Commentary on the debate.... [Archive]

Caeser25

10-03-12, 20:43

Same old shit.

Obama: I inherited the greatest economic crisis since the Great Depression, same policies that got us here (democrat policies on banks was the problem, not trickle down) millionaires and billionaires, cutting spending means cutting Medicare, social security, education, kids in wheelchairs, (usual democrat rhetoric) corporate welfare is tax breaks (as if the government has a right to that money :rolleyes:) , etc.

Romney: grow the economy, lower tax rates, reduce deductions, reduce government......

Koshinn

10-03-12, 20:45

It's streaming live on YouTube

Palmguy

10-03-12, 20:47

Romney is winning so far, from my perspective.

I'm no Romney cheerleader but they are not the same person at all.

J-Dub

10-03-12, 20:52

jaxman7

10-03-12, 20:55

Romney is winning so far, from my perspective.

I'm no Romney cheerleader but they are not the same person at all.

Agreed,

Romney nailed him on the private energy comment being grown within the private sector despite federal restrictions and a few others areas such as his rebuttal to Obama's deduction for factories going overseas snip at Romney.

-Jax

Cagemonkey

10-03-12, 20:56

Bullshit. Its all bullshit.

There will be voter fraud, the election has already been decided by the people who run this country.

But Im sure the Jellyfish are hanging on every softball bullshit question.

P.S. They are the same people, puppets for the globalists and their agendas.Agreed. Over all I dislike Romney and hate Obama. Romney might be able to get the economy moving a little better, but I worry about the influence the Neocons have on his foreign policy and his willingness to go to war with Iran.

Sensei

10-03-12, 20:59

The Secret Service should step in and stop the bloodbath. Obama is getting killed.

munch520

10-03-12, 21:10

The Secret Service should step in and stop the bloodbath. Obama is getting killed.

Agreed. Businessman > good public speaker/lifelong politician

Pilgrim

10-03-12, 21:21

Romney actually seems like he knows what he's talking about... I find it rather refreshing. Obama... well... he ain't doing so good.

Surprisingly good moderation by Lehrer.

tb-av

10-03-12, 21:42

I agree... Romney hands down. Even the media is out of the gate saying Obama looked weak.

Romney won every round. Obama looked like he wished his corner would throw in the towel right towards the end.

Denali

10-03-12, 21:51

Surprisingly good moderation by Lehrer.

This because Romney refused to allow him rope to interfere on behalf of Obama! Romney thrashed Obama, and its going to only get worse for Obama when the subject matter turns to foreign relations as Obama's "ahh" doctrine burns at his arrogant feet....

CarlosDJackal

10-03-12, 22:07

Obama's answer on every topic seemd to be:
- More taxes on the rich.
- Trying to help the "Middle Class".
- We cannot allow the American people to make their own decisions on anything.

Romney took this one hands down. He did a god job standing his ground and not letting obama get away with lies.

CoryCop25

10-03-12, 22:13

CNN reported that Romney won the debate.
Obama supporter stated moderator was biased toward Romney and wasn't fair to Obama.

The_War_Wagon

10-03-12, 22:17

NIGHTMARES are "dreams," right? :rolleyes:

http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-snc7/421368_446296022080181_138239160_n.jpg

SHOULDA posted this sooner - your Obama-debate Bingo card!

http://iowntheworld.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/35484_438322542881001_173768126_n.jpg

DeltaSierra

10-03-12, 22:20

Bullshit. Its all bullshit.

There will be voter fraud, the election has already been decided by the people who run this country.

But Im sure the Jellyfish are hanging on every softball bullshit question.

P.S. They are the same people, puppets for the globalists and their agendas.

I couldn't have said it better myself.

This is sooooo stupid. Both the individuals involved are confirmed globalists, and are both on the same team.

Neither one is better than the other - they are both scumbags of the first order.

jaxman7

10-03-12, 22:24

Agreed. Businessman > good public speaker/regurgitator of words sourced from a teleprompter

Fixed it for ya munch. ;)

-Jax

ETA: I was amazed the words-forty seven percent-didn't leave Barry's mouth during the debate.

Sensei

10-03-12, 22:25

I flipped over to MSLSD...er...I mean MSMBC. Their post-debate panel is all up in arms over Obama's poor performance. I suppose this is a good sign given the panel is composed of: 2 socialists, The Race Baiter in Chief, a woman that wants to be a man, and a man that wants to be a woman.

Straight Shooter

10-03-12, 22:25

Right after the debate..I went to MSNBC, as I often do, to see how they act and what they say.
THEY ARE LIVID! ALL of them say Romney won, and won big. I absolutely thought Chris Matthews was gonna stroke out. He looked like someone slapped him across the face, his hair was all sticking up, and he was INSANE. The dude Maddow is having a coniption right now.
IF he does this well again, and IF Ryan smokes Biden as I fully expect him to, Romney WILL win.
Now, Im not so much for Romney, as I am against this mother****ing BASTARD S.O.B. we have now.
Obama had his ass handed to him.

Safetyhit

10-03-12, 22:26

The reaction at MSNBC. Priceless.

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2012/10/03/chris_matthews_freaks_out_at_obama_after_debate_romney_was_winning.html

jaxman7

10-03-12, 22:35

The reaction at MSNBC. Priceless.

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2012/10/03/chris_matthews_freaks_out_at_obama_after_debate_romney_was_winning.html

Awesome! This is really refreshing to hear these guys squirm for a change.

I just got a tingle down MY leg Mr. Matthews.

-Jax

bubba04

10-03-12, 22:55

Romney blew me away. There is hope.

Denali

10-03-12, 23:00

Its amazing what the media misses, or overlooks, there was a knockout quote, one that should ensure that Obama is chased back into the nebulosity from whence he came,

"Obama On Jobs: "You May Want To Move On To Another Topic"

That was as memorable a quote, and moment, as I've ever seen in a presidential debate, and I've seen a lot of em!

B Cart

10-03-12, 23:08

Romney definitely dominated the debate tonight. I loved the fact that Obama couldn't even look Romney in the face for the majority of the debate. Take away the teleprompter and Obama falls apart like a cheap suit.

I'm not a big Romney fan, but i'd sure as hell take him over Obama any day of the week.

Packman73

10-03-12, 23:14

Well done Mitt.

Pilgrim

10-03-12, 23:19

This because Romney refused to allow him rope to interfere on behalf of Obama! Romney thrashed Obama, and its going to only get worse for Obama when the subject matter turns to foreign relations as Obama's "ahh" doctrine burns at his arrogant feet....

Yeah I guess your right, and you're in good company, as I've had a 1/2 dozen people tell me I'm wrong on this tonight... It's just hearing Barry get trashed so badly gave me such enjoyment, I was apparently overlooking anything negative!

