The Long Shadow Of Katrina: Military Snipers Engaging U.S. Citizens? [Archive]

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djegators

04-15-13, 08:04

I had heard rumblings about Special Operations snipers being deployed to
New Orleans to support the effort to restore order. He confirmed the
rumors and shared his own intimate knowledge that close contacts of his,
many active duty Spec Ops snipers (some Navy SEALs), took leave to work
for the controversial PMC (Private Military Company), Blackwater.

Chris went on to tell me that the bulk of the guys he knew directly had
racked up over thirty kills between them. I asked him about Rules of
Engagement, and asked, "Who were they shooting at," and he just gave me a
big Texas shrug and smile. I figured out really quick that it was 180
grains of due process (usually to the head at 200M).

http://sofrep.com/19314/american-snipers-engage-us-citizens-in-new-orleans-circa-2005/?fb_source=pubv1

Voodoochild

04-15-13, 08:11

Skeptical..

fixit69

04-15-13, 08:13

Maybe.

Wouldn't put it past some.

sinlessorrow

04-15-13, 08:14

Skeptical..

Same, sounds like a lot of BS.

Littlelebowski

04-15-13, 08:14

Good ol' gossip mongering.

C-grunt

04-15-13, 08:50

It's really convienent that the guy confirming these stories was killed recently. Why wouldn't the author have written this in 2012?

austinN4

04-15-13, 09:01

It's really convienent that the guy confirming these stories was killed recently. Why wouldn't the author have written this in 2012?
My thought as well.

Larry Vickers

04-15-13, 10:39

The author is a known liar and has been outed in the SEAL community as such - complete fabrication

Voodoochild

04-15-13, 10:42

The author is a known liar and has been outed in the SEAL community as such - complete fabrication

Larry much obliged for posting your knowledge. As I said to another member it is a shame that he dragged Chris Kyle's name through the mud.

Littlelebowski

04-15-13, 10:43

The author is a known liar and has been outed in the SEAL community as such - complete fabrication

Yup...

fixit69

04-15-13, 10:48

Thank you for the clarification, Mr. Vickers.

Safetyhit

04-15-13, 10:51

The author is a known liar and has been outed in the SEAL community as such - complete fabrication

You mean worse than Bronson? Can't stand that bastard.

djegators

04-15-13, 11:09

The author is a known liar and has been outed in the SEAL community as such - complete fabrication

Thank you for that. I was not trying to start shit here with the post, thought it might be an interesting topic.

Larry Vickers

04-15-13, 15:08

Honu

04-15-13, 15:45

seems to be a rumor 8 years to late !
never let a good crisis go to waste ! problem is you should act quicker than 8 years later :)

I call BS I think folks showing up with rifle wounds to the head would have made the news by the anti gun folks quickly !

GeorgiaBoy

04-15-13, 16:01

What is his motivation behind lying?

gun71530

04-15-13, 18:08

What is his motivation behind lying?

I would venture to guess, some idiot looking for attention.

Sent from my DROID X2 using Tapatalk 2

kmrtnsn

04-15-13, 18:13

I would venture to guess, some idiot looking for attention.

Sent from my DROID X2 using Tapatalk 2

A lot of that shit going on.

ICANHITHIMMAN

04-15-13, 19:09

SICK what some people will do!

Mjolnir

04-15-13, 19:25

Cannot speak about Kyle and what he did or did not do as I did not know him but I have close friends who were in New Orleans providing maintenance for an important site and each to a man witnessed/observed contractors bragging of "engaging targets" when they returned (via helicopter from wherever they went on whatever missions they did).

They never asked who they were shooting at or their ROE - as I would have.

These guys wore no insignia that identified them as US solders so we must assume they were contractors from the US.

I've no reason to doubt what several persons have told me. My only GUESS would be if a person or persons were observes to be in possession of a weapon the operators had a green light - which some guys were laughing and joking about what they had just done.

Not really unreasonable considering the extenuating circumstances.

Lesson(s)

Stay on your own property and do not brandish weapons lest others identify you as a "bad guy".

krisjon

04-15-13, 21:18

Interesting insights from LAV.

Brandon has definitely been pretty prolific lately - turning much of his experience into business opportunities and profit.

Not that things like this couldn't (or didn't) happen, but when a news site is part of your business, creating "news" sometimes comes with the territory.

Iraqgunz

04-15-13, 23:45

I'm not calling You a liar, but I know quite a few guys who worked Katrina and not one of them ever spread such tripe. I was offered a position as well but I was already OCONUS. This story sounds alot like people talking shit in an attempt to "impress" someone. The story as relayed by Brandon Webb even quotes Jeremy Scahill who has the credibility of a rotten dog turd.

Cannot speak about Kyle and what he did or did not do as I did not know him but I have close friends who were in New Orleans providing maintenance for an important site and each to a man witnessed/observed contractors bragging of "engaging targets" when they returned (via helicopter from wherever they went on whatever missions they did).

They never asked who they were shooting at or their ROE - as I would have.

These guys wore no insignia that identified them as US solders so we must assume they were contractors from the US.

I've no reason to doubt what several persons have told me. My only GUESS would be if a person or persons were observes to be in possession of a weapon the operators had a green light - which some guys were laughing and joking about what they had just done.

Not really unreasonable considering the extenuating circumstances.

Lesson(s)

Stay on your own property and do not brandish weapons lest others identify you as a "bad guy".

