View Full Version : Customizing a Glock with Robar - advice wanted
NighthawkTalon
01-14-13, 14:24
Hi all,
I recently sent my Glock 21 to Robar (http://www.robarguns.com) for a grip reduction and customization. I sent it in with a few things I wanted and basically requested that they contact me in order to discuss the gun and what we would to do it, with this idea in mind for the most part: to have the gun function as well as possible and look as good as possible without sacrificing the Glock's inherent reliability. In other words, I'd like for it to be as accurate and good looking as possible without affecting reliability or going over the edge.
Here's a list of what I was considering
-NP3+ treatment... internal and external (http://www.robarguns.com/np3-plus.html)
-Grip reduction - the grip isn't too big for me, but it could definitely be reduced a little bit. I was thinking about just having the backstrap reduced and the texture done while still leaving some of the finger grooves
-Grip texture (heavy)
-1911 grip angle
-Round out trigger guard
-High grip modification
-Smooth trigger operation (thinking about reducing the trigger pull a little as well, thoughts?)
-Forward cocking serrations (thinking about not doing this)
-Threaded barrel. I want to be able to swap out between threaded and non-threaded barrels, and as a result was considering having Robar install a match grade barrel, but I have heard about that affecting the Glock's reliability, so I think I will just keep some on the side if I ever need to shoot reloads
-Night sights - thoughts? I was thinking about the XS tritium or whatever you guys recommend
Anyway, this is the gist of it. I would just like some input on it, and to hear whether or not any of this will affect the reliability.
The NP3+ sounds like some great stuff and I'm having my 1911 done in it, but do you guys think it would offer any real benefits over Glock's finish(even having only the internals done)?
I was thinking about not doing the NP3+ anymore (depending on what you guys say) or only doing the internals, skipping out on the forward cocking serrations.
Also, what do you guys think of red dots? I was thinking of having one installed. Heard good things and I like the look, but not sure about the extra bulk. I was thinking about having this done and simply buying another slide if I need to swap them out.
Thanks for reading and I appreciate any comments or suggestions... and I will definitely post pictures once completed.
Robar's glock modifications page: http://www.robarguns.com/glocks.html
Complete list of services and prices: http://www.robarguns.com/assets/robar-price-list-effective-october-18th%2c-2011(1).pdf
I have two pistols with the NP3 finish,a Glock 26 and a S&W Mod.19-2 snub. Both were done between 6 to 7 years ago and both get used,carried and trained with regularly.The NP3 has held up well but has developed a yellowing appearance around the muzzle end of the slide on the very front. Old buildup from muzzle flash,I assume.
It's hardly noticeable and the NP3 is easy to clean even after several hundred rounds in a session. I think it's a vast improvement as the NP3 does not show any wear after hard use,and is very tough and abrasion resisrant. Again,easy to clean.
Worth the investment IMO.
Sights and grips are a personal thing. I think XS sights are a joke and I really don't like most 'high grip' mods on a Glock. It can make 'Glock knuckle' worse. Glocks already have a very low bore axis, not much room or need for improvement there.
If you just thin out the spot on the trigger guard that rubs your middle finger it makes the gun more comfortable to shoot and makes it feel like it sits a little lower in your hand.
Aftermarket finishes on a Glock are totally unnecessary but they do look cool. I like a silver slide on 'em, but all mine are just factory..
Red dots are gaining popularity on handguns, again, a personal preference. I carry concealed and use my carry guns to shoot Production and SSP, so I keep low-profile Ameriglos on my Glocks. If you're gonna shoot it suppressed, I think a RDS with Ameriglo suppressor sights as back up irons is a pretty slick setup.
Lighter triggers do help a lot of shooters, but I keep mine stock with the 5.5lb stuff. I'm used to it, it's reliable, it's free and I actually like it better than the lighter setups I've tried.
The best thing to do is to shoot guns with the mods in question and see if they're for you...
I had a G23 with a Robar grip reduction and the heavy grip texture. My hands are medium-sized, and I really liked the reduction—it would be a must for me on a G21. The other stuff you listed (1911 grip angle, rounded trigger guard, forward cocking serrations, high-grip mod, etc.) makes me think that you're overthinking it. There's a thread here about what mods Glocks require, and the consensus is a) better sights, b) OEM "minus" connector (maybe), and c) a grip reduction if your hands are small.
Beyond that, a match barrel won't hurt reliability if it’s fitted properly, but there are other ways to improve accuracy for less money. Two of my three match barrels shoot groups about 1/3 smaller than the factory barrel. The third one actually shoots worse than the factory barrel, but to be honest, I haven’t tested it fully yet. Fitting is the issue, and Robar should be able to do that no problem.
In my experience, you’ll need to rezero if you switch barrels. Adjustable sights make that easy. So would an RDS, but I'm not sure that the RDS is really ready for prime time. A search for the RDS Pro & Con threads here will food for thought on that.
Night sights are a must, but a search here would show you a dozen or so options that are better than XS. I'd start with Trijicon HDs or Heine’s and go from there.