Terracoma

10-03-12, 23:32

CNN reported that Romney won the debate.

I got a kick out of this and linked a few people to it, but noticed later that CNN only sampled 430 people total...

Oh well, the reaction over at MSNBC was telling enough.

FromMyColdDeadHand

10-04-12, 00:01

That is the first time that I thought Romney actually wanted to win this thing.

What I learned tonight is that I wouldn't want to go against Romney on a business deal. Look at it this way, if we are looking for a CEO to run our country, who would you have picked tonight?

Romney for the first time defined himself and his positions in relation to Obama with out the filter of the press or the noise of 30sec commercials.

I think Obama is going to come out more aggressive in the next debate. My guess is that Romney is capable of scaling the ferocity of his rhetoric to handle anything Obama can dish out.

Romney showed me he is a winner. Failure doesn't come easy to him.

DeltaSierra

10-04-12, 00:01

Romney blew me away. There is hope.

You know, that is THE DUMBEST thing I have seen on this forum in some time now.

Do you have the least damned clue as to what Romney did while he was the Governor in Massachusetts?

I saw, firsthand, the stuff he did, the laws he signed, the things he supported. That guy is a bloody politician, and will say anything, ANYTHING, to get elected.

THERE IS NO HOPE, folks! Regardless who wins this election, we, the people, LOSE!

I am so totally and absolutely sick and tired of hearing this partisan bullshit. You don't have a damn clue what is real, or what YOU think - all you know is what the media says...

FromMyColdDeadHand

10-04-12, 00:05

I got a kick out of this and linked a few people to it, but noticed later that CNN only sampled 430 people total...

Oh well, the reaction over at MSNBC was telling enough.

I watched it too, and the sad thing is that Rachel Maddow is capable of some interesting insights in the first half of her sentence, but the last half is always a partisan hack job.

Do they make the 'dude' on the MSNBC wear the glasses so that people can tell him apart from Rachel? What is Ezra Klien's claim to fame?

VIP3R 237

10-04-12, 00:08

You know, that is THE DUMBEST thing I have seen on this forum in some time now.

Do you have the least damned clue as to what Romney did while he was the Governor in Massachusetts?

I saw, firsthand, the stuff he did, the laws he signed, the things he supported. That guy is a bloody politician, and will say anything, ANYTHING, to get elected.

THERE IS NO HOPE, folks! Regardless who wins this election, we, the people, LOSE!

I am so totally and absolutely sick and tired of hearing this partisan bullshit. You don't have a damn clue what is real, or what YOU think - all you know is what the media says...

That is why i struggle with Romney, even with him being a fellow mormon and utahn, ultimately he is a politician. However without a doubt i feel he is a better option that what we currently have.

I did really enjoy this though" "You're entitled to your own plane. You're entitled to your own house. But, you're not entitled to your own facts." -Mitt

Sensei

10-04-12, 00:13

DeltaSierra

10-04-12, 00:19

That is why i struggle with Romney, even with him being a fellow mormon and utahn, ultimately he is a politician. However without a doubt i feel he is a better option that what we currently have.

Ok, just how is that guy "better" than Obama?

Name ONE thing he did as Governor of Massachusetts that was "better" than what Obama is doing right now, as President.

He supported an assault weapons ban, one of the most onerous in the nation. I guess that is "better?"

He was instrumental in the passing of one of the worst "healthcare reform" laws in the country, and, for your information, it was, in large part, what "Obamacare" was based off of. I guess that is "better" than what we have now?

Those are just two things he did (out of many, many more,) that you should learn more about before making any comments about how much "better" he is than what we have now.

I think that your Haldol just wore off.

You sir, are a genius. When anyone disagrees with you, you try to figure out what medications you think I'm on? Sheer genius, I tell you.

I'm speaking from experience. I'm speaking about something I have personal knowledge about. I'm speaking about something that I have had to deal with. You, on the other hand, are speaking about something of which you know nothing about. I guess all your degrees make you exempt from the laws of reason, since you seem to be incapable of such....

Sensei

10-04-12, 00:39

You sir, are a genius. When anyone disagrees with you, you call names - sheer genius, I tell you.

I'm speaking from experience. I'm speaking about something I have personal knowledge about. I'm speaking about something that I have had to deal with. You, on the other hand, are speaking about something of which you know nothing about. I guess all your degrees make you exempt from the laws of reason, since you seem to be incapable of such....

And anyone who disagrees with you is dumb or making a dumb statement.

You really need to stop with the deranged posts in all caps about having no hope. Screaming at someone who makes a simple comment about being encouraged by the debate makes you come off as insane.

Also, Romney did not support an AWB. He signed one - there is a big difference. That ban was the incarnation of a liberal legislature. Sure, he made some dumb statements in favor of the law as he was putting ink to paper. However, he was not the driving influence behind the law. Romneycare is another compromise law that was going to pass whether or not he supported it.

Waylander

10-04-12, 01:17

And anyone who disagrees with you is dumb or making a dumb statement.

You really need to stop with the deranged posts in all caps about having no hope. Screaming at someone who makes a simple comment about being encouraged by the debate makes you come off as insane.

Also, Romney did not support an AWB. He signed one - there is a big difference. That ban was the incarnation of a liberal legislature. Sure, he made some dumb statements in favor of the law as he was putting ink to paper. However, he was not the driving influence behind the law. Romneycare is another compromise law that was going to pass whether or not he supported it.

This.

Some people live in absolutes and have no grasp of context.

Reagan while governor of CA (one of the most liberal states...a la MA) signed one of the most sweeping pro-abortion bills into law leading to millions of abortions. He changed his tune before he ran for President.

I think though Romney needs to admit Romneycare is a failure. Get out in front of it and say it was an experiment that failed is precisely why Obamacare needs repealed.

Romney 1
Obama -1

maximus83

10-04-12, 01:25

Romney by a wide margin. More specifics on tax and economic and jobs details, and better job of tying his comments back to underlying principles. Also a good job of forcing the discussion back to BHO's actual record, despite BHO's disingenuous attempt at centrist-speak during the debate.

One of the bright moments was Romney's closing statement, where he referred to the Constitution on the wall behind and said it is government's job to uphold the Constitution. Now, whether he actually DOES that if he gets elected, remains to be seen. But at least in principle, he wants to. The current occupant of the White House fails even to defend our Constitution in principle, usually apologizing for it or making comments that suggest it is a hindrance to all his wonderful plans to "fundamentally change" us.

Caeser25

10-04-12, 01:55

Why wasn't The Fed mentioned ONCE?

RancidSumo

10-04-12, 02:11

Caeser25

10-04-12, 02:43

Overall, Romney definitely came out on top.

That said, I didn't hear one single sentence about monetary policy all night. What is the point of a debate if you are going to leave out the single most important issue?

