View Full Version : AUG's in Syria
Looks like some of the Syrian Rebels are using AUG's.... wonder where they were sourced from?
http://www.trbimg.com/img-50c2821b/turbine/la-afp-getty-515842656.jpg-20121207/600
From an article on US non-involvement in Syria (http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/world/la-fg-us-syria-20121208,0,5305035.story)
They are probably from the CIA
Failure2Stop
12-08-12, 08:41
They are probably from the CIA
:rolleyes:
Typos brought to you via Tapatalk and autocorrect.
Mr.Anderson
12-08-12, 11:32
:rolleyes:
Typos brought to you via Tapatalk and autocorrect.
So...
The US Gov ISN'T funding "Al Qaeda" in Syria?
One link: http://www.thenewamerican.com/world-news/asia/item/12802-us-funded-jihadist-%E2%80%9Choly-war%E2%80%9D-in-syria-seeks-sharia-dictatorship
However, I suppose you're right. With the ability to open flaunt the crap the US Gov. is doing to the Am. People and around the world, the CIA doesn't have to do as many secret deals.
Sorry, I don't drink the Gov. Kool Aid any more.
I believe that banking institutions are more dangerous to our liberties than standing armies. If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue of their currency, first by inflation, then by deflation, the banks and corporations that will grow up around [the banks] will deprive the people of all property until their children wake-up homeless on the continent their fathers conquered. The issuing power should be taken from the banks and restored to the people, to whom it properly belongs.
And it's "these types" that run the US Gov.
I'm not tryin to be a jerk. This is my .02
Just tryin to get through to people with good hearts that have just been blinded by the flag and service to "Country", just like I used to be.
MadAngler1
12-08-12, 15:23
Saudi Arabia is a known user of the AUG and previously used the FAL. Hence, I would venture to guess that Saudi Arabia or Qatar are providing the Sunni Muslim Wahhabist rebels the weapons. While Qatar does not use the AUG, they have provided millions in funds to the Sunni rebels to overthrow Assad.
Wikipedia lists only Saudi Arabia and Oman as users in the Middle East: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steyr_AUG#Steyr_AUG_clones
This link asserts backs up this claim, that Saudi Arabia is providing the AUGs: http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=d89_1345609305&comments=1
Found this article off a link from Wikipedia: http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2012/aug/09/syria-bashar-al-assad . They claim that still most of the weapons being used are captured Soviet stuff from existing Syrian stockpiles. Logistics and spare ammo, fuel are a huge problem.
Another Guardian article about Saudi Arabia funding the rebels: http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2012/jun/22/saudi-arabia-syria-rebel-army
Here's a pro-Syrian government website bitching about finding Austrian AUGs and Swiss made hand grenades in rebel hands: http://www.syrianews.cc/terrorists-in-syria-use-steyr-aug-rifles/
Regardless, I think it's a good guess that the guns came from Saudi Arabia. Both Saudi Arabia and Qatar are openly funding the rebels, since they are not fans of Assad's pro-Iran/pro-Shite Muslim/somewhat Christian friendly regime. Believe it or not, Christians back the Assad, because his regime is tolerant of their existence. They fear retribution and death if the Wahhabists gain power.
As an aside, I hope the hell that the US State Dept has paid attention to the consequences of our financial assistance to "liberate" Egypt and Libya from Mubarak and Gaddafi. We now have in their place pro-Islamist regimes, namely the Muslim Brotherhood in Egypt and a potpourri of Islamist rebel groups in Libya. The same thing will happen in Syria if these Wahhabist Sunni rebels win. There will be a huge flight of Orthodox Christians from Syria into Lebanon or Turkey. As much as I hate all these dictators, what is replacing them is far worse. I wish the US would stay out of it.
Draufganger
12-08-12, 16:00
Was about to say that the AUG's for the terrorists are most likely from nowhere else, than Saudi Arabia, but MadAngler1 got it covered pretty well...
Littlelebowski
12-08-12, 16:53
Saudi Arabia is a known user of the AUG and previously used the FAL. Hence, I would venture to guess that Saudi Arabia or Qatar are providing the Sunni Muslim Wahhabist rebels the weapons. While Qatar does not use the AUG, they have provided millions in funds to the Sunni rebels to overthrow Assad.
Wikipedia lists only Saudi Arabia and Oman as users in the Middle East: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steyr_AUG#Steyr_AUG_clones
This link asserts backs up this claim, that Saudi Arabia is providing the AUGs: http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=d89_1345609305&comments=1
Found this article off a link from Wikipedia: http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2012/aug/09/syria-bashar-al-assad . They claim that still most of the weapons being used are captured Soviet stuff from existing Syrian stockpiles. Logistics and spare ammo, fuel are a huge problem.
