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View Full Version : Ruger Gunsite Painted and Customized :) a 19D's Review (Army Cav Scout)



sangria7
09-02-12, 15:45
Morning All

On this fine labor day I finally got the time to go over the review of my Ruger Gunsite. Before I go on, I wanted to share that I was a former 19D Cavalry Scout assigned to 10th Mountain Division Light Infantry; so 'scouting' was our bread and butter. (I did this for over 7 years and even help instruct many young scouts). I have broken down the key elements for a good scout rifle. The traditional Cav Scout missions are screen, recon, route survey, pursuit and demonstration, objective overwatch. The cav scout is the commander's eyes and ears they go out and get fresh intel. And no, we are not Infantry and part of our SOP is not to get "decisively engaged"; if anything we do 'enemy harassment' at best. A dead scout is a useless scout; especially if they have intel already gathered.

This review is based on my opinion and my opinion only. I do not say I am the sole expert but only go by experience. I am sure I will have people who disagree :)

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Function Category[B]

- Weight: At only 7lbs the RGS is a perfect weapon for the scout. Maneuverability, Speed, and Stealth is a key element for a scout and moving around with heavy load is not optimal for a 19D or any light based war-fighter. Adding a scope, bipod, and cheek pad holder brings the RGS to 10lbs 2 oz. Still very light in my opinion.

- Iron Sights: The iron sights out of the box are almost dead on at 50 yards. Most of the shot groupings at 50 were a little high and to the left about 1 MOA. But then again it could probably me as I did it only sandbag supported and not on a sled. Also the ammo I used was the very cheap Brown Bear 308. However, if you will be using a short relief scope, the rear iron sights has to come off, which is a no-no in my book. That means if your primary scope or optics breaks or dies, and you become forced to remove it, then you do not have any back up sights literally. Fortunately, the are easy to put back on, but you will need your allen wrench and your back up sight readily available. One note is that under dynamic stress situations, you will not be able to perform this function easily. The rear aperture sight is a ghost ring adjustable sight and the front sight is a fixed non glare post.

- Accuracy:Based on the ammo I was using, I would say that the RGS is very accurate out of the box. I apologize for not having more information on the range report or have my targets available to show you but once I had my optics zero'd in my shot groups were right on top of each other at 50 yards using cheap ammo. I can only assume that using match grade brass would be much better. But in my usage, the RGS is capable of shooting 1 MOA groupings at 100 yards using crappy ammo. The barrel itself has a 1:10" twist which is adequate to stabilize the 308.

- Firepower / Ammo Stress Test: With the available 10 round magazine, the firepower is adequate for the Scout's Mission. Again, we do not get decisively engaged. The one downfall is that since it is a bolt action rifle and your shots are dependent on your speed and ability to manage the bolt. The 308 caliber is more than adequate to bring down targets at very long distances. The .308 is acceptable for both military and Law Enforcement use, and is very capable of 800+ meter hits on a human size target. If you are a Law Enforcement sharpshooter, keep in mind the penetrating power of the .308, especially with full metal jacket rounds like the old M118. The RGS comes with a standard 10 round Mini-14 style magazine but a 3 and 5 is also available. I opted to get the 10 round polymer magazine as it was easier load and easier to place within the magazine well. Lastly it was half the weight. The polymer magazine is the way to go. I used the Brown Bear 308 for a reason, and that is to stress the rifle a bit. In the field, getting clean and optimal ammo is not always readily available. I shot 60 rounds of Brown Bear and I wanted to see the effects. Out of the 60 rounds, I had a total of 8 FTE situations. The round got stuck in the chamber. In order to remove the stuck round, I had place the rifle vertical, pull the bolt to the rear, and shake vigorously; and the ammo would fall out in a shake or two. Using the Brown Bear, the action however in feeding the round was sloppy and jerky at times. Nothing too bad, but definitely noticeable.