NP3 is a good finish, but it's no better than the Tennifer your G21 already has for the average user. (I'd definitely consider it for a 1911, though.) Glock internals have all the coatings they need, so I can't see adding anything to them. You can slick up the trigger on your own—it literally takes 20 minutes with a Dremel and a polishing wheel. Numerous threads here can help you figure out what you need to do. Also, if you skip the forward cocking serrations, you won't need to refinish the slide.
But again, better sights, an OEM "minus" connector, and a grip reduction are probably all you need. Use the money from all the other stuff to get a bunch of ammo to test. Find out what your pistol shoots best, then hit the range and bond with your G21.
Okie John
NighthawkTalon
01-14-13, 19:09
I have two pistols with the NP3 finish,a Glock 26 and a S&W Mod.19-2 snub. Both were done between 6 to 7 years ago and both get used,carried and trained with regularly.The NP3 has held up well but has developed a yellowing appearance around the muzzle end of the slide on the very front. Old buildup from muzzle flash,I assume.
It's hardly noticeable and the NP3 is easy to clean even after several hundred rounds in a session. I think it's a vast improvement as the NP3 does not show any wear after hard use,and is very tough and abrasion resisrant. Again,easy to clean.
Worth the investment IMO.
Thanks... definitely doing the NP3 on my 1911 and looking forward to it.
Sights and grips are a personal thing. I think XS sights are a joke and I really don't like most 'high grip' mods on a Glock. It can make 'Glock knuckle' worse. Glocks already have a very low bore axis, not much room or need for improvement there.
If you just thin out the spot on the trigger guard that rubs your middle finger it makes the gun more comfortable to shoot and makes it feel like it sits a little lower in your hand.
Aftermarket finishes on a Glock are totally unnecessary but they do look cool. I like a silver slide on 'em, but all mine are just factory..
Red dots are gaining popularity on handguns, again, a personal preference. I carry concealed and use my carry guns to shoot Production and SSP, so I keep low-profile Ameriglos on my Glocks. If you're gonna shoot it suppressed, I think a RDS with Ameriglo suppressor sights as back up irons is a pretty slick setup.
Lighter triggers do help a lot of shooters, but I keep mine stock with the 5.5lb stuff. I'm used to it, it's reliable, it's free and I actually like it better than the lighter setups I've tried.
The best thing to do is to shoot guns with the mods in question and see if they're for you...
Off-topic question, what about the XS 1911 sights? Someone recommended those to me.
I will probably do just that with the trigger guard as it seems like the grip I have on it is fine, but it definitely rubs against my middle finger a bit.
I don't plan on carrying it, so I am definitely considering the red dots as I like the look and think it will help my shooting out. I eventually plan to get a g30 or g19 for concealed carry, so I will add the suppressor sights as well as I do want to suppress it at some point. Thanks for the input.
I had a G23 with a Robar grip reduction and the heavy grip texture. My hands are medium-sized, and I really liked the reduction—it would be a must for me on a G21. The other stuff you listed (1911 grip angle, rounded trigger guard, forward cocking serrations, high-grip mod, etc.) makes me think that you're overthinking it. There's a thread here about what mods Glocks require, and the consensus is a) better sights, b) OEM "minus" connector (maybe), and c) a grip reduction if your hands are small.
Beyond that, a match barrel won't hurt reliability if it’s fitted properly, but there are other ways to improve accuracy for less money. Two of my three match barrels shoot groups about 1/3 smaller than the factory barrel. The third one actually shoots worse than the factory barrel, but to be honest, I haven’t tested it fully yet. Fitting is the issue, and Robar should be able to do that no problem.
In my experience, you’ll need to rezero if you switch barrels. Adjustable sights make that easy. So would an RDS, but I'm not sure that the RDS is really ready for prime time. A search for the RDS Pro & Con threads here will food for thought on that.
Night sights are a must, but a search here would show you a dozen or so options that are better than XS. I'd start with Trijicon HDs or Heine’s and go from there.
NP3 is a good finish, but it's no better than the Tennifer your G21 already has for the average user. (I'd definitely consider it for a 1911, though.) Glock internals have all the coatings they need, so I can't see adding anything to them. You can slick up the trigger on your own—it literally takes 20 minutes with a Dremel and a polishing wheel. Numerous threads here can help you figure out what you need to do. Also, if you skip the forward cocking serrations, you won't need to refinish the slide.
But again, better sights, an OEM "minus" connector, and a grip reduction are probably all you need. Use the money from all the other stuff to get a bunch of ammo to test. Find out what your pistol shoots best, then hit the range and bond with your G21.
Okie John
I'm sure I'm over-thinking it. Always do. I'm not looking to overdo the gun or anything, I just don't want to have any regrets once it gets done.
I think I will skip out on the NP3 and forward cocking serrations for sure, but I will probably get the match barrel now. If it's fitted, would I still be able to fit the original barrel properly?
