View Full Version : Port Authority Cop busted for having ARs
From the New York Post:
"Port Authority cop Jeffrey Haner was busted on possession of two illegal assault weapons, including the same type of Bushmaster rifle used in the Newtown massacre, authorities said.
Ramsey, NJ, police said they took a total of 10 weapons from Haner after his wife asked for a temporary restraining order"
I know that under current Jersey law, LEOs are just like everyone else, having to go through same procedures to obtain an AR and also having the same restrictions on the source of all evil in America; flash-hiders, 30 round mags, collapsible stocks and worst of all, the dreaded bayonet lug.
I'm wondering if you can get into hot water for even bringing a non-New Jersey compliant rifle to a NJ public range, even if you ARE A FEDERAL LEO AND A RESIDENT OF ANOTHER STATE and have obtained it legally and can own it legally in another state?
And as an aside, would anyone have cared if he and his spouse were not involved in whatever domestic dispute that caused the whole thing?
"Would anyone have cared..."
Isn't that the same story for all of us? Its all fine until "they" have some reason to look at you or come after you. At that point, if they want to find something, they will.
On one hand I feel bad for the guy, since these laws are a bunch of BS that NOBODY should have to contend with. On the other hand I don't like the elitist, above-the-law-attitude this demonstrates. If this officer found an AR in my trunk one day while I was passing through his state, would he have busted me?
HackerF15E
12-31-12, 09:41
Exactly the reason why only military and police should have assault weapons!
:rolleyes:
Like I posted in another thread, do not put ANYTHING past the rat bastards. The will eat thier own to further their twisted agenda.
"Would anyone have cared..."
Isn't that the same story for all of us? Its all fine until "they" have some reason to look at you or come after you. At that point, if they want to find something, they will.
Depends on "their" motivation. I had a bitch pull a similar stunt on me and had my guns taken for like a week.
They (local L.E.) didn't care about my SBRs, etc. Didn't even check my papers when I went an picked them up.
I'm wondering if you can get into hot water for even bringing a non-New Jersey compliant rifle to a NJ public range, even if you have obtained it legally and can own it legally in another state?
Correct, you cannot bring a lawfully owned (say Pennsylvania purchased AR-15 by a Pennsylvania resident) to a NJ range. About the only thing you CAN do is travel THROUGH NJ with your lawfully owned AR15... complying with federal laws for how it is secured in the vehicle. Don't you ever get it out of the trunk whilst in NJ.
I edited my post with additional comments because for some reason I can't add a reply to VoodooMan. What is up with that?
Originally Posted by Ick
Correct, you cannot bring a lawfully owned (say Pennsylvania purchased AR-15 by a Pennsylvania resident) to a NJ range. About the only thing you CAN do is travel THROUGH NJ with your lawfully owned AR15... complying with federal laws for how it is secured in the vehicle. Don't you ever get it out of the trunk whilst in NJ.
*Unless the AR15 you are bringing is NJ-compliant, in which case you are allowed to go the range there - just like you can with a pistol with a compliant 15rnd (or less) magazine (and no hollow points).
I thought NJ was like Maryland... you have to have your evil looking rifle "registered" with local authorities. For example, I could box up my M4 in the trunk and take it to my Maryland secondary residence... but I better be registered in their system if I have it anywhere in MD outside the locked case... including IN MY OWN RESIDENCE.
Looking to learn....
Correct, you cannot bring a lawfully owned (say Pennsylvania purchased AR-15 by a Pennsylvania resident) to a NJ range. About the only thing you CAN do is travel THROUGH NJ with your lawfully owned AR15... complying with federal laws for how it is secured in the vehicle. Don't you ever get it out of the trunk whilst in NJ.
Very true, I have hated living in this state and did not give any of my shooting money to any establishment in the state, I went to PA or the base range to shot and buy ammo.
I'll look for the two craziest cases here, but at least Christie fired the judge in the first case.
http://abcnews.go.com/US/brian-aitken-jersey-gun-charge-commuted-gov-chris/t/story?id=12448867
And at the airport don't miss your plane.
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2011/01/18/traveling-mans-gun-arrest-appealed-supreme-court/
A retired police officer in NJ told me even though hollow points are legal the laws are so construed that he uses FMJ in his pistols at home to reduce the chances of being arrested if he has to defend himself.
SWATcop556
12-31-12, 10:47
A retired police officer in NJ told me even though hollow points are legal the laws are so construed that he uses FMJ in his pistols at home to reduce the chances of being arrested if he has to defend himself.
