View Full Version : UPDATE To Hammerhead Order
davidjinks
09-13-12, 08:31
Deleted
That is interesting. I have bought and use the hammerhead tool for some time and have never had an issue or heard of one.
As someone that was a heavy PP user in the years past, it is possible for things to get completely hosed and have zero idea that someone bought something from you.
C4
davidjinks
09-13-12, 09:02
Deleted
Well, I've never used the tool so I can't comment on it.
For the last part, that's understandable, however when you admit to the order and admit to shipping said order and then do a 180 and say duh...what order...well I rest my case.
Oh yeah, I'm still out my money and product.
Understand. If I admit to the customer that I received their money/order and then cannot find it later on, I HAVE TO ship them their order (even if I lied and never actually saw the payment).
C4
davidjinks
09-13-12, 09:31
Deleted
Well Grant, that's not what happened here. Confirmation came directly from Bob thanking me for my order. That tells me he has the purchase information.
Now, so as to keep on topic:
Buyer beware of Hammerhead tools. Make sure you keep all correspondence and tracking/PayPal/payment information if you decide to do business with this company.
Sure it wasn't an automated e-mail (my system generates those when you order from me and I never actually e-mail you)? Just a thought.
BTW, I am in the process of trying to fix your problem. ;)
C4
davidjinks
09-13-12, 09:40
Deleted
Got this e-mail from Bob:
My plan-
Refund his purchase and ship two tools out today with an apology and the understanding that I'd be pissed-off as well if it happened to me.
C4
Army Chief
09-13-12, 10:52
There is enough external evidence out there to give Bob some benefit of the doubt, and he's obviously committed to making this right, despite the earlier confusion, so let's put this one to rest for now and re-engage if the end state truly warrants a legitimate long-term caveat emptor.
AC
Army Chief
09-13-12, 11:36
Was contacted by the OP with a constructive update, so am re-opening this accordingly.
AC
davidjinks
09-13-12, 11:50
Deleted
Hammerhead tools are some great products, their wrench is one item that no AR15/ M4 tool box should be without.
This is the only complaint I've ever heard about them, and it sounds like the OP should be updating this thread to reflect his complete experiences.
AC,
I appreciate you opening this back up for me.
UPDATE:
Within an hour of contacting PayPal, I received a full refund of all money paid to HHT.
Grant,
Thank you for taking the time to contact Bob at HHT. You did a very cool thing by going out of your way to get some resolve. Especially when the business wasn't conducted with you directly. That's a stand up act right there.
AC,
If its needed, please close the thread. And again, thank you chief!
You are welcome Sir. Bob (like myself for many years) works two full time jobs (LE Helicopter operations and HHT). Things can get screwed up as you don't know which way is up sometimes.
Glad you got everything resolved.
C4
davidjinks
09-13-12, 12:05
I'm not really sure at what you're getting at here. Other than not posting all correspondence with HHT everything I've said in this thread is true and up front.
If you'd like, you can PM me and we can further discuss the matter. But if you're hinting that I'm lying or being dishonest, don't bother with the PM. That's how I'm taking your post.
Hammerhead tools are some great products, their wrench is one item that no AR15/ M4 tool box should be without.
This is the only complaint I've ever heard about them, and it sounds like the OP should be updating this thread to reflect his complete experiences.
Army Chief
09-13-12, 12:15
No issue with keeping things open at this point.
When we are in the middle of grievance resolution, we've found that it is usually better for all concerned if we go into a brief lockdown to prevent the airing of third-party opinions and/or the usual "piling on," but once the facts and end state are known, it is certainly appropriate to pick things back up from there.
As a Hammerhead user myself, I had no doubt that this would be made right; just wanted to make sure the buyer and seller both had a chance to resolve this before the rest of us jumped in and veered it completely off course. ;)
AC
Army Chief
09-13-12, 12:17
If you'd like, you can PM me and we can further discuss the matter. But if you're hinting that I'm lying or being dishonest, don't bother with the PM. That's how I'm taking your post.
I can tell you up front, knowing Stick fairly well, that wasn't what he was referring to. He just wanted to make sure that "the rest of the story" made it into the thread before site management potentially made any locks permanent. Probably a remark more intended for me than for you. ;)
AC
skullworks
09-13-12, 12:20
David, I believe what Sticks is saying is that once everything is settled (and judging by Grant's comments you should have some tools coming your way on top of the refund) you should also add a comment to this thread about how Bob rectified the situation... ..and perhaps remove the "beware" in the thread title.
