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Fozzy_Bear
03-11-08, 09:40
I just finished assembling my first Black Rifle and I took it to the range this weekend.

--Just for reference; It's a DPMS receiver with a RRA LPK (Hogue grip upgrade), Bushmaster complete upper (20 inch, A2 ), and a cheap eBay stock (it was the last piece I needed and I couldn't wait for a good deal on a stock to come around... Also, I used a Colt-manufactured 30 round magazine)--

I wanted to test everything out, and I wanted to see what worked well in my rifle, so I shot 3 different types of ammo. I figured I'd share the info here.

But, PLEASE NOTE:::: I am new to the whole Black Rifle culture (not firearms in general though) and I am not trying to get into the religious war that is Ammo selection, I'm just passing on direct First Hand experience about how MY weapon functioned.


That being said, I used

20 rounds - of PMC Bronze 55gr FMJBT sold as .223

19 rounds of Wolf 62gr FMJ sold as .223
and
19 rounds of Winchester 55gr FMJ sold as 5.56 ( could tell the higher pressure)

( I disassembled one of the Wolf and Winchester to compare them...)

total round count : 58.

So on with the info:

The rounds marked as 5.56 were clearly higher powered than either of the .223 marked rounds. I was aware that was how it should be, but I was actually surprised that I was able to notice such a difference.

The 20 rounds of PMC were consistent and at least as accurate as I am.
My personal goal is to have a pattern no bigger than the area of my fist --if I put my fist on the target, all the holes should be covered. - I figure if I were standing next to something and punched it, that would be my pattern and if my firearm is as good as my fist... That's good enough for me, since I don't have a job, or life, where I am depending on my weapon. --

The Winchester was more accurate, and definitely more powerful. - I wouldn't hesitate to use it if I were to actually NEED my weapon.

Of the 19 rounds of Wolf ammo I fired, 13 of them functioned correctly. 6 failed to load properly. After manually cycling the charging handle, all 6 caught the second time though.

I did NOT fire all of the ammo in order (stacking the deck by giving one manufacturer a dirty gun); I loaded a magazine with 4 rounds of each ammo (wolf, then PMC, then Win for the first few, then reverse order to see if the Wolf were getting a bad rap by following the others... - nope.) and fired at a different circle on a 4-bulls-eye target for the 4 shot group (5 paper targets total)

So there you have it. - My first Black Rifle experience. I'm quite please that the first weapon I built from parts is more accurate than I am, and that as long as I feed it brass shells, it seems to work flawlessly.

The only issue I had was that I found a place where I didn't lube the weapon well enough. I noticed the slight beginnings of wear on the side of the BCG gas-key. I got the BCG really well, but I guess I didn't get enough on the top of it (or I was using something too thin (hopes gun oil) and it rolled down... I'll be sure to get that well before the next trip to the range.

That being said, I wouldn't just use this to bash Wolf. The BCG admittedly had a lubrication issue (allbeit very small), and the buffer and buffer spring were the cheapest money could buy. - It's possibly that in a fully top-tier weapon that there would have been no problems... But, all things being as they were (are) I will not be buying any more myself.


Next time I hope to put some M193 head-to-head with some of the Winchester ammo and possibly some 855 ammo so I can get a feel between true 5.56 loads.


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Fozzy_Bear
03-11-08, 15:51
side note:

I went back and looked and the Winchester ammo is labled M3131, which apparently is well known to those of you who would know such things.

WS6
03-11-08, 23:33
side note:

I went back and looked and the Winchester ammo is labled Q3131, which apparently is well known to those of you who would know such things.


There ya go :cool:

Fozzy_Bear
03-12-08, 00:16
oops. Thanks.

markm
03-12-08, 08:56
The lube on the outside of the bolt carrier shouldn't be an issue. I'm sure all of our carrier keys have those bearing wear marks on them.

I use a thin coat of grease on the carrier rails and the sides of the key to avoid having lube all over the place. But on the actual bolt and inside the carrier, I go pretty sloppy wet with lube.

Fozzy_Bear
03-12-08, 10:58
Yeah,
After doing a good bit of reading over the past few days, I'm pretty sure that the bcg was as it should be (I did put oil there, but it dried from the gasses.. switching to grease will help).

I'm betting now that the root of the problem was the buffer/spring. I was, or course, aware that the spring and gas system worked together, but I wasn't aware of how subtlly that interaction is. Apparently, (if you really know the system, and I don't... yet) if you have a rifle length gas system and a carbine buffer and buffer spring, you are very likely to have issues with low powered rounds. The "dwell timing" is thrown off by the lower mass of the buffer and wrong spring rate. (at least according to a few FAQ's on TOS)

So since the purpose fo this rifle it to have fun at the range, and I'd like to be able to use the cheaper ammo, I'm going to buy a new A2 stock kit and 200 rounds of Q3131. I'll install the new spring and buffer, and properly break-in the whole machine. - That (according to those who say they know: and it sounds reasonable) will fix me right up.

Does that sound like the right thing to do, to you?

markm
03-12-08, 11:19
The set up should work. (carbine buffer system/rifle gas system)

I'd expect to see problems from the PMC bronze if anything. A few of us have found it not to run the rifle gas system very well at all. But that wasn't with a carbine buffer. :confused:

Win Q3131 is sketchy ammo in my experience. Often mentioned as being overpowered, blowing primers etc.

Fozzy_Bear
03-12-08, 12:31
The set up should work. (carbine buffer system/rifle gas system)

I'd expect to see problems from the PMC bronze if anything. A few of us have found it not to run the rifle gas system very well at all. But that wasn't with a carbine buffer. :confused:

Win Q3131 is sketchy ammo in my experience. Often mentioned as being overpowered, blowing primers etc.

Well, I have a bit of a small sample (one box each) , but PMC and 3131 seemed OK... I believe the overpowered reputation though. As I mentioned above, it was clearly stronger than the others. - I was attributing that to the 5.56 vs .223 chamber pressures, but hearing that it specifically is a hot load is something that doesn't supprize me.

I guess I probably aughtta' just get some surpluss ball ammo for the break-in then. ... I'll research that a bit more before I spend any money though.

As far as it SHOULD be working... I did admit I just bought the cheapest stock kit I could find ($35 to my door with stock, tube, buffer, and 2 springs to choose from - that I couldn't tell appart) since that was the only thing holding me back from completing the rifle... I figured that if I were going to skimp to get it completed, I would only skimp on something that didn't affect the actual shooting (I was willing to put up with a rattle for a few weeks.). I didn't know how much the whole rear of the weapon affected chambering.

So I'll just spring for the full retail price of the right stuff that matches what I have and go from there. - I was hoping to get a good deal if I waited until somebody was selling a used one, but it sounds like matching the wear-level of the buffer spring with all of the other components is a good idea,. So I guess I'll just get a new one.


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