Trying to improve my deer rifle?

[sierra 223]

I have been out of the deer hunting/bolt action rifle scene for a long time.

From my teen age years I have a Remington .270 ADL with bright blue finish and wood stock.

Rifle has a cheap Bushnell 3x9 with cheap base and rings.

Thinking of upgrading to VXII Leupold and not sure which rings and base.

Also wondering about free floating barrel and/or bedding stock or changing to a Bell and Carson Carbonlite stock.

Rifle currently will shoot appox. 1.5 group prone resting on top of a cushioned railroad tie.

What are you guys thoughts on how much improvement this options would make on group size.

Thanks

[jbjh]

A new stock and almost any new glass will do wonders for you, if you have time behind the trigger. Your rifle is likely old enough to have been made at a tome when there was more drop at the heel to allow for iron sights. Newer guns are stocked for scopes.

But don't expect gear to make up for lack of practice.

[rdc0000]

You can fix the the wood stock. Remove the Remington bump in the front of the barrel channel and free float the barrel. Adjust the trigger to a safe setting that you like. Make sure the trigger is safe, those old ADL triggers are very good. Test shoot it. If you are still not satisfied with accuracy you or your smith can bed the action with expoy. I like Brownell's steel bed others prefer marine-tex.

Get a good quality scope and rings. I really like Burris Pro rings with the nylon inserts as you do not have to worry about stress being induced to the scope tube. It also allows you to use 2 piece bases with out issue. I use the weaver style but the dual dove tail rings are totally bullet proof for hunting.

I really like B&C carbolite stocks and have 3 on hunting rifles but, I feel they need the same work that you or your smith could do to your wooden ADL stock to include free floating and action bedding.

[ICANHITHIMMAN]

Whats your end game what do you want it able to do? ie. take a deer at what distance, look like something else etc?

[TomD]

You didn't specify ammo used but IMO, you're doing ok! First 'smithing I would do is have the barrel re-crowned. Do one thing at a time and you may find the sweet spot without spending quite as much money. Or, you could just get a Savage!

[TacMedic556]

I have been out of the deer hunting/bolt action rifle scene for a long time.

From my teen age years I have a Remington .270 ADL with bright blue finish and wood stock.

Rifle has a cheap Bushnell 3x9 with cheap base and rings.

Thinking of upgrading to VXII Leupold and not sure which rings and base.

Also wondering about free floating barrel and/or bedding stock or changing to a Bell and Carson Carbonlite stock.

Rifle currently will shoot appox. 1.5 group prone resting on top of a cushioned railroad tie.

What are you guys thoughts on how much improvement this options would make on group size.

Thanks


Bedding the action, free floating the barrel, and dropping it in a McMillan stock with an improved scope and a good load that you work out will surely enhance the performance of the rifle! Check out the custom work by BlackOps Precision. They did my dads gun and it is very nice. Sub MOA. He has done Sub .44" and .5" groups at 100 meters. Check it out:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=daTz5iZnC_E&feature=plcp

[tuck]

I ran into the same issue as you a few years ago. I have a Marlin MR-7 in .270 that was my first deer rifle. It would shoot around 1.5MOA with the original wood stock and el-cheapo simmons 3x9 scope and rings.

I ended up buying a replacement walnut stock which I free floated, added better rings and a Nikon scope. I also did some experimenting with ammo. The rifle is a solid MOA shooter now with 130gr Federal Power Shoks and shoots under 1 MOA pretty regularly with 140gr Hornady custom shop ammo.

[Watrdawg]

I had a Rem700 in 300 Win Mag and it shot pretty well. 1"-1.5" groups depending upon me doing my part. I decided I wanted a custom rifle and found Hill Country Rifles out of Texas. They had an accurzing package that was fairly inexpensive. When we started talking about barrels the cost wasn't that much extra. I ended up with a Lilja barrel, trued and bluprinted action, lugs squared, stock bedded and trigger work. They guaranteed 1/2" groups at 100 yards with factory ammo. It easily shoots that and at times I can shoot even tighter groups with factory Federal ammo. Hill Country does a great job!

