View Full Version : Grenaded Glock
4DAIVI PAI2K5
02-17-13, 16:52
Was doing a VSM class with Grant over the weekend. About 3/4 of the way through the class we had a kaboom. Ammo was tula. Guy was not hurt just a little shaken up/pissed off. He finished the class with his back up. It was a G19 not sure of gen. The Glock did a great job of redirecting the blast and keeping the shooter hand okay and shooters around him. Esp Grant who was just feet away. I'm not a good photographer so these are all we got. Here is to hoping Tula takes care of him, and hope he is even able to find one during this crazy gun buying time.
Cracked the frame , blew out the mag from the gun, follower was gone. Mag release was destroyed, trigger in half and ripped the extractor out. The barrel was clear and all round were in the target. Last one didn't make the A zone tho lol.
http://i157.photobucket.com/albums/t47/adam_parks/VSM%20pistol%201/_MG_3621_zpsdf4c7a9a.jpg
http://i157.photobucket.com/albums/t47/adam_parks/VSM%20pistol%201/_MG_3618_zps3edb829f.jpg
http://i157.photobucket.com/albums/t47/adam_parks/VSM%20pistol%201/_MG_3612_zps8cfc8a4c.jpg
http://i157.photobucket.com/albums/t47/adam_parks/VSM%20pistol%201/_MG_3624_zpsf19d30b0.jpg
http://i157.photobucket.com/albums/t47/adam_parks/VSM%20pistol%201/_MG_3630_zps8f7f9586.jpg
http://i157.photobucket.com/albums/t47/adam_parks/VSM%20pistol%201/_MG_3632_zps34d74e94.jpg
Five_Point_Five_Six
02-17-13, 16:57
Here is to hoping Tula takes care of him,
I wouldn't hold my breath if I were him.
Good luck with Tula
Glad he didnt get hurt.
And....oh the irony in the date code on the serial number.
Foreboding.
4DAIVI PAI2K5
02-17-13, 17:18
And....oh the irony in the date code on the serial number.
Foreboding.
Yeah the tnt was notice lol
Heavy Metal
02-17-13, 17:25
Anybody have a lot number on this ammo?
TNT... Oh, the irony.
Looks like a classic high pressure case failure.
Heavy Metal
02-17-13, 17:41
i wonder if it could have been behind a squib?
TNT... Oh, the irony.
Looks like a classic high pressure case failure.
Assuming this is the culprit would the gun have favored better with a supported chamber or do you think the results would have been the same with any other modern polymer gun?
Dollylamma
02-17-13, 17:47
From what I remember there was no indication of a squib. As in I thought I saw the prior round hit the target and there was a normal bang coming from the gun. However as a disclaimer, I wouldn't bet the farm on it.
steyrman13
02-17-13, 17:56
Assuming this is the culprit would the gun have favored better with a supported chamber or do you think the results would have been the same with any other modern polymer gun?
I had a similar problem in a Sig P229. It blew out the side of the hand grips as well and the extractor and stuck the case in the chamber. I sent it to sig and they xrayed and everything checked out, but had to replace extractor, grips and a spring.
Cagemonkey
02-17-13, 17:58
Glad no one was hurt. Ironic the prefix to the guns Ser# is TNT. I don't understand why people shoot crap ammo.
I am glad the shooter and everyone else is ok. Lets hope that Tula takes care of this situation.
I don't understand why people shoot crap ammo.
People are cheap. No one likes paying extra for insurance. People will play the percentages until they experience the downside.
It's not that you can't have a problem with higher quality (more expensive) ammo. It's that 1) you're less likely to have a problem and 2) if you do, the higher quality ammo companies and gun makers will work together to make it right since they're all repeat players.
I'm glad the guy still has his fingers and eyes. I hope Tula will step up and replace the pistol but I doubt they will.
Assuming this is the culprit would the gun have favored better with a supported chamber or do you think the results would have been the same with any other modern polymer gun?
Case support across the line has been steadily greater, and current G19s are pretty good. I think that round would have made its mark and damage on any gun, but each type will have its own failure thresholds for different components and portions thereof. I've seen similar failure patterns in the M&P (full size). I haven't seen any 9mm HK failures to associate with.
SilverTongueDevil
02-17-13, 18:37
Tula good luck but Glock might just say here you go...
Interesting. I just read a report over on the Walther Forums of a catastrophic failure of a PPQ .40. Glad noone was hurt in either instance.
morbidbattlecry
02-17-13, 18:49
I wouldn't be too hard on him for running Tula. We have to shoot what we can find if we want to train. So much ammunition is being produced these days that the probability of this happening with ANY manufacturer is pretty high.
Dollylamma
02-17-13, 18:56
If its cheap and easy, there is probably a reason. Retreat. That could be applied to many things in life... hint hint.
We were doing a "Bill Drill" and on the last round, we got a very loud BOOOM! I was looking at the gun as it happened. Saw the mag jettison out of the bottom of the gun and then the shooter threw the gun down range.
I immediately looked at the shooters hand and started counting fingers. Phew all there. Then I started to look for anything that was red, again nothing.
I have never witnessed a gun kaboom so it was interesting to watch as it happened.
