View Full Version : Why not Beretta?
anachronism
02-09-13, 09:49
I've noticed that Berettas aren't popular here, perhaps a little higher than Rugers and XDs on the scale, but not much. Are there any pitfalls we should be aware of? I've always had great success with the brand.
Beretta are great handguns.
But...
It seems that at least 99% of shooters can't manage a DA pull and they are easily confused and frustrated with any controls other than the trigger. And for some reason it's very unacceptable these days to have a handgun that requires lubrication.
Magic_Salad0892
02-09-13, 09:59
They're just big, and require a little maintenence. They're spoken of pretty highly here my most, but you don't hear of them often because there are better designs.
Super accurate, and reliable under most conditions.
Size
Safety/de-cocker location
DA/SA trigger
DAO trigger is even worse
Cost
A great pistol choice in 1972 that has been superseded in the marketplace by much better designs in the time since.
I have two, 92fs, and SC Px-4. The 92 is super accurate, the PX4 is taking a little time to adjust to.
Good quality and excellent customer service
I like the beretta, I shoot well with it, and the DA pull really doesn't bother me.
All that said they are more expensive and harder to find parts for locally than a glock.
I shoot just about every modern pistol I've had my hands on fairly similarly on the clock in a couple drills (glock, M&P, xd, beretta fn...dot torture, el presidente and the test to name a few).
With that in mind I went with the gun that I could readily find parts for locally, that just so happened to be glock.
mkmckinley
02-09-13, 10:06
The biggest downside of the 92 series is the slide mounted safety that can be inadvertently engaged.
twistedcomrade
02-09-13, 10:14
I love my 92FS and will never part with it, but I do not carry it. There are better options for carry. I do think it makes an excellent nightstand pistol with a 20 rd Mec Gar in it.
JBecker 72
02-09-13, 10:21
I would like to own a 92 of some sort one day. I think its a pretty cool pistol.
The biggest downside of the 92 series is the slide mounted safety that can be inadvertently engaged.
I thought I read somewhere that you can disable the safety and make it so the lever is only a decocker.
Sent from my PC36100 using Tapatalk 2
Magic_Salad0892
02-09-13, 10:24
I would like to own a 92 of some sort one day. I think its a pretty cool pistol.
I thought I read somewhere that you can disable the safety and make it so the lever is only a decocker.
Sent from my PC36100 using Tapatalk 2
The G guns come with decocker only, but from what I know you cannot convert them back, and forth.
ramairthree
02-09-13, 10:27
They were ground breaking when they came out.
More capacity than a Browning HP.
Magazines that worked and were reliable.
9mm vs. 45 arguments aside.
Very reliable. Very accurate. A little big.
1911s and Berettas have fallen by the wayside to guns that do not seem to need as much mastery and training. Americans love stuff that is pick up and go with no effort needed. See many people taking up gymnastics vs. golf? Or buying a manual instead of an automatic?
1911s have hung on better do to the trigger pull and .45. 9mm and DA/SA have left Beretta by the wayside.
Also, a contract of bad magazines, use by tens of thousands of people with little training, poor maintenance, poor lube, etc. have led to a reputation it does not deserve IMO.
it's like saying the truck 200K miles on in 8 years and used also off road, but never changed the air filter, oil, etc. is a piece of junk because it had problems.
Summary-
Nothing at all wrong with them.
But they are sort of like a 25 year old 5.0 Mustang engine. They were great at the time, and can still perform well-
but if for less money you could buy a brand new 5.0 Mustang Coyote engine
or for twice the money you could have a new 428 Cobra Jet engine...
But total props to you if you roll with a Riggs mullet, McClane wifebeater, and a Beretta. And extra credit if you rock a Magnum PI 'stache too.
The G guns come with decocker only, but from what I know you cannot convert them back, and forth.
This place offers a service to convert them (I don't know anything beyond they offer said service).
http://alleghenygunworks.com/index.php/services-packages
I do have a bit of a soft spot for the 92 for some reason. They still seem to be well made and consistent with functioning which is nice. I also started giving them a second look because I noticed that during the whole panic mags were somewhat easier to find and at reasonable prices.
I don't care for the safety and I'm a bit dismayed at the holster selection for the 92A1, but I'm going to try and give the 92 a more serious look than just a gun to collect and shoot for fun. It would certainly help if Beretta wouldn't have discontinued some of the more practical versions of the 92. I got to hold a vertec once and I couldn't believe they discontinued it.
DanjojoUSMC
02-09-13, 11:36
I love them personally. One of the few not affected by the magazine availability abomination going on. The main things that scare people off - grip size, weight, abused military examples with or without checkmate mags, and trigger system that requires fundamental skills.
They are usually very accurate, able to be ran very fast while maintaining accuracy, less likely than most polymer pistols to be affected by a poor grip or light strikes. High probability that minimal, sensible maint. checks means it works 100% in important areas instead of being broken from the get go by design or manufacture.
Our M9's worked okay. It's huge heavy though. Lots of parts as well.
HackerF15E
02-09-13, 12:21
I'm a fan, although I like the 1911 better.
A lot of the disparaging comments have to do with people liking whatever is trendy, and the M9/92FS is just not trendy today. In the late 80s, it would have been a very different conversation.
It is stil a fine firearm for lots of duty, defensive, and sporting uses. I won't sell the one I own, and love to plink with it at the range.
I carried an issued Beretta 96D for about 14 months, then switched to a POW SIG 229, DAO. Our agency experience with the weapon was so abysmal that we abandoned it before the contract was up.
themighty9mm
02-09-13, 13:22
My all time favorite pistol. I ccw a 92 compact as often as I am legally allowed in a crossbreed supertuck. Own a few variation of the 92. The first shot DA, I am almost always spot on with. And at this point in time it has magazine capacities that run almost neck and neck with a glock 17 for example. I can also run it just as fast as I can any other trigger.
I has its down sides, in that its a bit big, and a bit heavy but... When you compare it to say, a sig 226, or glock 17, or pretty much all other full sized handguns, its size is so close its hardly worth mentioning. Same with weight for that matter. Just my opinion though. (I relize I contradicted myself in that I mentioned it at all. Its just a none issue for me) People mention the safety but its an easy thing to get used to if one is willing. Infact with my normal firing grip (provided the safety is on) my thumb naturally flips the safety off.
I think people often forget the 92fs came out in the same time frame as the G17 and sig 226. At this point in time they have all been updated accordingly. M9- m9a1, sig 226-sig 226r, g17 gen 1-g17 gen 4. All of wich have aded features end users want (for the most part)
theblackknight
02-09-13, 13:42
I do NOT like the 92FS/M9.
I would like if B made the guns all like the EliteII.
Decock only
real sights
Front strap cross stitch
The D spring
http://img30.imageshack.us/img30/575/dscf3327e.jpg
A regular 92FS tho?You can have that mess
It's still 3oz lighter than a 1911 and roughly the same weight as a Sig P226.
IMO, the weight issue doesn't hold water. It's an aluminum framed gun...
Our 96Ds were very similar to the Elites. The barrel did not extend past the end of the slide and the slides were of the reinforced Brigadier variety. I always wanted an Elite like the ones Blackknight posted, that or a Border Marshal variant.
For a while, Ergo Grips made a very thin grip panel for the Beretta but stopped selling them before I could get my hands on one. The texture looked great. Wish I could find a pair in black.
I've noticed that Berettas aren't popular here, perhaps a little higher than Rugers and XDs on the scale, but not much. Are there any pitfalls we should be aware of? I've always had great success with the brand.
Some 92's are really well thought of. Sadly Beretta doesn't make them any more.
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=120601
C4
Always enjoyed my 92. Not sure what model 92 it is though...ill to take it out and have a look. Shoots well, good feel.
http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/02/10/y7anu2a9.jpg
themighty9mm
02-09-13, 14:34
Always enjoyed my 92. Not sure what model 92 it is though...ill to take it out and have a look. Shoots well, good feel.
http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/02/10/y7anu2a9.jpg
Centurian. Full sized frame with a compact slide and barrel
I owned one (92FS Brigadier) and it was nice but big for what you get.
Reliable, accurate, nothing really to worry about.
I love older Beretta pistols and think they are dead sexy Italians. However they really don't fit into what I want / need for a working pistol. And the new models don't offer me anything that I want or need either.
I own one Beretta, an 87 (22LR) and it satisfies by lust for a sexy Italian Beretta. I like the looks of the 92 / M9s and have come close to buying another several times, but in the end it'll be taking up space in the safe, rarely getting shot. So my sole 87 it is... You can't tell me this isn't a slick looking pistol... ;)
http://i747.photobucket.com/albums/xx113/rhinowso/Beretta/IMG_0427.jpg
http://i747.photobucket.com/albums/xx113/rhinowso/Beretta/IMG_0429-1.jpg
http://i747.photobucket.com/albums/xx113/rhinowso/Beretta/IMG_0435.jpg
http://i747.photobucket.com/albums/xx113/rhinowso/Beretta/IMG_0436.jpg
http://i747.photobucket.com/albums/xx113/rhinowso/Beretta/IMG_0447.jpg
Rhino,
Those wood grips are gorgeous, they look about a 1/4 inch thick though, just how wide is that pistol in the grip?
K
It was my old mans duty pistol during the last of his 35yrs. He gave it to me when I joined.
Is it a 92? Just frankenstiened or was that a police style build?
I just bought a 92a1 last night. I've been looking for one for some time now. My carry gun however is a g17 but I just really wanted one. Like one of you said earlier it screams night stand gun with a tlr1s and a 20rnd mag.
Someone mentioned the D Spring and I'd like to briefly expand on this since the Beretta holds a special place in my heart. What this refers to is replacing the mainspring with the DAO version which is 18 lbs instead of the usual 20 lbs in the DA/SA version. This takes ~3 lbs off the DA pull and ~1.5 lbs off the SA pull. It is an easy modification to do and makes the transition from a 1911 a lot more manageable.
I had a 92G that was very accurate and reliable. Like one of the others here, I was issued a 96D when I was with USBP. They are fine guns, but I personally believe there are simply better choices for what most people are looking for.
The biggest downside of the 92 series is the slide mounted safety that can be inadvertently engaged.
That's my biggest complaint, as well.
I never knew what position the safety was going to be in when I pulled it from my holster.
Rhino,
Those wood grips are gorgeous, they look about a 1/4 inch thick though, just how wide is that pistol in the grip?
K
I haven't measured them, but the pistol is a single stack 22LR and is pretty small overall so the grips are thick. I love the pistol and it's perfect for teaching new, young shooters / females to shoot with.
People with larger hands are the only ones who don't like it typically, and that's the only reason I've heard people selling them - not too many show up on the used market. I was fortunate to get this older model without beretta lawyer speak plastered all over it two years ago, then found two LBs and the counterweight at CDNN. Had one cut down / threaded by Tornado Tech (beautiful work but took 8+ months to complete).
That's my biggest complaint, as well.
I never knew what position the safety was going to be in when I pulled it from my holster.
That's why I loved my 92G; worst case scenario, it was decocked and I had a DA pull.
I like my 92G. I liked my 92FS that I traded to get the G model. The largish grip feels good in my largish hands. Keep it lubricated, maintained, etc and it just runs and runs. Full capacity mags are not hard to find and rather inexpensive. The open slide seems to not only eject empty cases well but crud/powder residue also, leaving a relatively clean gun even after extended firing.
I've noticed that Berettas aren't popular here, perhaps a little higher than Rugers and XDs on the scale, but not much. Are there any pitfalls we should be aware of? I've always had great success with the brand.
Even though I believe the Beretta 92 series firearms are acceptable defensive weapons, I would prefer an XD or possibly one of the newer Rugers. I do not own an XD, Ruger or Beretta. I currently own 1911's, Glocks and SW M&Ps.
That's my biggest complaint, as well.
I never knew what position the safety was going to be in when I pulled it from my holster.
That is why we always taught to sweep the safety/decocker on the draw, thereby insuring it is in the fire position. In the 80's and 90's some leather holster manufacturers stitched in a block that would prevent you from snapping the retaining strap if the "decocker" was down.
Beretta wasn't the only firearms manufacturer with the decocker issue, there were also Smith, Ruger...
I had a 92FS for several years and really loved it. It was always accurate and reliable (crappy aftermarket magazines notwithstanding). I eventually ended up selling it to buy my first M&P. The only thing I really didn't like about it was that it didn't have a rail. If I ever have the money to blow, I'd love to get a bit newer model Beretta with a rail and the heavier slide and a decocker instead of a safety.
Crow Hunter
02-09-13, 18:20
I happen to really like Beretta's, although I don't own one today.
My 2nd ever automatic was a Taurus PT92 and I had 2 Beretta's after that.
The slide on a Beretta feels like butter on glass and they were extremely accurate for me.
My only real complaint was the size.
I have always wished they would make a G19 sized gun in DA/SA with a safety/decock on the frame (like Taurus) and a 12 or 13 round magazine. I would buy one in a heartbeat.
alvincullumyork
02-09-13, 18:33
I owned one (92FS Brigadier) and it was nice but big for what you get.
Reliable, accurate, nothing really to worry about.