I believe that it's not how a company behaves when everything goes right that shows what they're made of - it's how they behave when things go wrong. In this case it seems Bob has refunded your funds, but (based on what Grant said) is STILL going to ship your order free-of-charge.
davidjinks
09-13-12, 12:26
I hear what you're saying. That's the main reason I contacted AC and informed him of the update.
I will amend the title post haste.
AC,
I understand.
Stickman,
Maybe I misunderstood your post or maybe not. As I said, everything is true and 100%. I updated the thread accordingly and as quick as I could.
My intent is not to "Burn" anyone. It's to make people aware that this has happened. Also not only has this happened, but the resolve that has come out of this. Not too mention the help from another member here on M4C who didn't even need to help but did anyway.
If there is anything to update in the future, I will do so.
David, I believe what Sticks is saying is that once everything is settled (and judging by Grant's comments you should have some tools coming your way on top of the refund) you should also add a comment to this thread about how Bob rectified the situation... ..and perhaps remove the "beware" in the thread title.
I believe that it's not how a company behaves when everything goes right that shows what they're maid of - it's how they behave when things go wrong. In this case it seems Bob has refunded your funds, but (based on what Grant said) is STILL going to ship your order free-of-charge.
davidjinks
09-13-12, 12:28
It appears that the Thread Title fairy has already changed the title.
Thank you thread title fairy!
Army Chief
09-13-12, 12:32
You're welcome. ;)
In fairness, I tend to do this (or correct misspellings) to a lot of threads after they have gone inactive to facilitate clearer searches in the future, but in this case, it made sense to be a bit more descriptive while it was still active, so readers would be able to tell at a glance what the thread was about.
AC
Slvr Surfr
09-14-12, 03:41
Just FYI for anyone considering buying the HH tool, you can get them on Amazon. I found mine new, slightly cheaper than buying direct and it was free shipping. Amazon also had them in stock. Great tool!
You're welcome. ;)
In fairness, I tend to do this (or correct misspellings) to a lot of threads after they have gone inactive to facilitate clearer searches in the future, but in this case, it made sense to be a bit more descriptive while it was still active, so readers would be able to tell at a glance what the thread was about.
AC
Thanks AC. One thread on a busy forum can cost a company tons of money for the next 10 years!
After the OP receives his tool, I suggest that this thread is removed.
C4
glockshooter
09-14-12, 10:37
So because the problem got rectified through a third party we should delete the post as if it never happened. If grant had not made contact with the HHT would the problem still exist? It sure seems
like we are not adhering to the M4C standard. The OP updated things as they were fixed, so the post should stay for future customers. That way they can make an informed choice with all the info needed not just what certain people want to be seen. Aren't we supposed to be about making informed decisions? I am almost disappointed by the suggestion we delete the thread.
Matt
So because the problem got rectified through a third party we should delete the post as if it never happened. If grant had not made contact with the HHT would the problem still exist? It sure seems
like we are not adhering to the M4C standard. The OP updated things as they were fixed, so the post should stay for future customers. That way they can make an informed choice with all the info needed not just what certain people want to be seen. Aren't we supposed to be about making informed decisions? I am almost disappointed by the suggestion we delete the thread.
Matt
I am going to go on a bit of a rant here. It is not focused on you, but just in general.
As someone that CONSTANTLY has to deal with negative comments from a consumer from say 2003 or 2007 or 2009, I am of the opinion that the damage has been done (people have already seen this thread and will NEVER buy from HHT even though they make a superior product). The owner has already paid (more than he had too) in order to fix his error. Full refund, two free tools and loss of sales. How much more does the guy need to suffer??? The answer is zero.
So the question I ask is, what kind of informed decision would a consumer make from this thread? That the owner of HHT is a busy guy (two full time jobs) and made an error (just like EVERY OTHER COMPANY IN THE WORLD)?? Why does one mistake overshadow 1,000 or 5,000 or 10,000 positive sales? The answer is, it shouldn’t.
See the problem that I experience (as do all companies) is that most people never leave positive feedback (in public view). The 1-2 pissed off customers always seem to do it though. Is that fair? No, it isn't. This is the point.
C4
Grant, the term I like is "internet blackmail", which is when someone has a complaint about something which typically isn't legit. The person contacts the distributor/ manufacturer and says if they don't get what they want they will say bad things all over the internet and cause harm to the company.
ETA- For clarification, I'm not referring to this post with the above.
Grant, the term I like is "internet blackmail", which is when someone has a complaint about something which typically isn't legit. The person contacts the distributor/ manufacturer and says if they don't get what they want they will say bad things all over the internet and cause harm to the company.
ETA- For clarification, I'm not referring to this post with the above.
