View Full Version : batteries on a rifle (optics+light)
(not your normal EO vs AP thread)
OK this could fit in the optics or in the lights category, so I put it in general AR.
I would like to work it out so that I don't have two kinds of batteries on my rifle. Right now I have a EO512 and a Surefire G2L. This has me carrying AA batteries and CR123 batteries. I am thinking of changing out my optic this year. And the current availability of good AA weapons light makes this more complicated. My coms use AA as does my GPS so all AAs in my kit would be sweet, plus it would make it worth recharging.
I mostly want to write down all the possible combos in one place so I can think through the pros and cons... and open up the possibilities for discussion.
advantage EO -> faster reticle, field of view and cost
advantage AimPoint ->battery life and killflash
advantage AA batteries-> cost and availability
Advantage CR123 -> none when you can get a AA accessory that does the same job
(cheapest) I could switch out my light for an AA light - gives me all AA
(2nd cheapest) I could switch my EO512 for an XPS - gives me all CR123
(3d cheapest) I could switch my EO for a Pro -gives me all CR123
(most expensive) witch the optic for a comp 4 and the light for a AA - gives me all AA
if you want commonality with your batteries, the best option is to go with a cr123 powered eotech and a cr123 battery flashlight. I have both an xps 2-2 and a comp m4 aimpoint and out of the two i think the eotech is the better optic when it comes to fast sight acquisition and general reticle style. Seeing how cr123 batteries are all lithium, you don't have to worry about them going bad in a couple years and can just buy them in bulk and as far as i have seen, lithium AA cost a lot more than cr123.
I think both optics are durable enough and would only choose the comp m4 if battery life is of the utmost importance.
Oh and i forgot to mention, if by "pro" you mean the aimpoint pro...it doesn't use cr123a batteries. It uses 2L76 or DL1/3N batteries. Which would make for even more of a hodge podge assortment of batteries you need to carry.
I run a EXPS 3-0 and a surefire e1b. I have panasonic CR123's in them. I like the lithium cr123s due to shelf life. Panasonic and Surefire batteries are the same thing if I'm not mistaken, both come in bulk.
Didn't know AA's had a 10 year shelf life like the CR123's.
If you have a desire to store onboard and don't want check and see if the batteries went flat just sitting for a few weeks the 123's have a huge edge over AA.
Recharging AA is of course an option as you mention, but that demands an outlet or auto battery for a few hours or solar panel in the sun practically all day for just a couple cells.
Which were you planning on hauling in a BOB, or is the intent to never stray out of the yard beyond extension cord length?
All depends on mission plan I suppose, but I know for sure that a LOT more AA's have gone flat around here in less than a year than 123's
FWIW + a buck for coffee
ForTehNguyen
09-07-12, 21:44
CR123 flashlights are stronger and smaller than AA counterparts. Both optic and light in CR123 would be ideal but AAs are a heck of a lot more plentiful
Using a Eotech 512 (2xAA) and CR123 flashlight here
sinlessorrow
09-07-12, 22:15
Best bet is CR123 flashlights and aimpoints with their year long battery lifes.
Aimpoint M4 with a lithium AA will last longer than 5 years. Then just worry about CR123s for the light.
LK
some points
1) I use lithium AAs in all things gun related, but the extremely common regular batteries as well as the ability to recharge is a serious plus over CR123s. (I haven't experimented with recharging yet.)
2) I'm really impressed with my AA Fenix so the switch away from the G2X might happen anyway
3) I found a killflash for the EO so that is one (the smaller) advantage of an AimPoint down.
4) I didn't realize the pro used a totally different battery- yes I certainly don't want to add another.
I use a AA Eotech, easy to find batteries but the Lithium AA are in my go bag as they last longer. I carry a titanium Olight transformer or Sunwayman V10r-ti that has a different barrel so that the light can use AA or 123 batteries depending on what I have access to at the time.
http://www.batteryjunction.com/sunwayman-v10r-ti-plus.html
http://www.batteryjunction.com/sunwayman-v11r-aa-extender.html
http://www.batteryjunction.com/olight-2010-holidayset-transformers.html
Dos Cylindros
09-08-12, 01:31
I run a Surefire M300 mini scout and Aimpoint T-1 on my duty gun. I don't worry about different batteries. I keep two CR123's in my Tango Down grip, and two T-1 batteries in my Tango Down stubby VFG with a foam insert. No issues here.