Because they're both bought and paid for. Follow the money, goldmand sachs, jp morgan, there's your president.

http://www.opensecrets.org/pres12/contrib.php?id=N00000286

http://www.opensecrets.org/pres08/contrib.php?cid=N00009638

http://www.opensecrets.org/pres04/contrib.php?cycle=2004&cid=N00008072

For anybody questioning why is monetary policy important.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/091298645X/ref=redir_mdp_mobile/186-8148296-6745726

At this point, the most important vote you can make is your state senator, rep, and governor.

polymorpheous

10-04-12, 03:04

Magic_Salad0892

10-04-12, 03:11

This.

Some people live in absolutes and have no grasp of context.

Reagan while governor (of one of the most liberal states...a la MA) signed one of the most sweeping pro-abortion bills into law leading to millions of abortions. He changed his tune before he ran for President.

I think though Romney needs to admit Romneycare is a failure. Get out in front of it and say it was an experiment that failed is precisely why Obamacare needs repealed.

Romney 1
Obama -1

I thought Reagan was governor of CA?

NWPilgrim

10-04-12, 03:22

SMETNA

10-04-12, 03:23

Why wasn't The Fed mentioned ONCE?

You already know the answer

sjc3081

10-04-12, 03:37

I think we about to see the 1980 Presidential Election repeat itself.

Business_Casual

10-04-12, 06:00

I couldn't stomach listening to it. Glad Dear Leader was exposed as vacant and clueless. But did either of them mention the need to cut federal spending by more than 33% ($1.2 Trillion) just to balance the budget, let alone cut enough to start whittling on the deficit?

If not then we are doomed. There is no recovery on the horizon or by cutting 3% from a 50% over budget. Is the country on crack and not able to do simple math anymore?

When a candidate comes out and commits to cutting spending by 50% and telling the bankers we default and take a hike then I willlisten. Otherwise it is just flapping lips in the hot wind.

You are assuming a static model, which isn't true. We can grow out of it. The Fed wasn't mentioned because 98% doesn't know what a central bank is.

You know, if you think all this is real.

I am a bit concerned though, it does appear that the fix is in for Mitt, which I didn't expect.

You know, if you think this is all rigged.

Wow, it is hard to operate on different levels...

Waylander

10-04-12, 06:10

I thought Reagan was governor of CA?

Yep my bad. I didn't make myself clear. :)
I assumed everybody knew he was governor of CA, a very liberal state, in the manner of MA and Romney's situation.

I think the abortion thing is a funny juxtaposition between Reagan, who many adore (I like him), and Romney who made similar judgement calls.
Even so I doubt anybody here will discuss Reagan's flaws.

This is the first of 3 debates. Did anyone expect them to lay all their cards on the table the first night? :confused:

Why don't some of you that know what Romney shoulda said just write his speech for him. I'm sure it'll be an aha moment when he realizes he didn't talk about what you wanted to hear :rolleyes:

ETA:
Never mind, I've reminded myself why I had stopped posting in the GD forum.

The_War_Wagon

10-04-12, 06:56

Why wasn't The Fed mentioned ONCE?

Because he who CONTROLS the money, CONTROLS the country. "President" is just the guy who just gets the fancy house, Air Force 1, and facetime on the camera...

SMETNA

10-04-12, 07:17

You are assuming a static model, which isn't true. We can grow out of it.

Short of a new invention that changes everything, a la the automobile, or the Internet, there's no way we can grow our way out of it. No way.

Time is short for us. That kind of growth takes time.

J-Dub

10-04-12, 07:19

Romney blew me away. There is hope.

LOL welcome to the avg. American thought process. He can SAY he's for limited gov't, lower taxes, ect....shit he could say the ****ing easter bunny is real, or that he's moses....

Look at the globalists record, whos footing his superpac's bills, ect...

Jesus H. Christ. This is exactly why we're screwed

agr1279

10-04-12, 07:35

I think we about to see the 1980 Presidential Election repeat itself.

We can only hope this is true.

Dan

Sensei

10-04-12, 07:43

I couldn't stomach listening to it. Glad Dear Leader was exposed as vacant and clueless. But did either of them mention the need to cut federal spending by more than 33% ($1.2 Trillion) just to balance the budget, let alone cut enough to start whittling on the deficit?

If not then we are doomed. There is no recovery on the horizon or by cutting 3% from a 50% over budget. Is the country on crack and not able to do simple math anymore?

When a candidate comes out and commits to cutting spending by 50% and telling the bankers we default and take a hike then I will listen. Otherwise it is just flapping lips in the hot wind.

I seem to recall Romney mentioning 3 ways to reduce the deficit: taxes, economic growth, and spending reductions. He made it clear that his preference was growth then spending cuts. Taxes were not on the table.

Mjolnir

10-04-12, 07:54

You know, that is THE DUMBEST thing I have seen on this forum in some time now.

Do you have the least damned clue as to what Romney did while he was the Governor in Massachusetts?

I saw, firsthand, the stuff he did, the laws he signed, the things he supported. That guy is a bloody politician, and will say anything, ANYTHING, to get elected.

THERE IS NO HOPE, folks! Regardless who wins this election, we, the people, LOSE!

I am so totally and absolutely sick and tired of hearing this partisan bullshit. You don't have a damn clue what is real, or what YOU think - all you know is what the media says...

"No one" cares. It's the fluoridated water, GMO foods, EM pollution or SOMETHING.

It seems both parties are full of partisans not informed citizens.

I've no answer for them. We've slept for just over 100 years. There is a plan. Despite the calls of "Tin Foil". We are living in the final steps and in our natural lifetime the mask will be removed for those who profess they are "free" will see for self the delusions they've been living.

Sensei

10-04-12, 07:58

tb-av

10-04-12, 08:17

At this point, the most important vote you can make is your state senator, rep, and governor.

We've been at that point for quite some time. That's how the Dems got into power here in VA and even with this election I am still very concerned about Tim Kaine winning the Senate. It is a sickening thought to know that King Kaine could win and in doing so also bring votes to Obama and have him win the election again.

This win for Romney in the debate means nothing in the grand scheme if the lower level elections lift Obama. Kaine even has a new ad where he states he will work with "whichever" President is elected... so they are pretty much doing anything to get him elected in a swing state knowing it will bring votes to Obama.

tb-av

10-04-12, 08:26

It is interesting to see the left wing media turn on the moderator, Jim Leher, for not controlling the debate. After all, there must be some reason other than Obama's policies for Romney to win. Never mind the fact that Obama out-paced Romney by 4 minutes of total speaking time.

Did you also notice that after Obama told Leher to "change the subject" that Romney told Leher he would have to cut his funding?