Yep, very common. I see this type of thing about once every 4-6 months. I never bend to it and just ask them to make sure they spell my name properly when they write their negative review. :D
C4
I'm not really sure at what you're getting at here. Other than not posting all correspondence with HHT everything I've said in this thread is true and up front.
If you'd like, you can PM me and we can further discuss the matter. But if you're hinting that I'm lying or being dishonest, don't bother with the PM. That's how I'm taking your post.
I can see your confusion. My comment was made meaning the story isn't over, and that you should complete it when it is while providing updates.
To factually state what happened is honest. To stop providing updates or give the total information when the matter is concluded is dishonest, which is what often happens on the internet.
No one is taking shots at you or your integrity at this point. Nor is there a reason to if total disclosure is made.
glockshooter
09-15-12, 02:15
I am going to go on a bit of a rant here. It is not focused on you, but just in general.
As someone that CONSTANTLY has to deal with negative comments from a consumer from say 2003 or 2007 or 2009, I am of the opinion that the damage has been done (people have already seen this thread and will NEVER buy from HHT even though they make a superior product). The owner has already paid (more than he had too) in order to fix his error. Full refund, two free tools and loss of sales. How much more does the guy need to suffer??? The answer is zero.
So the question I ask is, what kind of informed decision would a consumer make from this thread? That the owner of HHT is a busy guy (two full time jobs) and made an error (just like EVERY OTHER COMPANY IN THE WORLD)?? Why does one mistake overshadow 1,000 or 5,000 or 10,000 positive sales? The answer is, it shouldn’t.
See the problem that I experience (as do all companies) is that most people never leave positive feedback (in public view). The 1-2 pissed off customers always seem to do it though. Is that fair? No, it isn't. This is the point.
C4
I understand what you are saying and I agree that if it was 5,6 or 7 years ago. What I have a hard time with how do you establish a track record good or bad if we delete the posts. I am well aware people make mistakes and I make my fair share. There was a mistake and it was eventually fixed that shows the guy made it right. That is the stuff I want to know as a consumer.
Matt
wetidlerjr
09-15-12, 04:40
I see no reason to delete this thread. It hasn't made me think less of Hammerhead Tools but, rather, that the owner is more than willing to correct errors regardless of the reason for them. :D
I understand what you are saying and I agree that if it was 5,6 or 7 years ago. What I have a hard time with how do you establish a track record good or bad if we delete the posts. I am well aware people make mistakes and I make my fair share. There was a mistake and it was eventually fixed that shows the guy made it right. That is the stuff I want to know as a consumer.
Matt
If the thread isn't removed, it WILL live on for years and years.
So by reading this thread, you gathered that HHT is a good guy and follows through on errors and you will buy from him. The same result would happen if this thread didn't exist as well. That's the point.
Now, here is what really happens. Guy is searching for user reviews of this product. He finds this thread (reads the first post and doesn't buy the product) OR sees it linked in a another thread where there is a debate about this product VS another. In an effort to win the argument, someone links to this thread and says; "Look at how bad this company is!"
Sale lost for no good reason.
C4
I see no reason to delete this thread. It hasn't made me think less of Hammerhead Tools but, rather, that the owner is more than willing to correct errors regardless of the reason for them. :D
That's because you are a smart guy and read the ENTIRE thread and THEN make an informed decision. Most people read JUST the google hits and make their decision. At best, they read the FIRST post and nothing else.
C4
This thread had shown me two things. 1 When HH is notified about a problem, they go above and beyond to fix it. 2. When Grant believes he can help you out he will.
Sent from my DROIDX
scoutfsu99
09-15-12, 08:23
That's because you are a smart guy and read the ENTIRE thread and THEN make an informed decision. Most people read JUST the google hits and make their decision. At best, they read the FIRST post and nothing else.
C4
Can the info be added to the OP? Either by himself or a mod?
Got this e-mail from Bob:
My plan-
Refund his purchase and ship two tools out today with an apology and the understanding that I'd be pissed-off as well if it happened to me.
C4
So Grant at gandrtactical.com has such good customer service that he's even improving the customer service of OTHER companies in his spare time!!! Well done Grant! Well done indeed.
davidjinks
09-15-12, 10:15
Everyone needs to understand a couple things:
1. I ordered the tools on the pure reviews, talk and reccomendations by many members here at M4C.
2. The ordered got screwed up, bottom line.
3. The issue has been rectified with the money being refunded to me.
4. If anything else comes of this, I will report it immediately.
5. I do not agree that this thread should be deleted. However if the powers that be deem it necessary to to close/delete...it ain't my pond.
davidjinks
09-15-12, 10:17
Yes, that was a stand up thing that grant did for me. No questions asked!