Ok I seriously just had a WTF moment. What law was he concerned with that he made that call? Not being snide. I'm honestly curious.
Voodoo_Man
12-31-12, 10:59
Ok I seriously just had a WTF moment. What law was he concerned with that he made that call? Not being snide. I'm honestly curious.
NJ state police have a habit of locking people up for hollow point ammo.
A buddy of mine is active NJSP and he told me on the regular he has troopers bringing the average citizen in on some type of illegal possession of hollow point charges after they respond to a call to that complainants home for whatever reason and see hollow points. It is perfectly legal to own them in NJ, you can transport them (as long as they are not in a firearm) and you can have them loaded ready to roll in your home, but troopers still lock people up for them.
edit; just to add, anytime I go over I make sure to have federal EFMJ rounds loaded in my 15rnd glock mags. LEO's are legally allowed to carry hollow points in NJ (regardless of what you have heard or read) but who wants to chance their life/career to some random trooper knowing the details?
Correct, you cannot bring a lawfully owned (say Pennsylvania purchased AR-15 by a Pennsylvania resident) to a NJ range. About the only thing you CAN do is travel THROUGH NJ with your lawfully owned AR15... complying with federal laws for how it is secured in the vehicle. Don't you ever get it out of the trunk whilst in NJ.
This. The FOPA of 1986 only allows peacable travel directly through a ban state. If you stop to sightsee or visit, you're no longer covered. It's advisable when travelling through communist territory to remove any exterior evidence of gun ownership. No need inviting unwanted scrutiny. :(
Voodoo_Man
12-31-12, 11:24
Correct, you cannot bring a lawfully owned (say Pennsylvania purchased AR-15 by a Pennsylvania resident) to a NJ range. About the only thing you CAN do is travel THROUGH NJ with your lawfully owned AR15... complying with federal laws for how it is secured in the vehicle. Don't you ever get it out of the trunk whilst in NJ.
*Unless the AR15 you are bringing is NJ-compliant, in which case you are allowed to go the range there - just like you can with a pistol with a compliant 15rnd (or less) magazine (and no hollow points).
Like I posted in another thread, do not put ANYTHING past the rat bastards. The will eat thier own to further their twisted agenda.
I assume that you are referring to the cop's wife and those like her who use privileged information from a marriage to destroy a man's life?
I will not be visiting that far north any time soon. ;)
Ok I seriously just had a WTF moment. What law was he concerned with that he made that call? Not being snide. I'm honestly curious.
You can own HP, but can't really possess it outside the home. And if you use it you in defense of your home you're asking for an extra legal hurdle to clear.
If the NRA cared about NJ they would pay for billboards on the turnpike and other well traversed roadways reminding not only the populace but also law enforcement that these are in fact legal and nearly pointless to demonize in such a simpleton manner.
It would show they care about members in the northeast and end the life damaging fallacy here in this state.
NJ, police said they took a total of 10 weapons from Haner after his wife asked for a temporary restraining order"
There is no faster, more efficient legal way for an overall innocent man to have his life destroyed than via a bogus TRO. Temporary in name and even duration perhaps, but the damage can last forever.
And as an aside, would anyone have cared if he and his spouse were not involved in whatever domestic dispute that caused the whole thing?
You mean if someone had evidence you owned "illegal" weapons would LE ignore it? Extremely unlikely, at least within an official capacity. But personally many know it's petty, misguided garbage.
The first carbine class I ever took had a few local LEO's and NJSP troopers in it. Every single one, and I mean each one without exception had ARs which would be deemed illegal for me to have and all of them were using non altered 20 and 30 round mags.
I don't know if these were department issued rifles or not, but I doubt it. They were mostly custom built looking affairs so I doubt they were issued, but I just didn't know as much back then.
I also remembers few of them having 9mm handguns with magazines holding more than 15 rounds.
I can't comment if the law does allow LEO's to have weapons that are evil and illegal for me, if these guys were ignoring the law, thought they were better than the law or were simply unaware of it. Just know what I observed.
SWATcop556
12-31-12, 13:26
NJ state police have a habit of locking people up for hollow point ammo.
A buddy of mine is active NJSP and he told me on the regular he has troopers bringing the average citizen in on some type of illegal possession of hollow point charges after they respond to a call to that complainants home for whatever reason and see hollow points. It is perfectly legal to own them in NJ, you can transport them (as long as they are not in a firearm) and you can have them loaded ready to roll in your home, but troopers still lock people up for them.
edit; just to add, anytime I go over I make sure to have federal EFMJ rounds loaded in my 15rnd glock mags. LEO's are legally allowed to carry hollow points in NJ (regardless of what you have heard or read) but who wants to chance their life/career to some random trooper knowing the details?
