I inadvertently clicked it off.
This seems to be conclusive evidence that guns are, in fact, dangerous.
Chainsaws and cars are dangerous. I don't think these things are in debate. This is why you have to follow certain rules, guidelines and conducts of safety when using these things.
The_War_Wagon
07-09-12, 07:06
"Stephens said the Detroit officer..."
Uh oh... my FAIL! sense is tingling...
BrigandTwoFour
07-09-12, 09:28
I was with my wife and a couple friends about two weeks ago at a local microbrew pub. We're chatting away and having a fine time.
And then I notice a gentleman walk in the establishment. He was wearing a FDE flight suit (the kind I would be issued when I go to the sandbox), and had a leather horizontal shoulder holster proudly strapped on. I couldn't quite make out the pistol, but from the diameter of the barrel sweeping my wife and I, I think it was in the .45 range. He was clearly LEO (had a badge), I'm guessing the local airborne border patrol unit.
I remember thinking that I would get my ass chewed out BAD for casually hanging out in a public drinking establishment in my uniform after hours, and that I really wanted to say something about appreciating being muzzle swept every few seconds that he was walking around and drinking his beer.
More here -
http://www.freep.com/article/20120708/NEWS01/120708029/Woman-hugs-off-duty-Detroit-police-officer-151-dies-after-his-gun-goes-off?odyssey=nav|head
"Goldpaugh, who spent several hours with the officer after the shooting, said the veteran beat patrolman was hosting a party at his home and was dancing with his wife when Miller came up behind him and tugged at his waist.
“And the gun went off,” Goldpaugh said. “It’s a fluke accidental shooting.”
The weapon, a department-issued, 40-caliber Smith & Wesson semiautomatic pistol, was in a holster worn inside the officer’s waistband and was covered by his shirt, Goldpaugh said.
Goldpaugh said the physical evidence from the incident corroborated the officer’s account of the shooting. The officer did not know the woman, who attended the party with other guests, Goldpaugh said."
Here's my guess:
The gun was either a Glock or M&P carried in condition one, the person who got shot was probably intoxicated, the cop was also probably intoxicated, and that the gun wasn't fired while in the holster.
I dont understand how she could have been shot "in a lung and heart" if he was carrying IWB. Was she on her knees??
It's a dance party... she could have been demonstrating some unconventional positions.
CarlosDJackal
07-09-12, 12:57
Shoulder holster would be my guess...
Probably a horizontal shoulder holster.
They were showing interviews of the victim's relatives (may she RIP) and one of the statements made was, "Why did he have to have a gun in a social setting?" :rolleyes:
As usual, people are going to blame the gun and not the idiot who was carrying it. It was his choice to use a holster that obviously did not provide enough security to prevent this from happening. I guess he'll have to live with this fact for the rest of his life.
Back when I was still wearing badge I had a drunk friend do a grab for my concealed handgun (Glock 23 in an IWB Kydex holster) through my untucked shirt. I almost elbowed her in the process but fortunately was able to maintain control of the firearm. This idiot is no longer a friend because of her anti-gun stance and her insistence to loudly ask me if I was carrying a gun in public. Thankfully, she moved back to Pennsylvania last year.
The later article has much more information;
The weapon, a department-issued, 40-caliber Smith & Wesson semiautomatic pistol, was in a holster worn inside the officer’s waistband and was covered by his shirt, Goldpaugh said.
However, McNair said she also was told her daughter “was being a little flirty” with the officer and the gun fired as they were in a face-to-face hug.
If you’re at a party, she asked, “why do you need a weapon with a round in the chamber?”
I think the media is playing it pretty fast and loose with the word "hug".
Also, the idea that you're a LEO and at a party in Detroit and shouldn't be carrying...give me a break. If Detroit is any like St. Louis, and we seem to swap places on the violent cities list every year, probably about 60% of the shootings start off as; "We were at this party and they just started shooting..."
I understand the family is upset, a 25 year old girl lost her life, but it sounds like an accident. All the blame in the world isn't bringing her back.