C4
Coal Dragger
02-17-13, 19:04
Buy crap ammo get crap results. Some people don't seem to understand this concept very well. Glad no one got hurt though.
militarymoron
02-17-13, 19:29
and people still wonder whether i'm wearing gloves when i'm shooting both pistols and carbines 'just to look cool'. i've had a couple of case ruptures happen when shooting my M&P and glock - mags blew out the bottom, hands got stung and blackened, but no damage to the guns. ever since then, i consider gloves as important as my hearing and eye protection. it's okay if i shoot a bit slower with gloves on.
and people still wonder whether i'm wearing gloves when i'm shooting both pistols and carbines 'just to look cool'. i've had a couple of case ruptures happen when shooting my M&P and glock - mags blew out the bottom, hands got stung and blackened, but no damage to the guns. ever since then, i consider gloves as important as my hearing and eye protection. it's okay if i shoot a bit slower with gloves on.
I keep saying that I'm to try to do more glove shooting, and then just forget.
Man...I would be soo pissed. Lucky for the shooter though.
KrampusArms
02-17-13, 19:39
Buy crap ammo get crap results. Some people don't seem to understand this concept very well. Glad no one got hurt though.
Indeed. Below is what happened when I STUPIDLY ran gun show reloads through my G17.
Mag blew out the bottom of the grip, gun locked up, just scary. Luckily both the gun & I walked away unscathed. G17 wasn't damaged at all. 15448
Several years ago our agency purchased a large quantity of 9mm training ammunition from a commercial reloader. After we transitioned to the Glock 22 it sat in storage. I shot some of it out of my Glock 17 last year and the magazine blew out of the bottom of the pistol. Luckily that was the extent of the damage and the weapon functions properly.
I contacted someone from our firearms training unit and asked about the ammunition. I was informed that they had two S&W 5904 pistols and one Colt 9mm SMG blow up and they sent out an e-mail advising personnel to turn in the ammunition.
When you shoot reloads or bottom end factory ammunition you are taking your chances.
SW-Shooter
02-17-13, 20:15
The only time I would ever use Tula ammo is if the SHTF and nothing, I mean NOTHING else was available. Tula is crap ammunition and I've seen more than a dozen of these types of problems on the various gun forums, that right there is what we call a clue.
I'm not sure what else I can add to this thread, but that was my gun.
I'm not going to champion Tula, but this the first issue I have had with it other than hard primers in my AR. I have probably ran somewhere in the neighborhood of 2k rounds through various guns.
As morbidbattlecry pointed out we use what we can get a hold of. I have classes scheduled that exceed 2000 rounds required. I have been using the Tula when I can so that I can save the brass for places that require it. My local range will only sell me 50 rounds a visit, so it makes it challenging.
I have an email into Tula USA, and I bought the gun from a small local shop. They have already contacted me and offered to interface with Glock to try and get things resolved for me. Another good reason to shop with the little guy, really good customer service.
For those asking for the lot #s. I was running four 15 round magazines, so I am not sure which box the round came out of, but below are 4 boxes I was loading out of.
LOT# Z361 26
LOT# Z573-12 31 01-11
LOT# Z573-12 31 01-11
LOT@ Z549-12 25 15 08
I believe those are correct, some of the numbers are difficult to read.
If anyone wants me to, I will revisit the thread with my results.
Thanks,
Howard
Coal Dragger
02-17-13, 20:24
Indeed. Below is what happened when I STUPIDLY ran gun show reloads through my G17.
Mag blew out the bottom of the grip, gun locked up, just scary. Luckily both the gun & I walked away unscathed. G17 wasn't damaged at all. 15448
I reload, but I'm also very anal about my reloads. I've never had an issue to date, but I use an auto indexing Dillon Square Deal B press for .45ACP that makes it pretty tough to double charge a case. With my other guns I tend to use powders that fill the case to a point that a double charge simply wouldn't fit. Not too hard to do with slow burning rifle or magnum pistol powders.
I'm glad you were not hurt.
Please update us on what response you get from Tula and Glock. I have a feeling Glock will make it right, even though it doesn't seem to be their issue.
Coal Dragger
02-17-13, 20:33
Yeah my bet would be you'll have better luck with Glock than you will with Tula.
In fact your phone conversation with Tula will most likely be like one of the Discover credit card commercials with the Russian guy named "Peggy".
I saw a fellow student experience a number of problems from a case of Tula 9mm at a course in 2010, including improperly seated rounds, extraction problems, mangled casings and a squib. This convinced me to avoid this brand in the future.
That said, 9mm was scarce during this period and people were scrounging to get rounds together for training. I normally stockpile Blazer for training purposes, but I remember having to hunt down a case of Wolf at short notice to use at this course. Considering the current circumstances, I imagine folks are scooping up Tula right now and are happy to get it, but I'd still pass based on this experience.
I want to get in to reloading, but I see stuff like this and I get worried about screwing up and having something like this happen... (I know this wasn't from reloads)
I have never witnessed a gun kaboom so it was interesting to watch as it happened. C4
Indeed. It's not something you want to happen, but the experience is educational. As is actually having gun, ammo, and remnants in hand rather than relying on pics. I've had a number of case failures of various types, which is never pleasant, and had various kb!'ed guns on the bench.