You can own HP, but can't really possess it outside the home. And if you use it you in defense of your home you're asking for an extra legal hurdle to clear.
If the NRA cared about NJ they would pay for billboards on the turnpike and other well traversed roadways reminding not only the populace but also law enforcement that these are in fact legal and nearly pointless to demonize in such a simpleton manner.
It would show they care about members in the northeast and end the life damaging fallacy here in this state.
All the more reason not to ever darken the state line. Good Lord!
JBecker 72
12-31-12, 14:07
Wow... New Jersey, the taint of America.
Voodoo_Man
12-31-12, 14:33
Firearms in NJ have to be legal for that state, thats all. If they come from CA they can be used legally at a range NJ because they comply with the NJ firearms restrictions laws.
This was told to me by a few NJSP guys who are "been there done that" type.
Also LE can technically posses magazines and firearms that would otherwise be prohibited for the general public, so 30rnders and muzzle breaks but only if their dept allows them to.
Again this was all told to me and I consider secondhand info as I do not travel into NJ unless I absolutely have to.
Suwannee Tim
12-31-12, 18:08
I have been told that New Jersey gun laws are convoluted, confusing and contradictory.
I'm wondering if you can get into hot water for even bringing a non-New Jersey compliant rifle to a NJ public range, even if you have obtained it legally and can own it legally in another state?
I don't have the specific case in front of me, but I seem to recall that a young man moved to Jersey in the last few years under almost exactly the circumstance you describe, except he didn't take his prohibited weapon the the range, I believe he's doing, or recieved a seven(7)year sentence in state prison....
Nice place, well on its way to eastern European style totalitarianism...
I don't have the specific case in front of me, but I seem to recall that a young man moved to Jersey in the last few years under almost exactly the circumstance you describe, except he didn't take his prohibited weapon the the range, I believe he's doing, or recieved a seven(7)year sentence in state prison....
Nice place, well on its way to eastern European style totalitarianism...
See my post.
bondmid003
12-31-12, 21:51
I have been told that New Jersey gun laws are convoluted, confusing and contradictory.
You would be correct sir
Ps Todd hit the nail on the head with the two examples of New Jersey law insanity
See my post.
N.J. Man Spared 7 Years in Prison for Guns Legally Owned
Thats the one...I see Christie merely commuted the injustice, leaving the citizen a convicted felon....I'm sure that Christie will embrace Obama again as he tramples down the 2nd...
PA PATRIOT
01-01-13, 00:29
I had called the NJ A/G's office in November asking what restrictions a active off duty or retired officer carrying under the federal law in NJ would have to abide by. No one I talked to had a clue and I was passed a round several times before I finally gave up.
I figure may safest bet would be to carry a "J" frame with Non-Expanding FMJ Full Wad-Cutters with two speed strips while I travel about in NJ.
Also many L/E Dept's in PA forbid the use of department owned firearms and ammunition in NJ so that should be a major red flag for those who wish to carry there.
Larry Vickers
01-01-13, 07:00
I feel sorry for ANYONE who has to live in New Jersey - one of my longtime students was a Chief of Police in NJ ( MAP) - as soon as he retired as Chief he packed up the family and moved out west
He told me he couldn't get out of NJ quick enough
You'll never see me doing a class there
Terrible place to live for those that cherish their 2A rights
I feel sorry for ANYONE who has to live in New Jersey - one of my longtime students was a Chief of Police in NJ ( MAP) - as soon as he retired as Chief he packed up the family and moved out west
He told me he couldn't get out of NJ quick enough
You'll never see me doing a class there
Terrible place to live for those that cherish their 2A rights
We have past damage to repair here, but for those of us born and raised with family in NJ this is still home. And if everyone who cares simply runs away we will have almost no one left to fight the unjust restrictions with us.
Suwannee Tim
01-01-13, 11:17
Then there is the case of Brian Aitken (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brian_Aitken) who moved from Colorado to New Jersey and was transporting three handguns while moving. His mother thought he was suicidal and called 911. The cops arrested him and he was convicted and sentenced to seven years in prison. Governor Christie commuted his sentence.
We have past damage to repair here.......
You have hope then? Is it realistic hope or forlorn hope?
You have hope then? Is it realistic hope or forlorn hope?
Why in hell would I give up hope? Who does that? And what about something as recent and also unlikely as Heller?