I love older Beretta pistols and think they are dead sexy Italians. However they really don't fit into what I want / need for a working pistol. And the new models don't offer me anything that I want or need either.
I own one Beretta, an 87 (22LR) and it satisfies by lust for a sexy Italian Beretta. I like the looks of the 92 / M9s and have come close to buying another several times, but in the end it'll be taking up space in the safe, rarely getting shot. So my sole 87 it is... You can't tell me this isn't a slick looking pistol... ;)
http://i747.photobucket.com/albums/xx113/rhinowso/Beretta/IMG_0435.jpg
That thing is awesome!!! How much did you pay for the extra barrels? How is the reliability?
JBecker 72
02-09-13, 18:55
What's everyone's opinion on the 92A1? I saw one recently and thought it would be the right choice for me. I liked that it had a rail should I ever want to mount an X300, and the front sight post was dovetailed so I'm assuming a wider range of sights would fit. I think I would be having the safety modified to a decocker only as well.
srcochran49
02-09-13, 19:40
I carried a 92FS as a duty weapon the last 10 years of my LEO career. Great gun. Never had an issue with the safety, and utilized several different types of holsters. Also, having started with revolvers, I never found the double action/single action transition to be an issue.
If the much older design of the 1911 is still considered to be relevant, why not the Beretta 92.
anachronism
02-09-13, 20:18
Many years ago I had a 96 Centurion that I foolishly sold to a friend. He won't sell it back to me, even to this day. Mine was nicely accurate, or perhaps shootable is a better term. We grouped poorly on paper, but could hit anything that needed it.
Fast forward to now- I just sold off My XDs a couple of weeks ago. One of the first things I saw after that was a new PX9 Inox, at a pretty good price, and it followed me home. Honest! The sights need upgrading, but the rest of it seems to be GTG. It doesn't like 115 gr ammo, but it's not broken in yet. Mine really seems to be sprung for european spec ammo. We'll see how it breaks in before changing anything. Cheap ball is not it's forte. Mine either.
It was nice to get back to a std DA/SA gun with a hammer. Striker-fired guns annoy me for some reason, perhaps I've spent too much time with 1911s. I have accepted plastic er, polymer frames, so I'm not a total luddite.
morbidbattlecry
02-09-13, 20:35
The G guns come with decocker only, but from what I know you cannot convert them back, and forth.
There is a company that will do a decocker only mod. I have never sent a gun to them or know of anyone that has but they do it. So it is what it is i guess. http://alleghenygunworks.com/index.php/services-packages
srcochran49
02-09-13, 20:43
We were issued 147gr hydra shocks, and trained with less expensive ball ammo(quals were with hydra shock). Never had any ammo related issues that I can recall. Just keep it lubricated and it should run fine.
While I still own the Beretta, my carry guns now are HK. Either a P2000SK in 9mm or a 45 compact.
I like that I have some M9s but I can't reach the trigger as my hand is not large enough.
I have an original GO issued M9 from my CO when he retired...My.personal favorite pistol.
Sent from my SGH-T989 using Tapatalk 2
IMO the size difference between the 92 and the other full size service pistols in use is negligible. As pointed out earlier, the 92 weighs about the same as a 226.
For it's slight size increase over a G17 it gets a half inch longer barrel.
As far as flipping on the safety goes, never had it happen in the holster. It takes a bit of force to engage it. Even then, your just run you thumb along the slide on the draw to make sure its up. Not much different than flipping the safety off on a 1911.
Also regarding its size, it can hold 18 rounds flush fitting with mec-gar mags and 20 with a bit out the bottom.
I can reach the trigger on a G17 or P226 but not an M9. I cannot even hold the grip of an M9 and close my hand around it.
An M9 is 1.5 times the weight if a G17.
There is nothing negligable about the difference.
In basic they gave recruits from my recollection a hard time about that.
To me, the m9 fits my hand perfectly no matter what.
http://www.hunt101.com/data/500/medium/5057CIMG0863.JPG
My pride and joy is my GO M9 that I got from a Major general USA retired who didn't want it anymore. Came with all the accessories including the lasergrip
http://www.hunt101.com/data/500/medium/Picture_00225.jpg
I can reach the trigger on a G17 or P226 but not an M9. I cannot even hold the grip of an M9 and close my hand around it.
An M9 is 1.5 times the weight if a G17.
There is nothing negligible about the difference.
I don't think comparing it the polymer pistols weight wise is fair. It's lighter than a full sized 1911 and the same as the full size Sigs. I probably should have made the distinction in my comment.
The 92FS has a radius cut backstrap that decreases distance to the trigger. That grip may fit your hands better.
That thing is awesome!!! How much did you pay for the extra barrels? How is the reliability?
CDNN had the extra barrels for around $70-80 two years ago - I bought two, the counterweight (it's aluminum, so it doesn't do much), plus a bunch of spare parts / grips / etc.
Reliability is good - unsuppressed it works with High & Standard velocity, but with subsonics it will eject but not pick up the next round. Suppressed it works with most subsonics, but not all, for about 75-100 rounds, then as it gets dirty it'll start having some malfunctions. Aguilla Standard and Subsonics are what I usually use in this.
I actually haven't shot it yet in the LB configuration, I need to do that one of these days.
ramairthree
02-10-13, 21:32
IMO the size difference between the 92 and the other full size service pistols in use is negligible. As pointed out earlier, the 92 weighs about the same as a 226.
For it's slight size increase over a G17 it gets a half inch longer barrel.
Trying to carry one concealed is where the size comes in. You can carry the same firepower in a Glock 19. I like Berettas, but I can't defend their size.
As far as flipping on the safety goes, never had it happen in the holster. It takes a bit of force to engage it. Even then, your just run you thumb along the slide on the draw to make sure its up. Not much different than flipping the safety off on a 1911.
I have a holster that covers the safety area. No issues. But any holster that does not, on many a random reach down and check the position will have changed. Same with an M4. Significant amount of carry and significant activity guarantee this. But yeah, all in the checking and the training.
Also regarding its size, it can hold 18 rounds flush fitting with mec-gar mags and 20 with a bit out the bottom.
They do have the same frame with a radiused backstrap that makes the grip size a non issue for small handed people.
I can reach the trigger on a G17 or P226 but not an M9. I cannot even hold the grip of an M9 and close my hand around it.
An M9 is 1.5 times the weight if a G17.
There is nothing negligable about the difference.
I always felt like the grip on an M9 and a Glock 19 were the same size.
I just pulled out both guns and measured them as closely as I could. Right at the middle of the grip and right where your middle finger would ride, perpendicular to the axis of the grip.
They're so close I couldn't tell the difference by wrapping string around the grip and marking it with a Sharpie. And the Glock got the benefit because the string was down in the bottom of the checkering...
The length to the DA pull on the Beretta is maybe 1/8" longer than the LOP on the Glock 19.
I'm also sitting here with a P229 equipped with a Short Reach Trigger and I'd almost bet the money that it's a hair longer than the Beretta. It also has the shortest circumference at about 3/16" less than the others. That were the same.
You can always look for a Vertec. Reach is a bit shorter.
Mine:
http://i614.photobucket.com/albums/tt230/Vgex/Free%20Arms/Beretta%2096/P1060798.jpg
I bought my 92 in 1993 and have shot well over 20,000 rounds through it with NO issues. Several years ago I did send it in to the factory and they replaced some springs and re-painted the 3 dot sights. I love it and most of my competition wins are with it.
Really wish Beretta would make one with a frame mounted safety like the Taurus clones. The taurus fits my hands exactly and the controls are perfectly placed....but its a Taurus and that keeps me away.
Failure2Stop
02-11-13, 09:59
You can always look for a Vertec. Reach is a bit shorter.
Mine:
http://i614.photobucket.com/albums/tt230/Vgex/Free%20Arms/Beretta%2096/P1060798.jpg
Best of the breed right there.
I'd be on one if I could find it for a reasonable price.
I think part of Beretta's problem is like with FN and SIG handguns.
That is they change stuff ALL OF THE TIME. I have a hard time following Beretta's IF-THEN flow chart of handguns they make, handguns they use to make, etc, etc. Same with FN. Not as bad with SIG, but pretty close.
Glock, HK, and S&W are much easier to follow and offer a lot more continuity. Where as Beretta's really good handguns are often short-lived special runs, hard to get, etc.
JMO,
I have had a 92FS since '94 and enjoy shooting it. It has always been accurate and dependable. That said, I carry a Glock 30SF.
I just measured my M9 and it is true that the trigger reach is barely more than a Glock. It did feel bigger in my hand though.
Failure2Stop
02-11-13, 11:01
I just measured my M9 and it is true that the trigger reach is barely more than a Glock. It did feel bigger in my hand though.
Did you measure the depth and width of both grips?
Some 92's are really well thought of. Sadly Beretta doesn't make them any more.
C4
Couldn't agree more. Beretta has offered some unique variations of the 92 platform, sadly they made them in short runs and didn't advertise them well. 92G-SD, 92G Elite II and the 92 Stock. Now you will pay out the wazoo for these.
Still a fan though...
Couldn't agree more. Beretta has offered some unique variations of the 92 platform, sadly they made them in short runs and didn't advertise them well. 92G-SD, 92G Elite II and the 92 Stock. Now you will pay out the wazoo for these.
Still a fan though...
I shot my 92G-SD yesterday (as it was above 30 for the first time in a long while). With that heavy slide, the gun is SOOOOFT shooting. It almost felt like I was back on target (waiting for the slide to catch up with me). :D
C4
I shot my 92G-SD yesterday (as it was above 30 for the first time in a long while). With that heavy slide, the gun is SOOOOFT shooting. It almost felt like I was back on target (waiting for the slide to catch up with me). :D
C4
Notice all the ones I listed feature the heavy “Brigadier” slide. They beg for +P ammo.
Nephrology
02-11-13, 13:05
The 92 series are good guns, but I think the lack of a truly compact or subcompact offering (besides the fairly uncommon 92 compacts) makes them less popular in the private market. Additionally they STILL sell the 92 with its fixed metal front sight... arguably the most ridiculous thing about the gun. The ergonomics, too, are not very intuitive, especially for those used to a 1911 style or striker fired semi-automatic.
I like the Beretta, and would choose to carry it over several of the "flavor of the month" pistols that are pimped now days.
The 92 series are good guns, but I think the lack of a truly compact or subcompact offering (besides the fairly uncommon 92 compacts) makes them less popular in the private market. Additionally they STILL sell the 92 with its fixed metal front sight... arguably the most ridiculous thing about the gun. The ergonomics, too, are not very intuitive, especially for those used to a 1911 style or striker fired semi-automatic.
Agree.
C4
RogerinTPA
02-11-13, 14:08
I had a PX4 storm in .40 when they first came out. Garbage. It broke quite a few times with in the first year or so. Beretta's CS sucked. Had it fixed for the last time, sold it, then went to the M&Ps (45, 40, 9, 9c) and didn't look back.
brickboy240
02-11-13, 15:14
It may be soft shooting and pretty reliable but it is way too thick and chunky and the safety way up on the slide is just awkward...sorry.
I had a 96F and for a 40...it was very soft shooting but I could not get used to the safety on the slide and if you power-stroke it fast....you can EASILY decock the pistol while doing so and have a pistol that is decocked and with the safety on. Not good if you're in a fight....I would think.
With the front sight as part of the slide, sight replacement is not easy. then there is that long, crunch-tickety trigger on the d/a side.
Overall...the Beretta is a mixed bag if you ask me.
-brickboy240
crusader377
02-11-13, 16:10
I think part of Beretta's problem is like with FN and SIG handguns.
That is they change stuff ALL OF THE TIME. I have a hard time following Beretta's IF-THEN flow chart of handguns they make, handguns they use to make, etc, etc. Same with FN. Not as bad with SIG, but pretty close.
Glock, HK, and S&W are much easier to follow and offer a lot more continuity. Where as Beretta's really good handguns are often short-lived special runs, hard to get, etc.
JMO,
I agree with you on this. I think part of this is a lack of a coherent marketing plan. Sometimes you have to wonder if Beretta even has a marketing department. Although it is somewhat a dated design, The Beretta 92 is a good pistol and the build quality and reliability of the pistol is very good. I almost think Beretta is a company that doesn't know if it wants to be a high end sporting gun manufacturer or a manufacturer of defensive/military firearms.
For a company who has been so successful with their 92 series, it amazes me that they haven't been able to produce a competitive modern polymer pistol even though they have been in the market for nearly 30 years especially since they do have the resources to design one. Walther is a far smaller company yet they have developed the excellent PPQ pistol and I see no reason why Beretta could not design a pistol with similiar utility and quality.
Also, I don't know why they don't consolidate the CX4 carbine line around the model that uses the 92 magazines and bring it in at a $550-$650 price point and market it as a lower cost home defense carbine.
Finally, they have the ARX-160 rifle which I think would be a successful rifle if they brought it in at a sub $1500 price point.
It may be soft shooting and pretty reliable but it is way too thick and chunky and the safety way up on the slide is just awkward...sorry.
I had a 96F and for a 40...it was very soft shooting but I could not get used to the safety on the slide and if you power-stroke it fast....you can EASILY decock the pistol while doing so and have a pistol that is decocked and with the safety on. Not good if you're in a fight....I would think.