The failure of the MIM extractor in the TNT gun is interesting.
Cylinder Head
02-17-13, 21:46
I'm happy the shooter is okay and hope he learned a lesson about running crap ammo. You may not be able to shoot as much but you sure do get to keep your fingers, face and guns.
My gun shop got a hold of Glock today. The rep told him they have seen these from pretty much every factory ammo from time to time. The Glock rep told him Tula was better than most at making things like this right.
I hope this is accurate. We shall see.
Howard
ICANHITHIMMAN
02-18-13, 08:55
Good job taking pics and documenting, its good to do that.
4DAIVI PAI2K5
02-18-13, 09:10
My gun shop got a hold of Glock today. The rep told him they have seen these from pretty much every factory ammo from time to time. The Glock rep told him Tula was better than most at making things like this right.
I hope this is accurate. We shall see.
Howard
Glad to hear this!
My gun shop got a hold of Glock today. The rep told him they have seen these from pretty much every factory ammo from time to time. The Glock rep told him Tula was better than most at making things like this right.
I hope this is accurate. We shall see.
Howard
If no one ends up replacing your Glock, let us know you and can have one at our cost.
C4
4DAIVI PAI2K5
02-18-13, 09:16
If no one ends up replacing your Glock, let us know you and can have one at our cost.
C4
Beers and dinner are on me after the next class Grant.
If no one ends up replacing your Glock, let us know you and can have one at our cost.
C4
And this right here is why you should shop at G&R.
JerryDefense
02-18-13, 09:25
This is not the first time I have heard of trouble with Tula. I by no means am saying you have to train with Winchester Ranger ammo but there is no arguing that Tula Ammo is as cheap as it gets. Find the middle ground that you can afford. Personally I have had great luck with S&B Ammo. Reasonably priced and consistent accuracy.
One other training I was at a guy got a Tula casing stuck in his AR and almost had to drop out of the class. He fought with it for at least 20 minutes..
Thankfully last Saturday this guy had a back-up gun and he kept all of his fingers, not everyone is that lucky.
Just my thoughts.
Buy crap ammo get crap results. Some people don't seem to understand this concept very well. Glad no one got hurt though.
True. I wouldn't take a class with that junk. I know ammo is tight.. but there has to be some kind of minimum quality standards. :(
Beers and dinner are on me after the next class Grant.
Sounds good!
C4
If no one ends up replacing your Glock, let us know you and can have one at our cost.
C4
Much appreciated.
Nephrology
02-18-13, 09:57
True. I wouldn't take a class with that junk. I know ammo is tight.. but there has to be some kind of minimum quality standards. :(
I have had very favorable results with Brown Bear (barnaul) and Wolf but Tula has got to be the worst ammo I've ever purchased. It gave my G19 and G17 consistent malfunctions. Failures to fire from rock hard primers, terribly out of spec OAL, etc etc.... Never buying it again myself, even though I often go with Wolf and Brown Bear.
Well, looking good so far...
------------------------
Mr. XXX,
I'm terribly sorry to hear about your gun being damaged. Your hand is OK,
correct? We would have no problem taking care of the repair costs for your
gun and reimbursing you for the ammunition. I can mail you a UPS next day
air shipping label to send your gun to the Glock service department. Let us
know what your address is and we can go from there. Again, we apologize for
the inconvenience and look forward to resolving this soon.
Best regards,
Adam Whitehead
TULAMMO USA, INC.
www.tulammousa.com
(888) 317-5810 ext. 4007
adam@tulammousa.com
Not to sound like an ammo snob, but I will never fire Wolf, Tula, Brown Bear, Silver Bear, etc... in a weapon that I care about (which is all of them). I will also not fire reloads unless I reloaded the cartridge myself (used to work at a gun range as a young teen, my main duty was producing .45ACP, 9mm, .38 special, and .38 super reloads). I refuse to buy remanufactured ammo or ammo from a questionable company. In 29 years of shooting, I've never had a single kaboom or squib, and I'd say that I've probably shot more than the average enthusiast (working at a range had its benefits).
So... I'm in total agreeance with others who have stated to stay away from cheap, crap ammo. The cost savings isn't worth it when you factor in the cost of replacing your weapon.
Well, looking good so far...
------------------------
Mr. XXX,
I'm terribly sorry to hear about your gun being damaged. Your hand is OK,
correct? We would have no problem taking care of the repair costs for your
gun and reimbursing you for the ammunition. I can mail you a UPS next day
air shipping label to send your gun to the Glock service department. Let us
know what your address is and we can go from there. Again, we apologize for
the inconvenience and look forward to resolving this soon.
Best regards,
Adam Whitehead
TULAMMO USA, INC.
www.tulammousa.com
(888) 317-5810 ext. 4007
adam@tulammousa.com
Looks good! I think they have "seen this movie before." ;)
C4
I just found a few threads about rims being ripped off of these Tulammo cartridges - Seems to me like they're making the steel cases TOO soft...
Howard,
I think it's outstanding Tula is stepping up to the plate on this issue.
The next question is, what are you going to do with the ammunition they send as reimbursement? :-)
brickboy240
02-18-13, 11:33
Where did you FIND 9mm ammo to even run through the gun?
