View Full Version : Let's start a list to remember who screwed us over when the chips were down
The Dumb Gun Collector
12-22-12, 07:59
Let's start a list to remember who screwed us over when the chips were down. I am not talking about people that have always hated us, like the Media or Bloomberg, I mean people who have taken our money for years but are now throwing us under the bus. I don't really care if you laid low and didn't comment. I want folks who took action to show that they were siding with the anti-gun crowd.
1. DICK'S SPORTING GOODS (Suspending sales of Semi-Autos)
2. CHEAPER THAN DIRT (Suspending online sales of firearms)
3. Cerberus /Freedom Group (which includes Remington, Bushmaster, etc) for immediately selling out. Whoever buys those companies gets a pass for freeing them from the douchebags at Cerberus who have no problem taking our money during the good times.
I don't personally have a problem with jacking up prices. Only a fool sells something for less than it is worth. But remember the companies who don't value their long term customers.
Who else?
Dos Cylindros
12-22-12, 08:59
Neither will ever get another penny from me.
Let's start a list to remember who screwed us over when the chips were down. I am not talking about people that have always hated us, like the Media or Bloomberg, I mean people who have taken our money for years but are now throwing us under the bus. I don't really care if you laid low and didn't comment. I want folks who took action to show that they were siding with the anti-gun crowd.
1. DICK'S SPORTING GOODS (Suspending sales of Semi-Autos)
2. CHEAPER THAN DIRT (Suspending online sales of firearms)
Who else?
Tactical Arms Mfg (http://www.charlotteobserver.com/2012/12/18/3734372/gun-makers-fret-as-gun-control.html#storylink=cpy)
Tactical Arms Mfg (http://www.charlotteobserver.com/2012/12/18/3734372/gun-makers-fret-as-gun-control.html#storylink=cpy)
Our sole business being the assault rifle, it is a concern that it will literally put us out of business,” said Ken Rinkor, vice president of Tactical Arms Manufacturer Inc. in Huntersville, N.C. “That is not for us to determine. If the general public decides to vote the way of banning assault rifles, then they can certainly do so, and we don’t have an opinion on how it will affect us.”
The family-owned company near Charlotte is a specialty manufacturer of AR-15’s, advertising on its website that “the same AR15 M4 used by the U.S. Army can be your home defense weapon of choice.” The company sells mostly to law enforcement personnel, Rinkor said.
While he feared a ban on rifles, Rinkor supported calls for a ban on sales to the public of high-capacity magazines, which may be used on his AR-15’s or those made by other manufacturers.
“Frankly, I think there’s no need for anybody to have such . . . magazines, 20 or 30 rounds. It makes no sense at all to have that large of a magazine, even for personal protection,” he said.
Read more here: http://www.charlotteobserver.com/2012/12/18/3734372/gun-makers-fret-as-gun-control.html#storylink=cpy#storylink=cpy
Wow. What an ass.
AJC Outdoors century ak47 for 900 wtf?
Scottryan BCG's from 210 to 425 WTF :haha: J/k Scott
Before anyone says Walmart, my local one doesn't have ar15s on the shelf because they're sold out and there is a months long waiting list, not because they pulled them due to the shooting.
Wouldn't BM be on the list? That a product they product could be used to ill effect seems to have come as a shock to them and the parent company put BM up for sale no?
I was about to pull the trigger on two DDM4v1 rifles at Rainer, I waited too long and the price went up $200 or so the other day. I went to complain on their forum at arfcom and saw there was already a thread there on it.
They're pretty much in my shit list now.
Jeff Dillard, from National Armory in Pompano Beach wants all private gun sales stopped, especially over the internet.
http://www.nbcmiami.com/video/#!/on-air/as-seen-on/Sales-Have-Soared-at-Pompano-Beach-Gun-Store--Owner/183890721
Please take a moment out of your day and express your opinion on his thoughts.
http://nationalarmory.info/
(954) 915-8226
cossetty@mynational.com
Tactical Arms Mfg (http://www.charlotteobserver.com/2012/12/18/3734372/gun-makers-fret-as-gun-control.html#storylink=cpy)
This is BS and an example of false media reporting. I live in Charlotte and never heard of this company. They claim to sell to LE, but I've never heard of an agency using their product. I addition, their website looks like something a 6th grader created. I'd try to drive by their store, but their is no address listed on their website. I've called the phone number listed on their website which has a NY prefix and a Hispanic lady picked-up the line and then hung-up.
I'll contact the Observer ombudsman to file a complaint. However, I doubt that it will help since they are a lefty publication.
Edit Update:
Here is the email that I sent to the Charlotte Observer Ombudsman:
Dear Sir:
I'm writing to inform you of inaccuracies in your story, "Gun makers fret as gun control consensus gains steam" that was posted on 12/18/12 and can be found here:
http://www.charlotteobserver.com/2012/12/18/3734372/gun-makers-fret-as-gun-control.html#storylink=cpy#storylink=cpy
In this story, you cite Tactical Arms Manufacturer Inc. in Huntersville, NC as a company that produces assault style weapons, but also favors tougher gun laws. On further review, I am unable to verify the actual existence of this company. First, their website appears to be a shell created by a novice scam artist. In addition, there is no mailing or physical address listed on their website. The provided phone number on their website has a NY area code, and appears to connect to a residence. Finally, I've been in the military and worked around the M4/AR15 series of weapons for over 15 years and I never once heard of this company or their supposed VP, Mr. Ken Rinkor, whose existence also cannot be verified.
Thus, it appears that your writer did not do his due diligence in vetting (or factiously creating) this source. Please contact me or issue a correction for this story that appears to contain false and misleading information.
Sincerely,
XXX
Outlander Systems
12-22-12, 15:15
Dick's...
...Can suck mine.
I hate that place anyway. I remember when they bought Galyans, the first thing they did was get rid of handguns.
I bought a Ruger Vaquero from Galyans when I was 21. Dick's can blow me.
They got their last penny from me, I can PROMISE you that. There's a REI across the street, True Wilderness about three miles from the Dick's by me, and GoingGear is about 10 minutes down the road. If I need a gun, there's mom 'n pop shops and Grant.
All others can burn.
I was about to pull the trigger on two DDM4v1 rifles at Rainer, I waited too long and the price went up $200 or so the other day. I went to complain on their forum at arfcom and saw there was already a thread there on it.
They're pretty much in my shit list now.
I don't like price gouging, but I don't know that I can blame companies for it, especially all but the biggest names. Even still, $200 for a DD isn't a huge increase considering their prices are already pretty low IIRC.
I don't like price gouging, but I don't know that I can blame companies for it, especially all but the biggest names. Even still, $200 for a DD isn't a huge increase considering their prices are already pretty low IIRC.
Yep, there may come a time when people wish they payed that $200 markup.
I still remember everyone saying they were gonna buy a Steyr AUG and HK94 when prices settled down below $700. I remember because I was one of them, still waiting.
Finally got my AUG at $950 and my first 94 at $1250 when it became obvious prices were only headed in one direction.
The only time prices have actually DROPPED was immediately following the sunset and even there prices didn't really drop (people with prebans still wanted pre94 prices for their blue and green label Colts) so much as new production rifles became available at non ban prices.
The only other time was about 18 months after the 2008 panic buy when people realized they couldn't get $2000 for the Colt 6920 rifle they bought for $1400 and the economy started crushing people and the huge glut of product began to sell at "cash me out" prices.
Wish I had the spare cash to start stacking up inventory in 2010/2011 when NOTHING was selling because I knew this day was coming eventually. But like most folks I was pretty strapped for cash and the only things I was buying were those I had to buy.
Just hope nothing becomes of the "threats of a ban" and I have one more chance to grab a couple of things.
JBecker 72
12-22-12, 17:17
I would love to add a 94 to my collection. My father gave me his 91 recently and its my favorite rifle I never shoot. It means a lot to me.
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Reagans Rascals
12-22-12, 17:21
I don't like price gouging, but I don't know that I can blame companies for it, especially all but the biggest names. Even still, $200 for a DD isn't a huge increase considering their prices are already pretty low IIRC.
Why is it illegal for a gas station to up the price to over $10 a gallon during times of natural disaster such as hurricane or blackout?
or scalping tickets....
its all bullshit either way...
price gouging is price gouging...
JBecker 72
12-22-12, 17:34
Dick's...
...Can suck mine.
I hate that place anyway. I remember when they bought Galyans, the first thing they did was get rid of handguns.
I bought a Ruger Vaquero from Galyans when I was 21. Dick's can blow me.
They got their last penny from me, I can PROMISE you that. There's a REI across the street, True Wilderness about three miles from the Dick's by me, and GoingGear is about 10 minutes down the road. If I need a gun, there's mom 'n pop shops and Grant.
All others can burn.
I miss Galyans. That store was so cool. I used to love the two story rock wall they had.
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The Dumb Gun Collector
12-22-12, 17:52
or scalping tickets....
its all bullshit either way...
price gouging is price gouging...
The laws against price-gouging are a bad idea in all scenarios. The reason there aren't truckloads of private suppliers rolling into hurricanes and floods with generators, food and gas is because they will be arrested if they are charging a premium. There may be momentary spikes but the market is much better at pricing scarce items than politicians.
While he feared a ban on rifles, Rinkor supported calls for a ban on sales to the public of high-capacity magazines, which may be used on his AR-15’s or those made by other manufacturers.
“Frankly, I think there’s no need for anybody to have such . . . magazines, 20 or 30 rounds. It makes no sense at all to have that large of a magazine, even for personal protection,” he said.
Read more here: http://www.charlotteobserver.com/201...#storylink=cpy
I own dozens of 30-round magazines, I don't hunt with them, I don't rely on them for protection from criminals, I use a shotgun for that purpose, nope, I have an AR(Colt)with dozens of 30-round magazines to protect me from the government, and its thugs!
The 2nd's not about hunting, collecting guns, or militia service, it was solely crafted to protect us from thugs in government, such as those marxist/leninists who are solely responsible for the malignant degeneration of my once proud society....
Why is it illegal for a gas station to up the price to over $10 a gallon during times of natural disaster such as hurricane or blackout?
or scalping tickets....
its all bullshit either way...
price gouging is price gouging...
I agree completely.
If you spot a company selling $60 magazines, $3000 AR's, $1200 BCG's, etc they should go on this list.
It's a fine line, if you're honest. There are plenty of scenarios where this is all the inventory that's available and in a NATURAL and FREE market, the price goes up when demand rises above supply. Not to mention, once the current inventory is sold out, and until distributors actually get new inventory from manufacturers, these local shops might as well close up and find a new day job to pay the bills until they receive inventory and have items to sell again. Maybe we could think about that reality instead of just about ourselves.
Why is it illegal for a gas station to up the price to over $10 a gallon during times of natural disaster such as hurricane or blackout?
or scalping tickets....
its all bullshit either way...
price gouging is price gouging...
Because of stupid libs messing with the free market and enacting too much regulation.
America is based on capitalism and the free market. The market is based on supply and demand, prices fluctuating accordingly.
It's pretty un American to complain that when supply is low and demand is high that prices follow suit. This is capitalism, the point is to make money! If people don't pay your prices, drop them until you find buyers... That's what CTD did regarding pmags at least. I don't agree with CTD suspending sales.
Or maybe it's very American to complain when instead of making money, you're on the receiving end of raised prices due to increased demand and virtually no supply?
The Dumb Gun Collector
12-23-12, 01:26
And on top of that, letting the market set the prices helps keep the items on the market. Last Saturday there were 2 Scar 17s on gunboker (or maybe 4). Now there are tons listed at ripoff prices. You don't have to buy them, but they are available. If they were all available at $2499 they would all be gone right now.
SeriousStudent
12-24-12, 00:08
You can make of this what you will. I had BBQ with some friends tonight. Their next door neighbor bought his first AR today.
http://noveskerifleworks.com/cgi-bin/imcart/display.cgi?item_id=16-300&cat=193&page=1&search=&since=&status=&title=
Noveske 16" complete rifle in 300 Blackout, with the stainless steel barrel.
It did come with the PMag, fire pig sticker and ball cap. It also had a $4000 price tag. Retail on Noveske's website is $2450. And he paid tax on top of the four grand, of course. For those of you bad at math, that's a $1550 markup. Enough to buy a Colt 6920 and an Aimpoint Pro a month ago.
He got it at Cheaper Than Dirt. No urban legend, I handled the rifle and talked to the man personally.
It was a very, very nice ballcap, though. Beautiful rifle, they build great stuff in Oregon. I just wish he'd listened to us earlier in the year.
Prices can and should necessarily go up with demand - only in cases where people are asking over 200% of the MSRP do I even consider it gouging. Even then - if people are dumb enough to pay that price, let them. Either you're for the concept of a free market where mutual transactions are voluntarily entered into by both parties as the basis of trade or you're not.
it still amazes me the folks that talk about getting a AR for sometime and then take the plunge during the panic buying and spending 3 times what it would have cost them just a month earlier :suicide:
I was about to pull the trigger on two DDM4v1 rifles at Rainer, I waited too long and the price went up $200 or so the other day. I went to complain on their forum at arfcom and saw there was already a thread there on it.
