PDA

View Full Version : Cyprus to tax bank deposits. Going to be ugly.



30 cal slut
03-17-13, 20:09
Going to be ugly in Euro-land tomorrow.

Readers digest version: Cyprus broke. Needs money. Will tax its own citizens' bank deposits to raise funds. Ugly. We're more broke than Europe. We're next. Could happen here. lol.




From: DAVID ZERVOS (JEFFERIES LLC) [mailto:*@bloomberg.net]
Sent: Sunday, March 17, 2013 06:45 PM
To: slut

Subject: Die Republik Zypern


What happened to Cyprus on Friday evening was one of the most significant developments in the Eurozone since the Greek election last summer. To tax the bank deposits of savers sends an ominous message to the entire global investment community. All of us should really take a moment to consider what the governments of Europe have done. To be clear, they initiated a surprise assault on the precautionary savings of their own people. Such a move should send shock waves across the entire population of the developed world. This was not a Bernanke style slow moving financial repression against risk free savings that is meant to stir up animal spirits and force risk taking. This is a nuclear war on savings and wealth - something that will likely crush animal spirits. This is a policy move you expect from a dictatorial regime in sub-Saharan Africa, not in an EMU member state. If the European governments can clandestinely expropriate 7 to 10 percent of their hard working citizen's precautionary savings after the close of business on a Friday night, what else are they capable of doing? Why even hold money in a bank account? Are they trying to start a bank run?

Sadly, the politicians that are responsible for this travesty likely don't even understand the unintended consequences of their actions. Instead, they just have a simple myopic goal - to get reelected. And because the SPD has consistently attacked Merkel over bailout payments from German taxpayers to Russian oligarchs, action had to be taken. The German elections are coming up quickly, and Merkel needed to quiet the opposition. She needed to appear tough - not like a leader who would just throw away hard working German taxpayer euros to a bunch of Russian tax dodgers. The plan was simple - haircuts on deposits. The German electorate would applaud her bold actions. She would be teaching the bad guys a lesson. And what could go wrong? Its only little old Cyprus - its too small to matter.

But how would she get the peripheral FinMins to agree? The southern contingent would block the move for sure - unless of course they were bought off. Its was a masterful plan - give the already beaten down peripherals better bailout terms in exchange for a transparent domestic political win on the Cyprus issue. The German electorate will think the weaker bailout terms for Ireland and Portugal are just a reward for following the mindless austerity measures. And in turn, the bulk of the attention will focus on the fact that German tax dollars were kept away from Greeks and Russians.

Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe it didn't really go down like that. But as I see it, there really is no other explanation for taking such extraordinary risks with bank stability. And what are those risks? Well the tax is still not a done deal in Cyprus. The parliament could reject it. We will find out Monday evening (maybe) - and if it is rejected, then Merkel's game of chicken for political gain will backfire. She will lose the bet that Cyprus is not big enough to be systemic. If the Cypriots just stand up and say - "ok kick us out and we'll keep the 10 yards of Target 2 balances and leave" - she will be up against a very painful wall. It will actually be up to the ECB to either cut off the ELA and force a Euro exit for Cyprus, or allow the ELA to pay off ALL depositors during the ensuing bank run. Importantly, the central bank governors are not the same as the FinMins. And it is NOT likely they would all agree to cut the ELA. And, if the Cypriots exit, it would likely cost the member countries even more than the bailout (as the Target2 money would stay in Cyprus). Although the Cypriots may not recognize it, they actually have a very strong bargaining position for a much better deal.

Now while the possible exit trade sounds entertaining and exciting, it is not the likely scenario. In the end the Cypriot parliament most likely bows to the Germans and passes the tax legislation. Then, peripherals widen across the board and the Euro weakens. The question of course is how much. A good guess at the initial reaction on Monday is -1.5/2 percent in EURUSD and +25 to +50 bps in peripheral 10yr spreads. Importantly, there could be a lot of uncertainty Monday if the Cypriot parliament is still in debate as the markets open. Of course risk assets globally will surely be soft.