Seriously...around here...unless you wanted to pay 30 bucks a box for 20rd hps....9mm bulk fmj ammo has not been around for months.
-brickboy240
G34Shooter
02-18-13, 11:55
Assuming this is the culprit would the gun have favored better with a supported chamber or do you think the results would have been the same with any other modern polymer gun?
Have you seen the chamber support for recent Glocks? They are not a problem like the .40 Glocks of ten years or so ago.
legumeofterror
02-18-13, 12:12
Assuming this is the culprit would the gun have favored better with a supported chamber or do you think the results would have been the same with any other modern polymer gun?
I had an over-pressure round of Tulammo go off in my Steyr M9A!. Blew out the primmer and got the case stuck tightly in the chamber. Once the casing was removed there were no negative effects to the pistol and it still functions fine.
http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a248/LegumeOfTerror/IMAG0071.jpg
http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a248/LegumeOfTerror/IMAG0074.jpg
I wouldn't hold my breath if I were him.
Yeah my bet would be you'll have better luck with Glock than you will with Tula.
In fact your phone conversation with Tula will most likely be like one of the Discover credit card commercials with the Russian guy named "Peggy".
My experience with Tula was great. They imediately offered to pay for any repairs to my firearms and refund me the cost of the ammunition.
Well, looking good so far...
------------------------
Mr. XXX,
I'm terribly sorry to hear about your gun being damaged. Your hand is OK,
correct? We would have no problem taking care of the repair costs for your
gun and reimbursing you for the ammunition. I can mail you a UPS next day
air shipping label to send your gun to the Glock service department. Let us
know what your address is and we can go from there. Again, we apologize for
the inconvenience and look forward to resolving this soon.
Best regards,
Adam Whitehead
TULAMMO USA, INC.
www.tulammousa.com
(888) 317-5810 ext. 4007
adam@tulammousa.com
I received a similar response from them.They ended up sending me a check for the value of the ammunition.
4DAIVI PAI2K5
02-18-13, 12:18
Glad to hear this man! Hope they follow it up.
Well, looking good so far...
------------------------
Mr. XXX,
I'm terribly sorry to hear about your gun being damaged. Your hand is OK,
correct? We would have no problem taking care of the repair costs for your
gun and reimbursing you for the ammunition. I can mail you a UPS next day
air shipping label to send your gun to the Glock service department. Let us
know what your address is and we can go from there. Again, we apologize for
the inconvenience and look forward to resolving this soon.
Best regards,
Adam Whitehead
TULAMMO USA, INC.
www.tulammousa.com
(888) 317-5810 ext. 4007
adam@tulammousa.com
Whether you like their product or not, this is a good example of proper customer service.
As to 'crap' ammo, I had an M14 come apart about like that shooting issued ball ammo. Way back when!
D. Christopher
02-18-13, 13:34
This is the climate in which these kinds of accidents will happen with increasing frequency.
1) Ammo manufacturers are at max production and many are taking steps or trying to produce more. (Longer shifts, more shifts, etc.)
2) More gun owners looking for ammo, and more people unable to find ANY ammo. (Many will buy anything they see at this point.)
3) Shooters buying more reloads because of scarcity of ammo.
4) Huge increase in number of gun owners and people going to the range to shoot.
No manufacturer is immune to having issues with their ammo. For the better companies that number is a very small percentage, but they are selling more ammo and production tempos are increased. Many more shooters and many more new shooters who wouldn't recognize a squib and might turn the squib into a kaboom. I don't practice with gloves on but it's clear that they can offer significant protection in many of these instances. Wearing them might save some fingers, particularly if you are shooting a lot of cheap ammo and especially during times of maximum production.
I applaud Tula for their handling of this situation, but I personally would never train with their ammo. Even though firearm & ammunition manufacturing and quality control continues to improve every day, I would expect to see an increase in the number of these accidents for the foreseeable future due to the huge increase in gun owners and ammo manufactured and sold.
brickboy240
02-18-13, 13:52
Help from Tula....hooray for them.
Help from Glock....probably not.
Remember...they were MIA when their 9mms started beaning us in the head with brass.
-brickboy240
Help from Glock....probably not.
Remember...they were MIA when their 9mms started beaning us in the head with brass.
-brickboy240
What is Glock's obligation here?
Help from Tula....hooray for them.
Help from Glock....probably not.
Remember...they were MIA when their 9mms started beaning us in the head with brass.
-brickboy240
If the issue is defective ammunition, I would think that it would be the ammunition company's responsibility to warranty the firearm and not the firearm company.
brickboy240
02-18-13, 16:21
While in this case...that is true...ammo is to blame.
Glock tried to blame their crappy MIM extractor on the ammo too...if you remember.
Sad really...the only damn 9mm ball you find and it blows up your gun. Sounds like my luck! LOL
-brickboy240
While in this case...that is true...ammo is to blame.
Glock tried to blame their crappy MIM extractor on the ammo too...if you remember.
Sad really...the only damn 9mm ball you find and it blows up your gun. Sounds like my luck! LOL
-brickboy240
This thread is about the Tula failure in a G19 causing catastrophic destruction. Take that other stuff to one of the other half dozen or so threads already running, please.
