View Full Version : 5.45x39 mags
Last I heard, my SLR-105 is shipping today. With that in mind, I figure that I had better get some mags to load up all that 7N6 that will be arriving about the same time as my rifle. I've been looking around and I'm seeing quite a selection of mags, but I don't know what to look for. Bulgarian, German, Russian, Steel, Polymer, Plastic(?), Bakelite, Circle 21, Circle 10, black, brown, brick, saddle, etc. the list goes on. Does anyone have any input as to what to get and/or what to avoid? From your experience, are most of these mags used? Should I be looking for new? Thanks.
i have a CUR-2 and i have 4 german bakelite mags and they work great. i havnt had any problems with them.
Well since you're getting a Bulgarian I would stick with the Circle 10 mags.
If you can find the Russian ones for a decent price jump all over them! Other than that get whatever you can find as the 5.45 seems to be plentiful and cheap right now.
Go with the Bulgarian mags. IIRC I purchased 10 mags from OhioRapidfire for 40 bucks plus shipping.
Checked out ORF and have 10 Brown Bulgy's on the way. Thanks for the directions. They had some Russian mags but they were a bit spendy. I suppose I need to bone up on my AK trivia but I have to ask what may be a dumb question...why are there so many colors of mags?
TigerStripe
06-09-06, 22:45
Checked out ORF and have 10 Brown Bulgy's on the way. Thanks for the directions. They had some Russian mags but they were a bit spendy. I suppose I need to bone up on my AK trivia but I have to ask what may be a dumb question...why are there so many colors of mags?
Mostly to match the furniture. The original orange bakelite were somewhat of a match with the wood. The plum and black were made to match the Russian plum furniture and the black was to match Bulgarian furniture.
TS
Pat_Rogers
06-10-06, 07:12
I strongly doubt that the former Soviet Union had the same amount of fashion "correctness" that exists on the errornet forums....
I worked in a unit called Foreign Material Acquisition and Exploitation during a turbulent period of the Cold War.
Our interviews and sources stated that the original light brown /orange color on the AK74 series was to
1. Visually distinguish it from the 7.62x39 AK47/ AKM magazine
2. Blend with natural surroundings
When the Bakelite 7.62x39 mags first came out, that sorta' shot down #1, but made sense as far as #2.
Later information was that the light brown/ orange had too much red in it to be useful as camouflage.
Plum is a more shaded color, and while there are some shades of plum in nature, it is clearly not as dominant as browns and greens.
Certainly black is the most useless color for camouflage, and is better known as a target indicator.
There is a theory that they went to black to save money, but that is anecdotal only.
Re magazines in general.
The vast majority of hobby shooters are more concerned with material things vice ability to use these same things. Sometimes i believe that there should be mandatory trigger time and less talk time.
My experience in exploiting and teaching AK's over the long term is that the quality of the guns are dependent on country of manufacture and time of manufacture. The magazines are pretty much like AR magazines- the individual mag works or it doesn't work.
The endless and mindless discussions on some boards re "Colt mags are the best" when Colt doesn't make magazines gets carried into the AK world too.
If your desire is to collect magazines- have at it. If you want certain mags for period display or aesthetic reasons, have at it.
If you want to actually use the AK, buy a lot of magazines and ensure that they work. Keep the good ones and 86 the ones that consistently fail.
Don't get hung up on which factory the magazine was made in. From a practical point of view, it isn't worth the time spent obsessing about it.
As i have never had an original thought in my life, i'm going to shamelessly plagiarize Jeff Cahill.
He stated that to him an AK was like looking at a row of drills on the wall at Lowe's. He is interested in them as far as performance is concerned- that is, when he presses the trigger that it works, but after it is finished, he puts it back on the wall and gets on with his life.
I feel pretty much the same about AR's as AK's. They are tools. Tools are meant to be used.
I like the idea that people have representative articles to trace history, and i know that i have spent a small fortune on books (I hate you Collector Grade Publications!) to learn about esoteric minutiae.
However, what i do as a vocation is teach fighting, and one has very little to do with the other.
TigerStripe
06-10-06, 10:42
I strongly doubt that the former Soviet Union had the same amount of fashion "correctness" that exists on the errornet forums....
I worked in a unit called Foreign Material Acquisition and Exploitation during a turbulent period of the Cold War.
Our interviews and sources stated that the original light brown /orange color on the AK74 series was to
1. Visually distinguish it from the 7.62x39 AK47/ AKM magazine
2. Blend with natural surroundings
When the Bakelite 7.62x39 mags first came out, that sorta' shot down #1, but made sense as far as #2.
Later information was that the light brown/ orange had too much red in it to be useful as camouflage.
Plum is a more shaded color, and while there are some shades of plum in nature, it is clearly not as dominant as browns and greens.
Certainly black is the most useless color for camouflage, and is better known as a target indicator.
There is a theory that they went to black to save money, but that is anecdotal only.