I'm wondering who the next two moderators are and what the format will be. Maybe Obama can pull some strings and have Judge Roberts moderate.

nineteenkilo

10-04-12, 08:52

I'm wondering who the next two moderators are and what the format will be. Maybe Obama can pull some strings and have Judge Roberts moderate.

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In This Section

Candidate Selection Criteria
Format
Dates and Locations
Moderators

2012 Presidential and Vice Presidential Debates

All debates will take place from 9:00-10:30 p.m. Eastern Time.
First presidential debate:
Wednesday, October 3
University of Denver, Denver, CO
Moderator: Jim Lehrer, Executive Editor of the PBS NewsHour

Vice presidential debate:
Thursday, October 11
Centre College, Danville, KY
Moderator: Martha Raddatz, Senior Foreign Affairs Correspondent, ABC News

Second presidential debate (town meeting format):
Tuesday, October 16
Hofstra University, Hempstead, NY
Moderator: Candy Crowley, Chief Political Correspondent, CNN and Anchor, CNN's State of the Union

Third presidential debate:
Monday, October22
Lynn University, Boca Raton, FL
Moderator: Bob Schieffer, Chief Washington Correspondent, CBS News and Moderator, Face the Nation

Doc Safari

10-04-12, 09:14

I think we about to see the 1980 Presidential Election repeat itself.

That was my thinking.

BUT...

Keep in mind that according to Bill Cunningham the election will come down to four counties in Ohio.

If Barry steals those, he wins the state, the Electoral College, and the election.

This is still not going to be decided until election day.

Safetyhit

10-04-12, 09:22

LOL welcome to the avg. American thought process. He can SAY he's for limited gov't, lower taxes, ect....shit he could say the ****ing easter bunny is real, or that he's moses....

Look at the globalists record, whos footing his superpac's bills, ect...

Jesus H. Christ. This is exactly why we're screwed

With good conscience I and many here will pick the candidate that increases my chances of financial prosperity, protects my family from threats both home and abroad, will not infringe on my right to bear arms and will restore respect to America. This while the ideologist crybaby conspiracy theorists waste their right to vote while claiming a hollow respect for the countless thousands that died to both establish and preserve that right.

There is nothing, and I mean nothing, currently more detrimental to the discussions here than the global takeover conspiracy, government programming, ultra-libertarian lawlessness bullshit. At this point I'd gladly designate one small corner of the country to the socialists and one to the Lord of the Flies with guns wannabes. Good riddance to all.

tb-av

10-04-12, 09:29

Mauser KAR98K

10-04-12, 10:07

Where has THIS Romney been? Where ever he has been, he needs to show up more.

chadbag

10-04-12, 10:53

1980 --- never happen.

I'm still very concerned Obama will win this handily. The people that vote for Obama don't care about these debates. Many have already voted.

If the left turns out to vote, Obama will win.

(pre debate) Rasmussen has Romney and Obama basically tied statistically while Obama has a 2pt advantage in absolute terms. But he has under 50% approval which is the biggest indicator historically of who will win the election (meaning President with under 50% approval is not re-elected).

I don't think Obama will have it easy and personally think he won't make it.

--

crusader377

10-04-12, 11:05

Where has THIS Romney been? Where ever he has been, he needs to show up more.

No kidding. Personally if I were Romney, I would try to challenge Obama to a couple of more debates especially in a more open format. I know the left is beating up Jim Lehrer but the limited control of last nights debate really showed on how much of an empty suit Obama really is.

Business_Casual

10-04-12, 11:05

Did anyone hear Obama say the job of the Federal Government is to keep you safe? Scary.

bc

WillBrink

10-04-12, 11:13

(pre debate) Rasmussen has Romney and Obama basically tied statistically while Obama has a 2pt advantage in absolute terms. But he has under 50% approval which is the biggest indicator historically of who will win the election (meaning President with under 50% approval is not re-elected).

I don't think Obama will have it easy and personally think he won't make it.

--

I don't think he'll have it easy, but will scrape by a very narrow margin. I don't think the debates will change enough minds already set to make the difference.

The ABO crew wouldn't care if Romney called Obama the N word on national TV, they'd still vote for him, and those seeing Obama as in line with their beliefs and or 'the devil you know' won't be swayed by Romney.

Romney was my Gov. and I'm not swayed by anything the man says either as he was less than impressive as Gov. and other issues already covered as to why he's not remotely qualified or fit nor a man who should be POTUS.

In my adult life as a registered voter I've never seen worse choices of "lesser of two evils" to vote for as is often the case in a (supposed) Democracy.

Not good.

Split66

10-04-12, 11:18

In my adult life as a registered voter I've never seen worse choices of "lesser of two evils" to vote for as is often the case in a (supposed) Democracy.

Not good.

Um...yeah, that about sums it up LOL!

VooDoo6Actual

10-04-12, 11:22

Did anyone hear Obama say the job of the Federal Government is to keep you safe? Scary.

bc

Indeed, a lot of scary stuff was said.

NWPilgrim

10-04-12, 11:33

I seem to recall Romney mentioning 3 ways to reduce the deficit: taxes, economic growth, and spending reductions. He made it clear that his preference was growth then spending cuts. Taxes were not on the table.

Not hardly. Assume healthy growth of 5-7%. With us spending 50% over budget every year it takes near a decade of consistent healthy growth to just balance the budget. Not very likely.

For one thing our population would not stand for freezing the budget at just 50% over. We want more and the default has an automatic increase baked in.

Second, Romney does not have a supportive Senate and even with some R wins it will not be filibuster proof. From whence will come the Congress with a fiscal backbone to arise from the body of Repubs that spent like drunken sailors for eight years?

Third, how many years will it take to go from a teetering stall to such robust growth? Add that on to your calculations.

I know it is psychologically painful to accept we have dug too deep a debt hole to cleanly climb out of. But look at 50% of the voters. Look at our record for the last 40 years built on debt bubbles. We are out of bubbles. Bubbles do not work.

The math is simple. Words may sound sweet but math does not deceive.

jaxman7

10-04-12, 11:36

Did anyone hear Obama say the job of the Federal Government is to keep you safe? Scary.

bc

I'd like to hear Obama's definition of safe. Wait....maybe I wouldn't.

-Jax

crusader377

10-04-12, 12:04

In my adult life as a registered voter I've never seen worse choices of "lesser of two evils" to vote for as is often the case in a (supposed) Democracy.

Not good.

Although I wasn't an initial Romney supporter the more I see him the more I like him and I think he is actually the best candidate that the GOP has put up in at least 20 years. Don't agree with all of his political views but he does understand the economy and he has a proven track record of success in many different endevors. He might not be my ideal candidate but he is what this country needs to move forward.