They're pretty much in my shit list now.
That's not an bad mark up in my opinion. Why wait and then bitch when prices go up.
You can make of this what you will. I had BBQ with some friends tonight. Their next door neighbor bought his first AR today.
http://noveskerifleworks.com/cgi-bin/imcart/display.cgi?item_id=16-300&cat=193&page=1&search=&since=&status=&title=
Noveske 16" complete rifle in 300 Blackout, with the stainless steel barrel.
It did come with the PMag, fire pig sticker and ball cap. It also had a $4000 price tag. Retail on Noveske's website is $2450. And he paid tax on top of the four grand, of course. For those of you bad at math, that's a $1550 markup. Enough to buy a Colt 6920 and an Aimpoint Pro a month ago.
He got it at Cheaper Than Dirt. No urban legend, I handled the rifle and talked to the man personally.
It was a very, very nice ballcap, though. Beautiful rifle, they build great stuff in Oregon. I just wish he'd listened to us earlier in the year.
That's screwed up.
Jeff Dillard, from National Armory in Pompano Beach wants all private gun sales stopped, especially over the internet.
http://www.nbcmiami.com/video/#!/on-air/as-seen-on/Sales-Have-Soared-at-Pompano-Beach-Gun-Store--Owner/183890721
Please take a moment out of your day and express your opinion on his thoughts.
http://nationalarmory.info/
(954) 915-8226
cossetty@mynational.com
Pathetic. That place is a train wreck. That bald guy with glasses in the video is a tool. He introduces himself as "Mike, the trainer" at that store. He was showing a friend of mine a G19 and an M&P9. She already had both guns from the glass counter out to handle. She was favoring the Glock and he prefers the M&P. So to drive home the point he takes his LOADED M&P out of his holster to show us!! Doing this he was muzzling my feet through the glass counter!!
Needless to say we were quickly out of there and will not return. I emailed the owner and he apologized and said he counseled Mike. He should have fired him.
They were also charging $1999 for the anodized 6920-MP back in August. I can only imagine what their prices are today. When I told them I got that same rifle from Clyde's for $1200, Mike "THE trainer" asked if mine came with tan mags. I said no, they were black. He says, well ours comes with tan. lol! So tan mags are $700?? That store is a joke.
There are local places selling M193 for $800/1k. People are paying it, so I guess it's just "market value" right now. My problem is that the same places preach customer loyalty constantly, then turn around and gouge those same loyal customers. I will definitely remember this in the future. All the extra dollars I've spent to support brick-and-mortar places when business was slow don't mean crap when times get hard on my end. Fair weather gun stores can blow me.
If we're going to have a strict business relationship, I'm gonna buy wherever the best price is and loyalty can get bent.
My personal list is growing...
Pathetic. That place is a train wreck. That bald guy with glasses in the video is a tool. He introduces himself as "Mike, the trainer" at that store. He was showing a friend of mine a G19 and an M&P9. She already had both guns from the glass counter out to handle. She was favoring the Glock and he prefers the M&P. So to drive home the point he takes his LOADED M&P out of his holster to show us!! Doing this he was muzzling my feet through the glass counter!!
Needless to say we were quickly out of there and will not return. I emailed the owner and he apologized and said he counseled Mike. He should have fired him.
They were also charging $1999 for the anodized 6920-MP back in August. I can only imagine what their prices are today. When I told them I got that same rifle from Clyde's for $1200, Mike "THE trainer" asked if mine came with tan mags. I said no, they were black. He says, well ours comes with tan. lol! So tan mags are $700?? That store is a joke.
Man glad Crylon is only a few bucks! I am going to start painting everything Tan! :dirol:
skullworks
12-24-12, 11:55
3. Cerberus /Freedom Group (which includes Remington, Bushmaster, etc) for immediately selling out.
Well now... Cerberus was never a "gun company" - they are a private equity firm that happened to invest in the firearms industry (among others). The reason Cerberus dropped Freedom Group is that one of the largest Cerberus investors is CalSTRS (a teachers union). After the union "reviewed" it's investment in Cerberus, they (Cerberus), being an equity firm, made the financially prudent thing and retained CalSTRS as a customer and instead dropped Freedom Group. Cerberus was never in the firearms industry because they are gun guys, they were in it as an investment for their customers.
But, if you feel they should be thrown to the wolves, feel free to do so.
skullworks
12-24-12, 11:56
Jeff Dillard, from National Armory in Pompano Beach wants all private gun sales stopped, especially over the internet.
The reason being obvious; no private sales + no internet sales = less competition in the market place.
Dick's...
...Can suck mine.
I hate that place anyway. I remember when they bought Galyans, the first thing they did was get rid of handguns.
I bought a Ruger Vaquero from Galyans when I was 21. Dick's can blow me.
They got their last penny from me, I can PROMISE you that. There's a REI across the street, True Wilderness about three miles from the Dick's by me, and GoingGear is about 10 minutes down the road. If I need a gun, there's mom 'n pop shops and Grant.
All others can burn.
Dicks is a clothing store.... That's why they are in shopping malls.
I actually wish REI wold expand their clothing line to carry UA. The whole store is nicer and the staff is way better than Dicks. But Dick's stores are strategically placed. Clothing and school team sports. Not really competition for REI, Bass Pro, or whatever other flavor you have in your region.
Pretty much all I buy there is UA and that's online on sale. I wish I knew somewhere to get deals on UA clothes.
Well now... Cerberus was never a "gun company" - they are a private equity firm that happened to invest in the firearms industry (among others). The reason Cerberus dropped Freedom Group is that one of the largest Cerberus investors is CalSTRS (a teachers union). After the union "reviewed" it's investment in Cerberus, they (Cerberus), being an equity firm, made the financially prudent thing and retained CalSTRS as a customer and instead dropped Freedom Group. Cerberus was never in the firearms industry because they are gun guys, they were in it as an investment for their customers.
But, if you feel they should be thrown to the wolves, feel free to do so.
What would throwing Cerberus to the wolves even look like? Not investing with them?
SeriousStudent
12-24-12, 14:26
.......
That's screwed up.
Yes, it's a beautiful rifle. I just kept thinking for that money, we could have helped him with a nice US Optics or Nightforce scope, and a Bobro mount. With a little careful shopping, we might have been able to do that all for four grand.
Or a really good can, and the stamp to cover it.
http://www.surplusammo.com/magpul-gen-2-pmag-30-round-5-56x45-ar15-m16-magazine-black-includes-dust-cover-mag211-blk/
http://i192.photobucket.com/albums/z198/merlebrooks/IMG_20121220_125054.jpg
Surplus Ammo and Arms
Lakewood, WA
I took this picture last week. They have since jacked up the price to $49.99 on non-windowed pmags on their website.
platoonDaddy
12-24-12, 19:31
Ruger BX-25 10/22 Magazine
1. Cheaper Than Dirt: $49.79 http://www.cheaperthandirt.com/product/MAG-410
2. Midway USA: $21.99 (back ordered, but guaranteed me the sale price of $21.99) http://www.midwayusa.com/find?userSearchQuery=ruger+bx-25
Of course I placed the order with Midway and for sure Cheaper Than Dirt, will never get another penny from me.
I wouldn't be surprised if a manufacturer (or few) caves. Maybe a mil or LE contract used as leverage to pressure not selling certain products in the civilian market.
Return of things akin to large receiver pins, sear blocks, manufacturers agreeing not to design/manufacture products designed to hold more than 10 rounds or having no "sporting" purpose, integral locks, "smart" guns, etc.
How many magazine manufactures would fold if they were threatened with losing mil/LE contracts if they sell their wares to the public?
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=119540
How about this
^^Just PM'd and said, "The price for the mags is a joke; right?"
I'm all for laissez-faire, but come on.
You know what, someone doesn't have to buy them if they don't want to. I'm changing my opinion. If he gets it, so be it. He's happy and the buyer is happy.
Streichers- My 2013 catalog has Pmags at 12.99. Website now lists for 16.99. Almost a 1/3 markup. Visited a NC showroom once in a great while while in the area. Workers were always real pieces of work. Must have been a top down thing.
**** them.
dookie1481
12-24-12, 23:57
Gotta love gun guys. All about free markets and capitalism, except when it's inconvenient to them ;)
Are we now including external influences on markets as still free market? Coulda sworn my textbook said...
-B
CarlosDJackal
12-25-12, 19:27
Gotta love gun guys. All about free markets and capitalism, except when it's inconvenient to them ;)
I don't see a problem. :stop: A free market and capitalism goes both ways.
Sellers have the freedom to mark-up their products as much or as little as they want.
Consumers have the freedom to spend their hard-earned money in support of whomever they want.
How about Luckygunner? The posted an announcement on Facebook last week that they had received a shipment of 200 Pmags and they would be on the website at 9AM. I clicked the link to see them marked up to $29.95.
The number of folks gouging far outweighs those who are not. Maybe it would be easier to just list the ones NOT raising prices.
BCM
Brownells - allowing backorders on out of stock items
We'll really need to differentiate from gouging the impact on prices of natural market forces like supply and demand or we'll fail to have an accurate list.
If you have 200 PMAGs and 10,000 interested buyers, what makes $30/mag outrageous? Heck, we already paid $30/mag for many mags that are produced in much lesser quantities well before this recent drama started. Now that demand has far outstripped supply, even PMAGs are not produced enough to meet demand, so prices naturally increase to whatever the market demand will bear.
An alternative would be to just open it up to auction-style bidding and then you'd see some really high prices as those with greater disposable income drop $50/mag no problem if they really want those mags. In that scenario, it's arguably better that the shop simply posts a fixed price to keep things artificially lower than pure market demand would dictate.
Then we'd realize that a shop selling PMAGs for $30 each when they could easily sell them all for twice that, is not gouging but actually doing folks a favor.
Belmont31R
12-26-12, 17:02
Gotta love gun guys. All about free markets and capitalism, except when it's inconvenient to them ;)
The check and balance to capitalism is consumers talking about retailers...or is capitalism just retailers charging whatever they want and we're socialists for bitching about price increases? A retailers loyalty and morality are also a part of how consumers choose to spend their money. If its kosher to boycott a company because they donate to an organization we don't like why would it not be kosher to black list a company who is trying to make an extra couple bucks off a single mag due to a 'scare'?
Capitalism is a two way street...:)
Sometimes making a couple extra bucks in the short term doesn't work out too well for a company....just like firing a couple extra workers at an employer so the executives get a bigger bonus for 'cost cutting' while putting extra work on the remaining employees doesn't always work out, and employees should be free to express opinions about good/bad places to work. Would you want to work for a company that was known for cost cutting (firing people on a whim) just for short term profit while you get stuck with the extra work?
Doc Safari
12-26-12, 17:22
I wouldn't necessarily ascribe an increase in pricing by a manufacturer to be "price gouging." If that manufacturer is having to make people work overtime, or add shifts to build more rifles, for example, then his overhead increases and he has to make up the difference. Plus if there is a shortage of parts, he may have to be paying his suppliers a premium to get product and not be left with unfinished assemblies.
The check and balance to capitalism is consumers talking about retailers...or is capitalism just retailers charging whatever they want and we're socialists for bitching about price increases? A retailers loyalty and morality are also a part of how consumers choose to spend their money.
Technically, it's free markets we're discussing and are interested in, not capitalism or socialism. In a free market, the seller is welcome to charge as much as he wants and the buyer is free to not buy anything he feels is not worth the price. The natural equilibrium point will be found rather quickly, even absent any competition for the seller, as the seller will simply not be able to sell any goods if the price is too high and the buyer will have to do without the item unless he's willing to pay a reasonable price for the item. So both have a vested interest in finding a middle ground and making a deal happen. Negotiation occurs, and that is how and where the equilibrium point will be found.
There are other factors that can increase market complexity, beginning with competition and the intricacies of supply and demand in our current market-in-question, but at the end of the day, the concept of "gouging" is really not what we're dealing with when the supply of an item is legitimately restricted and practically unavailable while at the same time actual demand is at its peak. These are natural market forces and the price adjusts accordingly. When the demand reduces and/or the supply increases, the prices will naturally fall back down.
The reality of this is that if you don't allow businesses to raise prices and artificially restrict the market from its normal function, there are multiplicative consequences, beginning with an impact on the business's bottom line vs where it would be had the market been allowed to run its natural course. This is the reason why government regulation of a free market in general does more harm than good to markets. Of course, many of our markets weren't truly free to begin with, and were instead born into a world of artificial restraints that often lead to even greater regulation in order to keep a facade on the market, so it retains a semblance of normal function. The sad part is the amount of productivity lost to the parasitic drag of all the regulatory restrictions creates an exceptionally inefficient market. A hidden cost that is often never highlighted.