Code3Patriot
09-08-12, 10:46
Aimpoint M4 with a lithium AA will last longer than 5 years. Then just worry about CR123s for the light.
LK
^This has always been my game plan as well.
Keep the AAs for your coms, GPS, red dot and keep a couple spare CR123s on hand for the light. Your coms and GPS are going to be AA no matter what anyway, correct?
At the end of the day both batteries are super common and I don't see the need to have EVERYTHING running on the same battery. It sounds like you think through and prep your gear ahead of time, keeping two types of batteries on hand won't kill whatever roles you have for your rifle.
Also, if your EOTech isn't giving you issues, consider sticking with what with what you have and use the money you would have spent on upgrades/different stuff for ammo and/or training.
ForTehNguyen
09-08-12, 12:41
Didn't know AA's had a 10 year shelf life like the CR123's.
If you have a desire to store onboard and don't want check and see if the batteries went flat just sitting for a few weeks the 123's have a huge edge over AA.
use lithiums, my AA energizer lithiums have a 2020 something use by date. But definately do not use alkalines in any of your long storage high reliability expensive electronics. Alkalines leak as fast as 6 months.
your weapon lights and optics need to be reliable with relatively little use - 123 batts for weapon related.
your EDC light and GPS are convenient but not critical and get much more use - AA rechargeables for administrative purposes
Rechargables are too much hassle and have short run time between charges. I used them in a varmint call and it was always going dead, can't imagine running a sight or a light with them. I switched to lithium AA's on the caller and remote and have not had any problems.
I also checked battery life on my eo-tech 512 with lithiums. I got over 1000 hrs on it but my H1 has been on for 27 months...
My lights use CR123's as well as my range finder so 3 different batteries but I have several of each stashed around and don't worry about storage life.
use lithiums, my AA energizer lithiums have a 2020 something use by date. But definately do not use alkalines in any of your long storage high reliability expensive electronics. Alkalines leak as fast as 6 months.
I gotta study up way more on the lithium variations.
I see they cost roughy what CR123 costs per unit, so based on that I guess it would be a coin toss as to which way to go.
Perhaps lithium for shtf and alkalines for general use til then?
ForTehNguyen
09-08-12, 16:00
I gotta study up way more on the lithium variations.
I see they cost roughy what CR123 costs per unit, so based on that I guess it would be a coin toss as to which way to go.
Perhaps lithium for shtf and alkalines for general use til then?
take a look on ebay, sometimes you can find energizer lithiums AA for under $1.75/piece. New I think these are $3/piece. I got some energizers one time that were probably 6+ months old, which in the retail world is "too old" despite the shelf life being much longer. Stores like to keep fresher dates on their stuff even though it lasts a lot longer. For the CR123s, they are usually $2/piece.
Lithium AAs are .5oz lighter than alkaline AAs. But for anything expensive or going in storage I would use lithiums. Dont want to risk corroding an expensive piece of gear because alkalines leaked. I also bought the magpul grip core pack to store 2xAAs. So our primary rifles have an extra change of batteries just in case. They make the grip core for 2xCR123 also. I wouldve liked to make my lights AA but they are not as compact or as strong as CR123 versions. So thats why I have CR123s in my lights. I wanted the most common to find batteries in my optics, AAs. Lithiums last longer in the Eotech 512 also. Their website says 600 hours for alkaline, but 900 hours for lithium.
For example: $1.70/piece shipped, 36 batteries for $61
http://www.ebay.com/itm/36-Energizer-Ultimate-AA-Lithium-Batteries-9-Pks-of-4-/170604959409?pt=US_Single_Use_Batteries&hash=item27b8d916b1
I'm enjoying the responses.
does any aim-point use a CR123?