WillBrink

10-04-12, 12:35

Although I wasn't an initial Romney supporter the more I see him the more I like him and I think he is actually the best candidate that the GOP has put up in at least 20 years. Don't agree with all of his political views

Which? They tend to change 180 depending on which group he's pandering to.

but he does understand the economy and he has a proven track record of success in many different endevors. He might not be my ideal candidate but he is what this country needs to move forward.

So many things wrong with the above, wouldn't even know where to start. I will only say, I live in the one and only state the man has any actual experience in as a politician, and his "proven" track record here was awful.

I'll put you down as an ABO person (a position I do understand considering...), and respect your choices there of. But, don't piss on me and tell me it's raining by pretending (or being fooled into?) claiming Romney's a good choice for the job.

500grains

10-04-12, 12:56

Mitt Romney may not be the next Thomas Jefferson. But neither is he a gay, muslim, communist Kenyan, nor is he Obama. Therefore he gets my vote.

Romney sucked for Mass. Mass. sucked before Romney. Mass. sucks after Romney. But I have a small degree of hope because in private industry at least Romney knew how to cut budgets and fire people to make a company profitable. Maybe he can cut budgets and fire people in government. And if not, at least he is not Obama.

crusader377

10-04-12, 13:07

Will,

What are our options? I actually favored RP in the primary and I describe myself as a limited government conservative or maybe a soft core libertarian. I'm also a small business owner who provides services to other small and medium sized businesses. I can tell you for a fact that the Obama administration has been toxic to small and medium businesses which provide greater than 70% of economic growth in this country.

If we get 4 more years of Obama, we will add at least $5 trillion to the debt taking it to $20 trillion plus along with no economic growth and increased government entitlements. Once interest rates rise which they will then will will be spending easily $1 to $1.5 trillion a year just servicing the debt. Then it is game over for the United States.

Philosophically Romney is not my ideal candidate but he does have a proven track record of success and he does understand the economy and business. He is the only candidate running who has a chance of forming policies that will get this country moving again. Furthermore, he is an honorable man who has been loyal to his family and has been a decent person his entire life. Romney has proven experience turning around failing enterprises and he is the best chance right now of being able to put America in the position of more freedom, prosperity, and smaller government in the future.

Doc Safari

10-04-12, 13:21

Romney sucked for Mass. Mass. sucked before Romney. Mass. sucks after Romney. But I have a small degree of hope because in private industry at least Romney knew how to cut budgets and fire people to make a company profitable. Maybe he can cut budgets and fire people in government. And if not, at least he is not Obama.

Romney is known as a turnaround guy who is able to pull failing businesses out of the fire.

That is exactly what the country needs right now.

I personally think he is soft on gun control, illegal immigration, entitlement programs, and government-run health care.

But at least maybe the country won't look like the Weimar Republic under Romney.

McCain was the one I despised. If not for Sarah Palin I would have stayed home in '08.

Denali

10-04-12, 14:52

You know, that is THE DUMBEST thing I have seen on this forum in some time now.

Do you have the least damned clue as to what Romney did while he was the Governor in Massachusetts?

I saw, firsthand, the stuff he did, the laws he signed, the things he supported. That guy is a bloody politician, and will say anything, ANYTHING, to get elected.

THERE IS NO HOPE, folks! Regardless who wins this election, we, the people, LOSE!

I am so totally and absolutely sick and tired of hearing this partisan bullshit. You don't have a damn clue what is real, or what YOU think - all you know is what the media says...

This man speaks the truth.

LOL welcome to the avg. American thought process. He can SAY he's for limited gov't, lower taxes, ect....shit he could say the ****ing easter bunny is real, or that he's moses....

Look at the globalists record, whos footing his superpac's bills, ect...

Jesus H. Christ. This is exactly why we're screwed

Thank you for your valuable insights....:suicide:

chadbag

10-04-12, 14:57

So many things wrong with the above, wouldn't even know where to start. I will only say, I live in the one and only state the man has any actual experience in as a politician, and his "proven" track record here was awful.

considering what he had to work with...

I did not live in Mass while Romney was there but I did grow up there. You won't ever get conservative/libertarian Republicans elected there -- if they do, they are in the closet having to deal with the overwhelmingly D controlled legislature.

I am not saying Romney is an ultra-conservative or libertarian, but in the environment he was in he worked to do his best. His D opponent would probably have been worse.

He IS a politician, by definition, and has to play the role in order to even get a chance at governing.

I'll put you down as an ABO person (a position I do understand considering...), and respect your choices there of. But, don't piss on me and tell me it's raining by pretending (or being fooled into?) claiming Romney's a good choice for the job.

I'll take the chance of a Romney presidency sucking against a known Obama presidency royally taking a huge turd sucking.

---

GeorgiaBoy

10-04-12, 15:08

Listen to the first 20 minutes of the first Kennedy vs. Nixon debate in 1960.

The parallels are so eery, despite that was 52 years ago, to what was being discussed last night.

Safetyhit

10-04-12, 15:41

The ABO crew wouldn't care if Romney called Obama the N word on national TV, they'd still vote for him, and those seeing Obama as in line with their beliefs and or 'the devil you know' won't be swayed by Romney.

Romney was my Gov. and I'm not swayed by anything the man says either as he was less than impressive as Gov. and other issues already covered as to why he's not remotely qualified or fit nor a man who should be POTUS.

In my adult life as a registered voter I've never seen worse choices of "lesser of two evils" to vote for as is often the case in a (supposed) Democracy.

Not good.

What an absolute joke every single word of this post is. Gives new meaning to the term "exaggeration", but I suppose if you look for something hard enough your mind can generate all sorts of illusions out of perceived necessity.

At this critical and confusing time we are certainly seeing what some here are really made of. Makes me miss the days of Harv's tirades.

glocktogo

10-04-12, 16:07

What an absolute joke every single word of this post is. Gives new meaning to the term "exaggeration", but I suppose if you look for something hard enough your mind can generate all sorts of illusions out of perceived necessity.

At this critical and confusing time we are certainly seeing what some here are really made of. Makes me miss the days of Harv's tirades.

Most of us would say the same of your posts on the subject. Will's thoughts on Romney are solidly in line with a large segment of both the conservative AND libertarian voters who find him to be an exceptionally poor candidate.

I guess things look different from behind the lines in the PRNJ. :(

theblackknight

10-04-12, 16:53

But neither is he a gay, muslim, communist Kenyan, nor is he Obama. Therefore he gets my vote.

This is like someone plugged Rush Limbaugh's radio feed into a voice-to-text program and then posted on this forum for reasons I can't understand.

Safetyhit

10-04-12, 17:07

I guess things look different from behind the lines in the PRNJ. :(

Yes, I live in New Jersey and therefore my judgement is clouded. I don't feel unconstitutionally restricted, I'm delighted I can't carry. I am complacent as deemed, you've exposed the true me.