Technically, it's free markets we're discussing and are interested in, not capitalism or socialism. In a free market, the seller is welcome to charge as much as he wants and the buyer is free to not buy anything he feels is not worth the price. The natural equilibrium point will be found rather quickly, even absent any competition for the seller, as the seller will simply not be able to sell any goods if the price is too high and the buyer will have to do without the item unless he's willing to pay a reasonable price for the item. So both have a vested interest in finding a middle ground and making a deal happen. Negotiation occurs, and that is how and where the equilibrium point will be found.
There are other factors that can increase market complexity, beginning with competition and the intricacies of supply and demand in our current market-in-question, but at the end of the day, the concept of "gouging" is really not what we're dealing with when the supply of an item is legitimately restricted and practically unavailable while at the same time actual demand is at its peak. These are natural market forces and the price adjusts accordingly. When the demand reduces and/or the supply increases, the prices will naturally fall back down.
The reality of this is that if you don't allow businesses to raise prices and artificially restrict the market from its normal function, there are multiplicative consequences, beginning with an impact on the business's bottom line vs where it would be had the market been allowed to run its natural course. This is the reason why government regulation of a free market in general does more harm than good to markets. Of course, many of our markets weren't truly free to begin with, and were instead born into a world of artificial restraints that often lead to even greater regulation in order to keep a facade on the market, so it retains a semblance of normal function. The sad part is the amount of productivity lost to the parasitic drag of all the regulatory restrictions creates an exceptionally inefficient market. A hidden cost that is often never highlighted.
Wow, that's a pretty good post. I guess that you are saying that external price controls suck - regardless if they come from the government or attempted boycott.
Streichers- My 2013 catalog has Pmags at 12.99. Website now lists for 16.99. Almost a 1/3 markup. Visited a NC showroom once in a great while while in the area. Workers were always real pieces of work. Must have been a top down thing.
**** them.
Sigh... you do realize that Magpul MSRP is 17.95 right? That price of $16.99 is actually a discount price.
Belmont31R
12-26-12, 22:37
I know all that. You missed my point that consumers engaging in dialog about retailers is a part of free market capitalism, and this it aimed at the crowd who bitch about consumers talking to one another. 'Like shut up if you don't like the price.' Or...'Don't buy it if you don't like the price.' Well...duh. Retailers and profiteers don't like consumers talking because it can have an adverse effect on sales if consumers enter into discussions about where to find a better deal, plan boycotts, ect.
There are some feel good notions, like pricing an item so high there is always some on the shelf for people to buy. That doesn't really work when demand is so high, and you're basically bending people over the barrel because of the political situation. During the 2008 panic the retailer blamed the distributors, and Magpul said they did not raise their prices. So either the retailers were lying or the distributors were bending us over. If the retailers were telling the truth then why would they not try to find another distributor who didn't raise prices. I know this to be true based on the fact some retailers did not raise their prices, and they would have had to if distributors raised their prices.
I went into one shop the day after the 2008 election, and nearly everything in the store had doubled in price. Obvious attempt at that store to make a quick buck off the shooting community's political fears, and it's quite my right as a consumer to tell other people about it. Of course when I did that I got the 'don't like it don't buy it' line, which is what I did, but it's perfectly within our right's as consumers to talk about it, and remember which retailers lied and/or tried to profit off shooters due to the political situation. We don't HAVE to accept retailers, who are supposed to be on the same 'team' as us, ripping people off to make a few extra bucks on a magazine, and I continue to patronize places like Bravo Co who did not extraordinarily raise prices (or at all) within hours of an election while blaming other people (lying to me and everyone else) like some other retailers did.
On another angle to that...gun retailer rely on gun owners to keep their products legal. They could not do it on their own, and the money and things I do politically directly benefits them. Based on that, when thing's aren't looking that hot, I don't appreciate them turning around and trying to make a quick buck off us with lying and profiteering. It's an outright lie that they have to charge more money to keep product in stock. Guess what? Everyone is sold out. There is only the secondary market to buy mags from right now. Them charging more isn't going to get them inventory any faster, and based on 2008 not everyone raised prices. If their distributor raised prices on them then they should find a new distributor because obviously not all them did (or maybe even none at all).
I don't believe in outright free markets with no rules. The Founder's had it right where the most minimal amount of government works best with rules enforced to keep thing's in order. For instance enforcing contract law, and illegalizing things like false advertising, outright dangerous products, bait and switch schemes, and trying to prevent monopolies are all good restrictions on a free market without creating a burdensome bureaucracy. There are pluses and minuses to every economic system, and free market has it's own drawbacks. I do not advocate things like price controls or regulatory red tape but think things like paying people with 'company cash' you can only use at the 'company store' should be illegal, and wages should be paid in US dollars. I don't think the government should tell anyone how much to sell a PMAG for but consumers have the right, in that situation, to talk about pricing, retailers, and share opinions/experiences. No one here is talking about price controls on AR mags.
I don't know what to think about this, I went to PK firearms and.....
PK Firearms is suspending all online and telephone orders until Further Notice. We will update as we know more. It will definitely be after Christmas and most likely after the New Year. Please don't bother to call the Shop unless it pertains to an FFL License or Warranty Issues. Thanks for your business, and we appreciate your understanding. Merry Christmas
http://www.pkfirearms.com/ (http://www.pkfirearms.com/)
brushy bill
12-27-12, 00:29
I'm one of the simpletons who sees this in positive terms.
Those who have what they need can ride out the panic.
Those who don't are becoming heavily invested in something they should have been long ago. This may make them less favorable of legislation requiring them to register or turn them in.
We've had "bad" guns be small concealable and cheap "Saturday Night Specials". Now the bad guns are big expensive and not concealable. All guns are bad to the libs and anyone with time on their hands can look it up if they choose. They have told so many lies over time it will be hard to keep it all straight.
ICANHITHIMMAN
12-28-12, 22:37
Can this list include members in the EE who are trying to get 80$ for a single PMAG or 1000$ for a lower? Please Please say it can?
Can this list include members in the EE who are trying to get 80$ for a single PMAG or 1000$ for a lower? Please Please say it can?
Hell yes! It should also include a link to the post so we will all know who to never buy from in the future.
I'm with ICANHITHIMMAN. I won't be supporting any member here who is trying to make a quick buck. They have their right to charge whatever they want and I have the right to believe they are a douche.
ICANHITHIMMAN
12-29-12, 10:15
Here is a short list, if your name is on it then oh well you don't belong here!
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=119883
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=119868
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=119699
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=119917
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=119859
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=119803
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=119924
polydeuces
12-29-12, 10:24
Have you noticed all but one of these came from "new" members - joined sometime '12.
How strange.
We need to make some changes in EE policy - when new members can start selling.
skullworks
12-29-12, 10:42
I don't know what to think about this, I went to PK firearms and.....
PK Firearms is suspending all online and telephone orders until Further Notice. We will update as we know more. It will definitely be after Christmas and most likely after the New Year. Please don't bother to call the Shop unless it pertains to an FFL License or Warranty Issues. Thanks for your business, and we appreciate your understanding. Merry Christmas
http://www.pkfirearms.com/ (http://www.pkfirearms.com/)
Actually, it says:
PK Firearms will be closed from December 29th thru January 7th for year end inventory. In order to obtain an accurate count of inventory on hand we will not be taking any phone or web orders during this time. We appreciate all of your business in 2012 and look forward to serving your needs in 2013. Have a Happy New Year!
Here is a short list, if your name is on it then oh well you don't belong here!
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=119883
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=119868
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=119699
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=119917
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=119859
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=119803
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=119924
quote the posts here so they don't edit and change them in response.
Actually, it says:
It does now.....It did say exactly what I put up originally, This sounds much better.
Submariner
12-29-12, 16:11
I gots to know.
I have 5 excellent condition (little, if any, use) preban Adventureline mags to pass on to someone who needs them. All drop free from my Colt. All have good feed lips, welds, springs and Magpul followers.
$160 shipped by USPS M.O. or discrete PP +3.5%. No GIFT OPTION.
SPF to djkrisg
Note: Bought in '96 with black followers for $20 each. According to Minneapolis FED Inflation Calculator, cost today of same item is $29.63. There were no Magpul followers in '96.
Ruger BX-25 10/22 Magazine
1. Cheaper Than Dirt: $49.79 http://www.cheaperthandirt.com/product/MAG-410
2. Midway USA: $21.99 (back ordered, but guaranteed me the sale price of $21.99) http://www.midwayusa.com/find?userSearchQuery=ruger+bx-25
Of course I placed the order with Midway and for sure Cheaper Than Dirt, will never get another penny from me.
I bought two locally for $25 each and was happy with that price. Good for Midway they're in my good guy list. CTD can KMA! I have some magazines on BO with Brownells they're on my good guy list too. It wasn't a lot but I added ten bucks to the NRA bucks at check out. I suggest you all do the same.
Back order is okay but they say 5/18/2013 is when they expect the shipment. Lots can happen in six months.
I gots to know.
I don't think so. Those are even legal in places like MA, NY and CA right? Those are Old magazines and sound like they're like new.
Brownells lists 20 round PMags have been discontinued.
http://www.brownells.com/magazines/rifle-magazines/magazines/ar-15-m16-pmag-polymer-magazine-10-pak-prod42583.aspx
Bummer. I wanted some to use for hunting with their 5 round limiter.
What will the "discontinued" 20 rounders be worth now?
Belmont31R
12-29-12, 17:45
Brownells lists 20 round PMags have been discontinued.
http://www.brownells.com/magazines/rifle-magazines/magazines/ar-15-m16-pmag-polymer-magazine-10-pak-prod42583.aspx
Bummer. I wanted some to use for hunting with their 5 round limiter.
What will the "discontinued" 20 rounders be worth now?
I think that's because they are coming out with a Gen 3 20rd mag which is curved and not straight.
bondmid003
12-29-12, 17:50
Some of the ee gougers have already edited. They all have about 60 posts too...
skullworks
12-29-12, 17:55
I think that's because they are coming out with a Gen 3 20rd mag which is curved and not straight.
I agree with Belmont. Also, the fact that Magpul is focusing their production on 30-round mags might be a factor as well (as in they might have chosen to cease production of the Gen3 20-rounders to free up production capacity for the 30-rounders until we/they know what's coming.)
I think that's because they are coming out with a Gen 3 20rd mag which is curved and not straight.
I agree with Belmont. Also, the fact that Magpul is focusing their production on 30-round mags might be a factor as well (as in they might have chosen to cease production of the Gen3 20-rounders to free up production capacity for the 30-rounders until we/they know what's coming.)
That's good news. Brownells does say they will be only making 20 & 30 round black PMags. I have some on BO. I don't need them but see them as something good to put aside.
ICANHITHIMMAN
12-29-12, 22:14
Info from some one who cant post here yet
Hi, I can not post in the GD yet but wanted to message you in hopes of you posting this.
Kyle's Gun Shop marked up their P-mags 100% to $29.99. Also I had an order for ammo placed that showed there was over 50 boxes in stock. Well I never got an email saying it shipped so I emailed them about it. Well apparently they were out and just taking a LOT of orders and if you emailed them about it they would put you on backorder! The people that said anything about the ammo or pricing on their facebook got their comments deleted. Thanks and I hope all is well!
https://www.facebook.com/KylesGunshop
ICANHITHIMMAN
12-29-12, 22:15
Here is another
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=120000
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=119994
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=119993
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=120015https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=119540
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=120004
$80 mags from Surplus Ammo.
http://www.surplusammo.com/products/Colt-Mfg.-AR15-Magazine-30-Round.html
bondmid003
12-29-12, 23:01
Gotta love the scalper prices on usgi mags
Let's add BofA to the list if it's not already on it.
I'm not very pleased with Bravo Company. We all know they make quality and have great CS. However, only taking orders that are $80 and above? Bullshit.
We all know they are M4C darlings, but I say, once again, bullshit. Don't give me any excuses for them; "It's because(blah, blah blah)... Whatever.
I'm not very pleased with Bravo Company. We all know they make quality and have great CS. However, only taking orders that are $80 and above? Bullshit.
We all know they are M4C darlings, but I say, once again, bullshit. Don't give me any excuses for them; "It's because(blah, blah blah)... Whatever.
That temporary policy has me bewildered considering BCM doesn't have any uppers, URGs, LRGs, barrels, barrel assemblies, complete rifles, bolts, bolt carriers, BCGs, and quite a few other products in stock. They must be having a heck of a run on their remaining inventory. :confused:
I will say this, BCM has shit in stock that nobody else does...barrel nuts, gas tubes, H buffers and a couple other items. I had no problem getting together a $100 order.
Brownell's is on my really good guy list. They back ordered my 10 GI mags and delievered them within a week.
Midway also back ordered some key parts for me and delivered within a week.
Aero Precision unloaded a 1000 lowers just days after the CT. tragedy and only charged $99 for them. They had stripped uppers up until a few days ago fo $89. No gouging from Aero Precision at all.