I didn't state why the colors of the mags and furniture was changed, just that the mags were switched along with the color of the furniture. Just as you stated each change in both mags and furniture was an attempt to make both fit it with the environment.
TS
Thank's Pat for providing this information. I certainly hope that my posts didn't come across as inquiries as to the collectability of various mags or anything else for that matter. I don't have the time, money, or energy to get into that. My son is growing too quickly to devote any unnecessary resources to such a hobby. My initial question was geared toward trying to avoid the shot gun approach in acquiring magazines for my new rifle. Being that I'm new to this particular round and the round dispenser, I was not sure as to whether there were any particular manufacturers or styles that were generally more reliable or of higher quality than others, hoping that I would have to deep six fewer due to being unreliable. My question regarding magazine color was simply a follow up to my first and was more for the sake of curiousity than anything else. You have answered both. Again, thank you.
Pat_Rogers
06-10-06, 11:20
TS- Understood. Just filling in blanks. Note however that black doesn't fit in with any environment. Again, the reasons for adopting black are beyond me...
Ryan- Good for you-the family always comes first!
I never did address your question directly. My experience is that by and large, offshore manufactured issue magazines, 7.62x39 or 5.45x39, work well in general.
Certainly you'll find individual magazines that work or don't, but having gone through several thousand magazines i'd be hard pressed to cite one as being better or worse then any other.
I have seen a few commercialy purchased magazines at class (again, issue mags) from different sources, and they all worked well.
The mags are relatively cheap, and the odds of finding good mags high.
Enjoy your 105. I have one and it is a very cool tool.
While I've got you all distracted with my questions, I'd like to add one more that's a bit off topic. I understand that 7N6 is corrosive. What do I need to do after I shoot to prevent any problems. I am the type of guy that cleans immediately upon returning home from the range. Is there anything aside from a good going over with Gun Scrubber, Hoppes, or CLP that I need to do? I think that I read somewhere that I should add Windex to my cleaning kit. :confused:
Pat_Rogers
06-10-06, 17:17
Ryan, i absolutely despise CLP, and use Slip 2000 as my lube and their 725 as the cleaner. I have been shooting the 7n6 and using the the Slip with no bad results.
I'd prefer to stay away from petroleum based products when possible. Slip does a much better job then CLP and is a lot less toxic.
Gotcha, thanks. I'll pick some up.
Pat_Rogers
06-11-06, 08:50
Ryan- I have a coupla' hundred 74 mags. The steel ones, the light brown, brick red, black and plum- all run fine.
I have noticed that some of the "plum" magazines are actually black painted over with plum/
The paint looks old, and i have no idea whether they were done OCONUS or by an unscrupulous dealer here.
I doubt you'll have any problems, but let us know how you like your 105.
I have a coupla' hundred 74 mags.
Oh how I would love to see your gun room, safe, shop, whatever or wherever it is that you keep your guns, gear and ammo. I don't think that I've seen a couple of hundred of anything in my life except ammo rounds, dollars, and what lately seems to be dirty diapers. :D
I doubt you'll have any problems, but let us know how you like your 105.
Will do. I'm patiently waiting for it to get here. You don't happen to know, given the curveture of the 5.45 mags, if they'll work in Eagle M4 mag pouches?
Also, TS, Boom, Marc, and miserai, thank you for your help.
Last question, any plans to ever come up North into the MN, IA, SD, ND, NE area for a class?
Pat_Rogers
06-11-06, 12:34
Ryan- a single AK74 magazine will fit in an Eagle double M4 pouch. No way that you can get two in there though.
As for plans to go up north, where it is cold in the winter and lots of flying vectors in the summer - no plans at this time ;)
TigerStripe
06-12-06, 00:57
Will do. I'm patiently waiting for it to get here. You don't happen to know, given the curveture of the 5.45 mags, if they'll work in Eagle M4 mag pouches?
Also, TS, Boom, Marc, and miserai, thank you for your help.
Thanks, but I don't think I added much of value to the conversation. I owned an SAR2 and couldn't get more than one mag in most pouches and not even one in some. Several companies make quality AK pouches and any mag pouch that hold an AK47 mag will hold a 74 mag. I want a 105 myself, but I can't find one and I don't know where to find decent quantities of AK74 mags at decent prices. I gave all my AK74 mags away with the SAR2 and I had about thirty of them. I'm sure you'll enjoy yours. I enjoyed my SAR2 for the little while tht I had it.
TS
I like the Russian poly mags the best. They just look right in my SAR 2.
Pretty much any AK-74 magazine is going to work well as long as your springs are still decent.
The Bakelite magazines came out at a time when the Russians still hadn't mastered polymer technology as we had in the West. The first polymer magazines the Russians came out with were plum, and they were plum because the dye that the first tried to use to make their stock sets and magazines black made the polymer too soft. As soon as they could, they corrected this and went black. I have some Russian plum magazines that were painted black at one time by the Russians at an armory level.