So far I'm leaning XPS and keeping the G2L and I can put the EO512 back in the event that I run out of CR123s
SpankMonkey
09-08-12, 17:23
I'm enjoying the responses.
does any aim-point use a CR123?
So far I'm leaning XPS and keeping the G2L and I can put the EO512 back in the event that I run out of CR123s
No....
I would switch to the XPS and run all 123s... You can get 123s for around a buck each. Price has really come down.
sinlessorrow
09-08-12, 18:30
I'm enjoying the responses.
does any aim-point use a CR123?
So far I'm leaning XPS and keeping the G2L and I can put the EO512 back in the event that I run out of CR123s
No but why does it matter? Aimpoints get 5 years of battery life, just keep 1 or 2 spare batteries and you have enough batteries for 15yrs.
Sinless has it - the replacement schedules are just so wildly different, I don't even view batteries for the aimpoint as expendables, more as wear items (around the same time I need to thoroughly strip and clean the rifle, and look at swapping springs), while the batteries are a simple swap as needed. I carry spare 123A's, but the AP batteries stay at home - when a battery will go half the tritium half-life in a Trijicon optic, they're onto something.
Maybe I’m missing the boat here, but honest to god choosing an optic/light combo based largely around type of batteries seems pretty silly. If it ends up that the best equipment for the job takes the same type of batteries then more power to you, but if not who cares. Honest to god ask yourself how many batteries are you really going to feed your optic and light when you are out and about.
Running around here in the Golden Crescent I have different batteries for my laser, weapons light, not to mention all three damn radios and GPS. Does it suck carrying a walmart worth of batteries in your ruck? Hell yes! But when shit heads are shooting at you it’s nice to know you brought the right equipment to make them stop, not curing that your radio and its AA batteries aren’t throwing enough power to talk to CAS...and all because you cant fit 5590s in your surefire…so why carry them for your radio.
I hope this doesn’t come off as the comment of a disgruntled FISTer, but picking equipment based on battery type strikes me as stupid. If you want all the batteries in your kids toys the same for convenience when going to walmart fine, but when it comes down to equipment used to kill people you might want to relook at your choices.
Maybe I’m missing the boat here, but honest to god choosing an optic/light combo based largely around type of batteries seems pretty silly. If it ends up that the best equipment for the job takes the same type of batteries then more power to you, but if not who cares. Honest to god ask yourself how many batteries are you really going to feed your optic and light when you are out and about.
Running around here in the Golden Crescent I have different batteries for my laser, weapons light, not to mention all three damn radios and GPS. Does it suck carrying a walmart worth of batteries in your ruck? Hell yes! But when shit heads are shooting at you it’s nice to know you brought the right equipment to make them stop, not curing that your radio and its AA batteries aren’t throwing enough power to talk to CAS...and all because you cant fit 5590s in your surefire…so why carry them for your radio.
I hope this doesn’t come off as the comment of a disgruntled FISTer, but picking equipment based on battery type strikes me as stupid. If you want all the batteries in your kids toys the same for convenience when going to walmart fine, but when it comes down to equipment used to kill people you might want to relook at your choices.
two points regarding your comments-
1) you don't have to supply our own batteries
2) there isn't much difference between the performance of AA and CR123 RDS or white light -so battery selection certainly comes in to the pros and cons
If I had a armor piercing laser death ray that used some obscure battery I would still use it and stock the battery.
1) you don't have to supply our own batteries
That's true, he doesn't have to supply your batteries... but I don't understand the point you're trying to make?
Did you mean he doesn't have to supply his own batteries? Because if he's like anyone else I know, he bought most of his own batteries besides perhaps for his comms. I know I had to buy my own CR123 and AA batteries in Afghanistan.
Don't need batteries for aimpoint. But I probaly need them 5 years from now. I would carry my batteries for my light in my grip or stock along with something to something to smoke on when everything is said and done.
Alaskapopo
09-09-12, 02:09
(not your normal EO vs AP thread)
OK this could fit in the optics or in the lights category, so I put it in general AR.