DSG Arms didn't jack their pricing on orange P-mags when they were the only Pmags to be found.
Here is another
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=120004
This link was to my listing. I'm going to attempt to defend myself.
I went to a local gun show yesterday with my wife. PMAGs were a highly sought after item there. Empty sections on tables where their mags had been were commonplace. Guys outside with signs saying "Buying Glock and AR Mags".
I wasn't around during the first ban, but I've heard stories that sounded an awful lot like what I was seeing. If I had had any mags with me, I could've easily sold them there.
Almost all that was left over we're unwrapped, non windowed, used PMAGs. The going rate for those were $40 each. I used the market I was exposed to to set my price. If that was in bad taste, I truly apologize. Let me assure you that I wasn't trying to "screw anybody over."
M4C has always been a reliable and trusted source of information for me. I've also been able to find hard to find items from time to time on the EE. I've got a good rating there and have always tried to operate professionally in my dealings there. If anyone was offended by my listing, again I apologize.
Thanks
Matt
[QUOTE=mnoe82;1485930]This link was to my listing. I'm going to attempt to defend myself.
I went to a local gun show yesterday with my wife. PMAGs were a highly sought after item there....."
I mean this in a kind hearted, joking way...
Say no more dude, really what happened was you took your wife to the gun show & she saw how much P-mags are selling for and said something like "you have a bunch of them you don't really need, why don't you post them for sale cause I'd like to have a XYZ..."
I have been hearing the same from mine since all this started. She knows it's a lost cause though. She knows I'm sitting on a healthy supply of SCAR H mags & knows what they have been going for online. I could cave and put all that on gunbroker & rake in enough to get into the fullauto game, but I just cannot bring myself to it. I remember how bad 94-04 sucked, and I've worked to hard to get what I have. Another thing is I have yet to meet anyone on this board who I would not call a friend. I could not stick it to a friend. Not in me. If one of you absolutely needed a SCAR 17 mag & was going into harms way right now I'd give it to you. That said, if you believe in a free market, you have to abide by it no matter how it performs. I wish I could buy gold at $500/ounce or gas at $1.50/gal.
[QUOTE=mnoe82;1485930]This link was to my listing. I'm going to attempt to defend myself.
I went to a local gun show yesterday with my wife. PMAGs were a highly sought after item there....."
I mean this in a kind hearted, joking way...
Say no more dude, really what happened was you took your wife to the gun show & she saw how much P-mags are selling for and said something like "you have a bunch of them you don't really need, why don't you post them for sale cause I'd like to have a XYZ..."
.
Nailed it. In our case it's for "The Baby", not even conceived yet and already dominating the expense report.
Littlelebowski
12-30-12, 08:33
Add me to the list; I'm selling my Surefire 60 and Glock 33s to finance my new M&P 15/22 :D
Add me to the list; I'm selling my Surefire 60 and Glock 33s to finance my new M&P 15/22 :D
Duly Noted Sir! ):
bondmid003
12-30-12, 09:01
A lot of the gouging is going on gunbroker or ebay. Then again a lot is self induced as people drive the prices up on themselves. :suicide2:
Add me to the list; I'm selling my Surefire 60 and Glock 33s to finance my new M&P 15/22 :D
I will sell you my M&P 15-22 for
wait for it
ONE MILLION DOLLARS!
and I'll even throw in the PA microdot and one box of .22LR.
Another way to look at it all is:
Is anyone whom ever has sold an HK 416 upper for more that half the price of the base gun (under $2000) bad?
Is anyone whom ever has sold a transferable machine gun for over the price of a dealer sample or new production bad?
What about the USMC marked Schmidt & Bender scopes?
Or anytime a new weapon/item/gadget hits the market & the first 40 or 50 go for higher prices than stuff is going now?
The ones buying at those prices are dictating those prices, not the ones selling. I saw it mentioned about BCM's minimum order as if that's bad. Guys, Paul is as stand up of a guy is there is. Anyone on here who is anyway remotely associated with a gun store will tell you what a hurricane this has been. Not to speak for Paul, but most likely he's doing that to try and make best use of his & his employees time during a huge spike in calls/sales while keeping his prices the same by limiting the amount of time spent on hundreds of small orders. Paul is not the screw you over type, he's a damn good man.
Another way to look at it all is:
Is anyone whom ever has sold an HK 416 upper for more that half the price of the base gun (under $2000) bad?
Is anyone whom ever has sold a transferable machine gun for over the price of a dealer sample or new production bad?
What about the USMC marked Schmidt & Bender scopes?
Or anytime a new weapon/item/gadget hits the market & the first 40 or 50 go for higher prices than stuff is going now?
The ones buying at those prices are dictating those prices, not the ones selling. I saw it mentioned about BCM's minimum order as if that's bad. Guys, Paul is as stand up of a guy is there is. Anyone on here who is anyway remotely associated with a gun store will tell you what a hurricane this has been. Not to speak for Paul, but most likely he's doing that to try and make best use of his & his employees time during a huge spike in calls/sales while keeping his prices the same by limiting the amount of time spent on hundreds of small orders. Paul is not the screw you over type, he's a damn good man.
Speaking of BCM, is the "Email when available" feature turned off, or I'm I just blind???
IDK, it may be as there will probably be a huge dip in supplys for a while. Gun & gun parts manufacturers are often considered way bigger than they are. They just don't have the mfg resources that say a car plant or tv plant does, so when the distribution system gets depleated as currently the case, it will take sometime before it catches back up. At a normal pace, every single "hot from the plant" SCAR 17 mag I have ever gotten was date stamped atleast 4-6 months prior to me getting it. With the astronomical demand on everything it would make sense for him to not leave folks hanging or hoping they will get such & such in the forseeable future. The run on all things that go boom has been like nothing before and really should be at the center of the media in support of not screwing with gun laws.
I do worry that lots of guys will get the "well I got mine, bring on the AWB" attitude & not do the legwork of defending their rights.
Speaking of BCM, is the "Email when available" feature turned off, or I'm I just blind??? Not blind, I had the same issue. If you click on the picture or the bolt lettering you get the description of the BCG and the option to get emailed when they are back in stock. If you click on "add to cart" you won't get the email option.
BTW...BCM shipped my parts list of barrel nuts, gas tubes, and gas blocks in under 24hrs. regardless of their warnings that it might take over a week on their website.
I saw it mentioned about BCM's minimum order as if that's bad. Guys, Paul is as stand up of a guy is there is. Anyone on here who is anyway remotely associated with a gun store will tell you what a hurricane this has been. Not to speak for Paul, but most likely he's doing that to try and make best use of his & his employees time during a huge spike in calls/sales while keeping his prices the same by limiting the amount of time spent on hundreds of small orders. Paul is not the screw you over type, he's a damn good man.
Paul is a good guy, but that doesn't mean the policy is a good one. A small order is just as important to the customer as the large order is to that customer. I don't see Grant, or Brownell's, or Midway, or SAW, or many other places with such a policy in place.
TacMedic556
12-30-12, 14:52
Botach tactical.
Normally had ok experience with them. Myself and several others ordered PMAGS, days before the rush even began on the 14th. They sold and continued to sell magazines, regardless of not having any in stock. They took the money, only to notify of back order status later on, and were slow to refund or communicate about refund process via email. Botach, continues to show products and sell products that are in NO POSSIBLE WAY in stock. This is unscrupulous in the least.
The best companies, such as Larue, BCM, G&R, they will not sell you a product if they do not have it, so I say stick with those that abide by that principle. I will from here on out, avoid all dealings with Botach. Done.
Not blind, I had the same issue. If you click on the picture or the bolt lettering you get the description of the BCG and the option to get emailed when they are back in stock. If you click on "add to cart" you won't get the email option.
BTW...BCM shipped my parts list of barrel nuts, gas tubes, and gas blocks in under 24hrs. regardless of their warnings that it might take over a week on their website.
Just placed a parts order with BCM, was able to get email alert on BCGs but not on uppers, so I used the "note" feature on the order form to ask them about that.
ICANHITHIMMAN
12-31-12, 10:02
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=120116
RogerinTPA
12-31-12, 10:26
Here is a short list, if your name is on it then oh well you don't belong here!
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=119883
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=119868
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=119699
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=119917
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=119859
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=119803
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=119924
Have you noticed all but one of these came from "new" members - joined sometime '12.
How strange.
We need to make some changes in EE policy - when new members can start selling.
Agreed. They are all recent members with low post counts who appear to have joined M4C for the specific purpose of using our E&E. They and those like them, should be banned.
Botach tactical.
Normally had ok experience with them. Myself and several others ordered PMAGS, days before the rush even began on the 14th. They sold and continued to sell magazines, regardless of not having any in stock. They took the money, only to notify of back order status later on, and were slow to refund or communicate about refund process via email. Botach, continues to show products and sell products that are in NO POSSIBLE WAY in stock. This is unscrupulous in the least.
The best companies, such as Larue, BCM, G&R, they will not sell you a product if they do not have it, so I say stick with those that abide by that principle. I will from here on out, avoid all dealings with Botach. Done.
Sadly this seems to have been thier MO prior to the panic. Hope you did get your $ back at least.
skullworks
12-31-12, 11:44
Sadly this seems to have been thier MO prior to the panic. Hope you did get your $ back at least.
Yeah, that's always been their MO (well, at least since the late '90s.)
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=120116
Just offered to trade a like new scout for the nine window PMags. He declined and said he could sell six and buy a new light. Kinda what I thought the response would be. :D
Singlestack Wonder
12-31-12, 12:07
Agreed. They are all recent members with low post counts who appear to have joined M4C for the specific purpose of using our E&E. They and those like them, should be banned.
If the required post count was increased to 250, perhaps they wouldn't make the effort?
nineteenkilo
12-31-12, 12:07
Agreed. They are all recent members with low post counts who appear to have joined M4C for the specific purpose of using our E&E. They and those like them, should be banned.
I sent Shivan a PM earlier asking for a post count limit on the EE. I think most of the regulars will agree that it is time.
Or if it bothers you, just don't go there. Putting a post count limit on some sections just has some people posting in the tech sections without contributing anything of value.
LowSpeed_HighDrag
12-31-12, 13:11
Personally, I do not care what anyone sells things for on our EE, you own a piece of gear, therefore you get to sell it for whatever.
Now, when a large distributor starts setting prices at astronomically high levels, I simply will not buy from them ever again. It is a free market, and they can sell a PMAG for 10 gold shillings, but in the end the free market will dictate that they go out of business or lower their prices. Trying to screw your customer base isnt good business, and those of us that pay attention will simply open a link to another store with better prices.
All these gougers really need to do in my eyes for me to shop there again is say, "Sorry, we got caught up in the hysteria too. Here is a large donation to the GOA and NRA, and our prices are normal again."
ICANHITHIMMAN
01-01-13, 10:52
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=120155
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=120000
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=118792
There are long term members selling things for very high prices too. A Colt BCG for $525! It is their gear and they can ask what they want but ouch!
platoonDaddy
01-01-13, 13:37
Republican in the senate who voted for $41 of tax increase for every $1 of savings!
**** them!
ICANHITHIMMAN
01-02-13, 07:42
This BS is happening on another forum I post on to, all new members (when I say new I don't consider join date, but post counts of under 250).
Just offered to trade a like new scout for the nine window PMags. He declined and said he could sell six and buy a new light. Kinda what I thought the response would be. :D
Surefire scout? What color?
Singlestack Wonder
01-02-13, 13:11
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=119540
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=119540
Saw that.
This really is disappointing the way some of our members are performing in the EE.
As someone else mentioned on here alot of you guys I consider friends. Others at the very least I have a great deal of respect for.
-Jax
Surefire scout? What color?
It's black. I have it on my .22lr upper. I don't really want to sell it.
http://i859.photobucket.com/albums/ab160/usmcvet0331/c9d8e3d8.jpg
My local dealer has them in stock again but they're $39.99 I just bought three 20 round PMags for $19.99 and a three pack of 5 round limiters so my son and I can use them to hunt with our AR's.
Now they're $100 'cause we are all "commies" I nicely suggested he sell them on Gun Broker.
Oh Well.
My LGS is selling lots of stuff and gun broker. A LWRC stripped lower sold for $806! Holly Crap.
All of you against the sellers you do understand that buyers determine price.
All of you against the sellers you do understand that buyers determine price.
Good point but I've already promised a few guys if I do get some more mags in for sale I am not raising prices. Not tooting my own horn it's just my humble opinion that doing it HERE is taking a big fat dump on the bed I am laying on.
I believe most guys 'gouging' on here are not deeply invested (for the most part) in M4C.
But yeh it ultimately comes down to the buyer deciding to purchase or not.
-Jax
I have been downsizing since I retired and I told a few local acquaintances my asking price for three of my rifles on December 11th, three days before the Connecticut tragedy. I kept my word when I sold them on December 21st.
I may not be a shrewd businessman for not jacking up the price and selling the rifles elsewhere, but a man is only as good as his word. I am sure as hell going to keep my word.
