View Full Version : hammer down
texasgunhand
02-27-13, 23:26
I guess iam old school in thinking dry firing is bad??? and i dont know of any way other than that to drop the hammer on an m-4 so its not cocked all the time during storage. Would leaving a spent casing in the chamber be a bad idea? long term???or will dry firing not hurt???
I dont like leaving the hammer back for a long time,cant be good for the spring. Altho i will admit some of my guns are 50 years old and they have been cocked for most of that time, and they still look and shoot like brand new. I havent had a chance to shoot a lot lately,so my guns stay stored,cleaned every once in a while to check for rust.
thopkins22
02-27-13, 23:32
Dry firing will absolutely not hurt, and is absolutely required if you plan to reach your potential. Nor will leaving the hammer cocked wear out your spring in any way.
With springs, the act of compressing and decompressing is what puts the wear on a spring. Prolonged compression only harms it if it is compressed beyond it's yield limit.
http://www.ohio.edu/people/bayless/seniorlab/samplereport.pdf
Considering that it's a steel spring, the only thing that will harm it is fatigue and stress...actions caused by firing/dry firing. It's also under stress at both points in it's cycle, but both points are well within the yield limit so long as they are quality springs.
In reality, it's absolutely nothing to worry about...let's say you dry fire enough to wear them out prematurely, they are very cheap and very easy to replace. It will take tens of thousands(if not more) of cycles to achieve this.
texasgunhand
02-27-13, 23:55
Ive been outa the scene for a while , and ive been reading here on spring life. In mags etc, Ive got an old old colt .32 acp that has had the mag loaded for longer than i have been alive. "my grandfathers hes 95 AND HE BOUGHT IT NEW...LOL" and the spring still works, I shot a clip outa it a couple years back, and it still worked great, thats why i asked this... i guess that it also will not hurt the firing pin etc???? When i went through my LE trainging 20 years ago they bitched about leaving mags loaded, but like i said that old colt has been loaded for 40 years..lol and it still worked like a champ.really over 40 years iam 45 and its been around longer than me..even the 40 + year old ammo was still hot...like i said, i just dont want to break a hammer, firing pin etc. being dumb.so i thought i would ask..... thanks
If dry firing damaged ARs, then the Army (and I suspect the Marines) would be going through thousands of spare parts every Basic Training or OSUT cycle. During Basic Rifle Marksmanship you will dry fire your rifle everytime you aren't actively engaged in something else. Hundreds of times a day for a couple weeks. At least. And everytime it's reassembled a function check is done. Then when it's turned into the arms room.
Things have changed. When I looked for firearms info the last place I went was to someone in LE. Many officers have very little real experience with firearms.
Some of the worst types of WECSOG I have seen were with LE weapons- AR's in particular.
We also don't call them clips. They are magazines.
Ive been outa the scene for a while , and ive been reading here on spring life. In mags etc, Ive got an old old colt .32 acp that has had the mag loaded for longer than i have been alive. "my grandfathers hes 95 AND HE BOUGHT IT NEW...LOL" and the spring still works, I shot a clip outa it a couple years back, and it still worked great, thats why i asked this... i guess that it also will not hurt the firing pin etc???? When i went through my LE trainging 20 years ago they bitched about leaving mags loaded, but like i said that old colt has been loaded for 40 years..lol and it still worked like a champ.really over 40 years iam 45 and its been around longer than me..even the 40 + year old ammo was still hot...like i said, i just dont want to break a hammer, firing pin etc. being dumb.so i thought i would ask..... thanks
If I may... I'd suggest a complete tear down of the weapon when not in use. This will give the springs some MUCH needed relaxation time.
Store it with the hammer cocked.
Do not put a spent case in the chamber and dry fire it before you store it.
Do clear the gun and check it twice, or more times, before you dry fire it.
Old School is fine and dandy when it comes to tattoos and cars. Anything else and you're just being a hard-headed dumb-ass.:dirol:
Just a quick question: do snap caps offer any protection while dry firing, or are they basically just for simulating malfunction?
Just a quick question: do snap caps offer any protection while dry firing, or are they basically just for simulating malfunction?
Snap caps offer limited value in safely function checking feeding or something.
But in the AR... they're not needed for dry firing at all.
I use snap caps for my dry fire practice.
I'm more worried about the OP classifying himself as old and he's only 45! The day I find a dead spring in my magazine is when I'll call myself old.
I use snap caps for my dry fire practice.