So Grant at gandrtactical.com has such good customer service that he's even improving the customer service of OTHER companies in his spare time!!! Well done Grant! Well done indeed.
It's not a one way street. Yes, sales get lost for whatever reason, good or bad. That's the retail business, whether in a store or on the internet. Sales are also made through the internet because of good reputation, customer service, and customer satisfaction, which is passed on thru various forums, blogs, emails, etc. For every potential customer that reads this thread and says "Screw Hammerhead", I'm sure there are quite a few more that read it and say, "He made it right, I'd buy from him". I'm for leaving this thread alone.
Robb Jensen
09-15-12, 10:45
Lesson...don't use Paypal.
It's not a one way street. Yes, sales get lost for whatever reason, good or bad. That's the retail business, whether in a store or on the internet. Sales are also made through the internet because of good reputation, customer service, and customer satisfaction, which is passed on thru various forums, blogs, emails, etc. For every potential customer that reads this thread and says "Screw Hammerhead", I'm sure there are quite a few more that read it and say, "He made it right, I'd buy from him". I'm for leaving this thread alone.
I wish common sense would prevail in these types of things. I have spent 10yrs selling gear and guns online. This is not the case IMHO.
C4
Lesson...don't use Paypal.
Aren't they anti-gun and will close accounts if they are used for firearms or related equipment?
scoutfsu99
09-15-12, 14:33
Sort of. They loosened up the rules a little bit on related equipment. You can buy AR barrels, etc on ebay now
I learned that I should have one of these tools and ordered yesterday,
From HHT using PP. I'm not anticipating any problems. I'm in sales and my product can be back ordered, occasionally an order gets screwed up but my customers trust me and I rarely lose a sale.
Win
I ordered the Hammerhead tool directly from HHT a few years ago. Everything went great. When I talked to him on the phone he explained to me that they had just been cleaned out of all their stock by some agency (I don't remember who) and that my order would see a delay because of that. Right on schedule, my tool shipped out and I received it about a week later. Just as promised.
OP I'm sorry to hear you had such trouble with your order, but I'm glad to know that HHT is taking care of you.
davidjinks
09-17-12, 14:13
I told everyone I would update this ASAP if anything changes.
I just received word (And pictures) from home that I received a package from Hammerhead tools. The package contained 2 HHTs as was previously ordered.
Bob Cockell (Hammerhead Tools) refunded my money AND still made good on the original order. For that, I thank him.
Regardless of the circumstances of the order being messed up, HHT made it right even with a full refund.
I did some searching because I am having similar issues with an order and found this thread, so rather than start a new one, I thought it better to post here.
I purchased the HHRT on 1/17 and paid immediately with paypal. On 1/26 I received a shipping notification e-mail with a USPS Priority tracking number. The number shows no info other than the fact that a shipment was created. The notification says to expect delivery within 2-3 days. Today is 2/4 and I've not received anything. I e-mailed Bob Friday, left a voicemail this morning, and sent a follow-up e-mail from a different account this afternoon in case the first was somehow caught in a spam filter. If anyone knows Bob or has seen their order recently shipped, I would appreciate some insight.
Thanks!
I received 5 of them within the last 10 days or so.
I received 5 of them within the last 10 days or so.
I use mine on a very regular basis. Great tool.
I did some searching because I am having similar issues with an order and found this thread, so rather than start a new one, I thought it better to post here.
I purchased the HHRT on 1/17 and paid immediately with paypal. On 1/26 I received a shipping notification e-mail with a USPS Priority tracking number. The number shows no info other than the fact that a shipment was created. The notification says to expect delivery within 2-3 days. Today is 2/4 and I've not received anything. I e-mailed Bob Friday, left a voicemail this morning, and sent a follow-up e-mail from a different account this afternoon in case the first was somehow caught in a spam filter. If anyone knows Bob or has seen their order recently shipped, I would appreciate some insight.
Thanks!
USPS was my problem recently. I had an order on its way back from ADCO. Tracking number said it would be to my house in 2 days. For whatever reason it took 8 (6 before it even moved).
Give it a little more time...after 4 or 5 days I believe you can call it in as lost and they'll look for it at the mail station.
horseman234
02-04-13, 18:18
I ordered one last Thursday. Received it today. Great service! As noted above, I bet it's a postal service delivery issue.
I ordered one last Thursday. Received it today. Great service! As noted above, I bet it's a postal service delivery issue.
I ordered as well Thursday or Friday and received today. Pretty awesome tool.
I did some searching because I am having similar issues with an order and found this thread, so rather than start a new one, I thought it better to post here.