It's just not adding up.
A dance floor blowjob is the only thing that makes sense.
I don't think it was so much a dance floor hummer as maybe some provocative dance moves.
CarlosDJackal
07-09-12, 14:03
Does anyone know what type of handgun(s) the Detroit PD issues? Based on the various articles about this that I have read, it seems to be a freak accident precipitated by the drunk victim.
WARNING: THIS IS PURE SPECULATION ON MY PART BASED ON WHAT I HAVE READ.
It seems that the victim may have felt up the Officer's waistband while he was dancing with his wife IN HIS OWN HOME. Turns out he was the host of the party and the victim was not known to him or his family but was brought to the party by another guest.
It sounds like the way she "hugged" him (as some news articles put it) it pushed the gun out of the IWB holster, turning the muzzle towards rear. And in the process of knocking the gun out of the holster, someone may have inadvertently gotten one of their fingers in the trigger guard which caused the handgun (in .40 S&W caliber) to discharge. It could happen when someone reaches of a firearm that they are trying to control or keep from falling to the ground. Any of the three individuals (the Off-Duty Officer, his wife, or the victim) who was within arms reach of the handgun could have done it.
If the victim was doing what a former friend once did to me when she was drunk (reached in and tried to grab my handgun - fortunately my shirt hindered her and I was able to pin her hand down and maintain control of my handgun) she may have caused the incident herself. Why she would do such a thing is the question. But you never know what drunks will do (which is why I am not an advocate of open carrying especially in establishments that serve alcohol).
A tragedy regardless of what really happened.
Yeah well, maybe the wife shot her and it's a coverup! The victim didn't know the people as she came with another guest and then was "flirty" and dancing up on another woman's husband? Bad idea... I bet the wife knew he was packing.
Yeah well, maybe the wife shot her and it's a coverup! The victim didn't know the people as she came with another guest and then was "flirty" and dancing up on another woman's husband? Bad idea... I bet the wife knew he was packing.
Kinda my thoughts ?
Guy brought some chick he met or was hired to party and go after the host like a stripper might and the rest ? Hard to say tragedy and cant imagine for any reason it was planned !
Could have been the wife crime of passion when the guest was doing a bit to much ?
Or no holster gal was undoing his belt and pants on her knees and as the weight made it start to fall she tried to grab it ?
Strange story for sure
If we're speculating...
Said she was behind him. Canted holster... she "get low get low get low" dances behind him, grabs his waist to get back up... BAM! That'd put her at the right height without the fellatio theory.
If we're speculating...
Said she was behind him. Canted holster... she "get low get low get low" dances behind him, grabs his waist to get back up... BAM! That'd put her at the right height without the fellatio theory.
Yeah that and no holster seems propable
Does anyone know what type of handgun(s) the Detroit PD issues? Based on the various articles about this that I have read, it seems to be a freak accident precipitated by the drunk victim.
WARNING: THIS IS PURE SPECULATION ON MY PART BASED ON WHAT I HAVE READ.
It seems that the victim may have felt up the Officer's waistband while he was dancing with his wife IN HIS OWN HOME. Turns out he was the host of the party and the victim was not known to him or his family but was brought to the party by another guest.
It sounds like the way she "hugged" him (as some news articles put it) it pushed the gun out of the IWB holster, turning the muzzle towards rear. And in the process of knocking the gun out of the holster, someone may have inadvertently gotten one of their fingers in the trigger guard which caused the handgun (in .40 S&W caliber) to discharge. It could happen when someone reaches of a firearm that they are trying to control or keep from falling to the ground. Any of the three individuals (the Off-Duty Officer, his wife, or the victim) who was within arms reach of the handgun could have done it.
If the victim was doing what a former friend once did to me when she was drunk (reached in and tried to grab my handgun - fortunately my shirt hindered her and I was able to pin her hand down and maintain control of my handgun) she may have caused the incident herself. Why she would do such a thing is the question. But you never know what drunks will do (which is why I am not an advocate of open carrying especially in establishments that serve alcohol).