And if the Cypriot parliament agrees to the tax, we should also see some serious instability develop at peripheral banks. Why keep your money at a Spanish or Italian bank when you can jump to Germany or France. And why even keep money in the Euroarea banking system at all. We should see huge outflows. Maybe I'm wrong and deposits stay sticky, but the risks here are HUGE and SCARY.

Right now, I would argue that the risk of an EMU exit by Cyprus is real. And this is much more of a clear and present danger than anything happening in Italy or Spain. And even without passage of the tax, the potential for a bank run is very real. As a consequence, these events are MUCH MORE important than the Italian election results, or frankly any other issue in Europe.

So how do we play this? As most readers know, my long term baseline for EMU has always been that we would see the Germans eventually crushed on their policies of bail-ins and austerity. This is a clear short term loss for this view that we are headed towards a long term "Lirafication" of EMU. I did NOT expect the Germans to get a PSI on Cypriot bank deposits. For me, it is a shocking outcome!!

That said, I still fully expect that Mario will forcibly stop contagion with the most powerful financial instrument in Europe - the ECB balance sheet. But Mario might hang back a bit if things get messy. He admonished Schauble back in January not to go down the bank deposit haircut path in Cyprus. He warned that Cyprus is systemic. The Germans are taking a serious risk with financial stability for pure political gains. Its a nasty game and Mario will NOT be pleased. He may in turn want to teach the Germans a lesson and let them squirm a while before he brings out the bazooka.

So while we are still on the long-term path to "Lirafication" of the Eurozone, this event strikes me as having great potential to create short term instability no matter what the Cypriot parliament decides. And taxing deposits in a "developed" country is uncharted waters - the reaction by ALL global investors could be very dramatic. For those in the long risk trade, who have enjoyed double digit YTD returns (ie spoo/nky plus blues etc etc), hitting a few bids on the sunday night open seems a very sensible strategy.

I hope I am wrong about the severity of this action. But the prudent thing to do is lighten up/hedge. Then you can watch from the sidelines and buy the dip (which could be pretty large) as it becomes clear that the German attack on reflation eventually falters. To put this policy action in the context of my commentary last Friday morning, what the Eurozone FinMins agreed to Friday evening was a bit of trepanning. My head is already starting to hurt!!

So get a good nights sleep. It will be all eyes on the Cypriot parliament for the next couple days. And my best guess is that things get quite messy this week. Good luck trading.




Please read the rules when posting articles. I don't care if it was emailed or not.

Voodoochild

duece71
03-17-13, 20:14
Bad news, the other shoe is hanging by a lace, ready to drop.

VooDoo6Actual
03-17-13, 20:21
Indeed & watching the train wreck happen while others continue to deny it's existance.

30 cal slut
03-17-13, 20:23
this is not tin-foil.

the author of this e-mail is a respected strategist from a wall street brokerage firm.

it's not fiction.

it's the reason why asian stocks are tanking, and why the djia futures are down 115 points right now.

going to be an interesting day tomorrow.

FlyingHunter
03-17-13, 20:57
and falling and falling...

SYDNEY (MarketWatch) -- U.S. stock futures fell in Asia trading hours on Monday, with Dow Jones Industrial Average futures down 121 points at 14,312.00, Nasdaq 100 futures down 28.50 points at 2,762.00 and S&P 500 futures down 17.30 points at 1,536.30 after weekend news that Cyprus plans to tax bank deposits as part of its bailout program.

The US, in my humble opinion is very fragile as well. Injected with FED printed money to the tune of $85Bn, every month, to support our present situation. When that stops, well, God help us.

Source for $85Bn: http://usawatchdog.com/fed-balance-sheet-firecracker-to-great-big-bomb-karl-denninger/

and : http://financialservices.house.gov/uploadedfiles/030513_mpt_hrg_memo.pdf

direct quote from above article:

On December 12, 2012, the Federal Reserve announced that it would keep buying $40 billion in mortgage backed securities per month and that it would begin buying $45 billion in long term Treasury securities per month.

jaydoc1
03-17-13, 23:31
Anyone read "Patriots" by James Wesley Rawles? This is how the whole thing starts and is, frankly, the leading contender for a realistic TEOTWAWKI scenario. Looking less tin-foily every day now.