Anyone that pays exorbitant prices for any gun related items right now is either mentally retarded or allowing their emotions control them. In either case, people trying to sell their shit for jacked up prices should be considered low rent used car salemen at best and leaches on the M4Carbine community at worst.
Yeah and don't give me that free market bullshit. They know exactly what they are doing -trying to take advantage of overly emotional and/or retarded people. Either way it's dicked up
All of you against the sellers you do understand that buyers determine price.
Yes and no. On an auction site yes. But if you walk into Bubbas Gun Shop. Bubba sets the price. You can haggle and choose not to buy but Bubba sets the price.
ICANHITHIMMAN
01-03-13, 07:20
All of you against the sellers you do understand that buyers determine price.
I understand this yes, but I also remember when it happened in 94 and in 08 and how everyone bitched. I don't want people like that here, they are not they type of men I would consider honest.
"A days work for a days pay"
Singlestack Wonder
01-03-13, 08:18
I understand this yes, but I also remember when it happened in 94 and in 08 and how everyone bitched. I don't want people like that here, they are not they type of men I would consider honest.
"A days work for a days pay"
Well stated.
Littlelebowski
01-04-13, 09:44
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=120474
Crow Hunter
01-04-13, 11:16
I don't understand people being so upset about this.
If I have something and it is worth $X to me, and you are willing to pay me $X+1 for it and I don't have any other reason to keep it, I will sell it to you.
Why should I be "required" by law or "honor" to sell it to you for what you could have bought it for X months ago?
Do you have a stipulation in your 401k that says when you decide to sell a stock, you have to sell it for the price it was when you bought it?;)
When this fever dies down (hopefully) and some of these guys who paid $120 for a SCAR 17 mag decide to sell them, are you going to give them $120 for them or will you give them whatever the going rate is?;)
My brother really likes his SCAR 17 & SCAR 16, but he doesn't $3,000 like them. Same thing with his SCAR 17 mags, he doesn't $120 each like them.:eek:
Even if I owned a gun store, I wouldn't sell out everything I had in my store for July 2012 pricing so I could just pay employees to sit around and twiddle their thumbs waiting for supply to outstrip demand. Especially having built my wage/benefit/profit structure based on a regular demand/pricing situation and a specific turnover rate and margin that becomes shot all to hell because I can't get any product to sell and I sold out everything I had on my normal margin with an unknown ETA on additional deliveries of product.
The only real choice in that situation is to push my prices up to correspond with my expected supply situation and hope the demand side goes up high enough that my margin will cover me until I can get more supply.
How long do you think the average 3 to 5 person gun shop can last selling cleaning supplies, targets and gun bags with no guns/ammo/magazines in stock with the occasional sale of a deer rifle or bird gun? All the while their customers are buying out all of their "demand" items and flipping them for double or more on Gunbroker or FTF transactions?
I am all for not dealing with companies/people that tick you off but labeling them as "traitors" for doing business is wrong IMHO.
NoveskeFan
01-04-13, 11:26
Crow Hunter, what gets me tweaked is this: I'm looking to buy a lower, I have a WTB ad. I have people messaging me asking for two to three times retail. I've offered to trade with some, but they don't want to honor the going rate for Pmags when they want me to pay out the ass for the lower. I think most on this forum think of other members as brothers. Look at the support some give to other members when things get bad in their personal lives. It's upsetting that "family" would screw each other over, but then again, most of the outlandish ads quoted are from members who infrequently post here.
Crow Hunter
01-04-13, 11:46
Crow Hunter, what gets me tweaked is this: I'm looking to buy a lower, I have a WTB ad. I have people messaging me asking for two to three times retail. I've offered to trade with some, but they don't want to honor the going rate for Pmags when they want me to pay out the ass for the lower. I think most on this forum think of other members as brothers. Look at the support some give to other members when things get bad in their personal lives. It's upsetting that "family" would screw each other over, but then again, most of the outlandish ads quoted are from members who infrequently post here.
Now that is a different situation IMHO.
That would tweak me too. If I am "paying" market price, you should be "paying" market price too on what I am trading, even if it was not between like minded individuals who share a common belief system.
Good point but I've already promised a few guys if I do get some more mags in for sale I am not raising prices. Not tooting my own horn it's just my humble opinion that doing it HERE is taking a big fat dump on the bed I am laying on.
I believe most guys 'gouging' on here are not deeply invested (for the most part) in M4C.
But yeh it ultimately comes down to the buyer deciding to purchase or not.
-JaxPerfectly reasonable.
Yes and no. On an auction site yes. But if you walk into Bubbas Gun Shop. Bubba sets the price. You can haggle and choose not to buy but Bubba sets the price.
If two people are looking at the same car and one is willing to spend more who does the dealer sale to? If I post up a BCG on the EE for $100 a bidding war will happen via PM, it’s simple supply and demand economics and only a fool would not sell to the highest bidder. The same thing will happen at Bubba's shop so Bubba moves the price up to eliminate the initial haggling. Having said all that I have NIB BCM 14.5 barrel that I'm selling to my cousin for what I paid.
I saw this add last night but was not quick enough with my response.
I wanted the two PMags for $35. I've bought them as low as ten bucks each and as much as $20 in the last few years so $35 shipped for two seemed like a great deal.
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=120416
I just was not fast enough.
Just my 2 cent on price gouging.
From the dealer side i can see it from two different angles. One is the "Lets get rich fast!" the other is "Because of the buying craze i am not going to get anything else back in stock for 6 months that i am forced to raise my prices to stay in business
Now with some outfit such as cheaper than dirt-bags where they are a large company and are well established i feel they are in the first category. But i feel your local mom and pop shops are being forced to raise prices just to cover their foreseen low inventory levels.
From the consumer side i think most of us are keeping our cool and are refraining from getting in to the craze. That being said i just watched a KAC SR15 lower sell for $1800 on gunbroker so people will pay to get what they want right now.
I saw this add last night but was not quick enough with my response.
I wanted the two PMags for $35. I've bought them as low as ten bucks each and as much as $20 in the last few years so $35 shipped for two seemed like a great deal.
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=120416
I just was not fast enough.
Good to see. If the EE exchanges were timed that is probably the shortest transaction in history.
-Jax
NoveskeFan
01-04-13, 17:28
Good to see. If the EE exchanges were timed that is probably the shortest transaction in history.
-Jax
I responded to an ad for a lower today, within six minutes of it posting. Didn't hear back from the OP, but the ad was updated with "SPF" within a short time. I was very sad:(
Good to see. If the EE exchanges were timed that is probably the shortest transaction in history.
-Jax
That was a quick one. I read the add a few time making sure I read it right at $35 for the pair OT $35 each. That cost me but that's cool. Today is my birthday. When my wife handed me my present I knew right away it was the ten NMHTG 30 round magazines I'd asked for in late November when she asked what I wanted for Christmas.
:dance3:
I responded to an ad for a lower today, within six minutes of it posting. Didn't hear back from the OP, but the ad was updated with "SPF" within a short time. I was very sad:(
Brownells is worth a hard look. Check out these lowers.
http://www.brownells.com/rifle-parts/receiver-amp-action-parts/receivers/lower-receivers/ar-15-stripped-lower-receiver-prod55099.aspx
Littlelebowski
01-06-13, 12:33
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=120692
Singlestack Wonder
01-06-13, 13:31
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=120665
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=120692
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=120665
Do you two have a point?
The laws against price-gouging are a bad idea in all scenarios. The reason there aren't truckloads of private suppliers rolling into hurricanes and floods with generators, food and gas is because they will be arrested if they are charging a premium. There may be momentary spikes but the market is much better at pricing scarce items than politicians.
Thank God! at least one more person that actually gets it. And yes Dicks and CTD have been and always will remain on my shit list.
NoveskeFan
01-06-13, 14:39
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=120708
Wanted $600 for the set.
Singlestack Wonder
01-07-13, 07:42
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=120523
bondmid003
01-07-13, 08:38
Do you two have a point?
I believe they are trying to make the point that the two sellers are trying to take advantage of this current "craze"
I think in order to post in the EE members must have a 200 post count in similar fashion of the general discussion area.
Littlelebowski
01-07-13, 11:37
Do you two have a point?
Yeah, don't shit on a good community. Free enterprise, got it. I will not be gougin here after learning so much from this forum. They are free to gouge if they want and I'm free to point it out.
Littlelebowski
01-07-13, 11:39
I think in order to post in the EE members must have a 200 post count in similar fashion of the general discussion area.
Agreed.
I've noticed that nobody is criticizing the members here who are listing stuff at high prices..with high post counts. They are out there if you look. I could care less what people want for their stuff.
bondmid003
01-07-13, 12:06
Is there a specific moderator to talk to about upping the post count requirement for the EE section?
Is there a specific moderator to talk to about upping the post count requirement for the EE section?
Robb Jensen is listed as the moderator for the EE. If you check the bottom of each forum it lists the folks in charge. I am sure they get an insane amount of email and PM's but it is worth a PM to ask.
Singlestack Wonder
01-07-13, 12:32
I think in order to post in the EE members must have a 200 post count in similar fashion of the general discussion area.
I agree (or 250 for Equipment Exchange). It's ironic that the douches asking $2300 for a bushmaster in the Equipment Exchange can't see all of the comments referencing them in the General Discussion area.
I understand where you are coming from with the recommendation about minimum post counts, but I am not sure that will resolve the issue. If I submit 200 posts, it means I can type and hit the "Submit Reply" button 200 times. It would not necessarily mean that I am an honest seller/buyer.
Unless a buyer/seller has several positive entries in their feedback history, I believe you are taking your chances. If someone commits to buying/selling, then backs out without a very good explanation they should receive negative feedback.
Outpost Armory in Christiana, TN. I love the people there, but the management seems to have decided to use Gunbroker as a way of pricing AR accessories. They were selling Pmags for $35 (when they had them) and Surefire 60-round mags for... no joke... $175 (+ tax, naturally).
The day after the craze started, they priced their 900-round cases of Federal 55gr at $600 (usually $450-ish).
I see your $175 Skyyr and I'll raise you $249
Another one to add to the list:
http://www.surplusammo.com/surefire-ar-15-high-capacity-60-round-magazine-mag5-60/
I agree (or 250 for Equipment Exchange). It's ironic that the douches asking $2300 for a bushmaster in the Equipment Exchange can't see all of the comments referencing them in the General Discussion area.
I might be wrong but I think they can see the posts they just can not respond to them.
Outpost Armory in Christiana, TN. I love the people there, but the management seems to have decided to use Gunbroker as a way of pricing AR accessories. They were selling Pmags for $35 (when they had them) and Surefire 60-round mags for... no joke... $175 (+ tax, naturally).
The day after the craze started, they priced their 900-round cases of Federal 55gr at $600 (usually $450-ish).
I talked to my buddy, he owns the LGS. He said he held his prices on PMags until he went through 750 of them at about $13 and all his other prices too. His PMags are now $39 for 30 rounders and he has 1/3 of a case of black and 1/3 a case of OD as of this morning. He told me he started looking at prices online and did some math and figured he'd lost 50K holding his prices. He had a customer come in with a Sig AR he'd bought at WallyWorld a few weeks ago, the guy wanted $1600 for it my guy laughed at him then the guy said look 'em up. He did, saw they were selling for $1900, he bought it and flipped it that day for $1900 that is when he started looking online and adjusted his pricing. This was all a few weeks ago. I am happy with what I have in my gun safe. I don't feel I "need" any more then what I have, but I am still irritated with what's going on.
Razorhunter
01-07-13, 15:55
"Let's start a list to remember who screwed us over when the chips were down"
Just about everyone who's posted guns, mags, or ammo for sale on any forum,including this one,since Dec 14th. Add that to the top of your list.
"Let's start a list to remember who screwed us over when the chips were down"
Just about everyone who's posted guns, mags, or ammo for sale on any forum,including this one,since Dec 14th. Add that to the top of your list.
I've had 7 transactions since 14 Dec. Including a trade that involved PMAGS and an LMT BCG (in the mail now) and both guys were perfectly legit and I was happy with what I paid for/received.
It's not everybody on here.
-Jax
I can tell you one vendor that would NOT make this list: DSG Arms. Not only were they still selling PMAGs at normal price until they ran out, they had the Holiday 10-Packs sale and they not only honored the pricing and allowed backorders at the price, they delivered on the goods. Given the market, that's some righteous activity.
Razorhunter
01-07-13, 18:57
Jax, yes Sir, you are correct. It is not everyone, that's why I said just about everyone. There are some good guys out there for sure. What's truly hypocritical, are the guys who I've actually seen complain about price gouging, only to see them simultaneously offering up bcgs, mags, etc at inflated prices!
Jax, yes Sir, you are correct. It is not everyone, that's why I said just about everyone. There are some good guys out there for sure. What's truly hypocritical, are the guys who I've actually seen complain about price gouging, only to see them simultaneously offering up bcgs, mags, etc at inflated prices!