A few years back I had a kaboom with Wolf...Brand new CZ 85combat, pistol had just over 200rnds through it KB was caused by case head rupture.. Wolf was very good about it, and replaced my pistol..Ever since then, I reloaded my own 9mm, I figure my QC, is probably better than theirs...
Absolute BS
02-18-13, 18:59
I know the sound of this round going off got eveyone's attention in the range.
4DAIVI PAI2K5
02-19-13, 06:10
I know the sound of this round going off got eveyone's attention in the range.
Between that and seeing the gun get thrown to the ground. It was a whole lot of :confused: at first.
Between that and seeing the gun get thrown to the ground. It was a whole lot of :confused: at first.
And why did you throw the gun down? Disgust at realizing what happened? I'm sure that had a helluva dramatic affect. :D
[no criticism at all, it's not a big deal to me, we might should throw them more often ;) ]
4DAIVI PAI2K5
02-19-13, 08:06
And why did you throw the gun down? Disgust at realizing what happened? I'm sure that had a helluva dramatic affect. :D
[no criticism at all, it's not a big deal to me, we might should throw them more often ;) ]
Because the damn thing just exploded in his hand. Would you have kept a hold of it. He threw it to the ground milliseconds after it happened.
jonconsiglio
02-19-13, 08:31
Because the damn thing just exploded in his hand. Would you have kept a hold of it. He threw it to the ground milliseconds after it happened.
When I first read that he threw it, I figured Pincus was there....!
I probably would have thrown it as well. An unexpected explosion in the hand can surely cause a spontaneous reaction.
4DAIVI PAI2K5
02-19-13, 08:48
When I first read that he threw it, I figured Pincus was there....!
I probably would have thrown it as well. An unexpected explosion in the hand can surely cause a spontaneous reaction.
Yeah it caused the whole group a OH SHIT moment.
And why did you throw the gun down? Disgust at realizing what happened? I'm sure that had a helluva dramatic affect. :D
I probably would have thrown it as well. An unexpected explosion in the hand can surely cause a spontaneous reaction.
During a couple of significant case failures last year, I dropped the guns pretty enthusiastically. The first probably qualified for "thrown."
Coal Dragger
02-19-13, 15:49
Glad to hear it sounds like Tula is stepping up, also surprised to hear it. I probably would be leery of using any of their ammo but at least they stand behind their product and take care of the kabooms caused by them.
LightningFast
02-19-13, 16:21
Glad to hear it sounds like Tula is stepping up, also surprised to hear it. I probably would be leery of using any of their ammo but at least they stand behind their product and take care of the kabooms caused by them.
I'm confused by how many people are surprised by this. Any issue with factory ammo like this I've heard of or encountered was dealt with very professionally by the company, including all incidences with Tula.
They will take care of you, should -God forbid- something unfortunate happen.
Just read about a similar experience w/ Tula ammo the other day on here. (http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_1_5/1441552_FNP_just_exploded_in_my_hands_____.html) He got to the last few rounds of Tula when his FNP-45 went kaboom.
And why did you throw the gun down? Disgust at realizing what happened? I'm sure that had a helluva dramatic affect. :D
[no criticism at all, it's not a big deal to me, we might should throw them more often ;) ]
My brain said "you feel pain, get rid of what is making you feel pain" so I dropped it/tossed it on the ground. I'd like to say i recognized the gun was at slide lock when I did it, but I can't be sure. Though the gun was at slide lock.
On second though I should have thrown it full force at Adam's head, oh well... maybe next time :)
El Pistolero
02-19-13, 19:40
I had a case failure with my Walther P22 and I dropped it in the sand. It stung. And that was with a rimfire. I can perfectly understand why someone would throw a 9x19 handgun that just KBed.
I also had an 8mm Mauser kaboom on me twice, but it was to heavy to throw.
4DAIVI PAI2K5
02-19-13, 20:56
If you would have thrown it at my head, I would have thrown Brian at your's.
Anything new from Tula?
My brain said "you feel pain, get rid of what is making you feel pain" so I dropped it/tossed it on the ground. I'd like to say i recognized the gun was at slide lock when I did it, but I can't be sure. Though the gun was at slide lock.
On second though I should have thrown it full force at Adam's head, oh well... maybe next time :)
LOL yeah I was visualizing more of the Pincus move which I ain't gonna fault a blastee for either. I mean, walks like a grenade, quacks like a grenade . . . throw it like a grenade.
Glad you weren't hurt bad and the replacement news is tracking favorably.
GUNSLINGER733
02-20-13, 13:16
Good to see Tula taking care of that. That says something about them.
talaananthes
02-20-13, 14:44
Scary. Glad Tula's making it right though.
I have seen a number of guns blow up, some with US made factory ammo. I have also seen a number of other ammo issues such as squibs, etc.
I am currently waiting to hear back from Winchester ref sime bad PDX1 ammo I have.
While Tula is cheap stuff I have yet to see any of it not act right as of yet.
Just sayin.
The way you guys talk makes it sound like kabooms are a common thing. In 29 years and countless rounds fired, I haven't had anything remotely close to a kaboom. I haven't seen a kaboom in person, and it hasn't happened to any of my shooting buddies as far as I know. I also don't shoot reloads or Russian ammo... But seriously, what gives? Some people say they've seen it with US factory ammo - if that's the case, maybe those people are really unlucky - either that or I've been extremely lucky...