While I don't see Romney as the worst candidate in history or whatever the retarded ****, you want better and so do I. But we don't get there via ideology or internet rants. If this country is to become the more conservative nation we need it to be, at this point there is no doubt that such a goal must be achieved in increments.

We need to earn the trust of more in the middle, especially minorities, in order to set a "new" standard of success. Then, once we regain the majority of public trust, we attempt to somehow ride that wave to even greater heights. Not trying to make it sound easy but hopefully you get my drift.

glocktogo

10-04-12, 17:25

Yes, I live in New Jersey and therefore my judgement is clouded. I don't feel unconstitutionally restricted, I'm delighted I can't carry. I am complacent as deemed, you've exposed the true me.

While I don't see Romney as the worst candidate in history or whatever the retarded ****, you want better and so do I. But we don't get there via ideology or internet rants. If this country is to become the more conservative nation we need it to be, at this point there is no doubt that such a goal must be achieved in increments.

We need to earn the trust of more in the middle, especially minorities, in order to set a "new" standard of success. Then, once we regain the majority of public trust, we attempt to somehow ride that wave to even greater heights. Not trying to make it sound easy but hopefully you get my drift.

I get where you're coming from, but I don't agree. The GOP has strayed from its history and principles. When you can't follow your own path, why would anyone else follow you?

The problem we have in this country is that we've allowed the left to disenfranchise a significant portion of the populace. They cut them from the herd and made them all sorts of promises that do damage to the country. They've done this for so long that they've institutionalized dependency for and on those people.

Rather than writing those people off, we need to draw some of them back into the fold. We have to empower them with more than a check. They have to be made to understand that this country doesn't succeed without them. Once we've established inroads on the Democratic strongholds, we need those people to use peer pressure on their family, friends and neighbors to get with the program or be counted as part of the problem. We also need to expose the racist, carpetbagging haters out there for the damage they do to their own people in pursuit of selfish desires.

I'd love to see every adult citizen in the country paying taxes. That would mean a significantly lower burden on everyone and prosperity to some extent for all. As it is, Republicans like Romney have written off large swaths of America as unworkable. That isn't the way to fix this country.

tb-av

10-04-12, 17:34

Al Gore has figured out why Obama did so poorly.... he told a group of people that because he arrived only 2.5 hrs before the debate the altitude got to him and that Romney had been there longer and acclimated ....

This is not a joke... he actually said that.

Hmac

10-04-12, 18:39

VooDoo6Actual

10-04-12, 19:16

I'd like to see Romney hit Obama w/ this little jewel:

Profits From Poverty: How Food Stamps Benefit Corporations.

http://g-a-i.org/gai-report-profits-from-poverty-how-food-stamps-benefit-corporations/

http://g-a-i.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/GAI-Report-ProfitsfromPoverty-FINAL.pdf

JPMorgan's Paton Discusses U.S. Food Stamp Profits ummm Use

http://www.bloomberg.com/video/57038578-jpmorgan-s-paton-discusses-u-s-food-stamp-use.html

http://i40.photobucket.com/albums/e225/teehee321/283405_473418919357689_1399067744_n.jpg

GeorgiaBoy

10-04-12, 20:25

Some of the hateful and vile comments often said on this Forum towards our President are just plain out embarrassing and disgusting.

chadbag

10-04-12, 20:30

Some of the hateful and vile comments often said on this Forum towards our President are just plain out embarrassing and disgusting.

That is ok, the feeling is mutual (not to you, to him).

Honu

10-04-12, 20:33

Some of the hateful and vile comments often said on this Forum towards our President are just plain out embarrassing and disgusting.

considering what he has done to this country ! I am amazed its not a lot worse ;)

and the things he has said about America for a President are down right embarrassing and disgusting !
like bowing to foreign leaders apologizing every where he goes etc...

Business_Casual

10-04-12, 20:46

Some of the hateful and vile comments often said on this Forum towards our President are just plain out embarrassing and disgusting.

We don't venerate politicians.

http://www.crossroad.to/articles2/05/dialectic.htm

500grains

10-04-12, 22:11

Some of the hateful and vile comments often said on this Forum towards our President are just plain out embarrassing and disgusting.

Which comment embarrassed you?

500grains

10-04-12, 22:13

The ABO crew wouldn't care if Romney called Obama the N word on national TV, they'd still vote for him,

Are you against use the the N word?

GeorgiaBoy

10-04-12, 22:46

Which comment embarrassed you?

Wasn't directed at any one person or any one comment. Its a generalized blanket statement on any of the hate I've seen over the course of the past several years on this forum.

- - - -

I'm not saying that you can't disagree with our president and believe he is in the wrong, and that he does things you don't like. But for the love of God, quit making such asinine and immature comments and insults towards the man that was elected our President. His position deserves respect, despite whichever party or ideological affiliation you have.

An Undocumented Worker

10-04-12, 22:58

Wasn't directed at any one person or any one comment. Its a generalized blanket statement on any of the hate I've seen over the course of the past several years on this forum.

- - - -

I'm not saying that you can't disagree with our president and believe he is in the wrong, and that he does things you don't like. But for the love of God, quit making such asinine and immature comments and insults towards the man that was elected our President. His position deserves respect, despite whichever party or ideological affiliation you have.

Were they disrespecting the position, or disrespecting the man in that position. There is a very distinct difference between the two.

GeorgiaBoy

10-04-12, 23:11

Were they disrespecting the position, or disrespecting the man in that position. There is a very distinct difference between the two.

He deserves respect as a person because he currently holds that position.

ForTehNguyen

10-04-12, 23:15

So we have to respect him? What is he a king? My loyalty is to the Constitution. Tyrants like him dont deserve shit from me.

GeorgiaBoy

10-04-12, 23:28

So we have to respect him? What is he a king? My loyalty is to the Constitution. Tyrants like him dont deserve shit from me.

Yeah, cause there is definitely not a difference between loyalty and respect. Not one difference. :rolleyes:

Oh yeah, forgot he was a "tyrant" too. My bad....

Split66

10-04-12, 23:32

"I think we have stopped a lot of what needed stopping. And I hope we have once again reminded people that man is not free unless government is limited. There's a clear cause and effect here that is as neat and predictable as a law of physics: As government expands, liberty contracts."

Well Ron they forgot.

Can Romney really pull off a 21st century Reagan Revolution?

500grains

10-04-12, 23:46

I'm not saying that you can't disagree with our president and believe he is in the wrong, and that he does things you don't like. But for the love of God, quit making such asinine and immature comments and insults towards the man that was elected our President. His position deserves respect, despite whichever party or ideological affiliation you have.

I respect the office of the President.