I would like to work it out so that I don't have two kinds of batteries on my rifle. Right now I have a EO512 and a Surefire G2L. This has me carrying AA batteries and CR123 batteries. I am thinking of changing out my optic this year. And the current availability of good AA weapons light makes this more complicated. My coms use AA as does my GPS so all AAs in my kit would be sweet, plus it would make it worth recharging.
I mostly want to write down all the possible combos in one place so I can think through the pros and cons... and open up the possibilities for discussion.
advantage EO -> faster reticle, field of view and cost
advantage AimPoint ->battery life and killflash
advantage AA batteries-> cost and availability
Advantage CR123 -> none when you can get a AA accessory that does the same job
(cheapest) I could switch out my light for an AA light - gives me all AA
(2nd cheapest) I could switch my EO512 for an XPS - gives me all CR123
(3d cheapest) I could switch my EO for a Pro -gives me all CR123
(most expensive) witch the optic for a comp 4 and the light for a AA - gives me all AA
123 batteries are more compact and generally have more power. Hence why AA flashlights suck but 123's kick but. AA EOTECHS also have the most troubles. Avoid them.
Pat
two points regarding your comments-
1) you don't have to supply our own batteries
2) there isn't much difference between the performance of AA and CR123 RDS or white light -so battery selection certainly comes in to the pros and cons
If I had a armor piercing laser death ray that used some obscure battery I would still use it and stock the battery.
1)You're right I don't buy my own batteries...I just raid the supply or commo shops...so I guess you actually buy my batteries. But we do have to carry all that shit around. so thats fun.
2) There is absolutely a huge difference between battery performance with the CR123. For optics it's somewhat a moot point, but for lights, lasers or now even radios CR123 is the way to go. There is a reason why Surefire and Insight equipment takes 123s not AA or AAA...and it's not because surefire wanted to get their logo on a battery.
If buying batteries is really hurting your morale get a Aimpoint and buy a new set of batteries once every Summer Olympics;). That's what I do back in the states.
How many batteries do you stock/go through?
What do you use your carbine for?
I agree with the silly part ref trying to match batteries between lights and sights.
I left my T-1 on for over three years at 7-10 setting, with the initial battery it came, with before it went dead.
The 2032s are small little batteries, about the size of a quarter, and available almost anywhere that sells batteries. I see them in grocery stores and drug stores.
I have to buy a few more than I normally would because my EDC S&W 642 with a CT laser grip also uses those batteries.
Go with a good Sure Fire light, buy a T-1 (or maybe even an Aimpoint M4 with lithium AAs) and forget about it.
ForTehNguyen
09-09-12, 09:33
123 batteries are more compact and generally have more power. Hence why AA flashlights suck but 123's kick but. AA EOTECHS also have the most troubles. Avoid them.
Pat
yea if you use alkalines and leave them in the safe for a year. Use lithiums and thats not a problem anymore
I agree with the silly part ref trying to match batteries between lights and sights.
I left my T-1 on for over three years at 7-10 setting, with the initial battery it came, with before it went dead.
The 2032s are small little batteries, about the size of a quarter, and available almost anywhere that sells batteries. I see them in grocery stores and drug stores.
I have to buy a few more than I normally would because my EDC S&W 642 with a CT laser grip also uses those batteries.
Go with a good Sure Fire light, buy a T-1 (or maybe even an Aimpoint M4 with lithium AAs) and forget about it.
If your supply line is good then yes, use what is around at any shop in the US. If your supply line is unreliable then I would try to use what is most easily available either with local purchase, mailed in, etc.
I have spent a little time overseas and I don't recall seeing a 2032 in the local shops. AA yes, 123 sometimes.
I carry my own lithiums in my luggage, AA and 123 a few packs of each, and my taclights are convertible from AA to 123 so when the 123 run out I throw in the AA.
I went with 123 flashlight (surefire G2) and an Aim point Comp M4.
With how long a single AA lasts in the M4 (while running the whole time), might as well just run it at the setting you like and change the battery out every year (set it aside to use in a TV remote, camera, or any device that you don't mind crapping out on you (unlike an optic when you need it)). An AA is all that is needed this route, not like you need the dot any brighter and the life is pretty much the top of the market where its like it doesn't use a battery except for having that little tube.