A tragedy regardless of what really happened.
Smith & Wesson M&P40 pistols.
Does anyone know what type of handgun(s) the Detroit PD issues?
One news article described it as a "Smith and Wesson M&P .40 caliber handgun" and they also described it as not having a mechanical safety.
theblackknight
07-09-12, 21:41
I was with my wife and a couple friends about two weeks ago at a local microbrew pub. We're chatting away and having a fine time.
And then I notice a gentleman walk in the establishment. He was wearing a FDE flight suit (the kind I would be issued when I go to the sandbox), and had a leather horizontal shoulder holster proudly strapped on. I couldn't quite make out the pistol, but from the diameter of the barrel sweeping my wife and I, I think it was in the .45 range. He was clearly LEO (had a badge), I'm guessing the local airborne border patrol unit.
I remember thinking that I would get my ass chewed out BAD for casually hanging out in a public drinking establishment in my uniform after hours, and that I really wanted to say something about appreciating being muzzle swept every few seconds that he was walking around and drinking his beer.
Wait.
Soo dude had a gun, and a beer.you didn't say anything?
Backbonefail
Sent from my Droid using Tapatalk 2
The pistol had to at least partially if not all the way come out of the holster and one of them likely accidentaly pulled the trigger during the fall or whatever happened, that or he wasn't using a holster.
I have some shitty holsters I've randomly acquired over the years and they still won't allow a pistol to just go off, function wise there ok they just suck at everything else.
One news article described it as a "Smith and Wesson M&P .40 caliber handgun" and they also described it as not having a mechanical safety.
Anyone care to guess what the next pistol that the Detroit PD adopts will have?
Anyone care to guess what the next pistol that the Detroit PD adopts will have?
Squirt guns.
The_War_Wagon
07-10-12, 08:53
Anyone care to guess what the next pistol that the Detroit PD adopts will have?
Matchlocks? :rolleyes:
One news article described it as a "Smith and Wesson M&P .40 caliber handgun" and they also described it as not having a mechanical safety.
I was thinking Glock or M&P from the moment I read about the incident. Not rocket science, the overt probability should be evident to most. Odds of someone walking around with a hammer back and safety off are much slimmer, but still possible of course.
CarlosDJackal
07-11-12, 09:20
Anyone care to guess what the next pistol that the Detroit PD adopts will have?
A revolver. But they will all have to carry their bullets in their pocket. :rolleyes:
High Tower
07-12-12, 11:11
If we're speculating...
Said she was behind him. Canted holster... she "get low get low get low" dances behind him, grabs his waist to get back up... BAM! That'd put her at the right height without the fellatio theory.
Daily Mail is reporting it was an "exotic dance." So I would surmise that you are correct in this theory...not that we'll ever find out.
Edit to add article: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2172094/Adaisha-Miller-knees-doing-exotic-dance-policemans-gun-went-killed-her.html
This sounds WAY too much like the "gun went off while cleaning" BS they routinely print to cover up suicides, particularly when it's a cop, so reliably used that it's established to mean exactly that. Corrupt media paired with big city PD's print whatever they're told to.
Daily Mail is reporting it was an "exotic dance." So I would surmise that you are correct in this theory...not that we'll ever find out.
Edit to add article: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2172094/Adaisha-Miller-knees-doing-exotic-dance-policemans-gun-went-killed-her.html
I like how a UK article is about the only one that has some mention of exotic ?
and this pic of her
http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2012/07/09/article-2170759-13FDE7FE000005DC-714_634x475.jpg
I think I might go back to my theory !
This sounds WAY too much like the "gun went off while cleaning" BS they routinely print to cover up suicides, particularly when it's a cop, so reliably used that it's established to mean exactly that. Corrupt media paired with big city PD's print whatever they're told to.
What pipe dream world are you living in that you think the media is in cahoots with the Detroit PD? Or any police department?
The first story probably said "hug" because to say "she was dancing like a stripper with a married guy in simulation of a sex act" only served to disgrace a dead girl.
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