Brand New Here, Bolt Carrier Group Question

[97Widerider]

Hello, New to the forum and have a question about my Rock River Arms LAR15 BCG replacement. My agency is sending me to a Carbine Instructor's Course hosted by the FBI in September. I currently carry my personal CAR A4 (purchased in 2005) that isn't even broken in yet. I had to give up my agency Colt 6920 when I took on a new assignment recently so just now started carrying my personal RRA. Another officer went through the same course and shot about 1000 rounds over 3 days. I know this is not a high round count for a carbine class but it is probably going to be a trial by fire for my AR.

Just because it is an Instructor's Course does not indicate that I know anything technical about AR15s albeit I have read quite a bit on the more popular boards so here it goes: Will a full Mil Spec BCG drop right into a non Mil Spec upper that fit an otherwise non Mil Spec BCG (i.e. my RRA BCG)? I was wanting to pick up a spare BCG anyway and this appears as to be a good as time as any, minus the price couging that seems to be going on. Hopefully prices will drop by September. I hope to build a spare AR15 to give to my son but must do it one piece at time and the BCG is a good start.

Despite it's waning popularity, as with any flavor of the month brand, I really like my RRA and plan to pass it to my son one day and have no issue with upgrading the BCG to a Mil Spec since the BCG is the heart of the weapon. I am not hung up on the Mil vs Non Mil Spec but know the Mil Spec is a beefier BCG. Improper staking, 4140 metal and the rest are of no concern to me.

Just another comment I would like to add. I work for a federal agency that has a full time armorer and firearms instructor, always has. We can personally purchase and carry any of the major manufacturers of AR15 but our field offices are currently issued Rock River (10" or 10 1/2"?)) and Daniel Defense (10") rifles. I understand we get them for close to the same price. Our agency has been very pleased with both manufacturers. Even with our current sequestration, there are some areas we will find money for and that is our weapon testing and selections. I will admit that most these rifles do not see rigorous range time. Most rifles are taken to the range and shot twice a year to qual (around 200 rounds) then put back into our trunk vaults. However, there are a handful that have seen some intense range time and are stellar performers (both brands). Sorry to stray from original topic but just wanted to state my peace in case any RRA hate surfaces.

97Widerider

[pingdork]

Orange search button.

Actually I asked a similar question months ago. I was looking to build cheapest lightweight range toy I could. Had the idea that a mil spec bcg would greatly improve its function.

From what I gather, things like proper gas port size also play important role in function.

[Airhasz]

Will a full Mil Spec BCG drop right into a non Mil Spec upper that fit an otherwise non Mil Spec BCG (i.e. my RRA BCG)?

BCGs are interchangeable between ar15 upper receivers with BCM and Colt being the top of the line...myself, I would just run the RRA BCG until it fails while keeping a top quality bolt on hand as a replacement...:happy:

[T-TAC]

http://www.bravocompanyusa.com/BCM-SOPMOD-Bolt-Upgrade-Rebuild-Kit-p/bcm%20bolt%20upgrade%20kit.htm

You can use this kit for a fast "UPGRADE". You wron't need the O ring and the gas rings you probably wron't need yet, but should keep for when yours wear out.

If you want a complete BCG;
http://www.rubbercityarmory.com/

I picked up two of these this week and they are very well made. Have a 30 day just don't like it warrentee. And a lifetime warrentee on breakage.

[NeoNeanderthal]

I am not hung up on the Mil vs Non Mil Spec but know the Mil Spec is a beefier BCG. Improper staking, 4140 metal and the rest are of no concern to me.
97Widerider

What? How can an untested, inferior metaled, improperly staked BCG be of no concern to you??? When you are a law enforcement officer who may utilize your carbine to save my life one day?

To me, out of all the attributes that you get with a milspec bcg, the extra metal in the rear is the least important. It is not a high stress area. The proper metal, testing (HP/MPI), and proper staking is way more important.

[sinister]

I doubt you'll ever need a spare bolt carrier. You probably won't need to carry a spare bolt in your tool box for at least another 5,000-10,000 rounds. Save your money (and the time and stress of having to track down a carrier at current market prices) and get a good Aimpoint, sling, or maybe a light.

I received 1200 Rock River select-fire M4s with Daniel Defense free-float rails for my Iraqi Commandos in 2008 -- as you may or may not know, Arabs can be tough on equipment. They work fine.