For flashlights you get more out of 123 in a similar package or get the same performance out of less. 123s have twice the volts, more amp hours, shorter (little fatter), lighter, store better, etc.
If you were debating two similar optics where one is AA and one 123 I would say go the route of the 123 but if just looking for an optic from square one I would choose from a list of what meets demands and pick which is most important.
I was also considering an Accupoint for what its worth.
Alaskapopo
09-09-12, 14:41
yea if you use alkalines and leave them in the safe for a year. Use lithiums and thats not a problem anymore
Hmm I can leave my Aimpoint in the safe for years if I want turned on with no issues. Sounds like a design flaw.
Pat
If your supply line is good then yes, use what is around at any shop in the US. If your supply line is unreliable then I would try to use what is most easily available either with local purchase, mailed in, etc.
I have spent a little time overseas and I don't recall seeing a 2032 in the local shops. AA yes, 123 sometimes.
I carry my own lithiums in my luggage, AA and 123 a few packs of each, and my taclights are convertible from AA to 123 so when the 123 run out I throw in the AA.
The 2032s are the size of a quarter. I say again, a quarter. They are lithium and have a shelf life of ten years. They last 3-5 YEARS running the Aimpoint constantly, which you can turn off if you so choose.
Going with a sight because it uses AA batteries, but only yields 300-500 hours of battery life, when you could get an Aimpoint, is flat out retarded.
You can easily store enough 2032 batteries in a MAID grip to get you by for the next ten years and still have roon to spare.
Just sayin.
Straight Shooter
09-09-12, 21:44
I run a SOPMOD buttstock, with two storage chambers.
could put 123's on one side...AA's on another, if need be.
PLENTY of room. Just my thoughts.
I think potentially handicapping yourself by selecting lights and optics based on the battery type, and not more important factors, is a little short-sighted.
What role does the weapon in question serve?
The 2032s are the size of a quarter. I say again, a quarter. They are lithium and have a shelf life of ten years. They last 3-5 YEARS running the Aimpoint constantly, which you can turn off if you so choose.
Going with a sight because it uses AA batteries, but only yields 300-500 hours of battery life, when you could get an Aimpoint, is flat out retarded.
You can easily store enough 2032 batteries in a MAID grip to get you by for the next ten years and still have roon to spare.
Just sayin.
In the US or if you have that option yes get the T1, if you don't have that option you take what you are issued. Traveling with gun parts OCONUS is frowned upon.
In the US or if you have that option yes get the T1, if you don't have that option you take what you are issued. Traveling with gun parts OCONUS is frowned upon.
Yeah, I get that. Of note in your comment is the word "issued". Having been issued gear I get that you have zero say in what that gear is and what battery it uses, thus not really part of this debate. The OP is asking what he should buy, which one would have to assume is for a CONUS role.
The 2032s are the size of a quarter. I say again, a quarter. They are lithium and have a shelf life of ten years. They last 3-5 YEARS running the Aimpoint constantly, which you can turn off if you so choose.
Going with a sight because it uses AA batteries, but only yields 300-500 hours of battery life, when you could get an Aimpoint, is flat out retarded.
You can easily store enough 2032 batteries in a MAID grip to get you by for the next ten years and still have roon to spare.
Just sayin.
Keep the AAs or CR123s in the MAID. You can put 2x CR2032s in the hollows under a Larue hi-mount.
H
sinlessorrow
09-10-12, 18:19
The 2032s are the size of a quarter. I say again, a quarter. They are lithium and have a shelf life of ten years. They last 3-5 YEARS running the Aimpoint constantly, which you can turn off if you so choose.
Going with a sight because it uses AA batteries, but only yields 300-500 hours of battery life, when you could get an Aimpoint, is flat out retarded.
You can easily store enough 2032 batteries in a MAID grip to get you by for the next ten years and still have roon to spare.
Just sayin.
They last longer than 10yrs but at 10yrs they wil be down to 70% losing another 3% every year.
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