View Full Version : First Handgun
I know this has been discussed at nauseum, BUT At this point..
Would you recommend buying a gen 4 glock 19 , tracking down an older gen 2 G19 on GB or going straight to the m&p line?
Regards,
Snake Plissken
08-01-12, 16:58
You really ought to read the first few pages of threads here.
If you don't feel like looking through any threads, do yourself a favor and finger as many guns as you can. You won't go wrong with any of the name brand, quality guns. Glocks are good though.
I am allowed to give away one free fish, today only and you, youngAR, are the lucky recipient!
Get a Walther PPQ. It's a solid, reliable pistol, accurate. simple and has just about the best trigger in the business
http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n289/SgtSongDog/Handguns/20120323_1726532.jpg
I am allowed to give away one free fish, today only and you, youngAR, are the lucky recipient!
Get a Walther PPQ. It's a solid, reliable pistol, accurate. simple and has just about the best trigger in the business
http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n289/SgtSongDog/Handguns/20120323_1726532.jpg
I don't know what that means sir but you can give away some of that 9mm NATO. Don't worry, it'll get taken care of.
I know this has been discussed at nauseum, BUT At this point..
Would you recommend buying a gen 4 glock 19 , tracking down an older gen 2 G19 on GB or going straight to the m&p line?
Regards,
If you are only going to own one handgun it's hard to go wrong with a 9mm Glock. I prefer the 17 personally, but the 19 is probably a better choice for CCW. Nothing wrong with Gen 2, but it won't have a light rail on the dust cover. The Gen 4 still appears to have some bugs to be worked out. I would recommend you look at the Gen 3 17/19s.
Gen 4 G19. Be prepared for the possibility of messing with it. You might have to.
Or: used older vintage Gen 3 G19 of unknown history. Replace all the springs, then quit worrying.
OP, you will probably find a different answer from every member here. My first pistol was a Springfield Armory XD-40 Tactical. Since then I have had an XD-40 subcompact, Ruger LCP .380, XDm .40 3.8 compact, XDm .40 4.5 custom, and newest addition is the XDs .45ACP. The last three of those I still have. As you can see I am an XD fan.
If you're unfamiliar with the XD line, it is a polymer pistol based off of a 1911 grip angle and shares the external grip safety which some love and some hate. My 5 different XD pistols have each functioned flawlessly through more than a thousand rounds each (almost a thousand with the XDs because it is so new, but still flawless so far) and each has had it's own purpose.
Springfield Armory, Glock, Smith&Wesson are all good brands. There are many more.
I think you should look at what you're trying to do and narrow the field. If this is a concealed carry weapon what kind of carrying do you need? Do you need something that will fit in your pocket or can you get away with wearing one on your hip? Is this strictly for home defense and range purposes? Do you want a polymer pistol? These questions will narrow the field quite a bit.
I personally don't carry any caliber that doesn't start with a '.4', but I have carried a little .380. I don't want to ignite a caliber flame war, its all preference. Once you have decided what qualifications the pistol must meet for use then we can help you further.
fail wagon
08-02-12, 01:14
Gen 4 G19. Be prepared for the possibility of messing with it. You might have to.
Or: used older vintage Gen 3 G19 of unknown history. Replace all the springs, then quit worrying.
My buddies gen 4 is having issues with even at a low round count. If it were me I would buy a 3rd gen if possible
pbr streetgang
08-02-12, 01:28
i have a couple of gen 3 glock 17's and a S&W MP9. i did have a gen 4 g19 and sold it after about 2 months, didn't really like it so much.
I would probably sell the S&W, but i will never sell the Glock gen 3's.
-Smith M&P or 3rd gen steel autos
-Older/3rd gen G19/17,
-PPQ
-Used (or new if you have the $$) HK USP, p30
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Beat Trash
08-02-12, 08:21
You question is kind of like asking, "Which model should I sleep with? The blond, the brunette, or the red head?" (Correct answer is of course, the red head.)
There is some amount of personal preference involved.
A reliable Glock 17/19 is a good choice. Unfortunately buying new is a crap shoot. Used guns can be an option if not abused too much.
An M&P would be a very good option.
The Walther PPQ is a good gun. Magazines are a bit pricy. I personally don't like the feel of the grip. Some people do. People have different size hands. Different needs. Different preferences.