With the front sight as part of the slide, sight replacement is not easy. then there is that long, crunch-tickety trigger on the d/a side.
Overall...the Beretta is a mixed bag if you ask me.
-brickboy240
I guess I just grew up on DA revolvers, but with the D spring, it's an easy trigger compared to some.
I've taken several classes and done some deployments with it. It does the job just fine.
I had a PX4 storm in .40 when they first came out. Garbage. It broke quite a few times with in the first year or so. Beretta's CS sucked. Had it fixed for the last time, sold it, then went to the M&Ps (45, 40, 9, 9c) and didn't look back.
Honestly, is there a single Euro based gun manufacture that has good CS?
C4
I would love to get my hands on any of the unicorn Beretta's (92G-SD, Elite, etc). It amazes me that Beretta decided to take their best pistols off the market and create an abomination like the PX4.
I have a M9 (commercial model) and love it. I wouldn't run it in a class but they are beautiful guns and very acurate.
They are very soft shooting.
There are a lot of Beretta guns to love.
My model 87 Cheetah in 22lr is nice:
http://www.mechmodels.com/images/pb87_1_022812.jpg
polydeuces
02-11-13, 22:16
Honestly, is there a single Euro based gun manufacture that has good CS?
C4
Actually, Steyr USA managed to surprise me big time in a good way.
But truth be told this is really because of one particular individual at their US office, without whom they'd probably suck as bad as all the others....
If you think euro's manufacturers' CS is bad here, wait till you need something from them at home - totally insane.
I've had to send a buddy of mine in Germany a set of HK guide springs because he simply would not get any response from their rep. 3 months and waiting.
Never mind he's LEO, they still treat their customers like dirt. It's sort of disgraceful.
They are very soft shooting.
There are a lot of Beretta guns to love.
My model 87 Cheetah in 22lr is nice:
http://www.mechmodels.com/images/pb87_1_022812.jpg
Wow. Amazing. That is a fine pistol.
Urban_Redneck
02-12-13, 06:54
Honestly, is there a single Euro based gun manufacture that has good CS?
C4
I've heard CZ is very good. Beretta CS has been awful to deal with, forever.
I was issued one at the 1st dept I worked for. It is a very smooth shooting gun and I was very accurate with it. I hated the decocker and it was a little bulky. The main issue which I am unsure if it was fixed or not it the locking block. In our small dept (at the time 6 deputies, 1 chief deputy and a Sheriff) we had 3 locking block breaks, including myself, inside a year. This was with less than 5,000 rds thru each with no hard use and keeping them clean and lubed.. After the issues we switched to Sig 226 which we had issues with as well we finally switched to Glock 22s and have not had any issues since the adoption of the G22.
legumeofterror
02-12-13, 09:58
Honestly, is there a single Euro based gun manufacture that has good CS?
C4
CZ's customer's service has been excellent in my experience. Both times I have called about purchasing extra parts they shipped them to me at no cost.
I updated all 4 of my Beretta's to the latest generation locking blocks.
You can get them on Midways and Brownells.
But my 1st beretta I've had since 1990 and several things happened along the way.
Extractor and trigger bar spring broke.
Beretta sent me new ones and gun smith put it in.
Replaced locking block after nearly 15k documented firing on it.
These are normal wear items...sorry......I don't believe in that stupid crap commercial where they welded up the cars hood and promised no oil change for 100k miles.
Doesn't happen with Glocks or Sig's or whatever.....even AK's they need maintenance no matter what.
Hell even a slingshot needs maintenance after poking the eyes out of squirrels and little kids for years.
brickboy240
02-12-13, 11:37
That Cheetah would be pretty if it were not for the "novel" of writing on the side. Wow...and we thought Ruger was bad about placing a novel of type on it's guns! LOL
-brickboy240
Yeah, that is too bad. S&W does that also.
brickboy240
02-12-13, 12:57
Yeah...that "billboard" on their first 1911s was very ugly.
-brickboy240
I've avoided the Beretta 92FS since the early 90's when I started to get into pistol shooting on a serious basis, preferring the Browning Hi Power, CZ-75 variants, 1911's, even the HK P7, and others. I am somewhat old school, so what to me is the newer, polymer stuff is fine, functional, and I shoot them well, just don't have an affinity for them.
Back to the Beretta. I saw the 92 as the new kid on the block at one time. Obviously, our military sidearm, at one time popular with law enforcement and in the entertainment media. All were big turn offs for me, as I gravitate away from the lastest, greatest and trendy. Now, 20 years later I have finally acquired a new 92FS. The safety is in the wrong place, and works opposite to every other pistol with a safety I have including a beautiful little Beretta 85FS. It is large, and the grip is wide. However, I have fallen for the thing. It is reasonably accurate, lthough shoots a bit low for me, but that is improving. With the installation of the D spring, the DA/SA trigger is wonderful. It is just a sexy pistol, that is extremely reliable, and able to hold 18 rounds with flush fit magazines, although I prefer the 15 round mags.
These pistols are easy to work on and modify by yourself. They are pretty modular. In fact so far, within a few minutes I've replaced the hammer spring, hammer, and installed a larger mag release. While I won't carry it for CCW, it is a great home defense or car gun, and gives confidence at the range. I can't imagine this thing having an FTF or FTE, just stone cold reliable.
I don't see a need for a safety on a DA/SA pistol like the 92FS so mine stays in the ON position. It only gets used as a decocker, although I am comfortable lowering the hammer, safely on a live round as with many of my other pistols, so that mostly doesn't get used either.
Most people on the forums knows me as the beretta nut, as I am a huge Beretta 92 fan. I've been collecting since 1993, when I bought my first gun. Over the years, I've probably owned just about everything at one time or another. I had a few Berettas in the 1990s, that I later sold. I've had the Beretta bug on and off over the years.
About 4 years ago, I got another 92FS, and I was hooked. With the hogue rubber grip panels (not the wrap arounds) - the grip is just perfect for me. I have small hands too, but it just works. Over time, I found that I even preferred the grip of the 92 over 1911s... I eventually sold off everything else, one by one, including an Ed Brown and a Custom Shop 9mm Springfield 1911. I just found that the 92 did it for me.
Now, I pretty much only have 92s (different variants). Granted, my "favorite" handgun has changed over the years several times. However, for about 4 years now, it's stayed the 92. And, I really have no urge to buy anything else but Berettas, since I've owned so many different handguns over the years.
People occasionally give me beef for liking the 92, but most just repeat things that they have heard others say about it - with no real experience with the gun themselves. I just ignore them. Everytime I shoot the gun, I have a smile on my face.
I also really like how easy it is to work on the frame and change out parts - and no fitting is required.
Most people on the forums knows me as the beretta nut, as I am a huge Beretta 92 fan. I've been collecting since 1993, when I bought my first gun. Over the years, I've probably owned just about everything at one time or another. I had a few Berettas in the 1990s, that I later sold. I've had the Beretta bug on and off over the years.
About 4 years ago, I got another 92FS, and I was hooked. With the hogue rubber grip panels (not the wrap arounds) - the grip is just perfect for me. I have small hands too, but it just works. Over time, I found that I even preferred the grip of the 92 over 1911s... I eventually sold off everything else, one by one, including an Ed Brown and a Custom Shop 9mm Springfield 1911. I just found that the 92 did it for me.
Now, I pretty much only have 92s (different variants). Granted, my "favorite" handgun has changed over the years several times. However, for about 4 years now, it's stayed the 92. And, I really have no urge to buy anything else but Berettas, since I've owned so many different handguns over the years.
People occasionally give me beef for liking the 92, but most just repeat things that they have heard others say about it - with no real experience with the gun themselves. I just ignore them. Everytime I shoot the gun, I have a smile on my face.
I also really like how easy it is to work on the frame and change out parts - and no fitting is required.
As someone that has recently gotten into collecting rare 92's (92G-SD, 92G Centurion Type M, 92G (prototype)), which ones (in your opinion) are the ones to own?
C4
brickboy240
02-13-13, 11:23
Right now, Coles Dist. in KY has several nice older Italian 92s on their Gunbroker sales area. All are under 400 bucks and look really nice.
I might pick one up just to have one.
-brickboy240
As someone that has recently gotten into collecting rare 92's (92G-SD, 92G Centurion Type M, 92G (prototype)), which ones (in your opinion) are the ones to own?
C4
Well, I have never been one to buy used guns - so, that eliminates some real goodies from the past. The Elite II is a nice gun.
I'm not into the Vertec grip (had one when they first came out), so the Steel I model and the Elite I do not interest me.
The Stock model is really cool. With the frame safety and other modifications Beretta did - its an awesome gun. Not cheap.
I always wanted a Billennium. For a while, they went for nearly $2k unfired. Late last year, their slowly climbed to close to $3k. I am at a place where I could get one if I wanted, but I'm just not gonna spend $3k on that. I had a $3k 9mm 1911 for a while, and while it was awesome, I'm not spending that much on a handgun again.
92G-SD is also sweet. I passed on one of these years ago when I bought an Inox Vertec. I wish I'd have gotten the 92G-SD instead.
Currently, on the current production models... You can get the 90-Two, M9A1, 92A1, 92 COmpact, the new M9A1 Inox compact and the M9/92FS.... I have owned a couple 90-Two's. I hate that grip. I tried to make myself like them. I sold both. 92A1 - nice improvements to the gun and dovetailed sights. I just sold both of mine this week, however. I just prefer the feel/weight distribution/balance of the standard 92FS models. Also, I sold one of my M9A1s, but kept one (since I have night sights installed in it).... I am moving away from the railed 92s now.
As for the Inox M9A1 compact... I just don't really care for Inox Berettas. Its the one gun I actually prefer in black. Plus, it is a strange little beast, with it being a "compact" but having that big, honking rail. Word is that they will come out in black later this year - but because of the rail, I have no plans to get one
Hi Shipwreck. See you on the Beretta Forums, and elsewhere, and picked up a lot of good info from your posts including on changing out my hammer spring to a "D".
I just ordered the two dot, adjustable Beretta (LPA) sight from MGW. Any advice on install or experience with these? I am actually debating on installing it or just getting Novaks that are a little taller (Brigadier height) to offset my 92FS shooting a little low (2.5 in at 25 yards).
Thanks.
Hi Shipwreck. See you on the Beretta Forums, and elsewhere, and picked up a lot of good info from your posts including on changing out my hammer spring to a "D".
I just ordered the two dot, adjustable Beretta (LPA) sight from MGW. Any advice on install or experience with these? I am actually debating on installing it or just getting Novaks that are a little taller (Brigadier height) to offset my 92FS shooting a little low (2.5 in at 25 yards).
Thanks.
I've seen those before. I've never really been a fan of those. I don't reload, so I like the standard sights just fine. My favorite are nightsights - the white circles around the tritium are even easier to see than the plain white dots at my dark, indoor range.
I tend to send my slides off to Tooltech Gunsight for night sight install. I am sending another slide off next week (they drill the front sight). I have never tried those Beretta adjustable sights.
I've seen those before. I've never really been a fan of those. I don't reload, so I like the standard sights just fine. My favorite are nightsights - the white circles around the tritium are even easier to see than the plain white dots at my dark, indoor range.
I tend to send my slides off to Tooltech Gunsight for night sight install. I am sending another slide off next week (they drill the front sight). I have never tried those Beretta adjustable sights.
I'm thinking about doing the tooltech option. That and a surefire light mount. I really wish there was a good way of putting an RMR on a 92.
Exiledviking
02-13-13, 19:04
I tend to send my slides off to Tooltech Gunsight for night sight install. I am sending another slide off next week (they drill the front sight). I have never tried those Beretta adjustable sights.
What's the usual turnaround from Tooltech?
What's the usual turnaround from Tooltech?
The first time I used them, it was 3 weeks total - including my shipping time to them. 2nd time - it was two weeks total. Very fast.
Someone told me recently it took a month for them. They apparently wait until they have a certain amount done, and then they mail a batch back at one time. So, to some degree, it may just be the luck of the draw when your slide goes out in the mail
That Cheetah would be pretty if it were not for the "novel" of writing on the side. Wow...and we thought Ruger was bad about placing a novel of type on it's guns!
That explains the reason I jumped all over the one I bought, a 1988 production without all of that stuff stamped all over the pistol.
DocCasualty
02-13-13, 21:18
The design remains solid as a full-size 9mm combat pistol. That's what it is and that's what it was designed to be. Personally, the slide-mounted safety/decocker is a deal breaker for me and why my early '90s Taurus PT99 is a much better pistol IMO. If you're going to compare it to or try to use it as a CCW pistol, its limitations become apparent. For a HD, OC or range pistol, if you're comfortable with the slide-mounted safety/decocker lever it remains an excellent choice.
DanjojoUSMC
02-13-13, 21:56
If you are going to spend a lot of time with the 92/M9 the best bet is train for racking the slide with grip outboard, weak hand thumb on top of slide and fingers under. Never actuated safety/decocker like this or seen anybody else do it. You don't come down on the slide the same way as you do with overhand, even if "attacking" it.
