M&P 9FS HK P30

[slappy]

I picked up an HK P30 a few weeks ago. Put roughly 400 rounds through it. It feels amazing in my hand and I thought I was shooting it well for what hand gun experience I have.

I bought an M&P 9FS last week and took it to the range for the first time tonight to find that I greatly outshoot the HK with the M&P.

I ran 100 rounds through each gun and my groups with the M&P were easily half of my groups with the HK. Keep in mind I'm quite new to pistol shooting (3 months). Would it be normal for a newcomer to experience such a drastic difference from one gun to the next?

Not sure if I got lucky with the M&P but it seems quite accurate for me (though I'm sure a better shooter may find otherwise). I was limited to a 15 yard range tonight though I'll try longer this weekend.

Attached photo is rapid fire from M&P at 10 yards. Didn't save my HK target but it was quite a bit larger group.
14789

[Kenneth]

If you are going for groups on a new platform to you then you should start a a lot closer range and then farther distances. Every Hk I have shot has been very accurate. I have an HK45 and a M&P9 and the Hk out shoots it every time. The M&P is accurate as well though.

[rathos]

I am gonna guess that your HK is a DA/SA gun? Most shooters that haven't practiced a lot will have a harder time with the transition and notice groups are a bit bigger. Some even have issues with the LEM due to the weight and length of pull. The M&P has the same trigger pull each time so it is some what easier to master. Dry fire with the HK will most likely dramatically increase your accuracy.

[Hogsgunwild]

Both of your guns were good choices although the H&K is far superior in quality. You are in a tough position as you will want to keep trying both guns to see which you like better. I could also outshoot the P30 with my Walther PPQ when I did side by side comparisons at the range. The thing to realize is that once you park one pistol and concentrate on mastering your training on just one of the platforms, you will perform so much better than if you keep going back and forth between the two. Shoot them both and figure out which one really works better in your hands and then try to stick with it.

I will add that when shooting at closer distances, my (rebarreled by S&W) 9MM M&P FS shoots tiny little groups inside of 10 ro 15 yards.
Due to factors such as the barrel's twist rate, bullet weight and speed, the accuracy opens up drastically past those distances. The M&P that you have have may not have those issues. At 25 yards, the P30 rentals that I have shot, shoot much tighter groups than my M&P does. I am just pointing out that there are a lot of factors to consider and you may not notice at this stage of your shooting.

The best thing that you can do (and you will hear it a lot on this forum) is pick a platform and then go take a quality training course with it. Then you will be in a better position to evaluate your needs.
I wish that I had the internet when I was a new shooter as it would have saved me a ton of grief by having received some great training in the beginning instead of fixing all of my bad habits after 30 years like I did.

[19852]

I think which one you stay with is going to depend on what you intend to do with it. Both are great guns with devoted followings.

[1gunzenuf]

I had the same experience with my handgun choices. The HK is very accurate during controlled or slow fire exercises, but it was difficult (at first) to get get double and rapid fire groups that were acceptable. The M&P and PPQ both brought better results more quickly. Practice with the HK will bring proficiency in a few weeks, or did with me.

I ended up selling the M&P and keeping the PPQ and HK. They all have differences that you will have to adjust to, but should all serve you well regardless of the one you decide to stick with. Keep shooting the HK and dry firing and you will tighten those groups and times very quickly.

Keep shooting and good luck...

[C4IGrant]

Back up to 25yds and see what you get.




C4

[slappy]

I'll be at a 25 yard range next time. I really do like both guns although I feel my experience with the striker fired guns is probably the factor. This HK is the first da/sa I've spent much time with. Already have M&P 45 and 9c that I love. I was amazed at how natural the 45 feels to shoot.

Thanks for the input guys.

[Psalms144.1]

Slappy - am I reading correctly that you've only been shooting handguns for 3 months, but you now have FOUR different pistols? With all due respect, stop buying guns, and spend the money on quality training.

OK - off the soapbox ;)

I'm an LE firearms instructor, and I can tell you without a shadow of a doubt that striker fired guns are the easiest to teach to new shooters, and DA/SA guns are the hardest. The trigger mechanisms can easily eclipse the mechanical accuracy of the platform, since trigger control and sight alignment are the two most important factors in shooting accurately (not the only factors, but the two that are most likely to cause problems), and the short, light, consistent trigger of the striker fired guns is much easier to learn to shoot well.

Added to that, typically the DA pull on HKs is very heavy, and there's no surprise that you don't shoot the P30 as well as the M&Ps. Honestly, as much of an HK fan as I am, if you had to ditch one of the pistols you own now to pay for a trip to a good course, I'd drop the P30. If you decide to stick with it, I'd recommend you consider switching the trigger mechanism to the LEM, which will at least give you a consistent trigger pull for each shot.

I was a dedicated GLOCK shooter for decades, until I joined an agency that was Sig only. For a four years (until we got approval for non-Sig personal weapons), I worked DA/SA Sigs hard, and got to the point where I was significantly more accurate and just as fast with my P228 or P226 than I ever was with my Glocks. I switched back to Glock, however, due to their lighter weight, better size efficiency, and rust resistance. Fast forward to 2012, and I was at the back end of a bad run of four problematic G19s, and decided to switch platforms - this time to the P30. Again, I initially had to slow WAY down to keep my accuracy, but after several thousand rounds of live and dry fire, I got the "hang" of the LEM, and now I'm back up to the same shooting speed as I was with my Glocks. The difference now, however, is, despite decades of Glock use, and over 30K rounds fired in training between 2008 and 2012 with a G19, my accuracy at range (25 yards and beyond) is SIGNIFICANTLY improved shooting the P30 or P2000 LEM.

So, bottom line at the bottom - congrats on getting a good-shooting M&P FS, and, pick ONE platform and master it - then expand your horizons!

Regards,

Kevin

[South]

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[slappy]

Kevin, South, thanks for your input I appreciate it.

I realize now how I came across with a list of four pistols and only shooting for ~3 months. I've had the 9c and 45 for a few years. Until about 3 months ago I was shooting them maybe two or three times a year.

Constant reading on this site sparked my interest in really taking handgun shooting a little more seriously. In the last few months I've put 1500 rounds through the 45 which I absolutely love to shoot, but the cost of ammo began to sink in thus the change to a full sized 9.

I bought the HK really for no other reason than I fondled multiple guns and couldn't get over the way it fit my hand. The M&P 9 on the other hand was offered to me last week at a very nice discount from a friend that works at Cabelas. One of those I'd feel stupid if I passed this up moments.

My train of thought right now is that 3 of 4 guns are M&P's so I should probably stick with it. Maybe I bit off a little more than I can chew right now with the HK.

I'll report back when I get the M&P to 25 and am looking at classes as we speak. I'm in Wichita KS if anyone knows of a good training resources within reasonable distances.

[Psalms144.1]

Slappy - good man! I don't know of any specific training availability in your neck of the woods, but your central location should make several decent options within striking range.

I'd clean up that P30 really well, lube it up and put it in the safe. At some point you might want to have another go at it, and, with the way things are going right now, any good FULL capacity pistol is likely to appreciate in value quite a bit over the next couple of months/years.

Regards,

Kevin