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- Mechanics: The RGS works. To start off the RGS has many pluses: Flash Suppressor, Picatinny Rails, Recoil Pad, Integral Scope Mounts, and a non rotating controlled extractor. It a few flaws that I experienced. If using a long range scope the bolt actions is right under the rear of the scope. In non stress situations, this is a non factor. However during high stress situations, this means that the user can potentially find themselves struggling with pulling the bolt back under that scope. I tried to simulate rapid firing and blind bolt manipulation and found it difficult; often times finding myself struggling. I actually lost layers of skin on my thumb joint. It could be that the bolt is still fairly new, but it is not as smooth as I would like it. Also, pulling the bolt back to full extension comes really close to my face. Too close for my comfort, and sometimes causing me to break cheek weld. Again, the rear iron sight must be removed in order place a high powered scope :( The magazine well is difficult to operate with the stock magazine, but using the polymers was much easier. All these are non issues at the rifle range, but can cause problems during dynamic stress situations. I would have loved Ruger to put this as a semi-auto action rifle; similar to the M14. Overall, the mechanics are great at the range, not so great in the field.
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Form Category

- Ergonomics: The barrel is only 16.5 inches and the overall length is 40 inches with the stock add-ons, give the RGS very good ergonomics. Scouts are not snipers nor is our mission to snipe targets. The main weapon for the Scout is the radio, which we use to call back intel and more importantly use for Call For Fire Artillery Missions. Saying that longer barrels hinder our ability to move in heavy brush. The barrel length is still good enough for long range engagements and egress back into hiding positions. The stock has the ability to adjust LOP as you add or subract the included stock spacers. So the only downside is to make sure you configure the stock prior to your missions.

- Aesthetics: OK, some people may disagree with me, but that stock look is not used for scouting. The finish actually reflects a camera flash and looks terrible in my opinion. So I sanded it down and used Krylon Camo Paint to give it more a military style look. It also significantly flattened the finish. Overall though the RGS looks great. It is simple and not too many buttons, levers, or widgets to worry about. Strip all modern trappings (optics, slings, etc) and it the aesthetics is just right for a Scout. Very pleasing to look at.
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- Build: Though lightweight it is a very sturdy rifle. The stock is a black laminate with wood grain coloration. Barrel is a alloy steel with matte black finish. The overall build is great!!!

Additions to the Rifle:
I am not a rich man so I have to choose wisely to get a balance between cost, usability, durability, and function. All the items below seem to work great for the rifle range and had no issues with them. For the most part I can say that these items can probably withstand normal usage and abuse, but not battlefield conditions. The Dynacomp probably would last though. I am still looking for a good midgrade scout scope.

- Muzzle Brake: I replaced the flash suppressor with the Spikes Dynacomp 308 muzzle brake. When I went to the range, there was very little change in the flash and sound report. The Dynacomp worked very well as a suppressor and did threw all the blast forward as well. I had a buddy sitting to my left and he could not feel an increase in concussion blast. The muzzle brake worked phenomenal. The muzzle rise was barely noticeable and all the recoil went backwards however.

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- Scope and Mount: BSA 2-7X32 Edge Series Pistol Scope and AccuShot Premium 1-Inch Weaver Style See-Thru Medium Profile Rings were added to my rifle. This is my interim scope and is used only for the rifle range. It works great and keeps the zero despite being a BSA. I am pretty sure it will not stand normal battlefield rigors.


PROS:
1. Value - for the price this scope is a gem and looks like will be able to stand the higher caliber rounds of my 308. Built very solid and not at all flimsy. The overall construction is great.
2. Eye Relief - very long relief. Looks like 12" to 20"; so works well for forward mounted optic weapon systems.
3. Picture Sight - Clear and nice picture
4. Variable Magnification - x2-x7 nice option to have.

CONS:
1. Parallax is terrible (50 yds). You have to be dead center looking into the eye port to see anything, so target acquisition is very slow.
2. x32 eye port is a little small and they should have made a x40. This coupled with the parallax issues slows down target acquisition.
3. No illumination. I wish it has some illumination. Would have paid the little extra $$$ for the illumination - if they had a model with it.
4. No where can I find that this scope is water/shock resistance :( Not sure this scope will withstand a drop..

