View Full Version : Filibuster on Gun Bill Fails
Doc Safari
04-11-13, 11:41
Well, time for the free-for-all on amendments.
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2013/04/11/gun-bill-clears-senate-hurdle-as-filibuster-falls-short/
Controversial gun legislation cleared a key Senate hurdle Thursday, as lawmakers voted 68-31 to start debate on the package which includes expanded background checks and new penalties for gun trafficking.
The amendment likely to be at the front of the line is one from Sens. Joe Manchin, D-W.Va., and Pat Toomey, R-Pa., which would scale back the call for universal background checks. The plan would expand checks to gun-show and Internet sales, but exempt certain personal transactions.
[Harry Reid] assured Democrats that a proposal to renew the assault weapons ban and a ban on high-capacity magazines would get a vote as an amendment, though it was dropped from the main bill amid intense opposition.
Soon, in order to have the right of Free Speech, you will need to pass a background check.
Soon, in order to have the right of Free Speech, you will need to pass a background check.
The sad part is that this is truly the direction we're headed in. If you've ever made a mistake in your life and been convicted of even a misdemeanor offense then the constitution basically doesn't apply to you these days.
My 'Republican' Senator Roger Wicker can kiss my (insert expletives). :mad:
-Jax
Anywhere you can go to see how people voted? I'd like to see what my senators voted.
My 'Republican' Senator Roger Wicker can kiss my (insert expletives). :mad:
-Jax
Mine too. I'm so pissed it's really not funny. I can understand how a certain someone felt when he made that controversial video.
My 'Republican' Senator Roger Wicker can kiss my (insert expletives). :mad:
-Jax
Wicker never responded to any letters or e-mails from me on the subject... big surprise, he know's he's got the job till he's tired of it.
People love their republican senators, but they are nothing but a bunch of sad ass ****ing politicians politicians.
so when will Texas secede from the union? should I start packing? lol
DreadPirateMoyer
04-11-13, 12:26
There's a list of the turncoats on TOS.
Both R senators from Arizona voted to proceed. I guess that means Arizona is now an anti-gun state according to the logic of some here. :rolleyes:
Is there a link to see who voted.. I'm guessing Rubio voted no, and I'm pretty sure Nelson voted yes..
Mauser KAR98K
04-11-13, 12:31
If the amendment puts BS in it, it will not go pass the senate and will die on the floor. Any bans are taking away of rights without due process will become radioactive to them.
Stay Frosty, Stay active with your Reps.
Wicker never responded to any letters or e-mails from me on the subject... big surprise, he know's he's got the job till he's tired of it.
People love their republican senators, but they are nothing but a bunch of sad ass ****ing politicians politicians.
currahee,
I got a response from him but it was very vague and diluted. If you know who Chris McDaniel is that man NEEDS to be our next state Senator. Used to workout with him at the local gym and every hometown gunshow he is there. A very very Constitutionally back boned politician.
-Jax
Doc Safari
04-11-13, 12:33
There's a list of the turncoats on TOS.
Both R senators from Arizona voted to proceed. I guess that means Arizona is now an anti-gun state according to the logic of some here. :rolleyes:
Someone someday needs to explain to me how John McCain isn't at least as bad a traitor as Jane Fonda.
:suicide:Dangit! Double post again!
Phillygunguy
04-11-13, 12:41
My 'Republican' Senator Roger Wicker can kiss my (insert expletives). :mad:
-Jax
My Republican Senator is Pat Toomey, how, lucky am I?
Phillygunguy
04-11-13, 12:44
so when will Texas secede from the union? should I start packing? lol
I'm all for secession I think that's all we may have left.
My Republican Senator is Pat Toomey, how, lucky am I?