The only .380 pistol I happen to like is a Beretta. I saw one not long ago at one of my LGS. I just can't convince myself to buying a .380 no matter how much I like the gun and that is one sexy little pistol.
I've seen those before. I've never really been a fan of those. I don't reload, so I like the standard sights just fine. My favorite are nightsights - the white circles around the tritium are even easier to see than the plain white dots at my dark, indoor range.
I tend to send my slides off to Tooltech Gunsight for night sight install. I am sending another slide off next week (they drill the front sight). I have never tried those Beretta adjustable sights.
Thanks. I may just go the Novak's route as I'm not a big fan of night sights, or I may just give the adjustables a try as I DO reload and POI can change with different bullet weights, and loads.
As someone that has recently gotten into collecting rare 92's (92G-SD, 92G Centurion Type M, 92G (prototype)), which ones (in your opinion) are the ones to own?
C4
A nice 92G Elite II is a must have. A 92 Stock or Combat if your willing to choke back the price.
A nice 92G Elite II is a must have. A 92 Stock or Combat if your willing to choke back the price.
If you ever find a 92 Combat, drop me a line. :D
C4
Coal Dragger
02-14-13, 17:02
I shot the M9 (92f) well when I was in the Marines, but never really developed any love for it. The grip doesn't really fit my hand well, and I never cared much for the trigger. The trigger could probably be fixed, but the grip frame for me is just not comfortable even though my hands are big enough for the frame.
HawaiianM4
02-16-13, 02:46
Thanks for starting the Beretta thread.
I do like the Beretta 92FS. At the time I bought one I was in the military and it was our issued pistol and I want to get good at shooting and handling it off duty. At the time it offered high capacity magazines and it didn't jam.
Also 9mm ammo has been plentiful and different brands don't seem to bother it. I have found american eagle to be the most accurate ammo for it.
Also the Beretta needs to be cleaned and function checked. Part of the fun for me is taking it apart, cleaning and then putting back together.
For me the Beretta is still fun to shoot.
I'm a huge Beretta fan as well. I do like Glocks, but I vastly prefer the Beretta 92. I've had about 10+ Berettas over the years, and never had a malfunction unless it was directly related to the magazine or ammo. Where as my Glocks have had issues. Beretta's other pistol designs aren't my cup of tea, but the 92 is easily my favorite handgun. I have no illusions that its "as good" as a H&K, Glock, or M&P in the ease of maintenance & long term durability. However, I can live with 100K lifespan with routine maintance.
Finally, some pics of my new carry guns:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v108/Avtomat/m9a1cs_zps62f7b538.jpg
And my bedside gun (sans TRL-1)
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v108/Avtomat/IMG_1487.jpg
^^^^^^Very nice. I recognize those from somewhere else. ;)
Did you do the OD green grips on the M9A1 yourself or are the aftermarket?
Finally, some pics of my new carry guns:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v108/Avtomat/m9a1cs_zps62f7b538.jpg
Ah I hate you...TWO of the new M9a1 compacts?!
Did you get those from that very first batch that was available on gunbroker? They're the only ones I saw that had 1 shiny black grip and 1 flat black grip....
Devilstang
02-16-13, 19:27
I have a .40 s&w px4 and I love it. Never had a failure.
Beretta customer service is absolute shit.
My son's Neos was part of a recall. I sent it in his original high quality molded plastic box per their preferred shipping instructions for repair. I had to take a half day off work to have the UPS man pick it up. No notification is given when they ship the gun back which obviously requires an adult signature. So after the missed delivery I have to take another half day off work. What came back was a different serial numbered gun (why his was determined to be unrepairable is beyond me) in a flimsy plastic container with shitty foam inserts. The gun was so loose in the inferior package that a loose magazine scratched the hell out of the barrel down to shiny metal.
So I call them. They tell me I am out of luck with my "quality case" they decided was easier to confiscate than return to me. And I would have to repeat the entire process to refinish the barrel on the damagd gun. Oh, did I mention that my state requires handgun registration? So now I have a registered handgun no longer in my possession and a new handgun not registered with no paperwork to identify its origin and how I came to possess it.
I repeat the half day off to ship, and then another unscheduled missed delivery, followed by another half day off to sign for it. They re-barreled the gun. And this time it was scratched on the bottom by their gunsmith as there was nothing else in the shitty case to do it.
I call again just to tell them I am selling my 3 Berettas and will never be buying their products again. I'm sure they couldn't care less.
Ah I hate you...TWO of the new M9a1 compacts?!
Did you get those from that very first batch that was available on gunbroker? They're the only ones I saw that had 1 shiny black grip and 1 flat black grip....
I actually got both from my local Gouger Mountain since they are the only store I've been able to find them at, and I didn't feel like going through the Gunbroker hassle. Plus even with GM's "Sale Price" I came out cheaper than the current Gunbroker prices.
@Pilot1: I made the OD green grips. :)
What's the usual turnaround from Tooltech?
I am sending off another slide this Tuesday. We shall see how long it takes this time.
I'm a huge Beretta fan as well. I do like Glocks. . .
Finally, some pics of my new carry guns:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v108/Avtomat/m9a1cs_zps62f7b538.jpg
My first firearm was the Beretta 92FS back in 1992. Regrettably I sold it 5 (or was it 6?) years later. Anyways, always been wanting a Centurion and now this Compact version as pictured is in the offering. Truly has got me itchin'!
Gary1911A1
02-18-13, 03:14
I really like my Beretta 92 Elite with it's G type decocker. I look at the Beretta as an improved Walther P38.
I really like my Beretta 92 Elite with it's G type decocker. I look at the Beretta as an improved Walther P38.
I only use my 92SF's safety like a decocker, meaning it does not stay engaged when the pistol is loaded. I see no need for a safety on a DA/SA pistol, especially with the Beretta's long first DA pull. The safety operates opposite from all my other pistols with a manual safety, so I'd rather not learn a new method of operation.
someone posted on here about someone that can refinish an old Beretta 92FS to make it look like new again?
Who was it?
Mines was purchased in 1990 or so and has been carried and put away wet.
Saw Die Hard 5 and in the beginning it shos John McClane shooting his trusty Beretta 92Fs :dance3:
The 92FS is a solid combat handgun. If you like it, buy it. Many agencies have sold their Berettas off for Glocks or M&Ps. You can often find solid agency owned Berettas at a good price in your local gun stores. Most of these guns were carried a lot and shot a little. Here are a few things you can do to make your 92FS experience better:
Try to find older ones that were made in Italy. If not, try to find one will all metal parts. If you get one with plastic parts for a good price, buy the all steel replacement pack - about $60.
Replace the hammer spring with the D spring - about $2. Then replace the hammer with an Elite hammer - about $15. This combination will have the DA shooting like a fine old school S&W revolver. The best $20 bucks you will ever spend.
Replace the trigger spring with the Wolff Factory Weight Trigger Conversion Unit - about $20. This will further improve your Beretta trigger but not a profoundly as the above mods.
Buy the new style locking block kit. Shoot the gun until the original part breaks and then have the new part on standby. If preparing for TEOTWAWKI replace the block, pin, and spring now and keep the original parts on standby.
Lube the gun, it is a machine - much like your car. It needs lube.
Crimson Trace Laser Grips. Just the grip profile it's self is my personal favorite. The laser is an added bonus.
If you want a light rail, try Brownells part # 078-000-076WB. It may be a better value than the cost of a new M9A1.
someone posted on here about someone that can refinish an old Beretta 92FS to make it look like new again?
Who was it?
Mines was purchased in 1990 or so and has been carried and put away wet.
Saw Die Hard 5 and in the beginning it shos John McClane shooting his trusty Beretta 92Fs :dance3:
CCR Refinishing is the way to go. They are very popular at the Beretta Forum...
http://www.ccrrefinishing.com/
His house black is close to the factory finish
someone posted on here about someone that can refinish an old Beretta 92FS to make it look like new again?
Who was it?
Mines was purchased in 1990 or so and has been carried and put away wet.
Saw Die Hard 5 and in the beginning it shos John McClane shooting his trusty Beretta 92Fs :dance3:
John McClane and Martin Riggs are the reason I bought my first Beretta.
More for die hard than lethal...for me.
Sent from my SGH-T989 using Tapatalk 2
HawaiianM4
02-18-13, 18:18
For a light/laser combo I use a TLR-2® with Laser Sight on the 92FS. With the laser I get pin point accuracy. The light is 300 lumens. Since I have an older model I have the Surefire MR11 X200 Light Integral Gun Mounting Rail.
I replaced the plastic grips with Beretta 92 Series Wood Grips w/ Medallion.
ennbeegunny15
02-20-13, 08:16
I like the beretta, I shoot well with it, and the DA pull really doesn't bother me.
All that said they are more expensive and harder to find parts for locally than a glock.
I shoot just about every modern pistol I've had my hands on fairly similarly on the clock in a couple drills (glock, M&P, xd, beretta fn...dot torture, el presidente and the test to name a few).
With that in mind I went with the gun that I could readily find parts for locally, that just so happened to be glock.
^this, i love my Beretta's. mine are range guns.
ennbeegunny15
02-20-13, 08:18
I would like to own a 92 of some sort one day. I think its a pretty cool pistol.
I thought I read somewhere that you can disable the safety and make it so the lever is only a decocker.
Sent from my PC36100 using Tapatalk 2
yes you can, i had my decocker/safety break on me at the range. so i decided to experiment and put some rounds down range and it fired even though i had engaged the safety. i was going to keep it that way, but decided to replace it. it was an easy fix. so you can actually do the mod yourself if you don't want a safety/decocker feature.
ennbeegunny15
02-20-13, 08:19
Beretta's are sexy guns and i shoot them very well, but for down and dirty i use my glocks.:D
After getting my Centruian out to shoot the other day I thought that it may need a refinish. Is it possible to strip the blue and get it cerakoted?
I'll just echo most of what has been said here.
Nothing inherently wrong with Beretta. My 96 was my first handgun I bought. The action is smoooooooooooooooooooooooth.
The pro's/cons as I have found:
Pros: Reliable--I had some FTE, but cleaned the extractor and problem fixed.
Its a pretty firearm.
Takedown is simpler (and doesn't involve the Darwin feature of pulling the trigger) than most other pistols.
There was a time when the DA pull was a "feature" But times have changed.
Did I mention the action is smoooooooooooooooth.
Makes excellent club when empty!
Cons: She's a biggun. Bigger than a Glock with 2 fewer rounds. WAY bigger than an M&P with 2 fewer rounds.
Not as robust, particularly in .40 caliber.
Not popular with the cool kids.
Nasty long DA pull that needs practice to master.
Those with small hands can find it uncomfortable (I have "medium" hands for a 6 footer, and have no issue with it).
Safety is backwards if you like 1911s. But you do get in the habit of thumbing in forward. I've never accidently flipped it on, but I have forgetton to flip it off.
These DA/SA were a middle way between Revolvers and 1911s before the Polymer Pistol Plethera (TM). There are a lot of good pistols here--the older Sigs (when sigs were good) that mainly have fallen because they aren't popular so parts/training/manual of arms have deteriorated with age.
I've thought of selling my 96, but I just can't do it. It is my only .40 and it is also great for dry fire practice with the exposed external hammer or the long DA pull to perfect trigger squeeze with pennies/shells casings.
brickboy240
02-20-13, 11:47
Another plus to the 96F is that it is a very soft shooting 40. Takes some of the "snappy" nature of the 40SW round away.
Only the HK USP 40 full-size is softer recoiling than the 96F Beretta in my experiences.
The 96F is also very reliable....I don't recall my old 96F ever jamming.
-brickboy240
Berettas are OK, but just OK, and almost everything else (service/military pistol wise) is SO much better.
TED
Berettas are OK, but just OK, and almost everything else (service/military pistol wise) is SO much better.
TED
Care to elaborate?
By the way, some may not know this, but you can now get A+ quality mags that allow 18 rounds flush and 20 just a bit out the bottom for the 92 series. That makes up for the size.
as some have eluded to the design has been surpassed. That said I qualed expert last week with a shot out army M9 40/40 in the black at 25m. if lubed properly and maintained it will work.
Berettas are OK, but just OK, and almost everything else (service/military pistol wise) is SO much better.
TED
Which is why they were a fly by night company that lost all govt contracts. They had a limited fan base in the world of guns and now of you find one they are cheap as hell.
Oh...wait...none of that is true. nm
Berettas are OK, but just OK, and almost everything else (service/military pistol wise) is SO much better.
TED
You do realize the Beretta M9 IS a service/military pistol...right? Infact its gotta be the most commonly used military pistol...
Nothing inherently wrong with Beretta.
When people ask me what I think about them, my answer is usually 'A very well made, obsolete design'.
My issues:
I like the trigger to be the same from shot to shot, on any weapon;
The direction the slide mounted lever moves;
The height over the hand of the slide mounted lever;
...and the open top slide.
I know getting 'bit' by the slide is an operator related issue, but it is the only self loading pistol that has ever done this to me.
Having said that, I'd like to get one because of its military provenance, not because I think it can keep up with other contemporary designs.