Another Guardian article about Saudi Arabia funding the rebels: http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2012/jun/22/saudi-arabia-syria-rebel-army
Here's a pro-Syrian government website bitching about finding Austrian AUGs and Swiss made hand grenades in rebel hands: http://www.syrianews.cc/terrorists-in-syria-use-steyr-aug-rifles/
Regardless, I think it's a good guess that the guns came from Saudi Arabia. Both Saudi Arabia and Qatar are openly funding the rebels, since they are not fans of Assad's pro-Iran/pro-Shite Muslim/somewhat Christian friendly regime. Believe it or not, Christians back the Assad, because his regime is tolerant of their existence. They fear retribution and death if the Wahhabists gain power.
As an aside, I hope the hell that the US State Dept has paid attention to the consequences of our financial assistance to "liberate" Egypt and Libya from Mubarak and Gaddafi. We now have in their place pro-Islamist regimes, namely the Muslim Brotherhood in Egypt and a potpourri of Islamist rebel groups in Libya. The same thing will happen in Syria if these Wahhabist Sunni rebels win. There will be a huge flight of Orthodox Christians from Syria into Lebanon or Turkey. As much as I hate all these dictators, what is replacing them is far worse. I wish the US would stay out of it.
Great post.
Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk 2
The whole Bengazi affair exposed that the CIA was sending weapons to the rebels. We are probably paying for Saudi's to give the AUG's to the rebels.
As an aside, I hope the hell that the US State Dept has paid attention to the consequences of our financial assistance to "liberate" Egypt and Libya from Mubarak and Gaddafi. We now have in their place pro-Islamist regimes, namely the Muslim Brotherhood in Egypt and a potpourri of Islamist rebel groups in Libya. The same thing will happen in Syria if these Wahhabist Sunni rebels win. There will be a huge flight of Orthodox Christians from Syria into Lebanon or Turkey. As much as I hate all these dictators, what is replacing them is far worse. I wish the US would stay out of it.
And I was half expecting a passionate & detailed analysis of the flash hider from the AUG experts on the site.
Excellent analysis!
Looks like a standard AUG duck bill.
At first glance, it seems that the arming the Syrian rebels with Steyr AUGs is an odd choice.
Given the fact that the rebels would have limited knowledge of the AUG weapon system (training and maintenance), you would have thought the Saudis would have supplied the rebels with Aks. The AK would be the logical choice since the rebels already have sizable quantities in their hands and because AUG mags and ammo isn't compatible with the AK.
Over the short run, maintenance would not likely be an issue (assuming that the AUGs are new or well maintained from Saudi armories) and the rebels will figure out the best employment of their new AUGs with the built-in optics. Still, mags and ammo availability will be the AUG's achilles heal.
Why would the rebels want their logistical system complicated with the AUG?
Just wondering what our friends are up to.....
Syrian rebels
Why would the rebels want their logistical system complicated with the AUG?
Just a guess, but if I was the Saudi gov., I would send some SF in along with the guns as "trainers".
You're probably right about the SF trainers, but it still doesn't answer the question of why send the rebels AUGs rather than AKs....
You're probably right about the SF trainers, but it still doesn't answer the question of why send the rebels AUGs rather than AKs....
Can you tell the difference between a Saudi SF and a rebel?
I can't.
Can you tell the difference between a Saudi SF and a rebel?
I can't.
Generally they look a bit different than the native syrians, darker and different features. Why we allow a state that funds terrorism to run rampant is beyond me, we've been coddling the gulf arabs for decades and they've been our biggest problem, and say what you want about iran/north korea whoever, but the last time it was saudis who slammed planes into civilians here; I feel like we have our eyes in the complete wrong direction.
Generally they look a bit different than the native syrians, darker and different features. Why we allow a state that funds terrorism to run rampant is beyond me, we've been coddling the gulf arabs for decades and they've been our biggest problem, and say what you want about iran/north korea whoever, but the last time it was saudis who slammed planes into civilians here; I feel like we have our eyes in the complete wrong direction.
Is the guy carrying the kid Syrian? Are you sure?
Can you tell the difference between a Saudi SF and a rebel?
I can't.
Once again you're correct, I could not tell the difference between a Syrian rebel and a Saudi SF type.
However, I think that there is a huge leap for the Saudi's from providing financial and material support to active Saudi SF involvement within Syria.