About as lucky as being in the middle of what's going on in your avatar. :(
-Jax
Here is the list for all to see
YEAs —68
Alexander (R-TN)
Ayotte (R-NH)
Baldwin (D-WI)
Baucus (D-MT)
Bennet (D-CO)
Blumenthal (D-CT)
Boxer (D-CA)
Brown (D-OH)
Burr (R-NC)
Cantwell (D-WA)
Cardin (D-MD)
Carper (D-DE)
Casey (D-PA)
Chambliss (R-GA)
Coburn (R-OK)
Collins (R-ME)
Coons (D-DE)
Corker (R-TN)
Cowan (D-MA)
Donnelly (D-IN)
Durbin (D-IL)
Feinstein (D-CA)
Flake (R-AZ)
Franken (D-MN)
Gillibrand (D-NY)
Graham (R-SC)
Hagan (D-NC)
Harkin (D-IA)
Heinrich (D-NM)
Heitkamp (D-ND)
Heller (R-NV)
Hirono (D-HI)
Hoeven (R-ND)
Isakson (R-GA)
Johnson (D-SD)
Kaine (D-VA)
King (I-ME)
Kirk (R-IL)
Klobuchar (D-MN)
Landrieu (D-LA)
Leahy (D-VT)
Levin (D-MI)
Manchin (D-WV)
McCain (R-AZ)
McCaskill (D-MO)
Menendez (D-NJ)
Merkley (D-OR)
Mikulski (D-MD)
Murphy (D-CT)
Murray (D-WA)
Nelson (D-FL)
Reed (D-RI)
Reid (D-NV)
Rockefeller (D-WV)
Sanders (I-VT)
Schatz (D-HI)
Schumer (D-NY)
Shaheen (D-NH)
Stabenow (D-MI)
Tester (D-MT)
Toomey (R-PA)
Udall (D-CO)
Udall (D-NM)
Warner (D-VA)
Warren (D-MA)
Whitehouse (D-RI)
Wicker (R-MS)
Wyden (D-OR)
NAYs —31
Barrasso (R-WY)
Begich (D-AK)
Blunt (R-MO)
Boozman (R-AR)
Coats (R-IN)
Cochran (R-MS)
Cornyn (R-TX)
Crapo (R-ID)
Cruz (R-TX)
Enzi (R-WY)
Fischer (R-NE) Grassley (R-IA)
Hatch (R-UT)
Inhofe (R-OK)
Johanns (R-NE)
Johnson (R-WI)
Lee (R-UT)
McConnell (R-KY)
Moran (R-KS)
Murkowski (R-AK)
Paul (R-KY)
Portman (R-OH)
Pryor (D-AR)
Risch (R-ID)
Roberts (R-KS)
Rubio (R-FL)
Scott (R-SC)
Sessions (R-AL)
Shelby (R-AL)
Thune (R-SD)
Vitter (R-LA)
Not Voting – 1
Lautenberg (D-NJ)
Wicker is a complete douche. He sell his penis if it advanced his career. Seems we have a list of these traitorous scum. Good it read as a who not to let back in office. Ever.
A Democrat from New Jersey didn't bother voting for it???
Harkin is on his last leg in IA, nobody wants him except for urban (if you can even call them urban) areas. After my last email transaction with him, I made sure to tell him that I'd do everything in my power to unseat him.
Grassley is a good guy and strongly supports the 2nd.
Email and write boys, it's gonna be a long one.
Harkin is on his last leg in IA, nobody wants him except for urban (if you can even call them urban) areas. After my last email transaction with him, I made sure to tell him that I'd do everything in my power to unseat him.
Grassley is a good guy and strongly supports the 2nd.
Email and write boys, it's gonna be a long one.
Oh I am gonna write. Thank Thad Cochran and sent the letter I got from Wicker back to him that states he won't do anything to infringe on the second amendment..... and remind him of a few things.
-Jax
I have met Thad Chochran, a few years back. Seemed to be ok. Wicker was a bit a fake d-bag. I could be wrong but I think his voting just confirmed it.
Too many "R's" in the Yea column and too few "D's" in the Nay column, but I state the obvious. Talk about the Usual Suspects.... Thankfully the two Senators that represent Texas knew the correct answer.
Well glad to see Coats (R-IN) stood by his word. I would like to at least send a thank you email to his office and let him know that I still support him.
My 2 Senators are hopeless. 1 of them is the writer of a proposed bill. Schumer.
Business_Casual
04-11-13, 15:01
Has it occurred to any of you that Mitch McConnell might know what he is doing?
Is it possible that he is letting the Democrat Senators have their vote on a bill that won't pass but can be a no-win situation for them in the next election, an election that is able to tilt in Republican's favor by one or two seats...