S. Galbraith
02-21-13, 07:54
The Beretta is "okay", but has many have pointed out there are better designs now days.
Alloy framed pistols are on the way out. There is really no advantage to using aluminum alloy, when modern polymers can get the job done. One thing to consider is that any firearm on today's market that has a frame made of aluminum alloy will have a substancial manufacturing cost mark up compared to its polymer competators if it is a quality gun. There is a reason why the 1980s and 1990s were considered the golden age of the alloy framed wonder 9s(Sigs/Berettas), because polymer guns had not yet dominated the firearms market. Most LE agencies still favored using alloy framed pistols in those days, so the demand was there for high quality contract pistols. Not to mention, I believe that the 1994 AWB actually kept the quality of service pistols very high because the primary market was highly demanding LE contracts.....unlike the civilian commercial market in which the average owner babies their pistol and doesn't push it hard. Now days, it is a much harder sell to justify the cost of an alloy framed pistol to the LE market.....especially when those pistols also have the added cost of a hammer fired action. Companies like Sig and Beretta have been scrambling for the last decade to cut manufacturing costs where ever possible in order to sell pistols closer in price to their polymer rivals. As such, there have been questionable quality levels from both manufacturers in the last decade from civilian owners(who baby their guns and usually don't put a lot of rounds down range), and especially from LE agencies. Most of the DOD guys I know who still carry Berettas favor those older guns like I mentioned due to modern Berettas breaking down much faster, and for us in DOI our older Sigs are still our best running guns.
So, in a nut shell......if you really want a piece of nostalgia, go for an older Beretta. If you want a modern, top of the line pistol consider H&K.
1. Alloy framed pistols are on the way out.
2. There is really no advantage to using aluminum alloy, when modern polymers can get the job done.
3. One thing to consider is that any firearm on today's market that has a frame made of aluminum alloy will have a substancial manufacturing cost mark up compared to its polymer competators if it is a quality gun.
4. As such, there have been questionable quality levels from both manufacturers in the last decade from civilian owners(who baby their guns and usually don't put a lot of rounds down range), and especially from LE agencies.
5. due to modern Berettas breaking down much faster
6. If you want a modern, top of the line pistol consider H&K.
1. Unfortunately this is the truth...the difference between having to machine a piece of aluminum or inject some plastic into a mold is obvious...even gun manufacturers are after the all mighty dollar
2. Again, probably true...I don't think anyone will argue that a metal framed pistol FEELS more solid and has less "slop" with the upper reciever, but does it actually make it function any different than a "cheaper" feeling plastic frame? No
3. I hear this a lot and its kind of silly IMO...the Berettas I see are very similarly priced to Glocks, M&Ps, XDs, etc...maybe $50 more in some cases. If you're spending ~$500-$600 on a pistol I would imagine, for 99% of people, $50 difference wont matter to them. In addition to this, I typically see USED Berettas sell for considerably more than USED glocks/M&Ps...at least in my neck of the woods, they seem to hold their value considerably more than their plastic counterparts.
4. I would classify myself in the "civilian owner who babies their guns" group for sure, so I have no personal experience with this...but I've loved Berettas for a long time now and I spend a lot of time on the Beretta forum, this is the very first Ive ever heard of this. While Beretta hasnt changed the 92-series pistol MUCH, they HAVE made changes over the years...the 92A1 is a somewhat updated version of the 92 and has some small upgrades in it. Not calling you a liar here...just havent heard this before.
5. Again, I have heard absolutely nothing about modern day Berettas "breaking down faster" than older versions...in my experience they seem to be every bit as durable as any other pistol.
6. I will agree 100% with you on this point :)
I prefer the feel and weight of a metal framed pistol, whether it is steel or aluminum alloy. I prefer the aluminum alloy framed pistols in general for carry, but do carry steel framed pistols like the wonderful HK P7 often due to its slimness and compact size.
No question, polymer has taken over, mainly for cost, but it does function, and has been totally embraced by law enforcement and most individuals. Still, for me it feels toy like, and in general top heavy due to the disparity of having a heavy steel slide on a light polymer frame.
It is a personal choice, there really is no right or wrong, just what works for you.
talaananthes
02-21-13, 09:13
Beretta 92 is like the Browning Hi-Power and CZ75 . . . game changing for its day, a pleasure to take to the range, but a bit dated. Any of those will serve you very well if you want to carry them, and no one will mock you in person to your face (who cares what shitheads on the internet say), but there are advantages from more modern designs.
On the other hand, steel pistols last a very, very long time. I used to own a WW2 era FN Hi-Power (1945 Belgian army gun, first series out of the factory after liberation) that shot like an absolute champ. Not a pretty gun, but it just. plain. worked. and had a gorgeous trigger pull. If you want a steel pistol just to have, I'd say the BHP or CZ before a Beretta.
I've been carrying Berettas in one form or another for over 10 years, and mine have been everything I could want. I keep looking around for a 'better' modern gun, but nothing I've tried has been sufficiently 'better' to justify the cost of switching platforms. The Beretta isn't perfect, to be sure. It's a big gun, especially for only holding 15 rounds. The safety isn't the most ergonomic. The front sight is integral to the slide and can't be swapped out. The DA/SA action requires a bit of practice to master.
But you know what? Most of those have been addressed at one time or another. The 92A1, Elite/Brigadier series (now sadly out of production) and Vertec (again, sadly out of production) all have dovetailed front sights. The G-pattern decocker (again, sadly out of production) eliminates the issue of the safety by simply turning it into a decocker, much like a SIG. It's still a big beefy gun, but for my truckasaurus hands, that's a benefit. And with the introduction of the 92A1, Beretta now has flush-fit 17-round magazines that will also fit the standard 92, bringing the capacity up to par with the G17 and M&P9. Replace the hammer spring with a D-model spring, and you've improved the trigger characteristics immensely.
Mags and holsters are plentiful and available and cheap. Even during this heinous panic buying time, I was able to get factory Beretta magazines for $21 each, shipped. Try that with HK, or even the M&P/Glock.
I've been carrying an old, 1999-vintage Beretta 92G Elite for most of my adult life. I use it in IDPA, in training classes, and for daily carry. The gun just plain works. If Beretta brought back that gun, along with the 92G-SD (or simply made the 92A1 in a G configuration), they'd be every bit the equal of the Glock or M&P from a functional standpoint. Cost is definitely going to be an issue, simply because it's cheaper (yet just as functional) to mold a frame from plastic than it is to mill it from a block of aluminum. I'd love to see Beretta work on a 92-based design with a polymer frame, but it seems they've put their eggs in the PX4 rotating-barrel-abortion basket.
The M9 is a good gun, but not a great gun. It was designed for guys who carry a lot and shoot ocassionally.
Uncle Sam spec'ed it for a life of 5,500 rounds -- obviously they'll go many, many times that.
No machine is perfect. Don't get sentimental about a machine.
http://gunnuts.net/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/M93-1024x768.jpg
http://i767.photobucket.com/albums/xx319/jayjaypunisher/068.jpg
http://i637.photobucket.com/albums/uu92/fiveofnine/beretta92FS/Beretta003.jpg?t=1242432871
http://www.guns.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/12/SlideCrack1.jpg
http://img442.imageshack.us/img442/2743/z92bloccrk2.jpg
http://img638.imageshack.us/img638/4089/z92bloccrk1.jpg
http://img695.imageshack.us/img695/1858/z92slide4.jpg
http://img217.imageshack.us/img217/6233/z92slide3.jpg
http://img26.imageshack.us/img26/7062/z92barrelcrk.jpg
http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y52/bwskas/gascylinder004.jpg
http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y52/bwskas/gascylinder006.jpg
1996 test:
http://www.guns.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/12/CATResults3.jpg
The M9 is a good gun, but not a great gun. It was designed for guys who carry a lot and shoot ocassionally.
Uncle Sam spec'ed it for a life of 5,500 rounds -- obviously they'll go many, many times that.
No machine is perfect. Don't get sentimental about a machine.
http://gunnuts.net/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/M93-1024x768.jpg
http://i767.photobucket.com/albums/xx319/jayjaypunisher/068.jpg
http://i637.photobucket.com/albums/uu92/fiveofnine/beretta92FS/Beretta003.jpg?t=1242432871
http://www.guns.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/12/SlideCrack1.jpg
http://img442.imageshack.us/img442/2743/z92bloccrk2.jpg
http://img638.imageshack.us/img638/4089/z92bloccrk1.jpg
http://img695.imageshack.us/img695/1858/z92slide4.jpg
http://img217.imageshack.us/img217/6233/z92slide3.jpg
http://img26.imageshack.us/img26/7062/z92barrelcrk.jpg
http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y52/bwskas/gascylinder004.jpg
http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y52/bwskas/gascylinder006.jpg
1996 test:
http://www.guns.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/12/CATResults3.jpg
All true, but the gun has evolved over time. The more modern generations of the locking block last longer between replacements. The military M9 is not the same as the current-generation (or even the 14-year-old gun I carry). Just like Glock, Beretta has made incremental improvements. And I'll pretty well guarantee that my guns receive better preventative maintenance than most of the issued M9s, which will increase the effective life even further.
No gun is perfect. And no gun is right for every person or situation. But I've yet to find a gun that works better enough for me to warrant switching.
Working on getting the SGS compensator for my setup. Alot are telling me it's alot of fun and makes the setup super accurate.
S. Galbraith
02-21-13, 11:10
3. I hear this a lot and its kind of silly IMO...the Berettas I see are very similarly priced to Glocks, M&Ps, XDs, etc...maybe $50 more in some cases. If you're spending ~$500-$600 on a pistol I would imagine, for 99% of people, $50 difference wont matter to them. In addition to this, I typically see USED Berettas sell for considerably more than USED glocks/M&Ps...at least in my neck of the woods, they seem to hold their value considerably more than their plastic counterparts.
Sinister has provided some great photo documentation. These breakages are common with the DOD officers that I work with on their M9s, but it seems to be more common with Berettas manufactured in the post 2000 era. Either way, the M9 has a few achilles heels that causes premature breakages when the gun is run with full power ammo, and/or the pistol isn't serviced on schedule. Beretta has actually mentioned publically, along with Sig Sauer CEO Ron Cohen, that they have considered getting out of the highly competative handgun business and would like to focus on long guns.
This pistol broke at the 2011 All-Army Small Arms Championships at Fort Benning, Georgia. Besides the fact it's a National Guard pistol I have no other information on it.
http://i767.photobucket.com/albums/xx319/jayjaypunisher/068.jpg
This pistol broke at the 2011 All-Army Small Arms Championships at Fort Benning, Georgia. Besides the fact it's a National Guard pistol I have on other information on it.
http://i767.photobucket.com/albums/xx319/jayjaypunisher/068.jpg
That's either an older gun, or a gun built on the older pattern (I don't believe the M9 ever switched to the angled dust cover, but I could be wrong). It's still got a straight dust cover, which hasn't been standard in several years on civilian guns.
Berettas do break. That's undeniable. But they're not the POS's that a lot of folks seem to believe they are. Glocks KB. 1911s crack frames. Everything eventually wears out. You can make them last longer with proper maintenance and good ammo selection, and every design goes through revisions to improve it based on past experiences.
Sinister-
Thanks for the info. It's true, I have seen all of the breakages before on high round count military M9s. It is my personal observation that these all occur on older M9s (92F). Beretta has since improved the locking block with the current style which seems to have remedied the locking block problem. I have seen two 92F slides break. I have yet to see this happen with the newer 92FS type. Time will tell. Of course, the heavier Brigadier and Elite type slides do not seem to have this problem.
I do have to wonder if periodic recoil spring replacement would not have prevented the slide breakage.
That's either an older gun, or a gun built on the older pattern (I don't believe the M9 ever switched to the angled dust cover, but I could be wrong). It's still got a straight dust cover, which hasn't been standard in several years on civilian guns.
First, how did you figure the age of the gun? Serial number's right there. Military guns have the straight dust cover, which as far as I can tell has no bearing on a cracked slide.
Civilian guns now have a plastic trigger and safety. All guns now have a plastic recoil spring guide rod. They may or may not have the new bevels on the locking block (which still has to be changed out as they wear).
S. Galbraith
02-21-13, 12:23
First, how did you figure the age of the gun? Serial number's right there. Military guns have the straight dust cover, which as far as I can tell has no bearing on a cracked slide.
Civilian guns now have a plastic trigger and safety. All guns now have a plastic recoil spring guide rod. They may or may not have the new bevels on the locking block (which still has to be changed out as they wear).
Wow.....they are suplimenting plastic parts with parts that were originally designed to be steel machined parts? I thought that Sig supplimenting MIM parts in place of machined parts was bad. Plastic is fine when the gun was designed from start to finish as such, but when the original design called for machined steel....... Either way though, it seems like a LOT of firearms companies now days have two production lines. One for military/police, and one for the civilian commercial market. In the case of the Remington 870, you get more plastic and MIM parts on the civilian models, while the police models have machined parts.
For a mere $69, Beretta will sell you the original steel parts as an upgrade kit.