I purchased the HHRT on 1/17 and paid immediately with paypal. On 1/26 I received a shipping notification e-mail with a USPS Priority tracking number. The number shows no info other than the fact that a shipment was created. The notification says to expect delivery within 2-3 days. Today is 2/4 and I've not received anything. I e-mailed Bob Friday, left a voicemail this morning, and sent a follow-up e-mail from a different account this afternoon in case the first was somehow caught in a spam filter. If anyone knows Bob or has seen their order recently shipped, I would appreciate some insight.
Thanks!
USPS is probably the culprit. If I get tings shipped by UPS or FEDEX there is usually no issue. I can't even track things with the USPS numbers I'm sent most times, and the are rarely on time according to the shipping notice.
Rootbrain
After YEARS of never having issues with USPS I have has two shipments go missing in January to the tune of over $200. Of course, neither had insurance or tracking. For new priority mail, tracking is now free.
Sent from my iPhone on tapatalk
I did some searching because I am having similar issues with an order and found this thread, so rather than start a new one, I thought it better to post here.
I purchased the HHRT on 1/17 and paid immediately with paypal. On 1/26 I received a shipping notification e-mail with a USPS Priority tracking number. The number shows no info other than the fact that a shipment was created. The notification says to expect delivery within 2-3 days. Today is 2/4 and I've not received anything. I e-mailed Bob Friday, left a voicemail this morning, and sent a follow-up e-mail from a different account this afternoon in case the first was somehow caught in a spam filter. If anyone knows Bob or has seen their order recently shipped, I would appreciate some insight.
Thanks!
Well, here's my update from Bob @ Hammerhead this morning:
"Hi Josh,
Your tool was shipped on Monday the 28th.
I'm not sure what's up as I have 4 others tools in limbo as well.
Ill re-print and send another tool out right away. If the lost tool arrives, please keep it or pass it on to a friend. Sorry for the delay, Bob-"
Can't ask for better service than that. :D I can't wait for it to get here as I know it'll be a great tool (from the glowing feedback in just the last few posts).
I wish common sense would prevail in these types of things. I have spent 10yrs selling gear and guns online. This is not the case IMHO.
C4
Can't speak for others, but having read the entire thread, I would not hesitate to buy from HH, especially with Grant's recommendation, not just of the product, but also of the company owner.
Well, here's my update from Bob @ Hammerhead this morning:
"Hi Josh,
Your tool was shipped on Monday the 28th.
I'm not sure what's up as I have 4 others tools in limbo as well.
Ill re-print and send another tool out right away. If the lost tool arrives, please keep it or pass it on to a friend. Sorry for the delay, Bob-"
Can't ask for better service than that. :D I can't wait for it to get here as I know it'll be a great tool (from the glowing feedback in just the last few posts).
If this is how it pans out...........Hello new best friend! :D
Twice in this thread it has been shown that he has stellar customer service. I would not hesitate to buy from him either! (wont have to if ash is my new best buddy though!)
kantstudien
02-06-13, 00:43
Damn! Bob's going to go broke if he keeps up this level of service!
I've had mine (Hammerhead Tool) for quite some time now. Zero problems, works exactly as advertised and I had no issues with receiving it.
I have noticed that sometimes priority mail will get things to me with amazing speed but when I ship something that way it can sometimes take longer than I would like. YMMV
**UPDATE**
My second tool showed up today. Still don't know where the first one went (Sorry Karcas), but I've got a rifle to build this weekend and am stoked about using this new Hammerhead Tool! Thanks again to Bob for the outstanding customer service!
I am also going to use it on Sunday. I never done a full build before an have t used any other AR tools. I just read reviews on it and biught it.
After reading this thread, I have to say a few things.
My business is over a hundred years old, with a great rep and as alway "the customer comes first". With the addition of Internet sales in 2005, I used UPS. In 2009 I switched to USPS. In the four years I used UPS I might have had 5 lost/somehow screwed up orders. Just this year I have had 11 orders lost/somehow screwed up. PayPal also has had a few wacked out moments, but I tend to belive what the past shows me.
In short, shipper beware who you use. I will be changing.
**UPDATE**
My second tool showed up today. Still don't know where the first one went (Sorry Karcas), but I've got a rifle to build this weekend and am stoked about using this new Hammerhead Tool! Thanks again to Bob for the outstanding customer service!
Hey no problem. I'm glad one got to you! I'll just have to put an order in myself one of these days :)
This thread, and how Bob handled things, convinced me. I placed my order on the 5th, around 9pm. Had it in my hands on the 8th.
Looks like a fantastic tool. Now I need to figure out what to do with a couple lowers so I can use it...
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