The way you guys talk makes it sound like kabooms are a common thing. In 29 years and countless rounds fired, I haven't had anything remotely close to a kaboom. I haven't seen a kaboom in person, and it hasn't happened to any of my shooting buddies as far as I know. I also don't shoot reloads or Russian ammo... But seriously, what gives? Some people say they've seen it with US factory ammo - if that's the case, maybe those people are really unlucky - either that or I've been extremely lucky...
I shoot 3 or 4 matches a month and usually see a KB about once a year.
It's not that big 'a deal. Mostly hurt pride when someone blows up a 3K 2011 with a faulty reload. I always chuckle and say "Yeah, but look how much you saved on ammo!":lol:
I have seen KB's with U S factory ammo and reloads. What I find even more disturbing is the number of FTF with Winchester Ranger and Federal HST in the last few years. The rounds failed to fire in several different guns. It makes me believe that factory ammunition is being produced faster than quality control can keep up with.
I have seen KB's with U S factory ammo and reloads. What I find even more disturbing is the number of FTF with Winchester Ranger and Federal HST in the last few years. The rounds failed to fire in several different guns. It makes me believe that factory ammunition is being produced faster than quality control can keep up with.
I teach firearms for a leo academy that also handles corrections. We have seen a lot of screwed up factory loaded ammo lately. Anything from primers in wrong to projectiles in sideways and upside down.
Dan
The way you guys talk makes it sound like kabooms are a common thing. In 29 years and countless rounds fired, I haven't had anything remotely close to a kaboom. I haven't seen a kaboom in person, and it hasn't happened to any of my shooting buddies as far as I know. I also don't shoot reloads or Russian ammo... But seriously, what gives? Some people say they've seen it with US factory ammo - if that's the case, maybe those people are really unlucky - either that or I've been extremely lucky...
Same here. 40+ years of pistol. When I reloaded I had a squib though. Stopped the wife from rolling the next shot from a K-38 when I heard the light pop.
The way you guys talk makes it sound like kabooms are a common thing. In 29 years and countless rounds fired, I haven't had anything remotely close to a kaboom. I haven't seen a kaboom in person, and it hasn't happened to any of my shooting buddies as far as I know. I also don't shoot reloads or Russian ammo... But seriously, what gives? Some people say they've seen it with US factory ammo - if that's the case, maybe those people are really unlucky - either that or I've been extremely lucky...
Right place, right time, right combination of variables.
It makes me believe that factory ammunition is being produced faster than quality control can keep up with.
Increased production means decreased QC standards for some. Many, unfortunately. Increased production also means a greater number of overall rounds in which even acceptable failure rates can occur.
I teach firearms for a leo academy that also handles corrections. We have seen a lot of screwed up factory loaded ammo lately. Anything from primers in wrong to projectiles in sideways and upside down.
Dan
That where I have seen it the most, with drop shipped LE grade factory ammo. There have been a few upside down primers too as you noted.
Good to see Tula taking care of that. That says something about them. It does say something, but I suspect that they deal with this more frequently than other reputable ammo companies. They have had a lot of practice. :lol:
Timely example of bad factory ammo from a range session today.
Blazer 40SW 165 FMJ, p/n 3589. ~5000rds acquired a couple of weeks ago. These three rounds were all in box #3 of the first case opened. The round on the left was fired in a stock gen3 G23, which went "fzzzzzzztttt" instead of bang. Bullet stayed seated in case mouth but increased OAL of cartridge. Stoppage cleared without issue. I expect to find more of these. (Primer on the right is also deformed, but not obvious in the photo.)
http://i76.photobucket.com/albums/j18/Skintop911/MISC/BlazerPrimers.jpg
El Pistolero
02-23-13, 21:30
Timely example of bad factory ammo from a range session today.
Blazer 40SW 165 FMJ, p/n 3589. ~5000rds acquired a couple of weeks ago. These three rounds were all in box #3 of the first case opened. The round on the left was fired in a stock gen3 G23, which went "fzzzzzzztttt" instead of bang. Bullet stayed seated in case mouth but increased OAL of cartridge. Stoppage cleared without issue. I expect to find more of these. (Primer on the right is also deformed, but not obvious in the photo.)
http://i76.photobucket.com/albums/j18/Skintop911/MISC/BlazerPrimers.jpg
Wow, I would send all that back! The entire lot is suspect, and the next faulty ammo could be worse, i.e. squibs or KBs.
Come to think of it, I usually shoot older ammo (FIFO) when I go to the range. It's crazy to think that newer ammo may be causing kabooms due to looser QC. I remember reading about and seeing pictures of the results of KBs when I was a kid, but I always imagined the chances of it happening to me were something like being hit by lightning. Maybe someone should come up with a line of protective shooting coveralls or something... Search Youtube for "Glock Kaboom"... Yikes...
eightmillimeter
02-24-13, 00:09
The way you guys talk makes it sound like kabooms are a common thing. In 29 years and countless rounds fired, I haven't had anything remotely close to a kaboom. I haven't seen a kaboom in person, and it hasn't happened to any of my shooting buddies as far as I know. I also don't shoot reloads or Russian ammo... But seriously, what gives? Some people say they've seen it with US factory ammo - if that's the case, maybe those people are really unlucky - either that or I've been extremely lucky...