"Beretta Factory 92FS Steel Parts:Trigger, Safety Levers, Recoil Road, Mag.Rel.":
http://www.berettausa.com/assets/item/regular/e00706.jpg
http://www.berettausa.com/products/beretta-factory-92fs-steel-partstrigger-safety-levers-recoil-road-magrel/
First, how did you figure the age of the gun? Serial number's right there. Military guns have the straight dust cover, which as far as I can tell has no bearing on a cracked slide.
The serial # doesn't show up in Beretta's lookup tool (which isn't surprising, since only US-made civilian market guns are in there). My point is that it's either an old gun or made to the old M9 design, while the more modern civilian production guns have gradually changed over the years. I'm not sure if the military guns have changed internally or not, as I'm not an expert there, but the straight dust cover lends one to believe that they haven't. If the gun isn't built with the modern refinements to the design, is it fair to put it up as an example of why the design is inferior?
Civilian guns now have a plastic trigger and safety. All guns now have a plastic recoil spring guide rod. They may or may not have the new bevels on the locking block (which still has to be changed out as they wear).
Don't get me started on the plastic parts. I'm not a fan at all, but I understand why Beretta started using them. They can't compete with Glock & S&W on price with an aluminum frame, so they took other cost-saving routes to try and keep the price down. I'd have preferred they design a newer version of the 92 with a modern polymer receiver, but they went with the PX4 instead.
And yes, you have to change out the locking block. That's part of normal preventative maintenance on this design. It's no different than changing out springs or other wear-prone parts, except it is more expensive.
I'm not trying to say the Beretta is somehow superior to more modern guns. It's not, in many ways. But I wouldn't call it obsolete, and I wouldn't discount it as an effective, reliable handgun. Hell, people still carry 1911s, with all their resultant issues of maintenance and tolerances. If I were getting into pistols fresh at this point, I might very well go with an M&P or HK, or even a Glock. But given my amount of time on the Beretta platform, I see no advantage from those guns that would be worth the cost and training time needed to switch.
And dammit, I wish Beretta would re-introduce the 92G-SD. So many of the little foibles of the basic M9/92 pattern gun were fixed in that design.
The last (and only one left) I own (for manly one-handed National Match bullseye):
http://i41.tinypic.com/imr05v.jpg]http://i41.tinypic.com/imr05v.jpg
Nice. You don't see too many Brigadiers, especially ones that aren't Elites/G-SDs.
dragonsfire311
02-21-13, 17:45
I went through the police academy with and carried a cougar 8045F in 45 ACP for several years. never had a problem or malfunction with it, sold it a couple of years ago, wish I hadn't.
The plastic parts are not really a concern IMO.
Has anyone seen the plastic parts break?
By the way, the plastic parts have a steel skeleton.
Beretta is delivering an awesome pistol for the money. It's better than paying the elevated prices SIG charges for a similar gun.
S. Galbraith
02-21-13, 19:57
It's better than paying the elevated prices SIG charges for a similar gun.
Is it? Not that modern day Sigs are anything to really compare to with the Cohen cancer.
That being said, if I wanted a DA/SA pistol I would happily pay double the price for a P30 over a modern Beretta or Sig.
Is it? Not that modern day Sigs are anything to really compare to with the Cohen cancer.
That being said, if I wanted a DA/SA pistol I would happily pay double the price for a P30 over a modern Beretta or Sig.
What does the P30 bring to the table that the 92 doesn't?
It ain't like it has nice trigger or is gonna be any more concealable.
They're both full size duty guns, they're both DA/SA, DAO or the P30 has that LEM... Thing.
Mags for the Beretta grow on trees compared to H&K mags and spare parts are all over the internet.
I can understand liking one over the other, but they're not that different. One is just newer and more popular. And costs twice as much.
I do have to wonder if periodic recoil spring replacement would not have prevented the slide breakage.
I agree with you....
The whole issue of Beretta problems that some claim has been overblown IMHO...
- Change the recoil spring and trigger spring every 3k-5k. - Change the locking block every 20k (I personally say every 15K – it’s only a $35 part, and they tend to break RIGHT after 20k rounds… Better safe than sorry).
Keeping up with recoil spring changes will GREATLY lesson the chance of a block breaking and/or a slide breaking... Many times a 92 with a broken slide has already had 1 locking block break - thus weakening it....
I’ve seen tons of posts over the years on various gun forums… Military guys who claim to have seen morons in the military using their M9s as hammers and tools… Beating on the guns. Also, no one maintains round counts on the guns. So, they get poor maintenance, and no spring changes as necessary. They just shoot the gun until something breaks or it doesn't work right. THEN they start changing springs...
So, no wonder they routinely break in the slide.
Plus, with the crappy magazines the military bought for years, this went a long way towards making people think the M9 wasn’t a good gun. The military was too cheap to buy decent mags/factory mags.
What does the P30 bring to the table that the 92 doesn't?
It ain't like it has nice trigger or is gonna be any more concealable.
They're both full size duty guns, they're both DA/SA, DAO or the P30 has that LEM... Thing.
Mags for the Beretta grow on trees compared to H&K mags and spare parts are all over the internet.
I can understand liking one over the other, but they're not that different. One is just newer and more popular. And costs twice as much.
Polygon rifling, ambi controls, imo better accuracy, more reliable, and much more comfortable. Im not knocking on the 92, but the P30 is a generation or two ahead.
When people ask me what I think about them, my answer is usually 'A very well made, obsolete design'.
There are some guys who think that 1911s are the best, and hate anything else… You got Glock fanatics who insult anything not a glock (this isn't as bad as it used to be - but 5-10 years ago, they were absolutely rabid in this regard).
Then, there are the revolver guys who will call ya a name if you don't own at least 1 revolver (which I do not).
I am admittedly a Beretta guy. I have nine 92 variants and have owned a couple PX4s... The PX4 is probably my fav polymer handgun. However, I'm not a big polymer fan - as I like guns that I can pt rubber grips on without having to use those slip on grips that are necessary on polymer handguns to have that option.
As such a Beretta fan - I get hassled by anti beretta types a lot. But ya know what - I don't really care. I have redone my collection, and over 3/4 of my handguns are Berettas. Its what I like. I once had all polymer guns. Heck, I've owned a lot of different guns over the years. I'm at the point where I know what I like and what works for me. And, I've pretty much owned almost everything else at one point or another.
Years ago, I would never have bought so many of the same model. Now, it's my fav....
None are "better" than the others. But some brands ARE better than others FOR ME. Why ya think we have so many different brands/makes/models of cars. We all like different stuff.
Berettas are the equal of any of the brands out there. Granted, the 92 is not the newest design out there - but neither is the 1911, and its popular as ever...
Glocks, Sigs and many other guns have their occasional "issues" too. Everyone seems to forget about those points, conveniently... But, we all have different preferences, skill levels, different sized hands, etc. So, my fav gun may not be your fav gun. Not everyone likes it. That's fine too...
As I said earlier in the thread... I got hooked on the 92 AGAIN about 4 years ago. With the hogue rubber grip panels (not the wrap arounds) - the grip is just perfect for me. I have small hands too, but it just works. Over time, I found that I even preferred the grip of the 92 over 1911s and every other gun platform... I eventually sold off everything else, one by one, including an Ed Brown and a Custom Shop 9mm Springfield 1911. I just found that the 92 did it for me. No other grip and feel of the gun in my hand is better for me...
Now, I pretty much only have 92s (different variants). Granted, my "favorite" handgun has changed over the years several times. However, for over 4 years now, it's stayed the 92. And, I really have no urge to buy anything else but Berettas, since I've owned so many different handguns over the years.
And, this is coming from a guy who probably has owned almost everything out there at one point or another, as I was on a 17 year constant handgun buying spree until the past year.... I've put that to a stop, as I've grown tired of always chasing after the next gun. I've thrown in completely with the 92 platform, and that's where I'm staying at now...
Polygon rifling, ambi controls, imo better accuracy, more reliable, and much more comfortable. Im not knocking on the 92, but the P30 is a generation or two ahead.
Why is polygonal rifling an advantage for the P30?
What kind of accuracy are you getting out of the P30 vs. the 92?
S. Galbraith
02-22-13, 08:36
Why is polygonal rifling an advantage for the P30?
For one thing it gives a barrel 2-3 times the lifespan of conventional rifling. Most hammer forged, convensional barrels lose quite a bit of accuracy at the 50k mark, while Todd Green's P30 went 91k rounds without any measurable decrease in accuracy. NASA's security force uses MP5s, and they have reported their barrels to have exceeded 100k rounds without needing to be replaced even though SMGs tend to be harder on barrels than handgun barrels.
What kind of accuracy are you getting out of the P30 vs. the 92?
I haven't shot a 92 since 2001, but I did compare a P30 9mm to a Sig P220 .45acp which is an absolute tack driver at 25yrds. The P30 actually shot tighter groupings than the P220 which shocked me for two reasons. One, I have used Sigs for over a decade and this was the first time I had used a P30. Two, I was using cheap mil 9mm NATO in the P30, and accurized .45acp handloads in the P220.
I agree with you....
The whole issue of Beretta problems that some claim has been overblown IMHO...
- Change the recoil spring and trigger spring every 3k-5k. - Change the locking block every 20k (I personally say every 15K – it’s only a $35 part, and they tend to break RIGHT after 20k rounds… Better safe than sorry).
Keeping up with recoil spring changes will GREATLY lesson the chance of a block breaking and/or a slide breaking... Many times a 92 with a broken slide has already had 1 locking block break - thus weakening it....
I’ve seen tons of posts over the years on various gun forums… Military guys who claim to have seen morons in the military using their M9s as hammers and tools… Beating on the guns. Also, no one maintains round counts on the guns. So, they get poor maintenance, and no spring changes as necessary. They just shoot the gun until something breaks or it doesn't work right. THEN they start changing springs...
So, no wonder they routinely break in the slide.
Plus, with the crappy magazines the military bought for years, this went a long way towards making people think the M9 wasn’t a good gun. The military was too cheap to buy decent mags/factory mags.
People will spend $50 on a "sand resistant" magazine, yet won't drop $50 on springs and a locking block to insure reliable performance...
thebarracuda
02-22-13, 09:50
I love my 92fs... One of the few pistols I own that I can constantly hit with, without feeling like I have to wrestle the gun. Points well, shoots where I look, smooth gun. -Hate the slide safety, and it is huge. I have since moved on to glocks for carry/self defense, but my beretta is still a fav. Started several new shooters on the beretta, as it was easier for them to score hits, 9mm in a large gun soaks up the recoil. Hooked 'em!
Polygon rifling, ambi controls, imo better accuracy, more reliable, and much more comfortable. Im not knocking on the 92, but the P30 is a generation or two ahead.
It has an ambi slide stop and paddle mag releases. The M9 has ambi safeties and a reversible mag catch but a one sided slide stop.
Everything else is just feelings.
No. An H&K is not more reliable. Just because it's plastic and twice the cost does not automatically make it more reliable.
A Beretta 92/M9, Browning Hi Power, Sig P226 set the pace for 9mm reliability.
It has an ambi slide stop and paddle mag releases. The M9 has ambi safeties and a reversible mag catch but a one sided slide stop.
Everything else is just feelings.
No. An H&K is not more reliable. Just because it's plastic and twice the cost does not automatically make it more reliable.
A Beretta 92/M9, Browning Hi Power, Sig P226 set the pace for 9mm reliability.
I agree feel is subjective, but i bet if you hand 10 people a P30 and a 92, 9 out of 10 will say the P30 feels better. However the reliability issue is there. I have never seen a P30 have issues. I cannot say the same about the 92 series.
And i never said it is more reliable because it is plastic and cost twice as much. You are the one who stated that. Around here pre-sandy hook there was only about a $300 dollar difference.
As i was saying im not bashing the 92, it's a fine pistol who many are fans of, but i think its a stretch to say it is as good or better than the P30. Just my 2 cents.
For one thing it gives a barrel 2-3 times the lifespan of conventional rifling. Most hammer forged, convensional barrels lose quite a bit of accuracy at the 50k mark, while Todd Green's P30 went 91k rounds without any measurable decrease in accuracy. NASA's security force uses MP5s, and they have reported their barrels to have exceeded 100k rounds without needing to be replaced even though SMGs tend to be harder on barrels than handgun barrels.
Honestly, at the point you've spent around $15,000 on ammo, is a $150 barrel really a big deal?
I carried one for about 6 months in Iraq. It was my primary weapon and I carried it concealed, no less. I was supposed to get an M11, but they were in short supply within our command so most of us got brand spankin' new Beretta M9s.
Compared to the Sig I had trained on prior to deployment, the Beretta was a brick. It wasn't so much the weight-- I routinely carried a full-sized 1911 back in the States-- it was more the bulkyness of the thing. And because of the slide mounted safety/decocker, I would inadvertantly put the weapon on "safe" every time I racked the slide, such as in a "tap, rack, bang" malfunction drill. I had to re-train myself to handle the weapon differently just to avoid this potentially life-threatening mistake.
I have no doubt they are accurate and reliable, but I feel there are better double action 9mm semi-automatics to choose from. If it weren't for the U.S. millitary endorsement I don't feel they would be as popular as they are.
-Mike
If a pistol is run without spring changes you are going to see issues eventually.