You're just working your ejector and extractor springs and parts needlessly. :eek:
Five_Point_Five_Six
02-28-13, 08:03
Using snap caps in your AR is like wearing a condom when you have sex with your wife even after one or both of you are fixed. Not needed, but if it makes you feel safer, go for it.
Both times I've put a snap cap into an AR,I 've had to mortar it to get it to eject. Never again.
bullittmcqueen
02-28-13, 09:11
What I find more disturbing over and over when I see threads like this is how people are so worried about messing up parts like springs that cost less than $5 to replace, when we are talking about a weapon system that is predicated on its ability to easily change out parts....
What I find more disturbing over and over when I see threads like this is how people are so worried about messing up parts like springs that cost less than $5 to replace, when we are talking about a weapon system that is predicated on its ability to easily change out parts....
It's called ARFcom logic. :rolleyes:
I have a 1925 outboard that I need to restore. The water pump is cam actuated and uses a return spring. This thing has been stored since before WWII with the spring compressed. The spring still works as good as new.
I guess a spring in a modern weapon made with better engineering and materials could fail sooner than a 1925 outboard motor, but I'm not going to worry about it.
Use one of these:
http://www.midwayusa.com/product/872223/tma-ar-15-dry-fire-device-delrin-orange
Using this product is not to save any wear and tear, which others have pointed out isn't an issue. The purpose is for only having to pull the bolt carrier back a very short distance for the next trigger pull. You can maintain your firing grip and position, while using your left hand to pull the charging handle back only about an inch to re-cock the hammer.
I used it with my 10 year old grandson, in order to get him used to firing and manipulating the safety, over and over again.
Just remember to take it before going out for your next range session!
Clear and clean, plus a good lubed gun in dry fire drills=a great knowledge of how your firearm operates and where your fire and reset points are on your rifle.
That product from Midway USA...The first and third comment screams a cleaning after a dry fire drill...if the product fits.
texasgunhand
03-24-13, 13:32
LOL, ok maybe 45 is mid school, Thanks for the info guys, some of my guns have been cocked and stored for many many years and they still shoot like new when needed.
Theres so much wrong info in springs etc. Iam sure glad I joined here it has provided many hours of reading,and some great info on subjects that used to be bad such as leaving mags loaded etc.
Like I said, really if that were true you think that old .32 acp colt pistol mag that has been loaded since before I was even born would be no good but its still got plenty of spring..
Right now Iam on the hunt for a metal trigger guard for a Rem. mod. 600 rifle. Hard to find unless you have one made for a 100 bucks. This part I need right now, So far ive only found 2 people making them. PITA..
And your right, I think I ordered a spare trigger and hammer spring, both as spare parts from Windham for like 2 bucks...I dont own a Windham rifle but parts cost so much right now and are so hard to find I just order from whos got them in stock. Guess there all pretty much the same. Could be wrong though....
[QUOTE=Iraqgunz;1564819]Things have changed. When I looked for firearms info the last place I went was to someone in LE. Many officers have very little real experience with firearms.
Precisely, I have watched in dis-belief over the years as many hold up LEOs as experts on everything firearm related. Just makes me want to scream.:(
Failure2Stop
03-24-13, 20:59
And your right, I think I ordered a spare trigger and hammer spring, both as spare parts from Windham for like 2 bucks...I dont own a Windham rifle but parts cost so much right now and are so hard to find I just order from whos got them in stock. Guess there all pretty much the same. Could be wrong though....
Windham isn't well regarded for most parts.
I would point you toward Brownells, they carry decent parts from JP, Wolff, Colt, and their own house brand.
Might also want to check with Grant at G&R, he carries quality parts and will steer you right.
ThirdWatcher
03-24-13, 21:21
In my agency, we carry our AR's w/ chamber empty, magazine inserted, and cocked w/ the safety on. Once a round is chambered, it is either fired or it becomes range ammo. (No round is ever supposed to be chambered more than once on the street.)
OP your windham parts will be fine for spare parts. Probabaly dont want to buy windham parts for a stripped lower though.
texasgunhand
03-24-13, 22:16
Yes I just ordered things like extractor pins, firing pin pins. Stuff that could get lost easy. Will look into those other places when this stuff dies down.
I want a good LPK and bolt for spares.Hopfully things will drop in price and come back into stock soon. Some people are talking about another year. I sure hope not... Thanks...
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.5 Copyright © 2024 vBulletin Solutions, Inc. All rights reserved.