Heavy Metal
03-17-13, 23:54
The Russian Mafia is NOT going to like this one bit! GAZPROM will get it back one way or another.

Mauser KAR98K
03-18-13, 00:49
Perfect timing. Announce it on a weekend when the Banks are not open. No one can get or transfer their funds.

If a run of the banks happens because of this in Europe if they spread this...look out. People are going Fruit and Haynes investment; putting money in their socks.

chadbag
03-18-13, 00:51
Perfect timing. Announce it on a weekend when the Banks are not open. No one can get or transfer their funds.

If a run of the banks happens because of this in Europe if they spread this...look out. People are going Fruit and Haynes investment; putting money in their socks.

Should help the price of gold. And other physical commodities.

---

Mauser KAR98K
03-18-13, 01:04
Should help the price of gold. And other physical commodities.

---

Brass, lead, copper...salt peter?

polymorpheous
03-18-13, 08:14
Heard on the radio a run on banks has started in Cyprus.

Belloc
03-18-13, 09:13
I saw this only this morning a few hours ago, and immediately transferred holdings from a European bank into a US account.


Wow.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5BmEGm-mraE

nimdabew
03-18-13, 09:16
Bank run anyone?

Crow Hunter
03-18-13, 09:24
There have been ideas floated around in the US related to 401ks back in Obama's 1st term.

I isn't out of the question here. But I bet if they did it here, even the anti-gun people would be looking for a AR.;)

Belmont31R
03-18-13, 10:14
Been done before, and they held hearings in Congress on doing that here.


When the government needs more money...they will get it one way or another. Create it or take it. Doesn't matter from whom or how.

Airhasz
03-18-13, 10:38
I've had my holdings inside my mattress since BHO defeated the Witch of Washington...:p

brickboy240
03-18-13, 12:34
Coming soon to our shores...count on it.

-brickboy240

TAZ
03-18-13, 12:47
Saw that this AM. First though was a run on banks and a resultant crash if their banking. A nano second after that I began to wonder how long before we strat having to do the same. I'll bet the first things hit here are gonna be 401k's. Nothing like having to report the earnings of your 401k as in income and paying a capital gains tax on it.

Doc Safari
03-18-13, 12:54
When the government needs more money...they will get it one way or another. Create it or take it. Doesn't matter from whom or how.

Right...and that's why they want to get the guns FIRST.

Doc Safari
03-18-13, 12:56
Saw that this AM. First though was a run on banks and a resultant crash if their banking. A nano second after that I began to wonder how long before we strat having to do the same. I'll bet the first things hit here are gonna be 401k's. Nothing like having to report the earnings of your 401k as in income and paying a capital gains tax on it.

I have already warned my broker that if it even gets close to something like that passing I will show up at her doorstep to withdraw all my funds.

TXBob
03-18-13, 13:39
An interesting observation (I won't claim it is unique) is that this really is not a tax, it is a confiscation of property (wealth). The only reason they call it a tax is so it can be made "legal"

For those of us of a certain age and familiar with a certain Sci-Fi series--it is akin to Emperor Palpatine saying "I will MAKE IT legal!"

See also the Obamacare decision: (1) its not a tax so we can rule on it now and (2) We rule that it is a tax.

Grizzly16
03-18-13, 14:57
I like the class/nationalistic spin they are putting on it.

"You see we made it mainly hit really big accounts. Most of those accounts are owned by rich Russian (mobsters...) so it is OK!"

I can't see anything good coming of this.

Belmont31R
03-18-13, 14:58
An interesting observation (I won't claim it is unique) is that this really is not a tax, it is a confiscation of property (wealth). The only reason they call it a tax is so it can be made "legal"

For those of us of a certain age and familiar with a certain Sci-Fi series--it is akin to Emperor Palpatine saying "I will MAKE IT legal!"

See also the Obamacare decision: (1) its not a tax so we can rule on it now and (2) We rule that it is a tax.


It would be legal here. Not much different taking it from your paycheck or bank account. It's just now you actually have to right them a check instead of them just doing a direct debit. Hell you might even be able to pay now with an ACH payment, and if you don't pay they freeze all your accounts.