Could it be that the Saudis are training and equipping a Syrian rebel SOF with AUGs?
Or, could the Saudis be looking at a post conflict scenario where quantities of AUGs are on hand but of limited worth/value due to the lack of maintenance and compatible mags and ammo?
In any case, this all waaaaay above my pay grade!
Once again you're correct, I could not tell the difference between a Syrian rebel and a Saudi SF type.
However, I think that there is a huge leap for the Saudi's from providing financial and material support to active Saudi SF involvement within Syria.
Could it be that the Saudis are training and equipping a Syrian rebel SOF with AUGs?
Or, could the Saudis be looking at a post conflict scenario where quantities of AUGs are on hand but of limited worth/value due to the lack of maintenance and compatible mags and ammo?
In any case, this all waaaaay above my pay grade!
I am not trying to convince you. I am just adding reasonable doubt to the situation.
To continue my process, I remember seeing some pictures from another conflict just a few years ago. They looked like someone had raided a private collection. There were no two alike. I have no idea where this one rifle came from. As far as I know it came from a private collection in the USA by someone who was a dual citizen.
Is the guy carrying the kid Syrian? Are you sure?
Not necessarily syrian, but I'd place good money on it that he isn't a gulf arab. Also, from my thankfully limited interactions with saudi royal guards, my guess is that no branch of the saudi military would be very effective at dealing with anything other than unarmed civilians. One of these guys "lost" a gun and then said "don't worry I'll buy you a new one" in response :lol:
ETA: I think their involvement is financial and perhaps in the form of irregulars like whatever alqaedaesque group they are funding now. They are DEFINITELY fighting against US interests imho.
MadAngler1
12-09-12, 20:20
At first glance, it seems that the arming the Syrian rebels with Steyr AUGs is an odd choice.
Given the fact that the rebels would have limited knowledge of the AUG weapon system (training and maintenance), you would have thought the Saudis would have supplied the rebels with Aks. The AK would be the logical choice since the rebels already have sizable quantities in their hands and because AUG mags and ammo isn't compatible with the AK.
Thanks for the kind words guys.
I'd like to second this comment by gsxr-fan. It makes no sense to ship 5.56 NATO chambered AUGs to Syrian rebels who are more familiar with 7.62x39 AKs and other Russian equipment. Perhaps the Saudis sent people to train them on the platform in an "adviser" role (which of course is pure speculation). I'm sure the Saudis could get their hands on as many AKs as they wanted, but I guess they don't feel the need for it or lack the brains to think about the logistics of arming a rebel group with a bull pup rifle chambered in a NATO caliber vs. the Russian stuff that is ubiquitous throughout the country. I doubt there is any sinister/covert intention here on the part of the Saudis. There is after all, a reason they wanted the US to drive out Saddam out of Kuwait in Gulf War I, as they don't trust the performance of their own well armed military force. It takes more to fight than just owning the best American/European arms that oil money can buy.
If I read the situation correctly, the beleaguered and numerically inferior rebel forces are facing a numerically superior and better equipped government forces.
Given that situation, it may well be that our friends the Saudis, may simply want to put a modern combat rifle w/optics into the hands of the rebels. And since they have a ton of money, logistical issues be damned!
Just my .02
Just because one is in the picture doesn't mean that they are in Syria in any large numbers or were sent to Syria in any large numbers.
AUGs are also in service with Morocco and Oman. I wouldn't be surprised if some of them made their way to Syria through whatever channels. Saudi Arabia may have had some spare ones laying around that they sent, or someone there sent through whatever channels.
I agree that a 7.62x39 gun would have made more sense from the logistic standpoint. But in this case it may have been a matter of whoever sent it to the Syrian rebels sending it because they had a spare gun or guns available to ship there. Hell, it could have come off the black market in Lebanon. I have a friend who lives there who reports all types of things on their black market, including Sig 550s.
If I read the situation correctly, the beleaguered and numerically inferior rebel forces are facing a numerically superior and better equipped government forces.
Given that situation, it may well be that our friends the Saudis, may simply want to put a modern combat rifle w/optics into the hands of the rebels. And since they have a ton of money, logistical issues be damned!
Just my .02
Didn't realize that funding global terrorism and attacking our country made them our friends, but fyi you are talking about 80% of the population against about 20%, so the rebels in theory dramatically outnumber the assad guys, air power and superior organization are the primary disparities that assad can exploit right now that I see, but it's just a matter of time until a new and probably much worse situation develops there after their current dictator is toppled and a new one installed.
Didn't realize that funding global terrorism and attacking our country made them our friends, .