It does happen. What you see with the internet is that people are quick to share the event, which benefits us all so we know what ammo is good and bad. I live in Iowa and 20 years ago a Kb that happened in Massachusetts would never be known to me. Now as I peruse the internet forums and read my emails I am up to date on just about every Kb that happens in the ConUS it seems.
American factory ammo is not immune either though, the recall on 62gr Remington match .223 ammo a couple of years ago was the real deal and there are pictures of blown up guns to prove it. That is just one example.
eightmillimeter
02-24-13, 00:10
Timely example of bad factory ammo from a range session today.
Blazer 40SW 165 FMJ, p/n 3589. ~5000rds acquired a couple of weeks ago. These three rounds were all in box #3 of the first case opened. The round on the left was fired in a stock gen3 G23, which went "fzzzzzzztttt" instead of bang. Bullet stayed seated in case mouth but increased OAL of cartridge. Stoppage cleared without issue. I expect to find more of these. (Primer on the right is also deformed, but not obvious in the photo.)
http://i76.photobucket.com/albums/j18/Skintop911/MISC/BlazerPrimers.jpg
Our agency no longer uses blazer for practice ammo because of this exactly. A couple of years ago we started noticing primers exactly like what you see there.
Our agency no longer uses blazer for practice ammo because of this exactly. A couple of years ago we started noticing primers exactly like what you see there.
Honestly, I've always been afraid of Blazer in the aluminum case. It's been around as long as I can remember and even as a kid I thought it was a bad idea. I just think ammo isn't something that you should intentionally cut corners on to save cost.
...and your internet theory is more than likely spot on. When I was a kid, you had to rely on second and third-hand stories and gun mags to get the scoop. I guess I have just been lucky.
Maybe someone should come up with a line of protective shooting coveralls or something... Search Youtube for "Glock Kaboom"... Yikes...
Honestly, I've always been afraid of Blazer in the aluminum case.
I don't think a KB in a handgun has ever resulted in more than a cut hand and that seems to be rare. I've never even seen a cut hand. Everyone at the range usually acts like some huge incident just took place, when in reality, someone just broke their gun.
It usually blows out the mag and extractor, sometimes it blows out the trigger or blows the top of the chamber through the ejection port.
I think the aluminium cases don't play well in 40. 9mm, ACP & 38spl aluminum have treated me well.
I don't think a KB in a handgun has ever resulted in more than a cut hand and that seems to be rare. I've never even seen a cut hand. Everyone at the range usually acts like some huge incident just took place, when in reality, someone just broke their gun.
It usually blows out the mag and extractor, sometimes it blows out the trigger or blows the top of the chamber through the ejection port.
Most failures are fairly simple and follow relatively predictable patterns, with minimal injury to the shooter. There are others more injurious though, requiring stitches, x-rays. Depends on what happened and how.
I think the aluminium cases don't play well in 40. 9mm, ACP & 38spl aluminum have treated me well.
Aluminum cases aren't bad in and of themselves. Like brass or steel, they require attention to detail and QC.
Glock 21 w/ 460 Rowland lone wolf barrel.1555915560
Shipping label, and a check for the ammo arrived today.
4DAIVI PAI2K5
02-25-13, 17:45
just ammo? No gun check?
Glad you still have all your digits.
Absolute BS
02-25-13, 20:26
Yeah it caused the whole group a OH SHIT moment.
yes... we all shit our pants at the same time... Some more than others :( I loved those 5.11 pants
sad to hear of Glock incognito.
RearwardAssist
02-26-13, 20:00
just ammo? No gun check?
I believe they said they would pay for the repair/replace from glock hence the shipping label
sad to hear of Glock incognito.
Why would they be fixing a problem caused by faulty ammo?
I believe they said they would pay for the repair/replace from glock hence the shipping label
Why would they be fixing a problem caused by faulty ammo?
It looks like Tula is replacing the Glock and refunding the ammo purchase price.
RearwardAssist
02-26-13, 20:45
It looks like Tula is replacing the Glock and refunding the ammo purchase price.
Yep thats what I said when he asked why they didnt send a check, and the other guy complained that glock didnt do anything.
Honestly, that is more than I expected Tula to do. Glad to see them step up and work with you. I knew Glock wouldn't do anything as it really wasn't their problem.
Glad the shooter is OK. I have been on the line when a gun KB'd and it scares the shit out of everyone.
I was at a class where a guy had a speer frangible round buldge his Glock 21barrel. Had to use a hammer to get the slide over the buldge.
Speer bought his agency a new Glock.
I have seen this numerous times. 3X by me personally (no, I dont reload lol). I have also seen it with a Beretta. The most entertaining was a hunting rifle, a 270 I think, that detonated sending wood stock parts 25 yards in all directions. If you spend enough time on a range, you see some crazy stuff.
I think a detonating gun would be an awesome anti theft, unauthorized use feature...lol.
talaananthes
03-10-13, 20:03
To the OP: My friend had some problems with Tula ammo recently. Less disastrous, but still I feel it's worth checking with them. Who did he contact and how?
