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Belloc
01-04-13, 09:08
http://buchanan.org/blog/the-republicans-after-dunkirk-5448


The Republicans — After Dunkirk
Friday - January 4, 2013

By Patrick J. Buchanan

At the Potsdam conference with Harry Truman and Josef Stalin, Winston Churchill learned that the voters of the nation he had led for five years through World War II had just voted to throw him out of office.

“It may well be a blessing in disguise,” said his wife Clementine.

“At the moment, it seems quite effectively disguised,” replied Churchill.

Republicans must feel that way today. For they have survived their own Dunkirk. They may have left their helmets, canteens and rifles behind, but they did finally get off the beach.

That Republicans suffered a rout, as the British did with the fall of France and evacuation at Dunkirk in 1940, is undeniable.

The party that blocked tax increases since George H.W. Bush agreed to raise Ronald Reagan’s top rate of 28 percent to 35 percent, thus repudiating his “no-new-taxes” pledge, just signed on to one of the largest tax increases in history.

Payroll taxes on working Americans will rise by a third, from 4.2 percent of wages and salaries to 6.2 percent. For couples earning $450,000, the tax rate rises from 15 to 20 percent on dividends and capital gains, and from 35 to 39.6 percent on ordinary income. The death tax will rise from 35 to 40 percent on estates over $5 million.

Obamacare will push those rates up further. And now we learn the bill was stuffed with tax breaks for windmills, NASCAR owners and Hollywood.

Why did Republicans go along?

Had they not, taxes would have risen for everyone. And Obama would have postured as the tax-cutting savior of the middle class by proposing to restore the Bush tax cuts for every couple earning less than $250,000.

What does this bill do to spur growth and create jobs? Nothing.

Even Lord Keynes would have wondered what these Americans were doing raising taxes on a recovering economy.

The GOP defense: We took this rotten deal to prevent a worse one.

And what, if any, is the “blessing in disguise”?

Obama has no more leverage. The Bush tax cuts for the 98 percent are now permanent. To block further tax hikes, all the House need do, from now to 2017, is stand united and just say no.

Obama is thus almost certainly staring at four more trillion-dollar deficits to match the last four, and he has no leverage to force Republicans to provide him with new revenue.

The president threatens that before he signs on to new spending cuts, Republicans will have to “make the rich pay their fair share.”

The GOP response should be: We will work with you on spending cuts, but there will be no more tax increases. If higher taxes are a condition you impose for spending cuts, there will be no spending cuts.

But, Mr. President, you will be in the driver’s seat when we go over the cliff into bankruptcy. You will be your party’s Herbert Hoover.

John Boehner and the Republicans got their clocks cleaned in these negotiations because they believed the president was dealing in good faith.

But the ideology and the interests of the Democratic Party dictate not only preserving federal programs, but expanding the numbers of beneficiaries, already near 100 million.

For the larger the number of beneficiaries, the larger the bloc of voters for the party of government and the greater the opposition to any who would dare to cut government.

The question for Republicans is what they do now, besides say no to new taxes.

Most Democrats are not going to agree to freeze or cut Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, Obamacare, food stamps, federal aid to education, Head Start, Pell Grants, housing subsidies, welfare, earned income tax credits or unemployment checks. These are the party’s pride and joy, the reason the Democratic Party exists.

As we have seen since 2009, Democrats will readily accept trillion-dollar deficits rather than do even minor surgery on their cherished programs.

As for the Republicans, is it wise to propose cuts in Social Security and Medicare, upon which Republican seniors depend, when they know for certain Democrats will reject those cuts and take credit for doing so?

Will Republicans recommend cuts in defense and foreign aid and a rollback of the U.S. military presence in Europe, the Far East and Persian Gulf? Sens. John McCain and Lindsey Graham already want to know why we are not intervening in Syria. Soon, some Republicans will be beating the drums for strikes on Iran.

Republicans Chris Christie and Peter King already want to know why Congress has not forked over $60 billion to repair the damage done to New Jersey and New York by Hurricane Sandy.

With the GOP splintering, with Democrats running the Senate and White House, conservatives must realize: They cannot make policy.

Let the Democrats take the lead, drive the car, propose the tax hikes, refuse to make the spending cuts and answer for where we are in 2016, because, right now, it looks as though we are headed for an even bigger cliff.

For the next two years, the best offense may be a good defense

Business_Casual
01-04-13, 09:20
The British never recovered and lost their empire entirely by the 1950's.