-bc
Both TN Senators voted with the Dems...Drafting my email to them now.
This vote is more about strategy than anything else.
The Republicans prevent the Dems from hammering them for obstructing debate and a vote on a very popular (yes, most everyone in the US wants to keep guns out of the hands of criminals and the mentally imbalanced) issue. They also force Dems up for re-election in 2014 to stake a position on an issue that could hurt them no matter which way they vote.
The Dems get to say they kept their promise to bring this issue to a vote, then can claim specific parts of the amendments prevented them from supporting the full package as they ultimately vote against it. This gives them cover with constituencies that are pulling them in two directions on gun control.
My Republican Senator (Ron Johnson) did vote to prevent debate, score one for him. But ultimately the specter of a disastrous 2014 election cycle will deter widespread Democratic support and therefore all these amendments will fail.
IMHO, of course...
Both Utah Senators voted Nay. Hatch has become a lot more mindful of these things since his last electoral experience and seeing what happened to Bennett.
I'm a little surprised at Ayotte from NH. She should know better. Off to draft a letter to her as a former (and maybe future?) NH resident.
---
GeorgiaBoy
04-11-13, 15:15
It looks better for the Republican party, that's why it was done.
A filibuster isn't exactly a "good" tactic to use. It continues to make the Republican party look like the obstructionist party and it doesn't allow the democratic voting process to take place.
Let the bill hit the floors and let congress vote on it accordingly. Just filibustering something away is not how business should be done.
I love how they say Internet Sales like you just slap down the plastic and Grant ships right to your door a new full auto M16. The reality of it is the internet sales are nothing more then Local Classified Ad's, just like in the newspaper.
It looks better for the Republican party, that's why it was done.
A filibuster isn't exactly a "good" tactic to use. It continues to make the Republican party look like the obstructionist party and it doesn't allow the democratic voting process to take place.
Let the bill hit the floors and let congress vote on it accordingly. Just filibustering something away is not how business should be done.
Sure it is. It is one of the tools in the Arsenal.
I'd rather stop a bill before it gets to the floor, and before it can be made much worse through amendments, and as it looks like, before the details have been released anyway.
The media is on the wrong side anyway so there really is no "win" for not filibustering. The media will hammer the GOP anyway.
--
A Democrat from New Jersey didn't bother voting for it???
He already voted back in 86.
Doc Safari
04-11-13, 15:34
The theory that the Republicans are pulling some grand strategy is fine if they weren't the Wishy-Washy Party.
The Republicans do more caving than a spelunker.
It looks better for the Republican party, that's why it was done.
A filibuster isn't exactly a "good" tactic to use. It continues to make the Republican party look like the obstructionist party and it doesn't allow the democratic voting process to take place.
Let the bill hit the floors and let congress vote on it accordingly. Just filibustering something away is not how business should be done.
OK, first....sit down.
Now that you are sitting I completely agree with you. A filibuster just saves the issue for another day and people run out and buy ammo at $1 a round "just in case" and make sure guns and parts are held at 300% markups.
We need to stop flying people around on AFO, we need to stop giving Obama the chance to say "We can do more..." on the news every night and giving all the other anti gun dipshits of the world a forum and spotlight to bang their drums on.
We need to have them put in a bill and send it to make the rounds. And we need to have everyone kick the shit out of the bill and retire all of those who supported it. That is the ONLY thing that is going to end this perpetual stupidity. Nobody is simply going to forget about this issue.
platoonDaddy
04-11-13, 15:38
Yesterday Coburn declared that the Manchin-Toomey deal was unworkable and will impose new taxes and unreasonable burdens on law-abiding citizens
Well, what did he do today, yep voted with reid.
PA PATRIOT
04-11-13, 15:41
This vote is more about strategy than anything else.
The Republicans prevent the Dems from hammering them for obstructing debate and a vote on a very popular (yes, most everyone in the US wants to keep guns out of the hands of criminals and the mentally imbalanced) issue. They also force Dems up for re-election in 2014 to stake a position on an issue that could hurt them no matter which way they vote.
My thoughts exactly.
GeorgiaBoy
04-11-13, 15:41
Now that you are sitting I completely agree with you.
Someone get Steyr his meds.