Do you have a link to the rds pro and con threads? I did a search but didn't come up with much. Appreciate the advice
I think I will skip out on the NP3 and forward cocking serrations for sure, but I will probably get the match barrel now. If it's fitted, would I still be able to fit the original barrel properly?
The new barrel is fitted to the slide, not the other way around, so you should be able to drop in the old barrel and carry on. As I mentioned, you should expect to rezero when you switch barrels.
Do you have a link to the rds pro and con threads? I did a search but didn't come up with much. Appreciate the advice[/QUOTE]
Use "RMR" as your keyword.
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=65538&highlight=RMR
And
https://www.m4carbine.net/search.php?searchid=5303232
Okie John
Off-topic question, what about the XS 1911 sights? Someone recommended those to me.
They're basically like shooting a handgun with a shotgun bead and no rear sight.
If you want to test drive some, just knock the rear sight out of your slide and shoot it with the front sight only.
If you love it, the $100 for the exact same thing may then be worth it to you.
If you can't hit anything and find it to be annoying, then a more conventional set of sights will serve you better.
I had a police trade in Gen2 G22 done over by Robar. Good people. I liked the NP3, its as slick as snot. The NP3 on the internals makes for a noticeable (albeit small) improvement in the trigger.
I had the front serrations done. The silhouette cut looks cool, but adds little to function and handling for the cost. I would advise the heavy grip texturing as the standard was mild in my opinion. No experience with grip reduction, however I did go for the high grip mod. I don't think it is needed on a gen3 or 4.
I also tried XS sights for about 6 months. I picked up the front sight really fast, but I ended up taking more time trying to acquire some sort of alignment that would allow to hit anything. In the end, I felt slower and far less accurate. YMMV
NighthawkTalon
01-14-13, 21:14
The new barrel is fitted to the slide, not the other way around, so you should be able to drop in the old barrel and carry on. As I mentioned, you should expect to rezero when you switch barrels.
Use "RMR" as your keyword.
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=65538&highlight=RMR
And
https://www.m4carbine.net/search.php?searchid=5303232
Okie John
Awesome. I will definitely do that. The glock barrels are not more inherently reliable, right? And thanks for the links.
They're basically like shooting a handgun with a shotgun bead and no rear sight.
If you want to test drive some, just knock the rear sight out of your slide and shoot it with the front sight only.
If you love it, the $100 for the exact same thing may then be worth it to you.
If you can't hit anything and find it to be annoying, then a more conventional set of sights will serve you better.
Good looking out. Thanks
I had a police trade in Gen2 G22 done over by Robar. Good people. I liked the NP3, its as slick as snot. The NP3 on the internals makes for a noticeable (albeit small) improvement in the trigger.
I had the front serrations done. The silhouette cut looks cool, but adds little to function and handling for the cost. I would advise the heavy grip texturing as the standard was mild in my opinion. No experience with grip reduction, however I did go for the high grip mod. I don't think it is needed on a gen3 or 4.
I also tried XS sights for about 6 months. I picked up the front sight really fast, but I ended up taking more time trying to acquire some sort of alignment that would allow to hit anything. In the end, I felt slower and far less accurate. YMMV
Hm, I have the Novak low mount night sights now. Supposed I will keep them. I wasn't a big fan of the 3-dot during the day, but that's probably because the white outline in the front sight has pretty much ran away.
Thanks again guys.
Awesome. I will definitely do that. The glock barrels are not more inherently reliable, right? And thanks for the links.
Yep. It's not the barrels, it's the fitting.
Okie John
Magic_Salad0892
01-15-13, 11:29
You're overthinking this.
Stick some damn 10-8, Heinie, or Trijicon sights on it. Vickers controls. Grip Plug. And a minus connector.
Shoot the hell out of it, then improve what parts you find lacking.
Here is what my carry Glock runs for example.
10-8 sights.
Vickers Gen4 magazine catch.
Vickers slide catch.
G19 serrated trigger.
Minus connector, NY1 Trigger spring.
Polished trigger bar, connector, and rounded striker block.
White Sound Defense High Reliability Extractor Depressor Plunger.
Lone Wolf 9x19mm non-LCI extractor + Non-LCI extractor bearing.
Grip Force Adapter. (the smooth one)
Removed Finger Grooves, undercut the trigger guard slightly.
OEM 9x19mm Threaded barrel (13.5x1mm LH threads)
Glockmeister Gen4 Grip Plug.
Gen4 Dual Captioned 18 lbs. recoil spring. (My Jager single captioned guide rod, and ISMI spring reached 5k, and I went back to a factory one.)
Magazines wear a +2 extension, and Wolff XP springs. Federal 147 gr. JHP.
No machine work, or sending it in is even needed. Maybe for a grip reduction, and stippling, but you don't need forward cocking serrations, or extra coatings. Tenifer (nitride) should help prevent against rust better than NP3 anyway, and has a harder Rockwell Hardness. (Nitride is like a 64 or so. Diamonds for example are 70.)
Where did you get the oem barrel?
Magic_Salad0892
01-15-13, 23:43
Where did you get the oem barrel?
PSA. Like a year or more ago.
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