- Buttstock Ammo Holder: Added a UAG Stealth Black Tactical Military Hunting Universal Sniper Rifle Gun Righty Right Side Butt Stock Buttstock Padded Cheek Rest Ammo Ammunition Holder Cartridges .223 5.56 7.62x39 7.62x54.

Pros
- Easy Install and will fit most rifles
- Inexpensive upgrade to 'range/target' rifle
- Good novelty or 'tacticool' item

Cons
- Cartridge Holder does not hold rounds tightly or securely in place
- Velcro seems flimsy and stitching does not seem durable for long haul
- Cheek Pad is thin

- UTG Tactical OP Bipod - SWAT/Combat Profile Adjustable Height
- Allen Company Web Rifle Sling
- Allen Company Sling Swivel Set for 1-Inch Slings with Hardware for Bolt Action Rifles[/span]

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Overall this is a great rifle and I think that Ruger did a good job. For the price between $700 to $1000 (depending where and how you get it), I would definitely get this rifle again. It is a fun rifle to shoot, and everyone at the range always stops and look. It is not perfect however, but close to it. Again, these are my opinions and in no way the definitive guide to what a good Scout Rifle is. Till next time...Scouts Out and See You On The High Ground!

Wake27
09-02-12, 18:21
This is kind of nit-picky, but infantry SOP is not to get decisively engaged. That's a bad thing. Its more of a 'close with and destroy the enemy' type deal. Looks like a pretty detailed review though.

R1J1D
09-14-12, 13:20
great review.. I wonder how does the bolt action feel after some use, and is there a way to get it smooth?

mark5pt56
09-15-12, 06:21
Moving this to general as it's not the intent of the manufacturer or this section.

jw0312
09-15-12, 11:09
Nice review. I like how that Dynacomp looks on it.

cqbdriver
09-20-12, 05:50
My GSR's bolt improved greatly after working the bolt at home & some live firing. It is still not the smoothest bolt that I've seen, but much improved from when it came out of the box.

When I first got the GSR, I put a cheap scout scope on the rifle to test the scout scope concept. I hated it & switched to an Aimpoint H-1. I really liked that setup. However, I needed the Aimpoint on another rifle.

I decided that may be the problem wasn't with the scout scope concept, but that I went cheap. So, I got a Leupold 2.5X scout scope. It changed my view (pun intented) completely. I love it. The glass is cystal clear and it is fast & accurate out to the ranges that I intent to use it (200 yds max in the part of the country that I hunt).

I wanted the rifle to be as short & handy as posssible. So, I remove the buttstock spacer. I noticed that I would almost hit my nose when working the bolt & would move my head. I put the spacer back in & now, I can work the bolt fast & never move my head position.

sangria7
09-20-12, 08:09
My GSR's bolt improved greatly after working the bolt at home & some live firing. It is still not the smoothest bolt that I've seen, but much improved from when it came out of the box.

When I first got the GSR, I put a cheap scout scope on the rifle to test the scout scope concept. I hated it & switched to an Aimpoint H-1. I really liked that setup. However, I needed the Aimpoint on another rifle.

I decided that may be the problem wasn't with the scout scope concept, but that I went cheap. So, I got a Leupold 2.5X scout scope. It changed my view (pun intented) completely. I love it. The glass is cystal clear and it is fast & accurate out to the ranges that I intent to use it (200 yds max in the part of the country that I hunt).

I wanted the rifle to be as short & handy as posssible. So, I remove the buttstock spacer. I noticed that I would almost hit my nose when working the bolt & would move my head. I put the spacer back in & now, I can work the bolt fast & never move my head position.

All great points! I agree with the assessments. There has been a lot of debate on how the a scout rifle should carry an optic and what kind of power they should have. But in reality, the scout mission is so diverse, being absolute is not good. Too many people are stuck on doctrine and not enough on METT-T.

chapperjoe
09-20-12, 08:52
I was insanely excited about this rifle until I got to work the bolt on one a few times.

what REALLY bugged me was when I withdrew the bolt all the way to the rear, how much it wobbled.... It didn't inspire confidence, which is all I'm looking for in a bolt gun of this size/purpose.