SMETNA
03-18-13, 15:18
I remember reading a while back that some British lawmakers were considering a measure that would force all paychecks to be sent straight to the government, and then they'd refund you what you were allowed to keep.

Needless to say, people flipped a shit and nothing became of it. But it gives you a glimpse into the mindset of an authoritarian

Belmont31R
03-18-13, 15:26
I remember reading a while back that some British lawmakers were considering a measure that would force all paychecks to be sent straight to the government, and then they'd refund you what you were allowed to keep.

Needless to say, people flipped a shit and nothing became of it. But it gives you a glimpse into the mindset of an authoritarian



Our own Pelosi was just saying last week that the government cut spending by raising taxes because tax cuts was in fact actually spending money. So when the government allows you to keep a portion of your paycheck its because THEY are spending money to do so.

SteveS
03-20-13, 20:05
Guys remember tarp???????? They didn't take the money out of our accounts to bail out the banks. We are paying higher taxes to pay back the federal reserve bankers bail out loan.

Belmont31R
03-20-13, 20:18
They are in deep shit I tell you what. I read today they are now looking to the Russians for help, and with the way Syria is going the Russians may just do it with some big caveats like naval access.


The way this was handled was very poor. Not only did they not approve the tax so they are in the same situation as before in that regard but now they still have to deal with the fallout as if they had approved the tax with runs on banks. They are keeping the banks closed yet have no money.

jpmuscle
03-20-13, 22:56
They are in deep shit I tell you what. I read today they are now looking to the Russians for help, and with the way Syria is going the Russians may just do it with some big caveats like naval access.


The way this was handled was very poor. Not only did they not approve the tax so they are in the same situation as before in that regard but now they still have to deal with the fallout as if they had approved the tax with runs on banks. They are keeping the banks closed yet have no money.

You would think at some point people would learn, Socialism DOESN'T ****ING WORK

Belmont31R
03-20-13, 23:03
You would think at some point people would learn, Socialism DOESN'T ****ING WORK


The banks are the one needing the money. They invested a shit ton in Greek bonds which are worthless, and can't cover their costs.


If everyone went to get their money out of the bank they wouldn't have it, even here. The money people deposit gets lent out, and invested in other things. Whats different here is they are so far in the hole because of the Greek bonds they have no hope of ever making enough money back doing other things that they become insolvent.

Todd.K
03-20-13, 23:14
It would be legal here. Not much different taking it from your paycheck or bank account.
Direct taxes must be apportioned by State, the exception being income by the 16th.

Belmont31R
03-20-13, 23:19
Direct taxes must be apportioned by State, the exception being income by the 16th.



I'm sure John Roberts can fix that. He created the ability to tax someone for being a living human being. He can create another tax for the gov when they need it.

Moose-Knuckle
03-21-13, 03:36
And to think people questioned why Germany has taken measures to repatriate it's bullion from the Federal Reserve.

jpmuscle
03-21-13, 04:13
The banks are the one needing the money. They invested a shit ton in Greek bonds which are worthless, and can't cover their costs.


If everyone went to get their money out of the bank they wouldn't have it, even here. The money people deposit gets lent out, and invested in other things. Whats different here is they are so far in the hole because of the Greek bonds they have no hope of ever making enough money back doing other things that they become insolvent.

That was my point, they invested their money in a wholly socialistic system and they wonder why their investments are now worthless. Brilliant idea all around.


And many people in this country sit back look at Greece and think "yea I wanna get me some of that". Its beyond asinine.

SMETNA
03-21-13, 05:09
Anyone else call shenanigans on Chase bank zeroing out customers accounts, then failing to adequately explain what happened?

Crow Hunter
03-21-13, 08:26
Anyone else call shenanigans on Chase bank zeroing out customers accounts, then failing to adequately explain what happened?

Haven't heard about that one. Linky?

Todd.K
03-21-13, 09:20
I'm sure John Roberts can fix that. He created the ability to tax someone for being a living human being. He can create another tax for the gov when they need it.