As a general rule I swap out 92 recoil springs when the spring shrinks to the same length as the barrel. (Factory 13lb spring)
Ben Stoeger has stated in a few videos that his Elites in excess of 100 thousand rounds never broke a locking block.
My best friend is a recently retired cop. He carried his 92F for 26yrs and it never let him down (he still has it for nightstand duty). For CCW he wanted identical controls (understandable) and picked up a used 92F Compact.
While they're admittedly bigger/heavier than other current options, I certainly wouldn't feel disadvantaged if forced to carry one.
Tomac
JBecker 72
02-23-13, 11:52
Well, I got a M9 today. Managed to work out a good deal for one of my M&P 9mm pistols I wasn't using. Came with 5 magazines and a few extra parts.
http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s73/hownowbrowncow_02/Guns/IMAG0478_zps82ca6db6.jpg
Well, I got a M9 today. Managed to work out a good deal for one of my M&P 9mm pistols I wasn't using. Came with 5 magazines and a few extra parts.
http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s73/hownowbrowncow_02/Guns/IMAG0478_zps82ca6db6.jpg
U da man. Congrats!
JBecker 72
02-23-13, 16:01
U da man. Congrats!
Thanks! I took it out behind the house and ran a few mags through it a bit ago and I gotta say I like it. Prior to today, I had only ran 1 magazine through an older 92FS. I can honestly say that this thread is what nudged me to get one, now I think I want another one with a rail.
Now to find a decent holster or 2 for this thing.
Try getting hogue rubber grip panels... Not the wrap around king with the finger grooves... But just the plain rubber panels. Makes a huge difference....
JBecker 72
02-23-13, 17:43
I'll look into them, thanks.
Sent from my PC36100 using Tapatalk 2
http://i1192.photobucket.com/albums/aa328/Foxtrotx1/DSC_1525.jpg
http://i1192.photobucket.com/albums/aa328/Foxtrotx1/DSC_1519.jpg
If the frame only lasts 100k rounds, I will have spent 20 grand on ammo. Oh well, another 600 bucks for a new pistol.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v108/Avtomat/compacttypel_zpsfb24305d.jpg
Wife swapped her G26 for a new USA-made 92 Compact Type L today. Put in the D spring and Elite II hammer to make it even better.
Thinking more about the polymer parts complaint: Why are people concerned with a polymer coated steel trigger, guide rod, left side safety and mag release when they shoot pistols that have polymer frames?
Thinking more about the polymer parts complaint: Why are people concerned with a polymer coated steel trigger, guide rod, left side safety and mag release when they shoot pistols that have polymer frames?
Because they like to whine.
The parts are fine. The guide rod is better.
I prefer the plastic trigger because it has a little texture to it. The blued triggers are slick as snot.
Thinking more about the polymer parts complaint: Why are people concerned with a polymer coated steel trigger, guide rod, left side safety and mag release when they shoot pistols that have polymer frames?
http://i444.photobucket.com/albums/qq169/bbossman1/IMAG0004.jpg
Because they like to whine.
The parts are fine. The guide rod is better.
I prefer the plastic trigger because it has a little texture to it. The blued triggers are slick as snot.
The metal triggers do offer a slightly better trigger pull, and you will need one to use a Wolff TCU.
I actually prefer the plastic guide rod, and could care less about the other parts. My only complaint is Beretta should use INOX controls on the INOX 92s.
BravoWhiskey
02-24-13, 11:18
Wanted to add to this thread.
92's work for me.
Between my EII and one of my Inox Brigs I have thousands of rounds in action/IDPA pistol type shooting. 2 malfunctions that were the slide not going all the way into battery, which were my fault do to bad grip while shooting in sleet/snow. D spring in the Brig (stock in the EII) and the DA is not really an issue.
Pair of Elites
http://i566.photobucket.com/albums/ss102/BravoWhiskey/Collections/006.jpg
Pair of Inox Brigs.
EI stays in the safe along with 1 of the brigs.
One Brig is set up with the EII features, Less the G function, and is now my back up gun since I aquired the EII. Trigger is a hair better in the more used Brig but they are practically the same.
I have seen all brands of guns have trouble at the matches. Guns costing thousands of $ down to the most common plastic one. I think it depends on how someone runs and maintains the gun more than the brand when comparing major manufactures.
http://i566.photobucket.com/albums/ss102/BravoWhiskey/Collections/IMAG0333.jpg
http://i444.photobucket.com/albums/qq169/bbossman1/IMAG0004.jpg
I see nothing wrong :confused:
JBecker 72
02-24-13, 19:53
I see nothing wrong :confused:
I think that is what he is getting at.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v108/Avtomat/DSCN0043_BerettaFamilyWM_zps2d4dcd2f.jpg
Still need:
Elite II
Italian 92FS
M9A1
92S
Inox Vertec
I love beretta, but my friend just broke his fire pin (likely) this afternoon, he is shooting UMC 9mm in his 92fs inox, and suddenly he is not able to firing any bullet out more. We suspect it is the ammo break the fire pin.
Plex, the beretta 92 pistol can suffer a firing pin breakage and still work 100 percent. The only exception is if the tip of the firing pin breaks (the only part small enough to fall out of the channel.)
In fact, there is a documented case on TOS where a guy broke the tip of his firing pin off during dry firing and tore the gun down only to discover the firing pin was broken in 2 OTHER places. Yep. The firing pin had broken twice before it actually stopped the pistol from working. If the tip of the firing pin is the problem it will be obvious by the shiny, sheared pin face when you shine a light on the breech face.
Ben Stoeger has a video where he reports that he broke a firing pin but never knew it was broken until he took the gun apart.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v108/Avtomat/DSCN0043_BerettaFamilyWM_zps2d4dcd2f.jpg
I really like those new 92FS/M9A1 Compacts. That is my next purchase.
themighty9mm
02-25-13, 22:56
Plex, the beretta 92 pistol can suffer a firing pin breakage and still work 100 percent. The only exception is if the tip of the firing pin breaks (the only part small enough to fall out of the channel.)
In fact, there is a documented case on TOS where a guy broke the tip of his firing pin off during dry firing and tore the gun down only to discover the firing pin was broken in 2 OTHER places. Yep. The firing pin had broken twice before it actually stopped the pistol from working. If the tip of the firing pin is the problem it will be obvious by the shiny, sheared pin face when you shine a light on the breech face.
Ben Stoeger has a video where he reports that he broke a firing pin but never knew it was broken until he took the gun apart.
I have had the exact same thing happen to me. The pin broke where the firing pin safety sits. Shot it that way for well over 500 rounds. Oddly enough and I know it sounds crazy but I could feel a slight difference in how the hammer fell during dry fire. Where the break occurred the firing pin was worn smooth, still never missed a beat though. Gave me even more respect for the gun
I have had the exact same thing happen to me. The pin broke where the firing pin safety sits. Shot it that way for well over 500 rounds. Oddly enough and I know it sounds crazy but I could feel a slight difference in how the hammer fell during dry fire. Where the break occurred the firing pin was worn smooth, still never missed a beat though. Gave me even more respect for the gun
The breaks are no surprise considering the FP were the safety engages uses 90 degree angles. I'm no engineer, but a radius seems like it may have worked better.
icecreamman
02-26-13, 00:03
I really like them. The DA/SA does not bother me a bit, but I have shot revolvers for years. Mine are keep well maintained and I trust them with my life every day. Couple recent additions to the family-
http://i1340.photobucket.com/albums/o738/JAGERBOMBER-ARF/image_zps76409caf.jpg
themighty9mm
02-26-13, 01:41
The breaks are no surprise considering the FP were the safety engages uses 90 degree angles. I'm no engineer, but a radius seems like it may have worked better.
All things considered I don't think it would have mattered much. I bought it as a used gun, its from the late 80's, had 16,000 rounds through it with only spring change (at the time). Not counting whoever else owned it. And on top of that easily and very conservativly 30,000 dry fires, without snaps caps or anything to soak up the vibration. It still functioned, and was easy to change out with nothing more than a ball peen and a 1/16th roll pin punch. I'd say that 3 dollar part well beyond served its life span
Crow Hunter
02-26-13, 10:15
I really like those new 92FS/M9A1 Compacts. That is my next purchase.
Me too.
I would like to try one out/get one but I can never find one anywhere.
Any leads?
Me too.
I would like to try one out/get one but I can never find one anywhere.
Any leads?
They seem to show up at Cabela's and Bass Pro. Good luck getting a deal there. I'm waiting for the Bruniton version to hit shelves.
I think that is what he is getting at.
Eggzactly... I melted the polymer off of those parts several years ago to demonstrate that these parts are not "plastic". I have a polymer left side safety, just haven't had the enthusiasm to "burn" it yet. I can tell you the exterior lever is the only polymer coated part, the internal part of the safety is all steel.
I have had the exact same thing happen to me. The pin broke where the firing pin safety sits. Shot it that way for well over 500 rounds. Oddly enough and I know it sounds crazy but I could feel a slight difference in how the hammer fell during dry fire. Where the break occurred the firing pin was worn smooth, still never missed a beat though. Gave me even more respect for the gun
Excessive dry firing will cause the pin to break. A snap cap will help prevent this.
themighty9mm
02-26-13, 16:58
Excessive dry firing will cause the pin to break. A snap cap will help prevent this.
I am aware of this. Was aware of it at the time aswell. As I said in my previous post. Its a couple dollar part and easy to replace. Wasn't worried about it. And the firing pin serve its life very well without snap caps
Eggzactly... I melted the polymer off of those parts several years ago to demonstrate that these parts are not "plastic". I have a polymer left side safety, just haven't had the enthusiasm to "burn" it yet. I can tell you the exterior lever is the only polymer coated part, the internal part of the safety is all steel.
Thank you for posting those pics. I misunderstood your post for some reason. May have been the JD.
I've got a 92G Compact Type L with night sights. Damn fine carry gun.
I have gigantic hands, and the Compacts always cramped them until I figured out an easy solution: replace the finger-shelf magazine floorplates with standard 92 floorplates. Bam. No more crowding.
Seeing this thread just makes me feel alot better in my selection.
I carry IWB my 92fs with a crossbreed.
I am 160 5'10
Seeing this thread just makes me feel alot better in my selection.
I carry IWB my 92fs with a crossbreed.
I am 160 5'10
I'm ten pounds less, 5'10 in the morning. :D IWB M9 Com.
HawaiianM4
02-27-13, 03:56
Has anyone had a beretta with checkering or scroll work. I have one that I would like military scroll work done on it for display.
xjustintimex
02-27-13, 03:58
http://www.imfdb.org/images/thumb/7/73/LW2_001.JPG/400px-LW2_001.JPG
Has anyone had a beretta with checkering or scroll work. I have one that I would like military scroll work done on it for display.
Several people at the Beretta Forum have added checkering to the frame themselves
azeriosu85
03-02-13, 18:02
The new 92fs Compacts made me take a HARD look at one for AIWB CCW. It, paired with a full size for HD, would make a PERFECT pair IMO:cool:
http://sigforum.com/movedimages/para/SHOT_13/IMG_8109_IMG_8106_BERETTA_9.jpg
JBecker 72
03-02-13, 18:07
Try getting hogue rubber grip panels... Not the wrap around king with the finger grooves... But just the plain rubber panels. Makes a huge difference....
I wound up ordering a set of Hogue G10 Piranha grips. From what I read they are slightly thinner than stock.
Crow Hunter
03-02-13, 19:28
The new 92fs Compacts made me take a HARD look at one for AIWB CCW. It, paired with a full size for HD, would make a PERFECT pair IMO:cool:
http://sigforum.com/movedimages/para/SHOT_13/IMG_8109_IMG_8106_BERETTA_9.jpg
Man I really need to find one of those around to try out.:neo:
talaananthes
03-02-13, 19:47
Man I really need to find one of those around to try out.:neo:
Can the compact take the full size mags? I've contemplated getting a mini glock to go with my 19 cuz the mags are interchangeable.
Why not Beretta?
Love their classy looks but can't abide the slide-mounted safety. I prefer my safeties in frame (1911 thumb) or integrated (Glock trigger).
azeriosu85
03-02-13, 21:41
Can the compact take the full size mags? I've contemplated getting a mini glock to go with my 19 cuz the mags are interchangeable.
Yes it can, even the 20 and 30 rounders;)
Just picked up an Elite II. :lol:
C4
Can the compact take the full size mags? I've contemplated getting a mini glock to go with my 19 cuz the mags are interchangeable.
Yes, the mini can. But honestly, it's not comfortable to shoot it that way. The older style 20 rounders work better when holding the compact with a bigger mag. The standard 92 mags aren't ally comfortable to shoot in the compact, IMHO...
The new 92fs Compacts made me take a HARD look at one for AIWB CCW. It, paired with a full size for HD, would make a PERFECT pair IMO:cool:
http://sigforum.com/movedimages/para/SHOT_13/IMG_8109_IMG_8106_BERETTA_9.jpg
Very interesting. That is the first blue 92 compact that I've seen with a rail. All of the others that I've seen either lacked the rail, or were Inox M9A1 compacts. I learn something new every day...
Just picked up an Elite II. :lol:
C4
Don't be surprised if this becomes your favorite Beretta.