You need to narrow down your list and then go out and shoot one of each gun on your list. Then buy whichever gun you like the most.
Failure2Stop
08-02-12, 09:08
I have around 6,000 rounds combined from my gen 4 G19 and G17, both built after Feb of 12. I have had 2 stoppages total that were not user induced, both horizontal stovepipes, both with blazer 115gr.
At this point I am satisfied with the performance of the recent manufacture gen 4 Glocks to recommend them.
At this point, unless you want something other than a Glock, just get a G19, some extra mags, new sights (I am really digging the Ameriglo Hacks and CAPs with a pro operator rear), a decent holster, and lots of training ammo.
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spencer_okc
08-02-12, 21:24
+1 on the PPQ trigger being AWESOME.
My personal opinion is that the GEN3 Glock 19 is one of the best all around handguns ever made. Small enough to conceal for most people, but still large enough to shoot well. Glock pistols are affordable, durable, and reliable. 15+1 capacity is plenty of firepower, and modern 124 or 147 grain self defense loading in 9mm are more than adequate.
The GEN4 is probably a fine pistol, but I don't have any experience with them. The GEN4 guns were built to fix problems with the GEN3 .40S&W models, and I would give the GEN4 a slight recommendation edge over the GEN3 in .40 caliber.
Smith & Wesson M&P pistols are supposed to be getting a new and drastically improved trigger sometime this year. The new M&P Shield is shipping with the trigger upgrades (and would also be an excellent pistol).
Springfield XD pistols seem bulky to me compared to the Glock & Smith, but they are also excellent firearms. My sister carries an XDM compact .40 as a police detective, and praises it as the best firearm she has every carried (previously carried Glock 17 and Glock 22 pistols).
Voodoo_Man
08-02-12, 21:26
I have around 6,000 rounds combined from my gen 4 G19 and G17, both built after Feb of 12. I have had 2 stoppages total that were not user induced, both horizontal stovepipes, both with blazer 115gr.
At this point I am satisfied with the performance of the recent manufacture gen 4 Glocks to recommend them.
At this point, unless you want something other than a Glock, just get a G19, some extra mags, new sights (I am really digging the Ameriglo Hacks and CAPs with a pro operator rear), a decent holster, and lots of training ammo.
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+1 for the gen4 g19 and g17.
I have both and both have good amount of rounds through them.
My g19 is my carry gun and does its job.
I have around 6,000 rounds combined from my gen 4 G19 and G17, both built after Feb of 12. I have had 2 stoppages total that were not user induced, both horizontal stovepipes, both with blazer 115gr.
Although that puts your MRBS at 3,000 rounds between them which is totally acceptable, I'd say it's inevitable that you're going to have some kind of FTE with 115gr bulk with the new springs.
crusader377
08-02-12, 23:29
For my first handgun, right now I would pick either a S&W M&P 9 or a Glock 19. Both of these pistols are well proven and aftermarket accessories are widely available.
If for what ever reason these two pistols don't work for you, I would then broaden my search to include the FN FNP/FNX or Walther PPQ
All four of these pistols are roughly in the $450 to $600 range and all four would work well.
The G19 and M&P9 are very similar. Go with what fits your hand the best. Try this- pick a spot on the wall, close your eyes, aim handgun and what you think is the spot- open your eyes. See how your pointing and how your eyes line up with the sights. Do that with both guns. See what naturally points best for you. See which slide release you like better, what trigger, etc (ergonomics). Function will be the same. M&P is also available with a thumb safety if that is important to you.
find a local range that rents the guns you want. Shoot each one then decide. I like M&Ps but their triggers are garbage. Usually takes a couple hundred in parts to make them decent. Glocks are decent, but I don't shoot them as well mainly because I haven't had as much trigger time as other guns. I am a huge 1911 fan, but you have to be committed to parts replacement and being somewhat of a minor smith unless you have a good 1911 shop around and are willing to pay them.
The PPQ is a pretty viable option from what I have seen, but I have never shot one so its hard for me to be able to recommend it completely. I like sigs and berettas as that is what I cut my teeth on, but mastering the DA/SA trigger does take more time then a striker fired gun that has one pull.
Even with all that being said, the first gun I put in a person's hand when they are new and asking about a first pistol is a glock 19.
Richard Belott
08-04-12, 10:34
+1 on going to your local dealer and trying all the guns on your list.