Your argument is like saying that ALL of America is anti-muslem because we allow the idiot to make films against Islam, and we allow the KKK to exist.
The portion of Saudi's who are Anti-American are small compared to the Saudi's who either don't care or who have helped with Iraq and other issues in the middle east.
For the most part they are the moderate muslems. They are not the kind where you are either Muslem or I keeel you.
The mag does not even look loaded, and if it is there are not many rounds in it.
Also if you look where the charging handle is, that gun has a lot of ware on it.
I would not be surprised if the Saudi's are giving them their old worn out AUG with a few rounds a piece, knowing they will soon be paper weights. This kind of keeps every one happy.
Your argument is like saying that ALL of America is anti-muslem because we allow the idiot to make films against Islam, and we allow the KKK to exist.
The portion of Saudi's who are Anti-American are small compared to the Saudi's who either don't care or who have helped with Iraq and other issues in the middle east.
For the most part they are the moderate muslems. They are not the kind where you are either Muslem or I keeel you.
This is the exact opposite of what I have personally witnessed. We are making the boogeyman out of the wrong countries and ignoring the biggest threats.
ETA: They are by far the most extreme sect of Islam, read up on Wahabism, that's what Osama was and what the Saudi royals are. I hesitate to even call it the same religion, they are like the Muslim equivalent of what Timothy McVeigh was to Christians if this gives you an idea of how nuts and violent they are, not to mention they a brutally oppressive, freedom hating dictatorship that stands for the exact opposite of a free and open democracy. For all the talk about the Muslim brotherhood they are like the teletubbies compared to these thugs we for some reason call allies after they murdered thousands of Americans.
threeheadeddog
12-11-12, 18:17
For some reason I fail to see this AUG pic as anything more than someone grabbing the "coolest" option.
Lets face it if something were to happen in this country and your average joe walked into armory trying to "kit-up" for rebellion, he would take a "6.8 ACR" over any practical AR/M4 variant because everyone knows how cool the "6.8 ACR" is and that it makes anyone who uses one cool too. The logistics wouldnt even enter into his mind, just the fact that everyone else is using an AR/M4 and he has the "better" gun.
BTW, in case anyone notices I am absolutely tired of walking into gun stores honestly looking at firearms for purchase only to have some 18-24 year old who lives in his parents basement take up all the salesmans time asking him why they dont have any 6.8 ACR's because that is what Delta uses and he knows this because he plays Call of Duty Modern Warfare. I swear this happened to me at 2 different stores within a very short period of time.
Over the short run, maintenance would not likely be an issue (assuming that the AUGs are new or well maintained from Saudi armories)
LMAO!! Have you ever been to that part of the world? Nothing is maintained. The Arabs just use equipment until it stops working. That goes for everything from an MP5 to F-15's. When it breaks, it must be the will of Allah.... This is less of an issue for the Saudis as they have more money than Allah. It's just one more example of their pathetic, never went through an enlightenment period culture.
KalashniKEV
12-11-12, 18:31
This is the exact opposite of what I have personally witnessed. We are making the boogeyman out of the wrong countries and ignoring the biggest threats.
I definitely don't want to sidetrack the AUG talk, but I do want to second this.
We only fight against those who share our values, we do the bidding of our enemies- and Saudi Arabia is by far the most backward country on the face of the planet today.
The soft-handed Gulf Monarchs have been puppet mastering, funding worldwide terror, manipulating outcomes, and enforcing their will/ "foreign policy goals" for many, many years.
"The biggest arms deal in history" with Saudi Arabia ($30B) should have been us slamming the crap out of them until they decide to make a change in the way they do business- and the funny part is they don't do fighting so it wouldn't even be necessary.
All it would take to change them is for us to tell them it's all over and to start negotiating the terms of their surrender.
But instead of attacking the root of the problem, we continue to do their bidding by making war with the pants-wearing, beer-drinking, basketball-league-having countries of the region.
...just like we did when we prevented Sadaam from bringing in new management under the banner of Ba'athist Socialism.
But yes, back to the AUG talk. I'm sure the guns didn't just show up in a box with a bow. They most likely were accompanied by trainers who were probably not Saudi.
Think more like transnational jihadis from Bangladesh, Britain, Chechnya and Pakistan- with, believe it or not, English as their common language.
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/07/28/world/middleeast/jeroen-oerlemans-john-cantile-two-journalists-freed-by-islamic-fighters-in-syria-after-weeklong-ordeal.html
Gulf Arabs don't get their hands dirty when they can just pay someone else to do the work for them.
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