To the OP: My friend had some problems with Tula ammo recently. Less disastrous, but still I feel it's worth checking with them. Who did he contact and how?
Sorry for the delayed response..
http://tulammousa.com/support/
So this has finally been resolved. I figured I would post a recap.
2/16 Attended VSM Pistol Class. Grenaded Glock due to ammo
2/17 Write Tula USA explaining issue.
2/18 Tula responds back. makes sure I am OK, and starts process of sending out check for ammo/shipping label (overnight) to Glock
2/25 Check for Ammo, and Shipping label arrive from Tula.
2/26 Per UPS tracking site, G19 arrives at Glock.
3/5 I call Glock for status. The advise it will be $100 for a new frame. Validate it was overpreassured ammo. Say they won't do any work until they are paid (they had not contacted me)
3/5 I call Adam at Tula explain the situation. Give him my case # with Glock etc.
3/5 Adam calls and leaves me a VM stating Glock has been paid.
3/5 Adam leaves me another VM saying Glock found more damage with the Gun, and it will be replaced. They (Tula) has already paid for it.
3/7 Called Glock to get Status. I get Sales order #, but no ETA to ship
3/12 Called Glock to get status, told to call back Thursday
3/14 Called Glock to get Status. No ETA, but the guy takes my # and tells me he will call me.
3/21 Call Glock for Status. They tell me it should be at my house today. Come home to a new G19 complete with 3 mags etc. :)
So in summary Tula's customer service as A+. I found Glock's to be somewhat lacking in the communication area. However I am all taken care of, and happy to have my gun back.
So this has finally been resolved. I figured I would post a recap.
2/16 Attended VSM Pistol Class. Grenaded Glock due to ammo
2/17 Write Tula USA explaining issue.
2/18 Tula responds back. makes sure I am OK, and starts process of sending out check for ammo/shipping label (overnight) to Glock
2/25 Check for Ammo, and Shipping label arrive from Tula.
2/26 Per UPS tracking site, G19 arrives at Glock.
2/5 I call Glock for status. The advise it will be $100 for a new frame. Validate it was overpreassured ammo. Say they won't do any work until they are paid (they had not contacted me)
2/5 I call Adam at Tula explain the situation. Give him my case # with Glock etc.
2/5 Adam calls and leaves me a VM stating Glock has been paid.
2/5 Adam leaves me another VM saying Glock found more damage with the Gun, and it will be replaced. They (Tula) has already paid for it.
2/7 Called Glock to get Status. I get Sales order #, but no ETA to ship
2/12 Called Glock to get status, told to call back Thursday
2/14 Called Glock to get Status. No ETA, but the guy takes my # and tells me he will call me.
2/21 Call Glock for Status. They tell me it should be at my house today. Come home to a new G19 complete with 3 mags etc. :)
So in summary Tula's customer service as A+. I found Glock's to be somewhat lacking in the communication area. However I am all taken care of, and happy to have my gun back.
Gives me hope, glad to hear. I shoot Tula when there's snow on the ground and I won't be picking up my brass.
Absolute BS
03-21-13, 22:23
Glad to hear its all worked out now. Ill try to post up a summary tomorrow evening on the blog and make sure everyone knows. The article I wrote about that class is one of the most read I have ever written so far. I guess I should thank your hands of steel for that?
ffhounddog
03-22-13, 04:11
I have never had issues with Tula USA ammo even the .223 but this is good CS if I have ever seen it.
I am glad everything came out okay and everything got taken care of.
That's awesome that Tula took care of the incident the way they did.
So this has finally been resolved. I figured I would post a recap.
2/16 Attended VSM Pistol Class. Grenaded Glock due to ammo
2/17 Write Tula USA explaining issue.
2/18 Tula responds back. makes sure I am OK, and starts process of sending out check for ammo/shipping label (overnight) to Glock
2/25 Check for Ammo, and Shipping label arrive from Tula.
2/26 Per UPS tracking site, G19 arrives at Glock.
3/5 I call Glock for status. The advise it will be $100 for a new frame. Validate it was overpreassured ammo. Say they won't do any work until they are paid (they had not contacted me)
3/5 I call Adam at Tula explain the situation. Give him my case # with Glock etc.
3/5 Adam calls and leaves me a VM stating Glock has been paid.
3/5 Adam leaves me another VM saying Glock found more damage with the Gun, and it will be replaced. They (Tula) has already paid for it.
3/7 Called Glock to get Status. I get Sales order #, but no ETA to ship
3/12 Called Glock to get status, told to call back Thursday
3/14 Called Glock to get Status. No ETA, but the guy takes my # and tells me he will call me.
3/21 Call Glock for Status. They tell me it should be at my house today. Come home to a new G19 complete with 3 mags etc. :)
So in summary Tula's customer service as A+. I found Glock's to be somewhat lacking in the communication area. However I am all taken care of, and happy to have my gun back.
Just over a month from KB to new Glock seems like grade A service to me. Glad your Glock suffered so your hand did not. Even with cash in hand it would have taken WAY over a month to find a Glock 19 around here.
Noah
p.s. Just bought my first AR, so a newbie to them (hence first post), but a Glock guy from NJ since 1991.
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.5 Copyright © 2024 vBulletin Solutions, Inc. All rights reserved.