It looks better for the Republican party, that's why it was done.
A filibuster isn't exactly a "good" tactic to use. It continues to make the Republican party look like the obstructionist party and it doesn't allow the democratic voting process to take place.
Let the bill hit the floors and let congress vote on it accordingly. Just filibustering something away is not how business should be done.
I hope you are right.
Graham does not think it will pass the House. Says he isn't afraid of a vote. If he is right, it could be the best thing that could happen. Kill it and be done with it.
From his facebook page: http://www.facebook.com/USSenatorLindseyGraham
I welcome a debate on the Second Amendment in the United States Senate. I want to proceed to this bill. I want to debate it. I am not afraid.
Some have asked why I opposed filibustering a procedural motion to move forward. Here’s my reasoning.
• Many Senators have refused to even take a position on some of these issues for fear of angering one side or the other. There’s only one way to see where Senators actually stand – make them vote.
• Filibustering right now means Senators get a free pass. Some politicians’ dream scenario is one where they don’t actually have to vote For or Against a proposal but can tell each side they were with them all along. Again, let’s make Senators vote.
• Nothing the Democrats are proposing would have prevented the Sandy Hook massacre. We need Senators on record. Do you support these proposals?
• The legislation can still be filibustered after today in the United States Senate. And even if gun control legislation passes the Democratic-controlled U.S. Senate it is unlikely to pass the Republican-controlled House of Representatives.
• Finally, I have my own legislation, supported by the NRA, which I want to bring forward in the Senate. My legislation would make a real difference in keeping guns out of the wrong hands.
It’s designed to prevent individuals like Alice Boland, a mentally disturbed individual who once pled ‘Not Guilty By Reason of Insanity’ in federal court for threatening to kill the President of the United States from legally buying a firearm. Under current law, she was able to pass a background check, buy a pistol, and go to Ashley Hall School in Charleston where she tried to shoot several school officials. One bullet in her hands is one too many.
Again, I welcome a debate on gun control and you should too. The American people deserve to see where their elected representatives stand on the Second Amendment.
Let’s vote.
Link to Grahams' legislation: http://www.lgraham.senate.gov/public/index.cfm?FuseAction=Legislation.SponsoredBills
Doc Safari
04-11-13, 15:54
You guys that think this should be voted on got a little too much sun hiding your Easter eggs. :D
I do not trust this bunch in office not to do some kind of trickery to pass this in the middle of the night, "deem" it to have passed, or claim that it passed during the conference or some horseshit.
We could have killed it before it left the launch gate. Now we have to fight like 300 Spartans to kill it.
You guys that think this should be voted on got a little too much sun hiding your Easter eggs. :D
I do not trust this bunch in office not to do some kind of trickery to pass this in the middle of the night, "deem" it to have passed, or claim that it passed during the conference or some horseshit.
We could have killed it before it left the launch gate. Now we have to fight like 300 Spartans to kill it.
+10000
Graham is an idiot
--
You guys that think this should be voted on got a little too much sun hiding your Easter eggs. :D
I do not trust this bunch in office not to do some kind of trickery to pass this in the middle of the night, "deem" it to have passed, or claim that it passed during the conference or some horseshit.
We could have killed it before it left the launch gate. Now we have to fight like 300 Spartans to kill it.
Sooner or later this day is going to come. There is no way they are going to just let it go away and die.
Someone get Steyr his meds.
**** it, I know where the bell tower is locally.
:D
+10000
Graham is an idiot
--
He is not 100% trustworthy I freely admit...... but an idiot he is not. You don't get to be in the position he is in by playing a stupid game in politics.
Don't forget this is politics. Republicans may very well be trying to save face by sending it to be voted on and hopefully down.
For all we serfs know, the votes are already bought and paid for and the tally not yet announced.
Doc Safari
04-11-13, 16:11
Everybody just gobble a handful of Prozac's and start loading your magazines.
Doc Safari
04-11-13, 16:14
For all we serfs know, the votes are already bought and paid for and the tally not yet announced.
Wow. Someone who "gets" it.
I have heard from many many sources over the years that they never schedule a vote unless they are pretty sure about the outcome, at least on the main bill.