Thanks Pat!

bc

Pork Chop
01-04-13, 09:41
Neither side has even the slightest interest in what's best for the "country" only what's best for the "party". I honestly do not believe they give even the slightest shit if we descend into 2nd or 3rd world status, as long as their party can blame it on the other & gain votes & control out of the ashes.

No.6
01-04-13, 09:45
Neither side has even the slightest interest in what's best for the "country" only what's best for the "party". I honestly do not believe they give even the slightest shit if we descend into 2nd or 3rd world status, as long as their party can blame it on the other & gain votes & control out of the ashes.


Are you saying that there is effectively only one party now in Washington? The "I'll help me and my buddies and to hell with everyone else" party?

Pork Chop
01-04-13, 09:51
Are you saying that there is effectively only one party now in Washington? The "I'll help me and my buddies and to hell with everyone else" party?

Not so much one party, they clearly hate each other.

Think of if like letting your dog starve to death to spite your ex wife because it was her dog too.

We're the dog.

No.6
01-04-13, 10:01
If the Repubs hate the Dems, then they sure seem to get along real well in my eyes. Dems say "we want" and the Repubs say "OK", then whine about how they had no choice but to go along.

Pork Chop
01-04-13, 10:07
Political maneuvering. How can I let bad shit happen & blame it on them?

Democrats are just better at it.

brushy bill
01-04-13, 21:52
Are you saying that there is effectively only one party now in Washington? The "I'll help me and my buddies and to hell with everyone else" party?

I don't think he is saying it, but I'm sure thinking it.

Alaskapopo
01-04-13, 21:57
Neither side has even the slightest interest in what's best for the "country" only what's best for the "party". I honestly do not believe they give even the slightest shit if we descend into 2nd or 3rd world status, as long as their party can blame it on the other & gain votes & control out of the ashes.

I agree. Both parties are screwed up.
Pat

Belmont31R
01-04-13, 22:30
Boehner is a terrible Speaker.



While American's generally wanted a deal the deal Boehner, and 84 other Republicans signed off on adds 4 TRILLION to the debt. That is not the deal Americans wanted. They wanted deficit reduction, and for a tax fix.


Obama will run circles around Boehner.

Alaskapopo
01-05-13, 01:58
Boehner is a terrible Speaker.



While American's generally wanted a deal the deal Boehner, and 84 other Republicans signed off on adds 4 TRILLION to the debt. That is not the deal Americans wanted. They wanted deficit reduction, and for a tax fix.


Obama will run circles around Boehner.

With respect most americans simply did not want to pay more taxes from I have seen in discussions. People give lip service to the debt but at the end of the day they care about their own pocket book the most.

Pat

SteyrAUG
01-05-13, 02:32
With respect most americans simply did not want to pay more taxes from I have seen in discussions. People give lip service to the debt but at the end of the day they care about their own pocket book the most.

Pat

I will be willing to entertain the idea of paying more in taxes IF and WHEN the mismanagement of what is currently being paid in taxes is corrected and tax dollars are used to benefit those who pay taxes rather than simply being handed out to those who don't pay taxes. Then of course there is the issue of my tax dollars being used to fund efforts to eliminate my rights and pay people to do it.

As anyone who know anything about budgets can tell you, when you are spending more than you take in you cut spending anywhere and everywhere you can. If this doesn't solve the problem then you have to figure out a way to bring in more money. But the one single thing you absolutely DO NOT DO is start spending more money.

If you make $15,000 a year and decide to have 6 kids due to poor planning or no planning then your lack of responsibility is going to make your life very difficult. It is kinda like when you burn off your hand with a blow torch because you are that incompetent. It's sad but you shouldn't be rewarded for your efforts. If you have any brains at all you will find 5 other people just like you and go in on a trailer home six ways.

There is absolutely no reason that somebody who worked hard to either go to school or build a business into something successful should have to pay a penalty for having their shit together.

Alaskapopo
01-05-13, 02:37
I will be willing to entertain the idea of paying more in taxes IF and WHEN the mismanagement of what is currently being paid in taxes is corrected and tax dollars are used to benefit those who pay taxes rather than simply being handed out to those who don't pay taxes. Then of course there is the issue of my tax dollars being used to fund efforts to eliminate my rights and pay people to do it.

As anyone who know anything about budgets can tell you, when you are spending more than you take in you cut spending anywhere and everywhere you can. If this doesn't solve the problem then you have to figure out a way to bring in more money. But the one single thing you absolutely DO NOT DO is start spending more money.