Rock River may not be MILSPEC, but DEA had pretty good selection criteria.

[97Widerider]

The new BCG will be a just in case for the carbine course and can be used when I piece together one down the road. I just don't want to slow things down if my AR has some hiccups while breaking in. I feel confident with my RRA even though I am getting a back up bolt carrier group. Shooting 1000 rounds over three days is nothing close to a real world (law enforcement) application. Just because you carry an AR doesn't mean you will always be expending a couple hundred rounds in the line of duty if you have to use it. I clean, lube and inspect my weapon after each qual ( to include my gas port stakings). I feel 100% confident that it will function as needed if I need it.

[Iraqgunz]

I suggest you read more. A lot of what you are saying and points you are making are either wrong or misunderstood. Myself and others have seen even the best ARs fail in training courses. I suggest you plan accordingly.

[justin_247]

Keep the current carrier and bolt... being that it's an instructors course, in the unlikely event that it fails in the duration of the course, they probably will have a spare BCG or rifle around for you to borrow.

In today's market climate, you're going to be wasting your money. Everybody is raping each other when it comes to BCG prices, even legit manufacturers and vendors.

Make sure your carrier key screws are tight and that they are correctly staked. If the gun is overgassed, you may want to get an H2 buffer and BCM bolt upgrade kit for it, but I would leave everything else alone.

[97Widerider]

Your money, your patience.

You say you're headed for an iinstructor certification course, yet you don't know or seem to have fully researched what breaks on an M4 (even on your agency's two brands), nor are you willing to take constructive input. Have you even asked your own agency armorer and instructor?

Perhaps the armorer and instructor have recognized trends for what breaks and could set up a "Goody bag" of high attrition basic load list spare parts?

Good luck.

I am not going to a Armorer's course but an instructor's course on how to better utilize my AR. Maybe I can learn what actually breaks a M4 style rifle at the course?? I have no intention being an instructor in either field. It is simply a free course I am taking advantage of. Please highlight where I am showing opposition to any contructive input.

[Iraqgunz]

No one is being raped. It's called there is a lack of proper material and qualified companies to produce them and the demand has skyrocketed.


Keep the current carrier and bolt... being that it's an instructors course, in the unlikely event that it fails in the duration of the course, they probably will have a spare BCG or rifle around for you to borrow.

In today's market climate, you're going to be wasting your money. Everybody is raping each other when it comes to BCG prices, even legit manufacturers and vendors.

Make sure your carrier key screws are tight and that they are correctly staked. If the gun is overgassed, you may want to get an H2 buffer and BCM bolt upgrade kit for it, but I would leave everything else alone.

[Iraqgunz]

Generally when an SME gives you some advice it's a good idea to listen because that person has seen and done more than your average Joe in a lifetime.

It's too bad that you are going to this course because based on your posting you lack the basic knowledge to understand what's being said and the cost and time being spent is probably wasted.


I am not going to a Armorer's course but an instructor's course on how to better utilize my AR. Maybe I can learn what actually breaks a M4 style rifle at the course?? I have no intention being an instructor in either field. It is simply a free course I am taking advantage of. Please highlight where I am showing opposition to any contructive input.

[justin_247]

No one is being raped. It's called there is a lack of proper material and qualified companies to produce them and the demand has skyrocketed.

That I do not deny. What I do deny is that it is necessary for vendors to raise prices to the extent that they have. I seriously doubt the actual manufacturers are charging the vendors a significant amount more now than they were before.

$120-165 BCGs are now selling for between $225-245 from many vendors when they're in-stock.

[DIRTMAN556]

Dude, listen to these guys. There is a wealth of accurate information from professionals whose duty it is to run weapon systems. That's what separates m4carbine.net from other sites.

[BufordTJustice]

I'm going to go on record saying that I have not seen one RRA that was not WAY over gassed.

As has been stated, buy an H2 buffer for a mid-length (or an H3 if a carbine-length gas system is being used), a Springco WHITE or BLUE action spring, and a BCM extractor upgrade kit (a springco 5-coil or wolff XP extractor spring would also be fine) and ride it till it breaks.

But don't be unhappy to learn that your gun is "as good as". It may actually be just as good as the real mil spec brands....but you won't know because RRA has skipped many of quality control measures, mil spec standards, and material quality tests that separate DD/BCM/LMT/KAC/Colt from the rest of the pack.