Trust me brother I empathize with your frustration.
-Jax
Just about everyone who's posted guns, mags, or ammo for sale on any forum,including this one,since Dec 14th. Add that to the top of your list.
Oddly enough, I have seen ads from guys I've had transactions with in the past - and they're all classy enough individuals to be selling stuff at a price comparable to the actual MSRP/Value of the product, prorated for condition. It's not everybody, it's just so noticeable when it's egregious, that I can understand what it's all about.
Simple answer is that price gouging only works because there are people ignorant, impatient, or stupid enough to pay those prices. I'll think less of a seller for trying to take maximal advantage of those folks, but frankly it's not any of my business. I couldn't care less if people are trying to sell a KAC lower for the cost of a suborbital flight -
The jokers this thread should be reserved for are the likes of Dick's Sporting Failures, Bocrap Tacticrap, and Cheaper Than Dirtbags who have directly performed actions harmful to manufacturers, made public statements that effectively crap out their own customer base, or continue to push forth with deceitful business practices.
I ordered some dinner for my family from a BBQ place that is next door to a Dicks....one of my kids needs a mouth guard for sports, so i went in
I went by the gun counter
And was hit with the true hypocrisy
Nope, no ar15s....
But, they had plenty of ar15 looking air guns they were selling
No ar15s
But the zombie slayer ar15 airsoft rifles were prominently displayed
I didn't buy a mouth guard
The BBQ was damn tasty though
Singlestack Wonder
01-10-13, 09:09
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=121053
Littlelebowski
01-10-13, 09:25
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=121053
Wow, $1k for a stripped lower AND you pay shipping. Classy.
bondmid003
01-10-13, 11:09
I've had 7 transactions since 14 Dec. Including a trade that involved PMAGS and an LMT BCG (in the mail now) and both guys were perfectly legit and I was happy with what I paid for/received.
It's not everybody on here.
-Jax
I have bought AR, FAL, and Glock mags and ammo at reasonable i.e. not marked up prices since the madness started. I look at the ads and if folks are trying to gouge I simply don't buy. It's frustrating but the only way it will stop is if people don't buy at their jacked up prices and they have to come down.
I've also got backorders with Brownells and DSG, hopefully they honor those orders.
bondmid003
01-10-13, 11:14
Wow, $1k for a stripped lower AND you pay shipping. Classy.
I bought ammo from him at a reasonable price. I don't know what's going on with that... :confused:
TacMedic556
01-10-13, 22:57
I know of a very well respected large Sporting good store here in NW Montana that hasn't even thought of raising prices, while smaller "ma and pop" stores here are jumping on the bandwagon and trying to sell $49 Pmags, $1800 Rock Rivers, $300/ 420 rd M855 etc.
I recently was able to complete a "hot order" (back order direct to large distributor) for a Colt M4 6920 for $1,149 through this very large sporting good store and they have received 15 black rifles this week alone with these kinds of orders.
Do not pay the gouge prices. Just shop around and be patient. Nothing is illegal yet. Things are still being produced. Just call, email, shop and order when you can.
AJC here in Houston has all this crap over priced.
Colt sp901 for 6 grand....wtf.
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?p=1500354#post1500354
"NEW Century Arms C15A1 stripped lower it had mag drop issues and i took it to a local gun smith and the issue was resolved (mags were really tight)"
AJC here in Houston has all this crap over priced.
Colt sp901 for 6 grand....wtf.
I refuse to do business with them anymore.
I refuse to do business with them anymore.
60 buck pmags and telling folks that magplul wont sell to civilians anymore
idiots....
60 buck pmags and telling folks that magplul wont sell to civilians anymore
idiots....
MagPul is a lot smarter than that.
MagPul is a lot smarter than that.
Absolutely. AJC Outdoors in Houston was telling people that Magpul announced they wont (which is bs) only to encourage those to fear buy their "last shipment" of $60 pmags......
Yeah what are they thinking. $60 is nuts. This dude has them for $50 each! :sarcastic:
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=121003
Littlelebowski
01-18-13, 07:58
Oooh, sequentially numbered PSA lowers! Highly collectible!
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=121897
Voodoochild
01-18-13, 08:09
All the price gougers that put mags up for sale at $50 each.
Littlelebowski
01-18-13, 08:13
You know, I get the free market. I'm a libertarian, the real thing.
However, this is a community. I am ****ing certain that if say, all of my shit was stolen tonight out of my house that people I've never met in person but have corresponded with and done business with on this forum; these people would step up and I would be inundated with offers of BCGs, mags, etc. The assholes with 50 posts selling what they have to make a buck...**** you, I'm also certain I'll never see your ass out sweating in training with me or anyone else here. Have fun with your quick buck and be sure to blow it on shit you don't need but don't whine when you don't have a carbine, mags, nor skills to use a carbine.
You know, I get the free market. I'm a libertarian, the real thing.
However, this is a community. I am ****ing certain that if say, all of my shit was stolen tonight out of my house that people I've never met in person but have corresponded with and done business with on this forum; these people would step up and I would be inundated with offers of BCGs, mags, etc. The assholes with 50 posts selling what they have to make a buck...**** you, I'm also certain I'll never see your ass out sweating in training with me or anyone else here. Have fun with your quick buck and be sure to blow it on shit you don't need but don't whine when you don't have a carbine, mags, nor skills to use a carbine.
Ski, that's how I see it too...and that's why these opportunistic ****s shouldn't be allowed to try to sell shit here. It's no coincidence that a good deal of them have only contributed a handful of posts.
It would be ironic if someone bought these lowers then PP would not give the money to the seller because it violated their no gun policy.:suicide:
montanadave
01-18-13, 09:02
All the price gougers that put mags up for sale at $50 each.
I saw two SCAR17s FDE mags sell for $410 a couple of nights ago on GunBroker. I had a dozen on back order with Midway for damn near a year before they finally showed up. Now I can't look at 'em without thinging, "Well, geez, what if ... ?"
Outlander Systems
01-18-13, 09:03
FWIW I just sold loaded PMAGs for $25.00 a piece, and 200 rounds of .223 for $75.00.
I mean, damn. How greedy can people get?
I've never really understood the overvaluation process. I pretty much got back what I put into my stuff.
When I listed the loose sack of ammo, it was like watching sharks in a feeding frenzy. That just tells me what a circus it's become.
I remember buying a PMAG in December '08 for $70, and looking back, I wouldn't give the shop that sold it to me a penny, if they had the last AR-15 on the planet.
Private sellers are a different story.
I like to call them "Opportunistic ****s".
You know, I get the free market. I'm a libertarian, the real thing.
However, this is a community. I am ****ing certain that if say, all of my shit was stolen tonight out of my house that people I've never met in person but have corresponded with and done business with on this forum; these people would step up and I would be inundated with offers of BCGs, mags, etc. The assholes with 50 posts selling what they have to make a buck...**** you, I'm also certain I'll never see your ass out sweating in training with me or anyone else here. Have fun with your quick buck and be sure to blow it on shit you don't need but don't whine when you don't have a carbine, mags, nor skills to use a carbine.
Preach it brother. Sick of it too.
-Jax
I saw two SCAR17s FDE mags sell for $410 a couple of nights ago on GunBroker. I had a dozen on back order with Midway for damn near a year before they finally showed up. Now I can't look at 'em without thinging, "Well, geez, what if ... ?"
I know I have two Charles Daly stripped lowers in my safe, NIB, I bought them from G&R for fifty buck each some time last year. I almost bought 4 just because but I only needed 1 so I felt ahead of the game with 2. I have 2 DD LPK's and all the other parts to build up an A2 lower and another carbine lower. But I'm keeping 'em. My son and I have the A2 upper put together, just need to put the lower together.
RogerinTPA
01-18-13, 09:48
FWIW I just sold loaded PMAGs for $25.00 a piece, and 200 rounds of .223 for $75.00.
I mean, damn. How greedy can people get?
I've never really understood the overvaluation process. I pretty much got back what I put into my stuff.
When I listed the loose sack of ammo, it was like watching sharks in a feeding frenzy. That just tells me what a circus it's become.
I remember buying a PMAG in December '08 for $70, and looking back, I wouldn't give the shop that sold it to me a penny, if they had the last AR-15 on the planet.
Private sellers are a different story.
I like to call them "Opportunistic ****s".
Local gunshops in my AO have been doing that for years, claiming that it was such a rare thing and cannot be found anywhere. I'd quickly tell them I have 100+ of them and you can buy them all day long online for less the $15.00 everywhere...not now of course.
Singlestack Wonder
01-20-13, 08:19
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=121940
The Eastern Sports and Outdoor Show, also known as the Harrisburg Gun Show, has announced it will limit the type of firearms that it will allow to be exhibited. “We have made the decision not to include certain products that in the current climate may attract negative attention,” they posted on their website.
The hunting and fishing show, the largest consumer event in the nation, offers 1,200 exhibitors and will run from February 2 – 10, 2013, just outside of Harrisburg, PA.
A representative to the show told the Daily Caller that “no specific information was available on the type of restricted product at this time” and she offered to have someone call back with the information.
The National Rifle Association, in a statement through their Institute for Legislative Action, stated they “strongly disagrees with Reed Exhibitions’ decision to ban Modern Sporting Rifles.” The statement went on to “urge you to follow the NRA and the outdoor industry’s lead by voicing your displeasure with Reed Exhibitions both before and during the show and encourage them to reconsider their position.”
The NRA is reconsidering their support of the show, “The NRA’s future participation in the Eastern Sports & Outdoor Show will be determined by Reed Exhibitions actions in response to the concerns raised by the NRA, the outdoor industry, and America’s law-abiding gun owners.”
Facebook fans of the show are outraged. One fan writes, “If you stand for and support the second amendment, then you would not allow your judgment to be clouded by the people who mean to do harm to the very foundation of this country. I and, my family, will not be attending.” Fans have set up a page calling for a boycott of the show and have gotten support from 1,348 people since Tuesday.
While the show will not specifically tell the public what products are banned, the website Lancaster Online is reporting that AR style rifles and high-capacity magazines are the targeted products. “Representatives from Kinsey’s Outdoors in Mount Joy and The Sportsman Shop in New Holland, which are both affected by the ban, said they were told by Reed officials they could not bring to the show for sale or display any AR-style rifles or ammunition magazines capable of holding more than 30 rounds,” the site reported.
Reed Exhibitions, the event’s organizer, is based in Norwalk, CT., approximately twenty-five miles from Newtown where the Sandy Hook elementary school shooting took place.
http://dailycaller.com/2013/01/18/americas-largest-outdoor-sports-show-to-ban-ar-15s/#ixzz2IMHrb1Ha
44mag.com has 30 round NMHTG mags back in stock @ $20.99. I don't need any but you guys might.
http://www.44mag.com/product/nhmtg_magazine_magpul_follower/nhmtg
LowSpeed_HighDrag
01-20-13, 13:45
44mag.com has 30 round NMHTG mags back in stock @ $20.99. I don't need any but you guys might.
http://www.44mag.com/product/nhmtg_magazine_magpul_follower/nhmtg
Thanks, I love NHMTG and 44mag, I bought two just for shits and giggles.
LowSpeed_HighDrag
01-20-13, 13:48
Jax Outdoor Gear released the following press message:
The unthinkable tragedy in Connecticut last Friday reinforced the reservations we have been feeling for some time about Jax selling both paramilitary semiautomatic weapons and large capacity magazines. These products do not align well with either the Jax mottos of "Grown-up and Still Having Fun!" or "Life is Better Here." Effective immediately Jax will no longer reorder, special order, or replace any AR15 or other paramilitary semi automatic firearms or high capacity clips exceeding 10 rounds of any kind.
If you live in Colorado, make sure you never again give these traitors your money.
Jax Outdoor Gear can kiss this Jax's (insert colorful words here) :D
-Jax
i think there is a difference between free market enterprise and screwing over your (fellow-likeminded-gun loving enthusiasts) when the chips are down, if we dont stand together in the EE what does that mean when shit actually gets real? (if it does)
44mag.com has 30 round NMHTG mags back in stock @ $20.99. I don't need any but you guys might.
http://www.44mag.com/product/nhmtg_magazine_magpul_follower/nhmtg
One hour later and it's gone. Shit.
I had an email from them. It may be worth the time to register. They had +200 listed in stock when I first checked. It was down to 100 by the time I posted and checked the link.
Thanks, I love NHMTG and 44mag, I bought two just for shits and giggles.
They're one of my favorites too and those are my favorite mags. The price was fair too. Locally they were selling for $20 each w/o the magpul followers and that was in October or November
And on top of that, letting the market set the prices helps keep the items on the market. Last Saturday there were 2 Scar 17s on gunboker (or maybe 4). Now there are tons listed at ripoff prices. You don't have to buy them, but they are available. If they were all available at $2499 they would all be gone right now.
And immediately relisted for 5K+ by a lot of those who bought them.