If you make $15,000 a year and decide to have 6 kids due to poor planning or no planning then your lack of responsibility is going to make your life very difficult. It is kinda like when you burn off your hand with a blow torch because you are that incompetent. It's sad but you shouldn't be rewarded for your efforts. If you have any brains at all you will find 5 other people just like you and go in on a trailer home six ways.

There is absolutely no reason that somebody who worked hard to either go to school or build a business into something successful should have to pay a penalty for having their shit together.

I agree there is a lot of waste that needs to be cleaned up. On the kids thing your right as a single guy I hate the fact I am subsidizing familes because they get a lot more tax breaks. One of my guys working for me with 2 kids and a wife who does not work takes home as much as I do because of all the deductions and I make $4 bucks and hour more hourly.
Pat

Business_Casual
01-05-13, 06:44
I will be willing to entertain the idea of paying more in taxes IF and WHEN the mismanagement of what is currently being paid in taxes is corrected and tax dollars are used to benefit those who pay taxes rather than simply being handed out to those who don't pay taxes. Then of course there is the issue of my tax dollars being used to fund efforts to eliminate my rights and pay people to do it.

As anyone who know anything about budgets can tell you, when you are spending more than you take in you cut spending anywhere and everywhere you can. If this doesn't solve the problem then you have to figure out a way to bring in more money. But the one single thing you absolutely DO NOT DO is start spending more money.

If you make $15,000 a year and decide to have 6 kids due to poor planning or no planning then your lack of responsibility is going to make your life very difficult. It is kinda like when you burn off your hand with a blow torch because you are that incompetent. It's sad but you shouldn't be rewarded for your efforts. If you have any brains at all you will find 5 other people just like you and go in on a trailer home six ways.

There is absolutely no reason that somebody who worked hard to either go to school or build a business into something successful should have to pay a penalty for having their shit together.

A). That will never happen, every new penny you send will spent along with 40 borrowed ones

B). Boehner is working from the base line of "how do we get re-elected" not "this is right for the country"

C). The path they should take is to shut down the government until spending and entitlements are addressed, and in the mean time send him a new bill eliminating the ATF and DEA and sending those agents to the borders and ports to protect our sovereignty


Like I said, never going to happen.

bc

chuckman
01-05-13, 06:53
I agree there is a lot of waste that needs to be cleaned up. On the kids thing your right as a single guy I hate the fact I am subsidizing familes because they get a lot more tax breaks. One of my guys working for me with 2 kids and a wife who does not work takes home as much as I do because of all the deductions and I make $4 bucks and hour more hourly.
Pat

There's a difference between the welfare cheats with a bunch of kids and your buddy with a bunch of kids, how they get income (and the source of income), and how they file taxes (if, indeed, the welfare cheats file taxes).

HackerF15E
01-05-13, 07:58
The entire root cause of "the problem" is the fact that both Republicans and Democrats think of their party affiliation FIRST, and doing what's right for Americans second.

It is all about POWER, rather than following the oaths they've all taken to support and defend the Constitution.

SteyrAUG
01-05-13, 12:15
The entire root cause of "the problem" is the fact that both Republicans and Democrats think of their party affiliation FIRST, and doing what's right for Americans second.

It is all about POWER, rather than following the oaths they've all taken to support and defend the Constitution.

Yep, politicians are in government for power and money. They are there to serve themselves while claiming to serve us. Anyone who is there to try and fix things will quickly be eliminated by the more powerful members or relegated to meaningless status.

Caeser25
01-05-13, 12:39
I agree there is a lot of waste that needs to be cleaned up. On the kids thing your right as a single guy I hate the fact I am subsidizing familes because they get a lot more tax breaks. One of my guys working for me with 2 kids and a wife who does not work takes home as much as I do because of all the deductions and I make $4 bucks and hour more hourly.
Pat

My stepsister is a diehard retarded liberal that brought up eliminating tax loopholes so the rich pay their fair share, at Christmas dinner of all times :rolleyes: I of course couldn't keep my mouth shut and immediately followed up with, you mean like the child, mortgage, student loan interest credits. All three of which are loopholes that you get that I don't. See the difference when it's your horse in the race. That immediately shut her and everyone else up, just about everyone else gave the head tilt dogs give you and the light bulb finally turned on.

With the debt ceiling coming up in 2 months, the republicants have all the cards if they had a worthwhile mouth piece that started hammering now. They gave Obama tax increases with almost zero cuts. The debt ceiling will not rise an inch in March without $41 in spending cuts for $1 in raising of the debt ceiling.