A per person tax is legal, though it falls under the same need for apportionment. This means it can't be progressive or the progressive rate would need to be different for each State. That would be fun to watch.

That the SC can call it a tax not a penalty but then claim it is not a tax on my person because there are exemptions for some people is disgusting.

TAZ
03-21-13, 09:24
Haven't heard about that one. Linky?

Google chase hacking and you'll get a lot of hits.

Maybe Cyprus realized that there wasn't any money locally so they got creative in how the interpreted their new powers??? Maybe only people of Greek descent got emptied out??

Hope the people affected by the hacking get their money back somehow. Shows just how much of a double edged sword all this interconnected-ness can be.

Ironman8
03-21-13, 10:02
Anyone else call shenanigans on Chase bank zeroing out customers accounts, then failing to adequately explain what happened?


Google chase hacking and you'll get a lot of hits.

Hope the people affected by the hacking get their money back somehow. Shows just how much of a double edged sword all this interconnected-ness can be.

Not sure how Chase Bank being hacked is grounds for calling shenanigans?

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-201_162-57575023/chase-denies-hacking-in-vanishing-balances/

From the article:

Within two hours, the bank tweeted that the issue was resolved. Customers reported seeing their balances once again.

Caeser25
03-22-13, 07:21
Fwiw their economy is like 80%ish banking and 20%ish tourism.

Caeser25
03-27-13, 06:31
A glimpse into the future tomorrow once our currency crisis hits.

http://classic.cnbc.com/id/100594872

The_War_Wagon
03-27-13, 07:34
http://images2.makefive.com/images/entertainment/culture/top-5-nerds/mr-rodgers-7.jpg

Hi boys & girls - can you say today's phrase? "MINIMUM balance."

Moose-Knuckle
03-27-13, 14:43
A glimpse into the future tomorrow once our currency crisis hits.

http://classic.cnbc.com/id/100594872

Gotta love their "motto" its straight out of a George Orwell novel . . . :suicide:
http://i10.photobucket.com/albums/a144/AKS-74/G4S-security-staff-008_zpsafc6ef45.jpg

Their security transport guys look like Jack Booted Thugs from a destopian sci-fi flick (TXH 1138 and Soylent Green come to mind) that transport dissidents to extermination camps. :help:
http://i10.photobucket.com/albums/a144/AKS-74/g4sguards_10162780_zps41386bb7.jpg




On a similar note, Wikileaks has documents showing the Greece government has hired Academi (formerly known as Blackwater USA) to "assist" national police against rumored civil unrest and a possible coup as the financial crisis worsens.

jpmuscle
03-27-13, 14:47
On a similar note, Wikileaks has documents showing the Greece government has hired Academi (formerly known as Blackwater USA) to "assist" national police against rumored civil unrest and a possible coup as the financial crisis worsens.

I'm surprised their aren't mass riots already considering.

Caeser25
03-27-13, 20:34
Gotta love their "motto" its straight out of a George Orwell novel . . . :suicide:
http://i10.photobucket.com/albums/a144/AKS-74/G4S-security-staff-008_zpsafc6ef45.jpg

Their security transport guys look like Jack Booted Thugs from a destopian sci-fi flick (TXH 1138 and Soylent Green come to mind) that transport dissidents to extermination camps. :help:
http://i10.photobucket.com/albums/a144/AKS-74/g4sguards_10162780_zps41386bb7.jpg




On a similar note, Wikileaks has documents showing the Greece government has hired Academi (formerly known as Blackwater USA) to "assist" national police against rumored civil unrest and a possible coup as the financial crisis worsens.

I noticed that too. Here to serve who?

The_War_Wagon
03-27-13, 21:10
Their security transport guys look like Jack Booted Thugs from a destopian sci-fi flick (TXH 1138 and Soylent Green come to mind) that transport dissidents to extermination camps. :help:
http://i10.photobucket.com/albums/a144/AKS-74/g4sguards_10162780_zps41386bb7.jpg

Hey - Devo's making comeback! Crack that whip!

Mauser KAR98K
03-27-13, 21:14
Boogidy, boogidy, boogidy, boogidy, let's go racing folks...to the bank.