Arik
09-20-12, 09:10
Thanks for the review. Ive been to looking for a LEFT Handed bolt action with iron sights that isnt a hunting rifle and is in a readily available caliber. There isnt much out there for us lefties. Im gonna see if i can find one to try out.

What do you guys think of the overall long term reliability?

Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk 2

brickboy240
09-20-12, 13:04
Wow...that is really nice.

You know what is weird? I actually want one of those more than an AR.

I don't know why but a Ruger Gunsite Scout with an Aimpoint is really something I want and could actually use more so than any AR.

-brickboy240

R1J1D
09-20-12, 18:15
Wow...that is really nice.

You know what is weird? I actually want one of those more than an AR.

I don't know why but a Ruger Gunsite Scout with an Aimpoint is really something I want and could actually use more so than any AR.

-brickboy240

I was thinking the same thing! now it just needs a folding or telescoping stock.

masakari
09-20-12, 20:28
Im a huge fan of scout rifles. Thats a nice looking piece, i think you did an excellent job with what you had. Keep it up!
Recommendation: when you get a replacement optic, i higly recommend the Leupold 2.5 or 4 power scouts. The burris scopes are far too heavy, large, and dont hold up as well as some say. I broke mine multiple times on my scout. The Leupold scout scopes are lighter, clearer, and made like tanks (in the USA)
For the rings, my favorite are Warne rings. Theyre built very sturdy, and well priced. You would probably need Low rings, although if you want your optic to sit higher for whatever reason, medium would work.

JHC
09-21-12, 11:07
Great review. The big FAIL with the Scout as a concept is the brutally poor low light capability of scout scopes. But there are plenty of options to cure that.

sangria7
09-21-12, 11:19
Thanks guys.

I do need better optics as stated by multiple people already :) I really do enjoy the rifle though. I just wish that when manufacturers create "scout" rifles, they consider mission capabilities and requirements.

For example Ruger should develop or contract out the development of an optic or optics that would work well the platform. AR specific optics are successful because they were able to determine the requirements and how they will operate on the platform.

This needs to be true.

masakari
09-21-12, 19:44
Thanks guys.

I do need better optics as stated by multiple people already :) I really do enjoy the rifle though. I just wish that when manufacturers create "scout" rifles, they consider mission capabilities and requirements.

For example Ruger should develop or contract out the development of an optic or optics that would work well the platform. AR specific optics are successful because they were able to determine the requirements and how they will operate on the platform.

This needs to be true.

EMAIL TRIJICON! They have responded to my numerous requests for a scout scope, and said they they will not ignore the requests, and it is being developed... but they need more requests to get the ball rolling faster. So contact them!
My idea of the perfect scout scope is an ACOG like optic that sits bery low (maybe with optional spacers?) And with 3X or 2.5X magnification. Dual illumination, and a easy to use ranging reticle are a must. It would need to be compact and lightweight.
When it comes out, it will be mine on day one.

R1J1D
09-21-12, 19:45
Any links on who to start emailing? :secret:

Arik
09-21-12, 20:39
So who makes quality mags a d hkw much are they?

Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk 2

sangria7
09-21-12, 20:49
So who makes quality mags a d hkw much are they?

Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk 2

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/829505/ruger-magazine-ruger-gunsite-scout-308-winchester-10-round-polymer-black

masakari
09-22-12, 03:34
Any links on who to start emailing? :secret:

http://www.trijicon.com/na_en/contact/index.php

Serlo II
09-23-12, 10:18
I found the bolt on my got much smoother after a while. Still, it will never be up there with my Steyr SBS.

I did not have much luck with the iron sights, got frustrated and put a conventional scope on. It's a Trijicon TR24. It's pretty fast and accurate to medium ranges.

Overall, I like the rifle.

sangria7
09-23-12, 10:38
I found the bolt on my got much smoother after a while. Still, it will never be up there with my Steyr SBS.

I did not have much luck with the iron sights, got frustrated and put a conventional scope on. It's a Trijicon TR24. It's pretty fast and accurate to medium ranges.

Overall, I like the rifle.