Failure2Stop
08-04-12, 10:55
+1 on going to your local dealer and trying all the guns on your list.
If I have never driven a car before, what good is it to go to the local dealer and getting into and out of a bunch of cars without driving them/without knowing how to drive them? What car am I most likely to leave with? The one he tells me to, whether that is because he needs to clear it off the lot, makes the most commission off of it, has a personal attachment to that brand/model, or maybe because it is what he thinks you want. Now, to make it even more interesting, what if he barely knows how to drive?
It's not any different with guns, most gunstore employees (unless you happen to live close to a good one) aren't impressive shooters, don't spend a great deal of time actually shooting, don't have hands on experience with actually getting people to use their firearms well, and are some of the greatest purveyors of gun myth and misconception on the planet.
Take a look atty what the leading trainers in the country use. Take a look at what the largest police contacts are for. Most people don't know what to look for as far as "feel", but with work just about anything will feel right.
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davebee456
08-04-12, 11:11
If I had to buy a NEW 9mm:
1. Walther PPQ
2. Hk P30
What I did is:
Buy like new Glock 19's
- Serial Numbers up to N** Serial Prefixes...
Late N Serials and M Serials are when the Dipped Extractor was introduced...
I sold my new one with the crappy finish and weak ejection and
I bought a LAC 08' Prefix Austrian Proofed Glock 19 at a local gun shop for
$425.00 OTD
Then I bought a FPE 03' Serial Prefix On gunbroker from a seller that said it was unfired for for $500.00
Just keep looking on Gunbroker and local stores for trade ins
2 Glock 19's for the price of one Hk P30.
My brother is just getting into guns and shooting. Complete novice. He wants a carry handgun. This is the advice I have given, and what he is going to do (he is not local to me, unfortunately)
1. Take an NRA basic handgun class.
2. Try as many guns as are possible during the class.
3. When renting/test firing, and when fondling new stuff from the case, I suggested he specifically check out: 9mm compact/sub compact Glock, XD and M&P and S&W 642 + Ruger LCR
4. If the basic class goes well, consider a follow up/more advanced class as soon as possible. If feasible, select and purchase a gun before the more advanced class.
I have around 6,000 rounds combined from my gen 4 G19 and G17, both built after Feb of 12. I have had 2 stoppages total that were not user induced, both horizontal stovepipes, both with blazer 115gr.
At this point I am satisfied with the performance of the recent manufacture gen 4 Glocks to recommend them.
At this point, unless you want something other than a Glock, just get a G19, some extra mags, new sights (I am really digging the Ameriglo Hacks and CAPs with a pro operator rear), a decent holster, and lots of training ammo.
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^This.
I've gotten slammed for this here before but here goes:
carry and combat performance are only part of the handgun equation-most people starting out should get a gun that promotes lots of inexpensive practice, has good sights and trigger and allows you to learn proper technique BEFORE moving to a gun for CCW or home defense. While I have my share of glocks and they do make good entry level combat guns, they are probably not the best to learn the fundamentals on, with the spongy long trigger movement arc and big blocky sights.
I will always maintain it may not be high speed or the latest tacticool thing but a good solid 22 target pistol that allows you to master the fundamentals is still the place to start.
Too many people try to run before they have crawled and walked with pistol shooting- If you feel the need for a defensive firearm right away sure get a glock or m&p or whatever, but it should be coupled with a good 22 training gun.
I've gotten slammed for this here before but here goes:
carry and combat performance are only part of the handgun equation-most people starting out should get a gun that promotes lots of inexpensive practice, has good sights and trigger and allows you to learn proper technique BEFORE moving to a gun for CCW or home defense. While I have my share of glocks and they do make good entry level combat guns, they are probably not the best to learn the fundamentals on, with the spongy long trigger movement arc and big blocky sights.
I will always maintain it may not be high speed or the latest tacticool thing but a good solid 22 target pistol that allows you to master the fundamentals is still the place to start.
Too many people try to run before they have crawled and walked with pistol shooting- If you feel the need for a defensive firearm right away sure get a glock or m&p or whatever, but it should be coupled with a good 22 training gun.
If you get an M&P pistol, you can also get a M&P 22 and have a great training pistol in .22 that nearly mimics the full caliber one.