The East Germans were the first Warsaw Pact country to start AK-74 production outside of the Soviet Union, and just kept using the bakelite mags.
The Bulgarians make/have made several color runs: Black, "Saddle Brown", "Firebrick Red", and a "Plum-Red".
The main reason for the different colors, from what I've been told, is that it depended on what dyes they had in stock at the time. The "Saddle Brown" color is actually the least expensive dye that they use that protects the polymer from degredation by ultra violet radiation. Black is current standard, but you'll see all colors used. They also got a bunch of plum magazines from the Russians when they first started '74 production.
Both Circle 10 and Cirlce 21 are Bulgarian, both are military, and there shouldn't be any difference in performance between the two.
The Poles and Romanians used steel for their '74 magazines. They work in any Warsaw Pact country's '74's. Romanian steel '74 magazines are a lot rarer here than the Polish.
All of them work, though I actually kind of like the bakelite magazines because they are more rigid and are a little easier to use in reload drills.
You're going to love your AK-74!
Here's a Russian plum magazine that has seen some serious use but is still 100%. You can see where it was painted black at one time.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v613/Tim_Orrock/MVC-019S.jpg
Bulgarian "Saddle Brown":
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v613/Tim_Orrock/SLR-105A1R7.jpg
Hope that helps.
Thanks for the information Templar. It's good to see you here.
No problem Ryan, Pat had already nailed most of it.
As far as why Russia, Poland and Bulgaria went with black....well, honeslty I don't know either but I honestly do think it might have had something to do with the US and other NATO countries' adoption of black service rifles as well. One of the main reasons the Soviets developed the 5.45x39mm round and the AK-74 to go with it were the early reports from Vietnam about our advisors armed with the M16's. They wanted to keep up with the Joneses too.
Corrosive ammo will clean up with standard cleaning gear. Just clean the gas tube thoroughly, as that's the part that will tend to rust first because of the lack of chrome plating. A 20ga. or 12ga. bore brush works great for that. It wouldn't hurt to go back the next day or two and clean again. Some people advocate the use of Windex because of the ammonia in it, but it's not necessary.
Be advised that the finish on the SLR-105's is kind of shitty. It's genuine Bulgarian military finish, which means that it won't hold up to harsh US solvents well at all. Underneath that bad paint is a phosphate finish though, so if you get motivated enough, have the rifle refinished in GunKote and then there are no worries.
One thing that I've had excellent luck with is Ballistol, from Germany. Developed by the Germans when they were short of petroleum, it's great stuff and will even take care of black powder residue, and is non carcinogenic. It also shouldn't screw with the finish too badly either.
Just smells like 3 week old gym socks.........:eek:
Excellent thread guys!
The only thing I have to add is a link to an outstanding website that Shooter521 put together for AK-74 mags. Check it out here: http://mywebpages.comcast.net/shooter2_indy/ak74_mag_guide.html
shooter521
09-01-06, 09:39
Excellent thread guys!
The only thing I have to add is a link to an outstanding website that Shooter521 put together for AK-74 mags. Check it out here: http://mywebpages.comcast.net/shooter2_indy/ak74_mag_guide.html
Thanks for the props, M4arc. I do what I can. :cool: AK-74 mags are a pretty specialized area. The different types/nationalities are fairly easy to distinguish and it is actually possible to "collect 'em all". I wouldn't even begin to try a project like this with the 7.62 varieties.
I'm always on the lookout for new variations to add to the collection. Just recently acquired a 5rd steel Romanian double-stack, and a firebrick red Circle 25 (which I didn't even know existed). Descriptions have been added to the guide, and I'll be uploading pics shortly.
Glad to be here; looks like a nice place to hang out.
Go with the Bulgarian mags. IIRC I purchased 10 mags from OhioRapidfire for 40 bucks plus shipping.
Ten mags for $40?
Damn that's cheap.
Shooter521 - Great having you here! You put together an awesome page on 5.45 mags.
Excellent thread guys!
The only thing I have to add is a link to an outstanding website that Shooter521 put together for AK-74 mags. Check it out here: http://mywebpages.comcast.net/shooter2_indy/ak74_mag_guide.html
That should be a sticky.
shooter521
09-01-06, 16:10
Ten mags for $40?
Damn that's cheap.
Actually they're even cheaper than that, now. 12 mags for $35.99!
http://rapidfire.targetweb.net/cgi-bin/store/agora.cgi/agora.cgi?cart_id=5959407.32567*jW7eC4&p_id=02093&xm=on&ppinc=big
Excellent thread guys!
The only thing I have to add is a link to an outstanding website that Shooter521 put together for AK-74 mags. Check it out here: http://mywebpages.comcast.net/shooter2_indy/ak74_mag_guide.html
Seriously great guide Shooter 521!
Heavy Metal
09-02-06, 10:46
The ORF mag deal is a good one but be prepared to remove lots of cosmoline.
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