Yes i noticed the bolt gets smoother but still it wobbles and jerks.

What do you mean about the iron sights - did you have trouble with zeroing it in? Yes the TR24 is an awesome sight; but man pricey :)

Mossyrock
09-23-12, 10:53
My Ruger Scout was VERY rough out of the box. It took me several hours of running the bolt with polishing compound before I was happy with it. While I tried both a Burris and Leupold Scout Scope, I ended up going with the full-length XS rail, medium Leupold QRW rings and a Weaver V3 1-3X variable. It is a TRUE 1X scope, so both eyes open snap shots are a breeze. Crank it up to 3X (not much, I admit), and you are good out to 200 yards plus.

sangria7
09-23-12, 13:01
My Ruger Scout was VERY rough out of the box. It took me several hours of running the bolt with polishing compound before I was happy with it. While I tried both a Burris and Leupold Scout Scope, I ended up going with the full-length XS rail, medium Leupold QRW rings and a Weaver V3 1-3X variable. It is a TRUE 1X scope, so both eyes open snap shots are a breeze. Crank it up to 3X (not much, I admit), and you are good out to 200 yards plus.

Yes, I am looking for the full XS rail for the RGS but I cannot find any in stock.

Serlo II
09-23-12, 13:21
I could not get my iron sights to zero.
I have the xs rail and it has a little peep sight. I admit I never tried it. I guess it will have to be for emergency use only.

I paid about $600 for the TR24 - not too bad concidering the cost of some of the new scopes out there.

sangria7
09-28-12, 10:42
do you know where i can get the full rail?

Mossyrock
09-29-12, 10:32
Here:

http://xssights.com/index.php?nID=scopemounts&cID=Scope%20Mounts&pID=scopemounts

here:

http://www.brownells.com/.aspx/pid=44897/Product/RUGER-SCOUT-RIFLE-RAIL

Or here:

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/436943/xs-sight-full-length-scope-mount-rail-ruger-gunsight-scout-aluminum-matte

I ordered mine directly from XS. No issues.

sangria7
09-29-12, 11:25
Here:

http://xssights.com/index.php?nID=scopemounts&cID=Scope%20Mounts&pID=scopemounts

here:

http://www.brownells.com/.aspx/pid=44897/Product/RUGER-SCOUT-RIFLE-RAIL

Or here:

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/436943/xs-sight-full-length-scope-mount-rail-ruger-gunsight-scout-aluminum-matte

I ordered mine directly from XS. No issues.

I will try XS. Thanks.

Brownells and Midway have been on backorder for a while now.

sangria7
10-02-12, 16:55
XS is also on backorder :cray:

1859sharps
10-12-12, 12:51
The big FAIL with the Scout as a concept is the brutally poor low light capability of scout scopes. But there are plenty of options to cure that.

That the available scopes do not address low light issues is not really a failure of the "Scout concept". The "concept" as laid out by the Col. allows for this to be addressed if technology allows for it. the "concept" is NOT in stone and many areas of the concept clearly are general enough to allow for changing technologies and technology improvements to improve the concept of a "scout rifle".

That the current "scout scopes" are weak in this area is less a "knock" on the "concept" and more a reflection of manufactures believing there isn't a great enough market demand to improve/update the scout scope designs.

My memory is that the Col him self was not very satisfied with available "scout scopes", and this was 10-15 years ago when I came across such references and to my knowledge neither of the two "scout scope" manufactures has updated their design in a whole lot longer than that time period.

sangria7
10-12-12, 13:36
Midway got them into stock and out of stock within the same day. Fortunately I was able to get an XS rail. I gave up on the Scout Scope and went to more a traditional rifle configuration and grabbed a 4-16 x 40mm.

R1J1D
10-12-12, 15:56
I could not get my iron sights to zero.
I have the xs rail and it has a little peep sight. I admit I never tried it. I guess it will have to be for emergency use only.

I paid about $600 for the TR24 - not too bad concidering the cost of some of the new scopes out there.

how is the eye relief on the TR24? were you able to mount it on the stock forward rail or did you mount it with rings?