**** Sherrod Brown. I really thought Josh Mendel had a shot in last years election.
Cagemonkey
04-11-13, 16:25
This is another example of how the CONSTITUTION is being nullified. All LEGISLATION is suppose to originate from the HOUSE. Not the SENATE, who then strong arms the HOUSE to accept it and move things back to the SENATE. This is UNCONSTITUTIONAL or a very gray area at the minimum.
Sessions and Shelby :dance3:.
Alabama is full of inbred hicks, stay away from here.
Alaskapopo
04-11-13, 18:00
This is another example of how the CONSTITUTION is being nullified. All LEGISLATION is suppose to originate from the HOUSE. Not the SENATE, who then strong arms the HOUSE to accept it and move things back to the SENATE. This is UNCONSTITUTIONAL or a very gray area at the minimum.
Um no that is not true. The Senate can propose bills as can the house.
Pat
Cagemonkey
04-11-13, 18:38
Um no that is not true. The Senate can propose bills as can the house.
Pat
All bills for raising revenue have to originate in the House of Reps. After that it mentions both houses in regards to legislation. So it looks like your right. My bad.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eDFy7EwBggg related video listing the 16 Rs that went off the D end on this one.
GeorgiaBoy
04-11-13, 18:58
All bills for raising revenue have to originate in the House of Reps. After that it mentions both houses in regards to legislation. So it looks like your right. My bad.
You are partially correct. Some are saying that because the bill being proposed has there being a fee collected for transfers, it's technically a revenue bill; thus unconstitutional.
Then you start getting into the whole "fee vs tax" debate.
Belmont31R
04-11-13, 19:05
Once again the RINO's vote with the Democrats.
It's sad you guys whine about how things will look to the public. That's only because the GOP public relations are so pitiful they allow the Democrats to steamroll over them on EVERY issue. I hear more from Obama alone than almost all of the GOP combined on every major issue.
Doc Safari
04-11-13, 23:17
Not that I believe anything Alex Jones says, but his show is entertaining and he occasionally has good guests.
Anyway, Larry Pratt from GOA was on today. He thinks Harry Reid is pulling a maneuver so the Senate will have to vote on all the Democrats' proposals before he even lets any of the Republican proposals come up, or something to that effect. The idea I get is that Larry Pratt thinks Reid is going to try to get all the bans and whatnot through just like Obamacare: with tricks and shenanigans.
Anyone else consider the option of a pro-2A Congress critter adding a provision to do away with the Hughes Amendment? Forgive my lack of civics knowledge, is this even possible?
I think you would get additional backlash going after Hughes now. IMHO we need a nationwide push with legislation, state by state, to improve all 50's mental health systems, detection and response. Massive effort obviously, NRA-ILA, GOP, I have no idea who is actually capable of accomplishing this. Get on the offensive, get the focus on the real problem, and best of all, get results. We should try and get these psychopaths off the streets.
The obvious lack of results from any currently proposed "gun control" legislation is a painful reminder that the Democratic leadership doesn't actually give a **** about the families. They had a prior agenda and are simply use the tragedies to further them. But I for one would like real solutions to identify these pieces of shit before they hurt others. It is still so sad seeing the kids at Newtown. :(
Yes it is sad.
But the Hughes amendment needs to be addressed. Might have to pick our battles on that one, but if still needs to come into purview at some point.
Anyone else consider the option of a pro-2A Congress critter adding a provision to do away with the Hughes Amendment? Forgive my lack of civics knowledge, is this even possible?
We'd be better off going after the sporter clause. We don't need to point out that the Hughes Amendment depends upon the sporter clause for it's justification and validity.
Belmont31R
04-12-13, 08:13
The GOP doesn't have the spine to add in an amendment like that. They didn't do jack shit for us when they had the House, Senate, and White House. In fact, they were going to renew the the 94 AWB, and you guys think they will add in something like that....:lol:
I'm shocked that Warner and Kaine (Pelosi's lap dog) voted to open it for debate...no I'm not :(
Gun Owners of America has compiled a short list of some of the problems. GOA - Ten Really Important Problems with the Toomey-Schumer Sell-out (http://gunowners.org/congress04112013.htm)
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.5 Copyright © 2024 vBulletin Solutions, Inc. All rights reserved.