I do not respect the usurper currently in that office.

crusader377

10-04-12, 23:53

He deserves respect as a person because he currently holds that position.

Respect is earned not automatically given due to position. Why should one respect an individual who is not only currently weakening America but more importantly putting our children into debt slavery?

Magic_Salad0892

10-05-12, 00:26

http://i40.photobucket.com/albums/e225/teehee321/283405_473418919357689_1399067744_n.jpg

That's hilarious.

Magic_Salad0892

10-05-12, 00:29

Honu

10-05-12, 01:09

He deserves respect as a person because he currently holds that position.

We salute the rank, not the man !

one of my fav scenes from Band of Brothers ;)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MTRZRRlA4sw

NWPilgrim

10-05-12, 04:39

He deserves respect as a person because he currently holds that position.

No. If he acted like a president then I would agree. If he talked of the American people with respect I would agree. But he does not.

He talks of some of the American people with great disrespect. With ridicule, scorn and condescension. He is an arrogant frat boy who was placed in the position of the president. He has no noteworthy accomplishment in his life EXCEPT the positions he has held/been given. Present and that is it.

What exactly has he done other than bludgeon Congress into passing Obamacare which 80% of the population did NOT want, and is doomed to fail and bring our country to its knees?

You may be his fanboy but he has made a mockery of the office of the president, and speaks of some Americans with contempt, and therefore does not deserve respect for holding it.

BTW, so far the folks I have encountered this year harping on the "respect the office" meme have all been liberals who talked of President George W. Bush in the most derogatory, outlandish and literally obscene manner. So it has been a very hypocritical charge from the people I have spoken with. I don't know if you treated George Bush with the same respect of office that you insist Barry the Usurper deserves. I however, never demanded GWB be treated with any more respect than I thought he deserved based on his character and how he acted in the office of the president, and I extend the same courtesy to Dear Leader.

montanadave

10-05-12, 04:43

No. If he acted like a president then I would agree. If he talked of the American people with respect I would agree. But he does not.

He talks of some of the American people with great disrespect. With ridicule, scorn and condescension. He is an arrogant frat boy who was placed in the position of the president. He has no noteworthy accomplishment in his life EXCEPT the positions he has held/been given. Present and that is it.

What exactly has he done other than bludgeon Congress into passing Obamacare which 80% of the population did NOT want, and is doomed to fail and bring our country to its knees?

You may be his fanboy but he has made a mockery of the position of the president, and speaks of some Americans with contempt, and therefore does not deserve respect for holding it.

I'm pretty sure the current conversation is about Obama, not W.

Try to keep up. :laugh:

NWPilgrim

10-05-12, 05:06

I'm pretty sure the current conversation is about Obama, not W.

Try to keep up. :laugh:

I'm pretty sure you are choking on your Obama button. How's your champ doing today? Kind of scary without the TOTUS huh? :p

montanadave

10-05-12, 05:56

I'm pretty sure you are choking on your Obama button. How's your champ doing today? Kind of scary without the TOTUS huh? :p

Easy now, just trying to inject a little levity into the discussion. :smile:

At this point, I don't have a dog in this fight.

GeorgiaBoy

10-05-12, 10:21

I'm not an Obama fanboy. Not in the least. But I still have respect for the man who is our President, regardless of my opinions of him.

maximus83

10-05-12, 11:42

I don't care if a president is gay, athiest, or if he even has a prison record, as long as he can properly run this country with respect to constitutional rights, putting this country in a better position, and without selling us out.

I do.
- Ideas have consequences
- Actions define character.
- Our founders, our Constitution, and 90% of our population accept the "self-evident" truth that a Creator exists. An atheist is free to think otherwise but is at odds with our entire tradition.

Denali

10-05-12, 12:50

I don't care if a president is gay, athiest, or if he even has a prison record, as long as he can properly run this country with respect to constitutional rights, putting this country in a better position, and without selling us out. I'd stand by him.

I care, homosexuals as a class are manipulators and often consumed with self-loathing, athiests are those who believe in nothing beyond their own self aggrandizement, while felons have been proven to be predatory opportunists....Not the best field to be picking candidates to lead you, and your children from!

500grains

10-05-12, 13:02

Act like a grown up or feel free to leave.

Voodoochild.

Magic_Salad0892

10-05-12, 13:13

I care, homosexuals as a class are manipulators and often consumed with self-loathing,

That's because most of them are liberals, not because they're gay.

athiests are those who believe in nothing beyond their own self aggrandizement,

Wow. Way to generalize, with no real evidence.

while felons have been proven to be predatory opportunists....Not the best field to be picking candidates to lead you, and your children from!

True. But if they can lead the country correctly, does it really matter? Nelson Mandella was a felon. But as far as I know, he's leading his country fine. (Not that I really know all that much about him, just what I hear.)

Magic_Salad0892

10-05-12, 13:15

Careful because Georgia Boy is a homo fan boy.

There is no need to throw insults. We're better than that.

montanadave

10-05-12, 13:30

There is no need to throw insults. We're better than that.

No, apparently not all of us are.

But at least "500grains" lends credence to the old adage "the best predictor of future performance is past performance" or, alternatively, "a leopard can't change it's spots."

Packman73

10-05-12, 13:32

"the best predictor of future performance is past performance" or, alternatively, "a leopard can't change it's spots."

Made me think of Obama...

Sensei

10-05-12, 17:10

Not hardly. Assume healthy growth of 5-7%. With us spending 50% over budget every year it takes near a decade of consistent healthy growth to just balance the budget. Not very likely.

For one thing our population would not stand for freezing the budget at just 50% over. We want more and the default has an automatic increase baked in.

I see two problems with your analysis. First, you seem to ignore that cuts are part of Romney's campaign platform and the GOP House budget proposals. Granted, these cuts are not of the scope proposed by RP or GJ, but those libertarian proposals are unrealistic (i.e. 46% DOD budget in 1 year) and likely to throw us back into a deep recession with all of the public unrest that you describe. I think that we should expect something similar to Cut, Cap, and Balance, or the Mack Penny Plan (http://www.conniemack.com/issues/penny-plan/) should Romney win and the GOP carry the legislature. Either plan would likely be sufficient to prevent a catastrophic collapse of our economy.

Second, you seem to think that a fiscal cliff is unavoidable or likely to happen in the next few years - not true. These meltdowns become a real threat when a country's public debt reaches ~120% of GDP. Well, the US has some time before we get there. Right now, our public debt is about $11.5T which is ~70% of GDP (there is another $4.5T in intra-gov holdings). In fact, we could balance the budget and have a functional government with our current debt for a long, long, time. There is no requirement that we pay off this debt in 20 or 30 years to avoid a meltdown. Realistically, our debt is something that will be addressed over several generations, and we will likely always carry some public debt (10-20% of GDP is reasonable).