Why should retailers sell products for less than the prevailing rate, when many of their customers will just resell them, without having to invest in overhead?
white spaniard
01-20-13, 20:17
$100 for Lancer 30 round mags limit two, at local gunshop in San Antonio TX.
http://m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=122096
Seriously? A $1000 markup.... surprisingly a new member with no feedback and just enough posts .....
:suicide:
http://m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=122096
Seriously? A $1000 markup.... surprisingly a new member with no feedback and just enough posts .....
:suicide:
He'll get it, probably not from here though.
How many times does it have to be said that buyers set the price. A friend recently put PMAGS on the auction site and started them at one cent, they went for $55 each.
I just bought a book that is out of print for $230 it originally sold for $20.
Let's not take our anger out on the buyers and sellers, take it out on our politicians and the media that created this situation.
FlyingHunter
01-21-13, 08:13
How many times does it have to be said that buyers set the price. A friend recently put PMAGS on the auction site and started them at one cent, they went for $55 each.
I just bought a book that is out of print for $230 it originally sold for $20.
Let's not take our anger out on the buyers and sellers, take it out on our politicians and the media that created this situation.
Right on Todd! We want to keep our second amendment freedoms, so let's respect the supply and demand market freedoms. If you don't like a price - move on. Focus on the politicians and media.
http://www.ydr.com/local/ci_22412868/lancasteronline.com/article/local/lancasteronline.com/article/local/805353_Cabela-s-drops-out-of-Eastern-Sports-and-Outdoors-Show.html
Cabela's drops out of Harrisburg gun show, cites assault weapons ban
By PAULA WOLF
The Lancaster Intelligencer
Updated: 01/20/2013 07:56:50 AM EST
As reported by The Lancaster Intelligencer
Cabela's Inc., the North American hunting and fishing retailer, announced Saturday that it will not participate in the Eastern Sports and Outdoors Show to be held Feb. 2-10 at the Farm Show Complex in Harrisburg.
This comes on the heels of smaller retailers boycotting because of the decision by event organizer Reed Exhibitions to ban the display and sale of assault weapons and high-capacity ammunition magazines. The ban was imposed following the deadly school shooting in Newtown, Conn., that claimed the lives of 20 children and six women and reignited the gun-control debate.
Read more here.
http://www.ydr.com/local/ci_22412868/lancasteronline.com/article/local/lancasteronline.com/article/local/805353_Cabela-s-drops-out-of-Eastern-Sports-and-Outdoors-Show.html
Cabela's drops out of Harrisburg gun show, cites assault weapons ban
By PAULA WOLF
The Lancaster Intelligencer
Updated: 01/20/2013 07:56:50 AM EST
As reported by The Lancaster Intelligencer
Cabela's Inc., the North American hunting and fishing retailer, announced Saturday that it will not participate in the Eastern Sports and Outdoors Show to be held Feb. 2-10 at the Farm Show Complex in Harrisburg.
This comes on the heels of smaller retailers boycotting because of the decision by event organizer Reed Exhibitions to ban the display and sale of assault weapons and high-capacity ammunition magazines. The ban was imposed following the deadly school shooting in Newtown, Conn., that claimed the lives of 20 children and six women and reignited the gun-control debate.
Read more here.
I don't buy shooting supplies often from Cabelas, but their stock just went up in my book.
Your argument makes no sense. How are the chips down? Where have these so called gun enthusiasts or owners been for the last 5+ years?
i think there is a difference between free market enterprise and screwing over your (fellow-likeminded-gun loving enthusiasts) when the chips are down, if we dont stand together in the EE what does that mean when shit actually gets real? (if it does)
Your argument makes no sense. How are the chips down? Where have these so called gun enthusiasts or owners been for the last 5+ years?
Anyone who had any kind of awareness in 2008/2009 has had plenty of time to start saving for a rainy day. Maybe "chips are down" means late to the party?
The only ones I feel sorry for are those who were too young to start collecting and preparing earlier. Just like the '86 MG ban, at 14, I was too young to do anything.
Anyone who had any kind of awareness in 2008/2009 has had plenty of time to start saving for a rainy day. Maybe "chips are down" means late to the party?
I'm pretty pissed off about the price of gold now.
Anyone who bought it at $600 an ounce should help a brother out and sell it to me for that. Otherwise, they're just taking advantage and screwing me over.
thopkins22
01-21-13, 12:32
If I decide to sell a firearm to "someone in need." I'm not going to do it in this climate for retail. I'm going to ask many thousands of dollars. Don't like it? Don't buy it. But it wouldn't exist on the market without current pricing.
Prices should be high enough that you can always find what you want to buy, and low enough that most of them are selling. Given the market(granted what I believe to be a short term market) prices are still too low. This is econ 101 stuff.
They'll correct when this blows over.
FYI, I'm NOT selling any rifles so don't go looking in the EE.
Your argument makes no sense. How are the chips down? Where have these so called gun enthusiasts or owners been for the last 5+ years?
well the chips might not be "down" but there falling towards the table.
what i mean is we are "pre-possible ban/revolution" so if we jack up the prices on everything we might be limiting our fellow
"freedom fighters"/"battle brothers" from becoming able to "respond" to a national threat to our civil liberties....
now over the internet this might sounds "tin-foil hat like" depending on how you read this.
please understand this is the furthest possible reality. but it is a reality.
well the chips might not be "down" but there falling towards the table.
what i mean is we are "pre-possible ban/revolution" so if we jack up the prices on everything we might be limiting our fellow
"freedom fighters"/"battle brothers" from becoming able to "respond" to a national threat to our civil liberties....
now over the internet this might sounds "tin-foil hat like" depending on how you read this.
please understand this is the furthest possible reality. but it is a reality.
Lefty is ready to back you up!:jester:
http://i859.photobucket.com/albums/ab160/usmcvet0331/Snapbucket/CCCFE33F.jpg
http://i859.photobucket.com/albums/ab160/usmcvet0331/Snapbucket/1ADD0429.jpg
Right on Todd! We want to keep our second amendment freedoms, so let's respect the supply and demand market freedoms. If you don't like a price - move on. Focus on the politicians and media.
Vendors are pulling out in droves from the Eastern Sports and Outdoors Show
Quote:
Outdoor sporting gear retailing giant Cabela’s Inc. and other smaller firms also have announced they won’t participate in next month’s show because of the ban by its organizers [of ARs and "high capacity" magazines].
Here is a list of supporters with links to their Facebook pages. If at all possible support them with your wallet and/or thank them with your words.
http://mynortheastoutdoors.com/esos-boycott-supporters/
2 Million Bullets
Alaska’s Ravencroft Lodge
Appalachian Big Game TV
Arrowhead Outdoors
Athens Archery
Atlantic Tactical
Blitz TV
Blaine Anthony, The Bear Whisperer
Boondock Outdoors
Bowhunter Planet
Cabela’s
CanCooker
Cochrane River Outfitters
Cross Canyon Arms
Cutting Edge Bullets
Dead Ringer Face Book Page Web Site
Direct Action Tactical Firearms
Domari Nolo Defense Consulting Face Book Page Web Site
Dominator 365
Droptine Outfitters
DuckWater Boats
Farmland Trophies Outfitting
Firearms Industry Consulting Group
Fred Eichler – Fulldraw Outfitters
Full Circle Outdoors
Gut N Tag, LLC Face Book Page Web Site
Heartland Whitetails
HookHunt
Hunters and Guides Connection
Hunter Safety Systems
Kinsey’s Outdoors
Keystone Country Store
Kodabow
Lancaster Archery Supply
Major League Bow Hunter
Midwest Whitetail Adventures
Mindful of Nature LLC
Mountain Dog Chews
Muskie Moose, LLC
Nature Blinds, LLC
Northern Hideaway Outfitters
Northern Outdoor Lodge
Open Season TV
Outdoor Edge Knives Face Book Page Web Site
Pipeline Ridge Hunting Preserve
Primal Urge Outdoors
Ralph & Vicki Cianciarulo – Archers Choice Media
Spook Span
Stay Ready Inc
Stokerized Stabilizers
TNT Archery
Trop Gun Shop Face Book Page Web Site
Wallaston Lake Lodge
The Warmbag
Whitetail Bosses
Whitetail Heaven Outfitters
Wired Outdoors
Woodcock Limited of Pennsylvania
Wyvern Creations
X- Stand Treestands
Zook Cabins
SAW Inc--Dallas area Shop frequently at shows.
Owner complains that prices for ARs are too high on TOS hometown forum.
But had no problem listing them at more than 2X retail this weekend.
SCAR17 6500 (down 500 from 2 weeks ago)
SCAR16 4500
ARs 3000-4000 for LMT/Colt.
Excellent news. This is one of the keys to surviving these type of attacks.
http://www.businessinsider.com/group...n-deals-2013-1
They won't be a part of anything firearm related. I'll never deal with them again. Keep dividing this country people.
Let them know how you feel
https://www.groupon.com/support
Now less people will be able to get into contact with proper instructors teaching them firearms safety.
Way to go Groupon.
Update: TV news says the policy is under review.
Hi Todd,
Thanks for your submission! Although we typically respond to most emails in less than 24 hours, we're running a little behind right now. You should hear from us in about 48 hours. Sorry in advance for the delay!
Regards,
Groupon Support
support@groupon.com
Littlelebowski
01-23-13, 06:40
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=122047
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/01/22/groupon-gun-deals_n_2527168.html
Add Groupon to this list.
http://m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=122665
this guy can die in a fire.....
wants $60 a peice for glock mags........ :stop:
http://m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=122665
this guy can die in a fire.....
wants $60 a peice for glock mags........ :stop:
Guys got $100+ for them in 94. And that wasn't before they might become nontransferable, as I understand this legislation aims to do.
If this goes through, or gets close, those prices will be cheap.
I was at a local gun show yesterday and saw a few Glock 19 magazines priced at $45 each. I also saw some Glock 17 magazines priced at $28.99 each.
I was at a local gun show yesterday and saw a few Glock 19 magazines priced at $45 each. I also saw some Glock 17 magazines priced at $28.99 each.
I don't even own a Glock 9 but would have snapped those up those were "normal" prices.
http://m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=122665
this guy can die in a fire.....
wants $60 a peice for glock mags........ :stop:
Looks like they're all sold.
http://www.newschannel5.com/story/20701142/gun-dealers-have-problems-with-credit-card-processors
Some of the big products from that company are Turbo Tax, Quickbooks, and Quicken. Be advised.
Bobert0989
01-28-13, 11:59
TROY BattleMags DID experience a slight price increase, but are now being sold to the public directly (backorders, of course), and offer an explanation to it that I believe. They said they designed and manufactured these mags based on a 7-year sales period to recoup investment, but being faced with possible legislation banning their products, they are trying to earn their projected profits as quickly as possible. I can't blame them for that, and they're still not as high as people selling used PMAG's for $60-70/ea. Some on eBay bringing $120+ each!
It is possible this scenario may pertain to other companies as well, but in this instance I think Troy has done the right thing, merely as an act of self-preservation.
Straight Shooter
01-28-13, 16:12
Hey usmcvet-
I woulda jumped on those $28 G17 mags... hell Gander Mtn YEARS before this last shooting was selling them for $35 while I was buying them all day for $23.
That ****in place should be on every gun owners Number 1 place never to buy any damn thing at. It is mine.
platoonDaddy
01-28-13, 16:49
Lets not forget this wack'o
http://i933.photobucket.com/albums/ad176/slickville/MentalIHealthCheck.jpg
I saw more PMAG M3s at the Palmetto Gun Show this weekend than I bet are available on the Internet. $50 each
NoveskeFan
01-29-13, 11:06
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=122864
I wonder how much I can get for my BCM? I hope this madness ends soon.
brickboy240
01-29-13, 11:48
Want it to end?
Stop paying their asking prices.
Simple enough.
Want it to end?
Stop paying their asking prices.
Simple enough.
Fortunately I am set on mags. Those PMAGs at the show were not moving well at all.
Want it to end?
Stop paying their asking prices.
Simple enough.
This. People at the show this weekend trying to sell mags for 50 & 60 bucks and people stupid enough to buy them. :confused:
Littlelebowski
01-29-13, 12:57
Why the assault weapon ban is probably going nowhere (http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/the-fix/wp/2013/01/29/why-the-assault-weapons-ban-is-probably-going-nowhere/?hpid=z4)
Excellent news. This is one of the keys to surviving these type of attacks.
Vendors are pulling out in droves from the Eastern Sports and Outdoors Show
Quote:
Outdoor sporting gear retailing giant Cabela’s Inc. and other smaller firms also have announced they won’t participate in next month’s show because of the ban by its organizers [of ARs and "high capacity" magazines].