If I have never driven a car before, what good is it to go to the local dealer and getting into and out of a bunch of cars without driving them/without knowing how to drive them? What car am I most likely to leave with? The one he tells me to, whether that is because he needs to clear it off the lot, makes the most commission off of it, has a personal attachment to that brand/model, or maybe because it is what he thinks you want. Now, to make it even more interesting, what if he barely knows how to drive?
It's not any different with guns, most gunstore employees (unless you happen to live close to a good one) aren't impressive shooters, don't spend a great deal of time actually shooting, don't have hands on experience with actually getting people to use their firearms well, and are some of the greatest purveyors of gun myth and misconception on the planet.
Take a look atty what the leading trainers in the country use. Take a look at what the largest police contacts are for. Most people don't know what to look for as far as "feel", but with work just about anything will feel right.
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THIS - despite my low post count, I've been a lurker on M4C for years... possibly the best, most concise, summary of the proper mentality (in my humble opinion) needed for "initial" handgun/longun purchases.
Buy something well regarded in the right community (read: M4C, et al), and shoot the heck out of it (not a couple hundred, but a couple thousand rounds, minimum, downrange). If in a year or two you become proficient enough by training often enough, THEN consider comfort/performance improvements that can be had through alternative weapon systems. Each system has it's benefits and drawbacks, and you'll find fanbois supporting/knocking brands to validate their own purchases.
Ultimately, while no one can tell you what works for you, there's no need to make simple, costly (in terms of dollars), mistakes early - get a worthy combat pistol and shoot it.
While I like the platform was surprised to see so many recommendations for PPQ.
I thought about this for awhile, and it really is a great first handgun. There are ZERO accuracy issues with it, has a phenomenal stock trigger, it's entirely ambi so no messing around for lefties, no mag release issues because you aren't engrained into any one style, no issues with being picky about ammo or grip that I have experienced, it's ergonomic and adjustable to smaller or larger hands, it's really a great first gun platform.
The obvious things the PPQ lacks is a lot of aftermarket support, like options for cutting up the grip, sights, etc. But imo those things are mostly beyond the first handgun owner anyhow.
I mean, I'm pretty sure almost no one here would for the OP recommend a stippled Gen3 Glock17 with a Glock19 sized grip reduction, a fiber front sight / black rears, a match barrel, undercut frame and the slide stop cut off.
.... So, yea, PPQ is actually a really fine choice for a first handgun.
Guinnessman
08-08-12, 16:08
I have several Glocks and they have all been great. My Gen 4 17 has been flawless since Glock updated its parts last November. My November built Glock 19 has been running great with no issues. Although the Gen 3 and 4 Glocks have had issues the past couple of years, all of my newer Glocks have performed well. With the addition of the new Apex Extractor the new Glocks should be good to go.
The Walther PPQ is another great gun that has been tempting me lately. If I was not so dedicated to Glocks I just may buy one of these. When I shot the PPQ it really impressed me with its accuracy and great trigger.
Go find a range and try as many models as you can. Good luck.
I don't know what that means sir but you can give away some of that 9mm NATO. Don't worry, it'll get taken care of.
I meant to address my post to Monarchos but I misread something somewhere. It was probably my dyspepsia, you know, where you read letters & numbers backwards and get them switched around.
Most of that 9mm ammo has already been taken care of, but thanks for offering :D
http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n289/SgtSongDog/Handguns/th_DSC_0024-1.jpg (http://s115.photobucket.com/albums/n289/SgtSongDog/Handguns/?action=view¤t=DSC_0024-1.mp4)
Glocks will likely not FEEL good the first time you pick them up, and I still don't like the hump position. But, they are quote shootable and accurate - and that is what counts.
The G19 and MP9 are very different. The MP9 grip is slim and slippery. Try the Gen 4 Glock - it has great texturing. If I don't hold my strong thumb WIDE over my weak hand, I get slide bite with a Glock in a hearbeat - not so with the MP. I use a GFA on the G19 and it corrects the hump and adds more beavertail. Glock seriously needs to add SLIGHTLY more beavertail and 1mm of plastic at the rear of the frame. This would allow the HIGHEST hold and make the gun 50% better. 100% better would be to change the hump.
.45's and .38's
08-09-12, 12:31
G19 Gen 4
I would also condsider the
M&P compact
Kahr CW or CM9, those can be found for great prices
whatever fits your hand best, the removable backhand straps on the g19 help with that
:dance3:
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