[sierra 223]

Thanks for the replys, would love to get some moa groups.

I havent shot the rifle for over 20yrs, I got it as a teenager in the early 80's. Bought the cheap Bushnell Banner as a broke teenager.

The ammo that I shot recently were Remington Core Lokts and Winchester Power Points,shot point of aim with both. Groups were slightly tighter with Remington.

Need to get some Federal and some other types to try out next.

I feel pretty confident free floating the barrel, but not so much the bedding of stock.

Any suggestions on bases, rings and scope would be appreciated.
Not as many choices in gloss finish scopes to match my blueing.

I have a lot of time behind an AR but not much with the bolt action and scope.

[SkiDevil]

Thanks for the replys, would love to get some moa groups.

I havent shot the rifle for over 20yrs, I got it as a teenager in the early 80's. Bought the cheap Bushnell Banner as a broke teenager.

The ammo that I shot recently were Remington Core Lokts and Winchester Power Points,shot point of aim with both. Groups were slightly tighter with Remington.

Need to get some Federal and some other types to try out next.

I feel pretty confident free floating the barrel, but not so much the bedding of stock.

Any suggestions on bases, rings and scope would be appreciated.
Not as many choices in gloss finish scopes to match my blueing.

I have a lot of time behind an AR but not much with the bolt action and scope.

For scope rings; Talley, Warne, or Leupold.

They are all quality made. If you are looking to pick-up a new Leupold scope and want the rings to match the finish the same brand rings or Talley should work.

As for the additional work it may not be necessary. The older Remington rifles were very well made. I would mount your new scope and test fire in order to see what it can do before making any modifications. In my experience when dealing with a quality bolt gun the biggest challenge to shooting it accurately is the trigger. Having the trigger/ sear polished by a competent gunsmith or replacing it with a Timmey is the first modification that I would consider.

p.s. Consider purchasing several brands of ammo once it is sighted in because it may have a preference for a particular weight or bullet type. The .270 winchester is an accurate and versatile round.

[cdmiller]

This is going to be a long post as I'm currently in the process of rebuilding 2 Model 700s (the .243 I shot my first deer with and the .270 I got for my 12th birthday 31 years ago) and can offer several suggestions as to optics, bases and rings, stocks, and triggers based on experience with these and other rifles.

First, if the rifle has iron sights and you intend to use optics, remove the iron sights and fill the screw holes with filler screws made for that purpose. You can order these from Brownell's or MidwayUSA or just buy some from a local gunsmith/gun shop. I suggest you do this because it makes scope positioning much easier. You want to do this before trying out different loads as my .270's POI moved significantly when I removed the sights and one load that had grouped well before stopped grouping and started patterning. (.243's sights come off next year as I am hunting with it in the Texas Hill Country this year and still have another 1-2 deer to kill. :) )

Second, unless you want quick detachable rings, I would suggest the Talley Light Weight Scope Rings. These have the bottom ring and the scope base machined as one solid piece instead of two separate pieces. I have them on the .270 now and the .243 will get them after hunting season. They are more than strong enough for this application, are easy to install, are beautifully machined, and remove one more interface where a problem can occur. I have tried Weaver style bases, different Leupold mounts, etc. and have decided that for most hunting rifles, these are the best option (again barring a desire for quick detachable rings).

Third, scopes are subjective, and price is a guiding factor here as well, but I can offer three general guidelines for hunting scopes based on experience:

#1 - Buy the best quality class you can afford without being ridiculous. There is no reason to spend $2k on a scope for an average hunting rifle but $300-$700 is reasonable. I have never looked through a scope that cost much less than $300 in dawn or dusk light and been happy. Reticle choice and if you want illumination is entirely up to your preference. As to brands, in this price range you will have good luck with scopes from Leupold, Zeiss, Burris, Nikon, and Vortex based on my own personal experience. There may be others that perform well in this range but I have not personally used them.