What we really need is leadership that will begin to apply the brakes on public spending and reverse the course. However, it needs to be a gradual reversal if you do not want the peasants to storm the castle. Another 4 years of Obama's policies will add enough structural debt through Obamacare, entitlements, etc. that we will very likely hit that 120% ratio sometime around 2025.

Thus, there is hope for a return to fiscal sanity without the calamity that so many around here seem to forecast (sometimes a little too gleefully for my taste). However, we need to start now. That means electing Romney AND a conservative Congress that will send him a reasonable budget.

tb-av

10-05-12, 17:38

That means electing Romney AND a conservative Congress that will send him a reasonable budget.

...and beyond that ... which I think is an even more difficult task.... is to eliminate the career politicians, RINOs, and self serving from both parties while maintaining a strong core.

Honu

10-06-12, 05:26

I wonder what radical progressive Dems would think of JFK ?

might answer how far the left has gone to the true communist progressive side ! and its not about America but about destroying America and what it was for some strange communist Euro abomination ?

montanadave

10-06-12, 06:58

I wonder what radical progressive Dems would think of JFK ?

Probably about the same as the current crop of "radical" Republicans would think of Reagan or Nixon.

Extremists and idealogues of both parties are driving the bus, fueled by special interest groups and media pundits who delight in the partisan rancor and political paralysis thus engendered.

I would suggest that saner heads will prevail, but there seems to be a dearth of sanity at this particular moment in time.

GeorgiaBoy

10-06-12, 11:11

America and what it was for some strange communist Euro abomination ?

*Socialist

;)

Sensei

10-06-12, 11:23

Probably about the same as the current crop of "radical" Republicans would think of Reagan or Nixon.

Extremists and idealogues of both parties are driving the bus, fueled by special interest groups and media pundits who delight in the partisan rancor and political paralysis thus engendered.

I would suggest that saner heads will prevail, but there seems to be a dearth of sanity at this particular moment in time.

Uh, no. Romney is not from the extreme right wing of the GOP. He is a New England moderate. All of the extreme right wing candidates either crashed and burned in the primary or did not bother to run. In addition, Paul Ryan is also a moderate who consistently wins in a largely Democratic district.

On the other hand, Obama is from the extreme left wing. In case you doubt me, here are a couple of moderate Dems: John Warner, Evan Bayh, Jim Webb, etc. A good way to tell that they are moderates is when they refuse to be on the same stage as Obama on campaign stops. Hell, Webb is even leaving the Senate over all of the BS.

Safetyhit

10-06-12, 11:41

I wonder what radical progressive Dems would think of JFK ?

You mean the one who stated "Ask not what your country can do for you, but what you can do for your country"? Probably not much since the entire current liberal platform is based on the need for government to be doing more for "you".

maximus83

10-06-12, 11:42

Uh, no. Romney is not from the extreme right wing of the GOP. He is a New England moderate. All of the extreme right wing candidates either crashed and burned in the primary or did not bother to run.

This. There really ARE no "radical" Republicans in the public spotlight right now.

Sensei

10-06-12, 15:06

This. There really ARE no "radical" Republicans in the public spotlight right now.

Correct. But there are a few true conservatives that are getting some press. For example, Allen West has his share of press since he in a fight for his House seat. I guess that he is "radical" since he tells the truth and embarrasses many members of the left wing media. Jim DeMint is another who pisses off the left.

montanadave

10-06-12, 15:25

Apparently the definition of "moderate" versus "extreme" or "radical" has undergone some rather substantive revisions since I last looked it up.

But, hey, whatever gets you through the night.

Honu

10-06-12, 19:47

You mean the one who stated "Ask not what your country can do for you, but what you can do for your country"? Probably not much since the entire current liberal platform is based on the need for government to be doing more for "you".

YUP ;) if dems were like that today I would find it much easier choosing the better person ! rather than today choosing the lesser of two evils !!!

man how times have switched !!!

500grains

10-06-12, 23:12

Extremists and idealogues of both parties are driving the bus, fueled by special interest groups and media pundits who delight in the partisan rancor and political paralysis thus engendered.

Yeah, those guys who want to balance the budget, adhere to the Constitution, end the failed Great Society, and pay less in taxes are really radical. Oh yeah. :rolleyes:

The only people who think the Tea Party is radical are those suckling on the government tit.

Belmont31R

10-07-12, 17:29

Yeah, those guys who want to balance the budget, adhere to the Constitution, end the failed Great Society, and pay less in taxes are really radical. Oh yeah. :rolleyes:

The only people who think the Tea Party is radical are those suckling on the government tit.

I think its funny that libertarians are REALLY the extreme right on the American political scale (aside from anarchists) yet the Chrony Capitalists who take farm dollars and support NDAA/PA/DHS/Social Security/Medicare are labeled by the left as "extreme right". lol.

If THOSE people are extreme right then they have NO CLUE. It's redefining the opposition so even reforming entitlement spending like Clinton did is now the new extreme right. I love how the left tries to constantly redefine things to fit their ideology just like how Obama constantly says self reliance and individuality isn't how we built this country like the Founders were socialists and we just have this crazy notion work or go hungry is a new invention. LOL.

Sensei

10-08-12, 00:27

If THOSE people are extreme right then they have NO CLUE. It's redefining the opposition so even reforming entitlement spending like Clinton did is now the new extreme right.

I think that we reached that stage a long time ago. Have you noticed that the media is all up in arms over Romney wanting a voucher system for Medicare. Interestingly, this is the only proposal to salvage Medicare for future generations since the status quo will result in a collapse in about 20-25 years. Thus, Romney is right wing for supporting policies to salvage an entitlement, but Dems are moderate or left wing for supporting polices that will effectively end Medicare.

Now, don't get me wrong. I'd love to see Medicare, and especially Medicaid, go the way of the dinosaurs. However, I'd prefer a gradual phase out of Medicare so that a bunch of elderly don't suddenly have their ventilators turned off for lack of payment on the bill. Medicaid is another story. Feel free to end that at anytime, and I'll gladly take the paycut and pay more property taxes to cover the cost of the body removal services...

500grains

10-08-12, 09:15

RancidSumo

10-08-12, 10:49

Since when did "shoot all felons" seem rational to anyone? That's just ****ing stupid.

chadbag

10-08-12, 11:03

Ever social program that the government has ever implemented has been a complete disaster. People on public assistance commit the most felonies. It seems that the freedom from responsibility that public assistance provides allows the inner demons to manifest themselves.

Steps toward a rational nation:

2. Shoot all the felons.

Not that I agree with this, but I wanted to point out that this would only "work" if you got back to felonies being real felonies and the Common Law concept of "criminal intent" again being recognized as necessary for a crime to have taken place.

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