Odds are against sure, but I've never been one to concern myself with odds when something of great importance is at stake.
From the New York Post:
I know that under current Jersey law, LEOs are just like everyone else, having to go through same procedures to obtain an AR and also having the same restrictions on the source of all evil in America; flash-hiders, 30 round mags, collapsible stocks and worst of all, the dreaded bayonet lug.
The laws in NJ concerning LEOs having privately owned "assault weapons" are interpreted differently by each county Court. Listed as exempt from the "Assault Weapon" ban is:
"A regularly employed member, including a detective, of the police department of any county or municipality, or of any State, interstate, municipal or county park police force or boulevard police force, at all times while in the State of New Jersey" NJSA 2C:39-6(7) (a)
Some Courts in NJ have held the LEOs can have "Assault Weapons" while others have allowed charges to proceed. In the 1990s a sitting State Attorney General directed that no LEO would be prosecuted for possession of an "Assault Weapon" until the legislature clarified the Statute. No clarification ever took place.
While I personally believe that possession of an semi-auto rifle, regardless of features, is protected under the 2nd Amendment, this officer will have a long haul to clear his name.
Mike
I feel sorry for ANYONE who has to live in New Jersey - one of my longtime students was a Chief of Police in NJ ( MAP) - as soon as he retired as Chief he packed up the family and moved out west
He told me he couldn't get out of NJ quick enough
You'll never see me doing a class there
Terrible place to live for those that cherish their 2A rights
My last day of work I left the building, got in my car and headed west. I don't miss the NJ politics at all. Unfortunately, CO is looking more like NJ when it come to the progressive BS.
Look forward to seeing you at SHOT.
Mike
We have past damage to repair here, but for those of us born and raised with family in NJ this is still home. And if everyone who cares simply runs away we will have almost no one left to fight the unjust restrictions with us.
I'm sure there are 1,000s who feel exactly the same way in CA. Unfortunately they are outnumbered by the millions who have effectively disarmed them.
Each state is a ship taking on water. Some states have taken on very little water and there are plenty of people to keep it that way, some states have so much water that if everyone who cares started bailing it would still sink.
The question is how long to you stay on the ship. It may be a nice ship, but if you don't have enough people helping it is eventually doomed.
NJ state police have a habit of locking people up for hollow point ammo.
A buddy of mine is active NJSP and he told me on the regular he has troopers bringing the average citizen in on some type of illegal possession of hollow point charges after they respond to a call to that complainants home for whatever reason and see hollow points. It is perfectly legal to own them in NJ, you can transport them (as long as they are not in a firearm) and you can have them loaded ready to roll in your home, but troopers still lock people up for them.
You've got to be ****ing kidding me.
My last day of work I left the building, got in my car and headed west. I don't miss the NJ politics at all.
Surely no one would miss NJ politics, but I can't help but wonder if you or your counterparts ever voiced any of these overt concerns in any sort of official manner. I know you had a lot at stake of course, but was there nothing whatsoever you could have done instead of leaving out of frustration?
Edit: And I don't necessarily mean you personally, just frustrated LE as a collective. I know for certain there are many like you here, so why the silence?
Surely no one would miss NJ politics, but I can't help but wonder if you or your counterparts ever voiced any of these overt concerns in any sort of official manner. I know you had a lot at stake of course, but was there nothing whatsoever you could have done instead of leaving out of frustration?
Edit: And I don't necessarily mean you personally, just frustrated LE as a collective. I know for certain there are many like you here, so why the silence?
There were more than a few pro 2A Police Chief's in NJ. We spoke out every opportunity. I sat in meetings of the State Chief's Association while members vocally supported right to carry. Unfortunately we were the minority. Personally, I refused an "invitation" from my Mayor to join Bloomberg's anti-gun group.
I can appreciate your frustrations. I watched as attempts to reform the permit system fell on deaf ears. In 27+ years in law enforcement in NJ I met very few pro 2A politicians. Nearly all the republicans in NJ would be moderate democrats (if such a thing exists) elsewhere. The democrats are as corrupt as they come.
I lived in NJ from age 7 to 48. I did all I could do to change the system. There came an opportunity to leave and I did. IMHO the only thing that will change 2A rights in NJ is Federal Court intervention. The State is broken beyond self repair. The NJ Supreme Court runs amuck and is a large part of the problem. There are no easy answers for the good people left in NJ.
Good luck,
Mike
Mike I just wanted to take a moment to thank you for the meaningful and informative reply. Hope you're enjoying the new surroundings.
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