S-1

04-16-13, 00:20

He claimed to have known 'Mark Owen' also - the author of 'No Easy Day' ; I know him and consider him a friend ; his statements were lies and if their paths ever cross Brandon Web will have to answer for them

Branden Webb and his fellow contributors over at sofrep did like to hold the fire to 'Mark Owen' and No Easy Day. They also like to talk trash about Owens' former unit and how they are trying to cash in with books, games and TV appearances. Yet, Brandon Webb wrote a book, started a for profit gossip blog and is all over the news networks claiming to be an expert on all things SOF related. Hmmm...

Also, you're not the first SOF type to call BS on his antics. I remember reading a post on another forum from an ad SEAL who said that "Webb is full of shit and talks big for only doing one deployment to the sandbox."

This exchange over at sofrep between Webb, Jack Murphy (don't know who that is) and a DG operator was entertaining. LOL

http://sofrep.com/11055/jack-murphy-lands-on-seal-team-sixs-target-deck/

ClearedHot

04-16-13, 00:41

Brandon Webb had this to say about LAV after catching wind of this thread here on M4C.

I don't know Larry and didn't have an opinion of him until now, apparently he's friends with Matt Bissonette and probably done business with him in the past/present. I do know he's misinformed and that it will be him and I that have words if/when our paths ever cross...

Magic_Salad0892

04-16-13, 00:57

Brandon Webb had this to say about LAV after catching wind of this thread here on M4C.

Oh yes. Because talking shit to a former SFOD guy is totally the best idea anybody has ever ever had.

Especially one who's idea of a good time involves beating up a perfectly good rifle, and blowing up a perfectly good car. :D

(Also, I think it's hilarious that a SEAL's way of calling somebody a pussy is saying that they only deployed one time.)

krisjon

04-16-13, 01:09

I've had the pleasure of training with LAV and I've crossed paths here in San Diego with Brandon.

Both are straight shooters and stand up guys from my experience. I'm sure this stuff will get sorted out one way or the other.

As I said in my previous post, Brandon has been very prolific lately. Depending on the circles you're talking to, this either adds to or takes away his credibility/believability. It's something more than one JSOC warrior has faced when choosing to become a less silent professional.

Nightvisionary

04-16-13, 05:19

Here is an interesting article on Hurrican Katrina shootings that allegedly occured involving Blackwater and other security companies. Consider the source (Mother Jones)when reading.

"When asked what authority they were operating under,'' Scahill reported, "one guy said, 'We're on contract with the Department of Homeland Security.' Then, pointing to one of his comrades, he said, 'He was even deputized by the governor of the state of Louisiana. We can make arrests and use lethal force if we deem it necessary.' The man then held up the gold Louisiana law enforcement badge he wore around his neck.''

http://www.motherjones.com/environment/2009/08/secret-history-hurricane-katrina

Mjolnir

04-16-13, 05:58

Here is an interesting article on Hurrican Katrina shootings that allegedly occured involving Blackwater and other security companies. Consider the source (Mother Jones)when reading.

http://www.motherjones.com/environment/2009/08/secret-history-hurricane-katrina

And that's how my contacts: family (several LEO) close friends and former co-workers defined it.

Nothing "tin foil" about it if you lived there.

There were no rapes in the Super Dome. The police chief admitted it on TV a few weeks afterwards, acknowledging that he took rumor to be truth. Of course, the psy-op damage was done by then.

Acadiana Ambulance explained on TV the "people shooting at rescue helicopters" as persons firing weapons to get their attention as the flew overhead. One guy was being lowered down onto a rooftop and declined to be lowered on the roof because "these people are heavily armed."

But by the time this was explained the steeple had swallowed it whole without so much as a thought. I mean, who in Hades would shoot the (unarmed) person coming to your aid.

Xe was there and it is suspected - not proven - that it was them who were shooting at persons on the ground that invalided to earlier. But they were not the only contractors there. I could easily ask the non-involved personnel on the ground but to what end? No one knows and no one cares.

Suffice it to say a lot of dark things happened and its "hush hush" and on a "need to know" or "friend of a friend" basis.

The incident on the bridge (there were more than one) and several at the Convention Center haven't been reported - unless persons unrelated who were working down there and people I know who were at these locations have come up with common lies.

I don't need to tell this forum but BE PREPARED. Make sure your lives ones are PREPARED. Be prepared to evacuate when/if necessary and have some provisions for a few weeks until calm can be restored.

Many in NOLA - like in NYC, DC and Chicago - exclusively use public transportation and many are poor. They were essentially stuck. Many with cars waited too late (my first cousin) and either were stranded on I-10 or turned back. Fortunately, my cousin was able to drive out early that next morning after noticing the water rising.

I worked down there for 2 years and spoke with as many people as I could. Trust me... You've NOT heard a lot of what took place in the media.

I'd also heard that some facet of US elite units were on the ground but there's no way (for me) to prove that.

I did see military police working traffic in New Orleans East and I was briefly detained by Blackwater for trying to see ruins near Lake Ponchartrain.

Many "dream of" disasters such that they can rise to the occasion. Maybe that's normal - or not unknown. After seeing that... no thanks.

Larry Vickers

04-16-13, 06:30

Brandon emailed me last night - we exchanged a few emails until I remembered my self imposed rule about Internet drama and bowed out - if our paths ever cross I'd be all ears to hear about this or anything else to help clarify the situation

Until then I'm out and remain skeptical to say the least.....

You guys are on your own .....

Voodoochild

04-16-13, 08:11

Closed per OP request.

Detmongo

04-16-13, 16:07