Sent from my Proctor Silex Toaster Oven using Tapatalk 2.
ramairthree
03-03-13, 15:24
Just picked up an Elite II. :lol:
C4
Hell yeah, nice buy.
I don't have one in 9mm, but have an Elite in 40 with the D spring and EII hammer. I also have the EII in .40.
As I have posted earlier in the thread, they are a dated design with certain things to keep in mind,
but in this current environment, snatching reliable, accurate SA handguns with a TON of mags in plentiful supply is better than many people have it.
anachronism
03-03-13, 15:40
Love their classy looks but can't abide the slide-mounted safety. I prefer my safeties in frame (1911 thumb) or integrated (Glock trigger).
But don't most of the non-striker fired DA guns have slide mounted safeties? Personally, I like to be able to see the doggone hammer position. This is probably a carryover from my 1911s, but I find it reassuring in a way.
I recently sold off most of my railed 92s. I just like the balance of the non railed models. When I hold them in a one handed grip, I can tell the difference.
Would it have killed Beretta to make the 92/m9a1 compacts have dovetailed front sights...
But don't most of the non-striker fired DA guns have slide mounted safeties? Personally, I like to be able to see the doggone hammer position. This is probably a carryover from my 1911s, but I find it reassuring in a way.
I'm a bit confused as to what you are trying to infer regarding my comment.
But don't most of the non-striker fired DA guns have slide mounted safeties? Personally, I like to be able to see the doggone hammer position. This is probably a carryover from my 1911s, but I find it reassuring in a way.
Some do, some don't. S&W's older DA/SA autos did, as do Ruger's, some of the older Walther's, and some of Beretta's other designs. CZ's, HK 45's and USP's, and the FNP/FNX series have frame mounted safeties. There are also other designs like HK's newer guns and Sigs which have no safeties.
Crow Hunter
03-05-13, 11:04
Well, if anyone is looking for one of the Inox Compacts they have 3 of them at the Jackson TN Gander Mountain.
I got to molest one today. It SURE was tempting. But at $749.99 it was a little on the rich side of tempting for me. Especially considering how invested I am in Glock right now. (Glock Armorer, full set of spare parts for the 5 Glock 19s I have and 60+ magazines and been shooting them since 1998:eek:)
It seemed significantly smaller than a full size 92F. It actually didn't "feel big" like the 92F always has to me, even though sitting right next to a standard 92F it didn't seem that much smaller.
They didn't have a G19, or any Glock for that matter around for me to do a direct comparison. But just "feel" wise, it seemed just slightly bigger than a G19 but fatter. Kind of like a G30.
I really liked it though and it was very sexy looking.
Would it have killed Beretta to make the 92/m9a1 compacts have dovetailed front sights...
That was one of the things that I noticed too. The orange dots just don't do it for me. I also preferred the old sty safety/decocker lever, this one seemed a little too small and sharp to me.
azeriosu85
03-07-13, 15:55
anyone seen the blued version for sale online? i just cannot find it...it's VERY tempting, i think it would make such a nice AIWB carry gun:lol:
anyone seen the blued version for sale online? i just cannot find it...it's VERY tempting, i think it would make such a nice AIWB carry gun:lol:
I don't believe they've been released yet. Of course, that assumes they are released at all. Beretta is notorious for showing vaporware at SHOT.
That said, I really hope they make this one. I'll buy two, assuming Feinswine deigns to allow it.
azeriosu85
03-07-13, 16:07
I don't believe they've been released yet. Of course, that assumes they are released at all. Beretta is notorious for showing vaporware at SHOT.
That said, I really hope they make this one. I'll buy two, assuming Feinswine deigns to allow it.
me too, that said, call me crazy, but the compact MIGHT replace my hk 45c for carry. i have a HK45 at home for bedside so i wouldn't dump them 100% but i do love the beretta
Has anyone had a beretta with checkering or scroll work. I have one that I would like military scroll work done on it for display.
Try these guys http://alleghenygunworks.com/index.php/services-packages
They do frame work, including checkering and they mention NFA engraving on their services page.
Beretta 92/96 Specific Services
Mill "F" Slide to "FS" Specifications 45
Straighten Frame to Vertec Style, Add 180
Vertical Serrations, NIW Vertec Grip Set
Machine Checker Front and Back Straps 125
Re-profiling the Trigger Guard to 75
Bilennium Style
Convert "FS" Safety to "G" Type Decock 180
Only
Fabricate and Install Conical Barrel 165
Bushing
azeriosu85
03-09-13, 13:42
SO i have been seeing the INOX version of the compact M9A1 pop up, but not blued yet :( any leads? Seems strange they would release the INOX first instead of the blued :confused:
ramairthree
03-09-13, 15:45
SO i have been seeing the INOX version of the compact M9A1 pop up, but not blued yet :( any leads? Seems strange they would release the INOX first instead of the blued :confused:
Same here.
I have seen a couple of those in the LGS but not any blued ones.
SO i have been seeing the INOX version of the compact M9A1 pop up, but not blued yet :( any leads? Seems strange they would release the INOX first instead of the blued :confused:
They released the INOX version first, and rumor is that the Bruniton will be released by mid year. I'm not usually a huge stainless fan, but I am going to pick up one of these INOX compacts.
Beretta does strange things. This model isn't even on the Beretta USA website, and the INOX was released third quarter last year.
azeriosu85
03-10-13, 17:13
They released the INOX version first, and rumor is that the Bruniton will be released by mid year. I'm not usually a huge stainless fan, but I am going to pick up one of these INOX compacts.
Beretta does strange things. This model isn't even on the Beretta USA website, and the INOX was released third quarter last year.
sigh, figures i find what might be fantastic carry gun, and now i have to wait 6 months:fie:
I recently sold off most of my railed Beretta 92 variants and one 92 compact. I just prefer the non railed, standard model the best. But, I bought one more regular model 92FS. Sent off the slide to Tooltech, and got it back a few days ago. Took 2 weeks and 1 day from the time I shipped it out until it came back in. Not bad....
ToolTech Gunsight drills the front sight and installs a new rear sight. This is the 3rd time I've used Tooltech. Plus, I have one 92FS with factory night sights, and rumor has it that they do the factory installs for Beretta as well...
Got a chance to shoot the gun with the new sights yesterday - everything went great. Once again - while on the range, I remember why I got back into the Berettas again (and eventually got rid of most of my other brands of guns).
Except for the grip screws and the Beretta medallion insert, this gun is set up identical to my main carry 92FS. My carry gun has NP3 grip screws, as the screw tend to rust with regular carry (I learned this the hard way).
Now, I can alternate my shooting trips, so I don't wear out my main 92FS. The others I have are not my main shooters, like these two are. As I've dropped all other platforms except for the M&P Shield - I'll be shooting these a lot over the coming years...
Once I drop a few more pounds, I may go back to carrying my 92FS again fulltime (been using the Shield lately)...
http://i59.photobucket.com/albums/g320/mistershipwreck/92-1_zpsf0ba33d4.jpg
http://i59.photobucket.com/albums/g320/mistershipwreck/92-2_zpsb97b2b03.jpg
azeriosu85
03-10-13, 19:49
http://i59.photobucket.com/albums/g320/mistershipwreck/92-1_zpsf0ba33d4.jpg
http://i59.photobucket.com/albums/g320/mistershipwreck/92-2_zpsb97b2b03.jpg
beautiful!:D
I love my Beretta. It's my beater truck gun. Not my first choice, and I prefer striker or SAO to DA/SA, but its one hell of a pistol. It's a keeper.
azeriosu85
03-13-13, 18:32
Does anyone know of any AIWB holsters for the newer M9A1 series??? i know they are there for the older 92FS, so it's kind of my deciding factor if i should go with the newer M9A1 series or stick with old 92FS style:confused:
DanjojoUSMC
03-13-13, 19:27
Could get a Blade Tech IWB and put a custom wedge.
azeriosu85
03-13-13, 19:37
Could get a Blade Tech IWB and put a custom wedge.
they make a straight drop for a M9A1?
I've oddly never fired a Beretta 92. I don't know why though. I like the design, but I think for me the trigger isn't what i'm looking for.
DanjojoUSMC
03-13-13, 20:09
they make a straight drop for a M9A1?
Yes brother, can do FBI cant or neutral with the IWB. Fricke Archangel is close to the same thing.
azeriosu85
03-13-13, 20:13
Yes brother, can do FBI cant or neutral with the IWB. Fricke Archangel is close to the same thing.
emailed Dale about seeing if he makes the Archangel for the M9A1, will update to confirm or deny on here. maybe Rich at CCC as well for a looper
Does anyone know of any AIWB holsters for the newer M9A1 series??? i know they are there for the older 92FS, so it's kind of my deciding factor if i should go with the newer M9A1 series or stick with old 92FS style:confused:
I have a comptac IWB Pro Undercover for a M9A1, but they no longer Mage a IWB for that model. I was lucky to order it when I can.
I may be selling my M9A1 soon, though.. My last one of that model.if I do, I'll be selling the holster. I used it once or twice, as I always prefer the non railed 92FS (and carried it more). I want one more regular 92FS, but I want a USA made one.. Still looking to find one locally
Does anyone make a mag adapter to better use full size mags in a compact 92?
Thanks,
19852
Does anyone make a mag adapter to better use full size mags in a compact 92?
Thanks,
19852
Sorry, no such animal.
GrandPooba
03-15-13, 22:54
Does anyone make a mag adapter to better use full size mags in a compact 92?
Thanks,
19852
i have seen people modify AR15 A2 grips into adapters.
i have seen people modify AR15 A2 grips into adapters.
Say what?
GrandPooba
03-16-13, 10:39
Say what?
http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_5_15/134143_Any_smaller_Berettas_that_accept_92_mags_.html
I just bought a 92a1 last night. I've been looking for one for some time now. My carry gun however is a g17 but I just really wanted one. Like one of you said earlier it screams night stand gun with a tlr1s and a 20rnd mag.
I bought one yesterday. I also carry a 17 but the price was low and it just hit the reward center in my brain. Good for a nightstand/spare/truck/loaner/beater 9.
Does any company do funnel work on the 92 mag well?
GrandPooba
03-22-13, 19:26
Does any company do funnel work on the 92 mag well?
Allegheny Gun Works
highly recommended on berettaforum.net
ramairthree
03-22-13, 21:40
you can file or dremel your magwell to turn out like the Elite beveled ones
http://i649.photobucket.com/albums/uu220/ramairfour/e8a8e943-d1ca-4e83-8811-285f29fd03a5_zps551309b3.jpg
FortySixand2
03-24-13, 20:44
Beretta makes a very good gun... particularly the 9mm, they had some issues with the 40s in the mid-90s, which has since been remedied.
Can anyone recommend any sources on holsters for a 92 compact?
Can anyone recommend any sources on holsters for a 92 compact?
I use a fullsize 92FS Comptac IWB holster for my compact 92 - holster works fine for both guns.
In the 1990s, I used a Glock 19 holster I already had for a Glock 26. Carried it thatw ay for years. There are some custom holster makers who will make holsters for the compact. But, if you open your horizons to fullsize holsters - your market availability opens way up.
Many leather holsters have the end of the gun sticking out anyway. And, the difference between the compact and fullsize is just 1/2 an inch.
I actually carry my fullsize more often, but sometimes will carry the compact model. I have night sights on both
I use a fullsize 92FS Comptac IWB holster for my compact 92 - holster works fine for both guns.
In the 1990s, I used a Glock 19 holster I already had for a Glock 26. Carried it thatw ay for years. There are some custom holster makers who will make holsters for the compact. But, if you open your horizons to fullsize holsters - your market availability opens way up.
Many leather holsters have the end of the gun sticking out anyway. And, the difference between the compact and fullsize is just 1/2 an inch.
I actually carry my fullsize more often, but sometimes will carry the compact model. I have night sights on both
Im entertaining the idea of appendix carry, but i'm wondering if it will even work with the barrel length. It just feels way more natural drawing from the front or the side.
I use a fullsize 92FS Comptac IWB holster for my compact 92 - holster works fine for both guns.
In the 1990s, I used a Glock 19 holster I already had for a Glock 26. Carried it thatw ay for years. There are some custom holster makers who will make holsters for the compact. But, if you open your horizons to fullsize holsters - your market availability opens way up.
Many leather holsters have the end of the gun sticking out anyway. And, the difference between the compact and fullsize is just 1/2 an inch.
I actually carry my fullsize more often, but sometimes will carry the compact model. I have night sights on both
Thanks, I had thought of doing just that but I didn't know the length difference between the compact and full size. At just a half inch it should not be a problem. I used to do the same with a G17/G19.
Thanks again.
If I am not mistaken, a holster made for the Centurion will fit the Compact perfectly.
If I am not mistaken, a holster made for the Centurion will fit the Compact perfectly.
Yes, but I couldn't find any of those in stock any where. Will come up with something soon.
Im entertaining the idea of appendix carry, but i'm wondering if it will even work with the barrel length. It just feels way more natural drawing from the front or the side.
I carried a beretta 92 IWB for a while,but I can only do it at the 3 o'clock position.
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