Here is a list of supporters with links to their Facebook pages. If at all possible support them with your wallet and/or thank them with your words.
http://mynortheastoutdoors.com/esos-boycott-supporters/
2 Million Bullets
Alaska’s Ravencroft Lodge
Appalachian Big Game TV
Arrowhead Outdoors
Athens Archery
Atlantic Tactical
Blitz TV
Blaine Anthony, The Bear Whisperer
Boondock Outdoors
Bowhunter Planet
Cabela’s
CanCooker
Cochrane River Outfitters
Cross Canyon Arms
Cutting Edge Bullets
Dead Ringer Face Book Page Web Site
Direct Action Tactical Firearms
Domari Nolo Defense Consulting Face Book Page Web Site
Dominator 365
Droptine Outfitters
DuckWater Boats
Farmland Trophies Outfitting
Firearms Industry Consulting Group
Fred Eichler – Fulldraw Outfitters
Full Circle Outdoors
Gut N Tag, LLC Face Book Page Web Site
Heartland Whitetails
HookHunt
Hunters and Guides Connection
Hunter Safety Systems
Kinsey’s Outdoors
Keystone Country Store
Kodabow
Lancaster Archery Supply
Major League Bow Hunter
Midwest Whitetail Adventures
Mindful of Nature LLC
Mountain Dog Chews
Muskie Moose, LLC
Nature Blinds, LLC
Northern Hideaway Outfitters
Northern Outdoor Lodge
Open Season TV
Outdoor Edge Knives Face Book Page Web Site
Pipeline Ridge Hunting Preserve
Primal Urge Outdoors
Ralph & Vicki Cianciarulo – Archers Choice Media
Spook Span
Stay Ready Inc
Stokerized Stabilizers
TNT Archery
Trop Gun Shop Face Book Page Web Site
Wallaston Lake Lodge
The Warmbag
Whitetail Bosses
Whitetail Heaven Outfitters
Wired Outdoors
Woodcock Limited of Pennsylvania
Wyvern Creations
X- Stand Treestands
Zook Cabins
thopkins22
01-29-13, 18:53
Fortunately I am set on mags. Those PMAGs at the show were not moving well at all.
Ditto at last weekends show in Houston. Lots of magazines at high prices that weren't selling.
They'll be ten to twenty dollars cheaper at next month's if not even cheaper.
Singlestack Wonder
01-29-13, 21:31
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=122864
TacMedic556
01-30-13, 10:44
Ok so help me out with this so I am not, "that guy".
Before supply disappeared and demand shot to high heaven, a COLT M16 BCG new was about $300 from Specialized Armament and $185 from Grant.
What would a reasonable price be now? There are thousands of individuals that want it and need it that cannot find one. I have a brand new, in the grease COLT M16 BCG (recent production gold spring) that I was going to keep as the one and only spare BCG, but with prices where they are on Gunbroker and ebay it seems foolish not to jump on, sell it for some money to put towards another much needed Geissele SSA and Omega 7.0 Rail that I am putting on a 6920.
Ok so help me out with this so I am not, "that guy".
Before supply disappeared and demand shot to high heaven, a COLT M16 BCG new was about $300 from Specialized Armament and $185 from Grant.
What would a reasonable price be now? There are thousands of individuals that want it and need it that cannot find one. I have a brand new, in the grease COLT M16 BCG (recent production gold spring) that I was going to keep as the one and only spare BCG, but with prices where they are on Gunbroker and ebay it seems foolish not to jump on, sell it for some money to put towards another much needed Geissele SSA and Omega 7.0 Rail that I am putting on a 6920.
Put it on gunbroker & let the buyers decide what to pay.
PdxMotoxer
01-30-13, 11:54
Re-Reading the OP's very first post...
i though this "list" was supposed to be about those who turned their
backs on us and STOPPED SELLING said product or halted internet sales
because of fear they might "get in trouble".
and the OP even said this IS NOT about price gouging.
(that's simple.. don't like their price don't buy from them)
But it's companies that be cause of P.C. (political correctness)
that have all together HALTED and STOPPED sales that need to go on "the list" so when this scare frenzy ends we dont forget who turned their BACK completely on us.
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=122864
I'm a free market person like many others here, but crap like this is what crosses the sensible line of respectability.
I agree completely.
If you spot a company selling $60 magazines, $3000 AR's, $1200 BCG's, etc they should go on this list.
i hardily agree, BUUUT what about people here getting 60.00 for a glock 23 mag. or 30.00 for an ar mag that was 10.oo$ 2 months ago. mods here should police our Lil gouging puter"" buddies here 1st. dont even read the w.t.s. boards anymore.
shame\shame/shame
jjw
I think this one wins. $90 for used USGI Mags! WTF!
Each Mag is US Military Surplus. Same ones trusted by the Soldiers serving today. Hard to find, but I have a total of 6 that are ready to sell. Prices: $90/ea or or 3 for $250 or 6 for $475. Shipping is included.
**Items are in working condition, I fired 30rds through each and cleaned to ensure I am selling fully functioning items**
http://www.gunsamerica.com/968450283/30_rd_AR_15_NATO_Mags_223_5_56.htm
NEW! COLT USGI AR-15 20 Round 5.56/.223 Nato Steel Magazine
Brand New (no box) Colt mfg. Co. USGI 20 round magazine for AR-15 5.56mm NATO / .223 Rifle. *Made in USA *Strong Steel Spring, with a Black follower *Reliable Colt manufacturing These Magazines have never been used, and hold up to 20 rounds.
1=$85 or 4 for $300
http://www.gunsamerica.com/910490724/NEW_COLT_USGI_AR_15_20_Round_5_56_223_Nato_Steel_Magazin.htm
NEW! COLT style USGI AR-15 30 Round 5.56/.223 Nato Steel Magazine
Brand New (no box) D&H Industries Co. Inc. USGI 30 round magazine for AR-15 5.56mm NATO / .223 Rifle. *Made in USA *Strong Steel Spring, with a Green follower *Grey teflon coating
These Magazines have never been used, and hold up to 30 rounds.
1=$60 or 4=$200
http://www.gunsamerica.com/992851244/NEW_no_box_D_H_Industries_Co_Inc_USGI_AR_15_30_Round_5_56_223_Nato_Steel_Magazine.htm
I think this one wins. $90 for used USGI Mags! WTF!
Each Mag is US Military Surplus. Same ones trusted by the Soldiers serving today. Hard to find, but I have a total of 6 that are ready to sell. Prices: $90/ea or or 3 for $250 or 6 for $475. Shipping is included.
**Items are in working condition, I fired 30rds through each and cleaned to ensure I am selling fully functioning items**
http://www.gunsamerica.com/968450283/30_rd_AR_15_NATO_Mags_223_5_56.htm
And they're beaters!!
:lol:
Somehow, I don't think that genius is going to be making a sale.
Littlelebowski
01-31-13, 20:21
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=123131
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=123140
"Buy with confidence. I have completed several transactions without incident." iTrader Rating: 0
At least change your ad so it doesn't show procedures for Arfcom.
SeriousStudent
01-31-13, 23:16
My favorite has got to be how the prices are immediately removed as soon as the item is sold.
Selling a Glock mag for $85? Own up to it like a man. Don't edit the thread to delete the price, as soon as you sell.
I'm not selling stuff at a high price, I'm not buying at a high price. In fact, I've given away mags for free to some folks that I thought needed them.
But frankly, it's cowardly to sell stuff for a markup like that then cover your tracks. Sounds like shame to me.
The Archangel
02-01-13, 10:51
I was about to pull the trigger on two DDM4v1 rifles at Rainer, I waited too long and the price went up $200 or so the other day. I went to complain on their forum at arfcom and saw there was already a thread there on it.
They're pretty much in my shit list now.
Yeah, Free-Market so is ties suck. This whole supply and demand stuff is crap. Communism wouldn't allow shenanigans of this sort!
So let me get this straight, you procrastinated and now you want to rub a good company into the dirt. Pathetic...
Singlestack Wonder
02-12-13, 14:11
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=124143
Ok so help me out with this so I am not, "that guy".
Before supply disappeared and demand shot to high heaven, a COLT M16 BCG new was about $300 from Specialized Armament and $185 from Grant.
What would a reasonable price be now? There are thousands of individuals that want it and need it that cannot find one. I have a brand new, in the grease COLT M16 BCG (recent production gold spring) that I was going to keep as the one and only spare BCG, but with prices where they are on Gunbroker and ebay it seems foolish not to jump on, sell it for some money to put towards another much needed Geissele SSA and Omega 7.0 Rail that I am putting on a 6920.
No, you don't understand. You don't want to get on the bad side of some guys.
You should sell it for the pre craziness price, so someone can else sell it for today's going rate.
My personal favorite.
www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=124143
LowSpeed_HighDrag
02-12-13, 20:07
I just made $950 off of a lower and BCG. Both buyers were more than happy to pay the price, I was more than happy to pay off my Benelli M4, and both parties benefitted. What of it?
Littlelebowski
02-12-13, 20:15
My personal favorite.
www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=124143
Won't even pay shipping, classy.
thopkins22
02-12-13, 22:33
You guys are brutal. I'm going to need a shell user name for when I reap profit during the next panic. :p
Kidding....
http://m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=122665
this guy can die in a fire.....
wants $60 a peice for glock mags........ :stop:
Why ? because you don't like or cannot afford the price?
May you die in a fire your commie tard. Those that really want them or really need them will find a way to buy them. It is a great system called capitalism.
So, someone school me.
Those of you who are offended, what price should an individual be selling their AR-15, or magazine, or whatever? Early 2012 prices? What about people listing the item for sale in an auction? Should they agree to complete the sell if the high bid on that AR comes to a price that reflects the current market trends?
Belmont31R
02-13-13, 00:47
So, someone school me.
Those of you who are offended, what price should an individual be selling their AR-15, or magazine, or whatever? Early 2012 prices? What about people listing the item for sale in an auction? Should they agree to complete the sell if the high bid on that AR comes to a price that reflects the current market trends?
They can sell it for whatever they want. People who cripe about the free market forget consumer talk is the 'check and balance' on people selling stuff for high prices. Its called 'consumer sentiment'. By all means sell whatever you have for whatever you can get for it. Just don't expect the people to come around and cheer it. Capitalism is not one sided, which I think its forgotten. Do you talk to people who have bought cars or other goods? Do you cheer the car dealer who raped your buddy or did you call him a dumbass?
They can sell it for whatever they want. People who cripe about the free market forget consumer talk is the 'check and balance' on people selling stuff for high prices. Its called 'consumer sentiment'. By all means sell whatever you have for whatever you can get for it. Just don't expect the people to come around and cheer it. Capitalism is not one sided, which I think its forgotten. Do you talk to people who have bought cars or other goods? Do you cheer the car dealer who raped your buddy or did you call him a dumbass?
No, we cheer the guy who bought something below the going rate.
The guy that sold it too cheap, he's the the one we call the dumbass.
Belmont31R
02-13-13, 03:52
No, we cheer the guy who bought something below the going rate.
The guy that sold it too cheap, he's the the one we call the dumbass.
A lot of people cheer the guy who raped someone, though.
Which is my point. It goes both ways. I'm not going to get a set of pom pom's because 100 people got ****ed by a car dealer. I might if 100 people raped the car dealer, and they were selling cars for 'the best price ever'.
Littlelebowski
02-13-13, 07:04
Why ? because you don't like or cannot afford the price?
May you die in a fire your commie tard. Those that really want them or really need them will find a way to buy them. It is a great system called capitalism.
Well, if you read this thread, you would find that there's no general consensus against the free market. There is disdain against people who are not part of this community who swoop into M4C to sell something and not participate in this community.
In other words, many of us appreciate this fountain of knowledge and don't want to shit where we eat.
Great grammar, by the way.
Singlestack Wonder
02-13-13, 09:11
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=123918
Singlestack Wonder
02-13-13, 13:20
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=122203
Why ? because you don't like or cannot afford the price?
May you die in a fire your commie tard. Those that really want them or really need them will find a way to buy them. It is a great system called capitalism.
I had a booth with my friend at the Hattiesburg gun show last weekend. There is a massive difference in free market prices and gouging.
Average price for a brick of .22 long was $70-$75. Still pissed about that.
Some no name delta ring assembly for $45!. Barrel nut not included.
Nothing much makes me madder than gun owners screwing gun owners.
-Jax
249+ posts about a revenge list on people who "screwed" us over in EE, internet commerce, and local businesses. I'll make this simple to understand. None of those sellers screwed us over. You want the short list on who screwed us over? That's easy. Look at your state and U.S. Representatives, Senators, Governors and Presidents that have attacked the 2nd Amendment over the years. They cause the constant fear of present and future restrictions and bans, which lead to panic. Don't know who our enemies are? Guess what? The NRA does, and they let their membership know who is for us and who is against us. The state pro-gun associations do the same.
Oh, you're not a member of either, then GFY! You're part of the reason why the chips are down. Let's start a public list of members who aren't in the NRA. Yeah, let's bring the pitchforks, clubs, tar and feathers, and start in on the people who haven't joined the NRA. Because they are the people who really screwed us over when the chips were down. You know who you are. Look in the friggin mirror.
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