#2 - Do NOT buy a scope with an objective larger than 45mm. You will start having trouble getting a good check weld to the stock on a regular hunting stock at the 44-45mm point and a good check weld is necessary for the shooter to acheive optimum accuracy. Also, a larger objective is really not necessary for just about any hunting you will do with a .270. All of my hunting rifles have scopes with objectives between 40mm and 44mm and I have no problems with having "enough light" to see well enough to make a legal shot.

#3 - Don't go overboard with high magnification scopes. I have one hunting rifle with a scope capable of magnification above 10x and it is intended for mule deer and pronghorn at longer range. Even then, a good 10x would be fine but I got a really good deal on it. :) My favorite hunting scopes are 2.5-10X but there a lot of good 3-9X scopes just because they are still the most popular deer scope. As such, some of the best prices can be found on these as well.

Fourth, I can offer some stock advice. Don't do anything until you have put the new scope and rings on the rifle as you may discover nothing is needed. If you think you can do better after mounting the new scope and shooting a lot, then try modifying the factory stock first. Remove the tip pressure "bump(s)" at the front of the barrel channel and rasp out the any raised areas throughout the barrel channel (some stocks only have the bump near the tip, others have it and a raised section near the action). Mask off the rest of the stock and give the barrel channel several light coatings of exterior grade spray polyurethane. Shoot it a lot more. If still not satisfied, look at composite stocks from Bell & Carlson, Hogue, etc that have an integral aluminum bedding block unless you want a wood stock. Then I suggest a gunsmith as I pay other people to bed wood stocks as I seem to have no knack for it. My .243 has had the barrel channel worked on as described and shoots 3/4-1" groups with ammo it likes if I do my part. The .270 will shoot just as well with an unmodified factory stock.

Finally, don't let anyone work on the factory trigger. The "took the rifle off safe and it fired" thing is not an urban myth with the original Model 700 trigger. I have personally seen it happen three times. Once was a brand new 7mm Magnum bought by a frind of one of my cousins about 25 years ago. In its first trip to the range, it fired the third time it was taken off safe. The other two times were with my father-in-law's .30-06. First time it happened was shortly after a gunsmith at a Remington authorized repair facility adjusted the trigger to make it lighter than the 6.5 lbs that it shipped with from the factory. It went to Remington for "repair" and came back with a 5.5 lbs trigger. Earlier this year it did it again. It went back to Remington and returned with the new X-Mark Pro trigger that is on the new production rifle set at 3.75 lbs. Great trigger. I was going to buy Timney, Jewell or Rifle Basix triggers for my two rifles. Now I just have a deal with a local gunsmith to buy the next two X-Mark Pro triggers he pulls off new rifles because someone wants a "better" trigger. Don't get me wrong, I have an expensive trigger on my precision bolt gun but I don't see any real advantage over the X-Mark Pro for hunting applications.

Just my .02. YMMV

[AKDoug]

Put a better scope on it and try several types of ammo. You rifle will likely have a favorite one. Frankly, a consistent 1.5moa rifle is more than enough for hunting deer out to 300 yards.

My Remington 700 is the ONLY rifle I own that needed that pressure point at the front of the stock. I fitted it to a new composite stock, glass beaded it, and free floated it. Wouldn't shoot for crap. Went from a 1.25moa rifle to a 3 moa rifle. Put a blob of bedding compound right at the end of the stock and presto..back where it was before. No, the composite stock really didn't shoot better than the original stock.

[ST911]

If it is shooting well, leave the base gun alone. Upgrade your optic, base and rings. Experiment with ammo types, looking particularly at the Hornady SuperPerformance line, as well the Black Hills Gold.

[mark5pt56]

The VX line in 2-12 would be a great choice along with some Lightweight Talley's

http://www.riflescopes.webyshops.com/Brands/Leupold-VX-6-Rifle-Scopes

http://www.talleymanufacturing.com/cgi-bin/public_controller.cgi?view=products&category_recnum=6

[sierra 223]

Thanks for the help guys, The light weight Talleys sound like a good idea to me.