Glock 19 GEN4 vs M&P 9c for EDC

[Unkle Kurt]

Many of you posted in my previous post in regards to replacing my G22 and G27 in favor of going to 9mm. I have since sold my G27 to a good friend and actually got what I paid for it as the prices 4 years ago were much better than they are now.

Today the wifey and myself ended up at Gander Mtn just looking. They had a Gen 3 23 and a Gen 4 19 in stock. After handling both I found that I much prefer the Gen4 grips to that of the Gen3. The texture as well as the slightly smaller grip circumference works better with my XL palms and Med. finger length. The salesman suggested up the M&P9c as "A good of gun or better than the Gen4 Glocks". I really liked the feel of it as well.

I'm aware that the Gen4 9mm Glocks had some teething issues and BTF issues. I'm also aware that the M&P 9's have had their share of complaints as well. So I'm asking M4C members, what is your take on this; which is the lesser of two evils.

In my last post, a lot of folks seemed to praise the G19 as the perfect size for carry. The M&P9c seems to be slightly smaller than but not as small as the G26 size that I just sold. Curious to see what people say here as there's only two sizes in the M&P lineup.

FWIW, If I end up getting the 9c, I will replace my G22 with a Full size M&P9 for compatibility

[Mike169]

I'll make two quick points.

1. BTF isn't a problem of ALL glocks, probably not even of most. I have a newer glock 19 with the "bad ejector", a newer glock 26 with a "bad ejector" and previously owned an initial run gen 4 glock 19 with the dreaded combo of "bad spring, bad ejector, and bad extractor" and didn't have BTF issues with any of these guns. My only point is there are plenty of good new glocks out there.

2. For IWB carry, I found a previously owned m&p9c to be uncomfortable. It is slightly thicker than a glock, but the seam between the changeable backstrap cut into my love handle to the point where I wouldn't wear it without a tee shirt.

YMMV on both of these points.. Both are great weapons, good luck!

[Hogsgunwild]

Both guns conceal very well. The M&P compact conceals a bit easier in some situations but is no factor in many situations of EDC. The G19 is right at the starting point of a perfect sized carry gun, so;
I would guess that a capable shooter with equal time on both models would find that the G19 gives you the luxury of more capacity and the capability of better accuracy if, for no other reason, the size of the gun helping in that regard.

You really need to wring them out and then decide which is better for you and you alone. I would gamble on the Gen 4 Glock and deal with the issues, myself. If weight is a larger factor for you than for most people due to back pain issues, then a 9 compact sized gun can make more sense. I say this because I have back pain issues and carry a P99AS compact, but, that gun is hard to find and not for everyone. It meets (actually exceeds) what I require in a carry gun.

[denn1911]

I own both of them, and they have been 100% reliable using different brands of FMJ and defensive ammo. I carry a full-size pistol (M&P45 or Gen 4 G17) 90% of the time. On those rare occasions when I need to be more discreet, my Gen 4 G19 is always chosen over the M&P9C. It feels better in my hand, and I like the added capacity. I own two Gen 4 G17's and one Gen 4 G19. The highest round count is over 12k rounds, and the lowest round count is over 4k rounds. I held off a long time before buying a Gen 4, but I've been very happy since doing so. See which feels better in your hand. If you can, shoot them both and manipulate the controls. Work different drills and choose what fits you best.

[Grip]

I carry a G19, or a G26 (wearing the G26 now)

The m&p9c sits at home 100% of the time. Not because it doesnt conceal well, but because even with the large backstrap, the gun doesnt feel good in my hand like a Glock. It feels tiny.

I have had zero issues with either glock. G19 was made in april 2012, G26 was made in april 2013.

Over 2k rnds of various 9mm through the 19, about 600 through the 26.

[RBid]

I'd be more comfortable carrying the M&P 9c year-round than the G19. Having said that, the G19 is my preference outside of summer time. Each of those would be on my short list for "if I could only have one gun". Tough call.

[1H11]

M&P9c off duty all the time. Fits the bill year around with no concerns what so ever. 2K rounds no failures at all.

[Psalms144.1]

Of the two, I'd opt for the Gen4 G19. IMHO, it is the perfect size for year-round carry, in nearly ANY circumstance or clothing (swimming is tough, I admit!)

I don't feel the M&Pc offers enough of a concealment advantage over the G19 to give up the shootability and capacity reductions, but, that's just me...

Regards,

Kevin

[Crow Hunter]

I have owned/carried a G19 for years. My brother owns a M&P9c with a safety.

I personally am more accurate shooting quickly with the G19, slowly with the M&P.

Honestly, if I weren't so invested in Glocks. (60+ mags, full spare parts kit, mulitple versions, Glock Armorer) I would probably get the M&P 9c without the safety because it is slightly easier to conceal, still has 12+1 capacity and it feels slightly better in my hands and I the grip is relieved around the trigger so I don't push to the left with it like I do a Glock without a deep grip.

I too have large palms but medium length fingers.

[sapper36]

I went from being a pure 1911 guy to Glocks a few years ago. I picked up a gen three 19 and 26 and felt okay with them. As a 1911 shooter the grip angle of the Glock took some getting used to. What I didn't like was the way it fit my hand. The middle finger of my firing hand would be in a lot of pain after a couple rounds to the point that I just didn't want to shoot anymore. I sold them and went to 9mm M&P's and they fit my hand much better and the grip angle is very close to a 1911 so it extremely comfortable. What I found though was that 9c was to small for my hands and the fullsize was two big for me to easily conceal year round. The magic however happened when I picked up a 45c. This is much closer to the G19 in size and I live the thing. Not sure if you would consider a different caliber but it made a lot of difference for me.

[rauchman]

....... What I found though was that 9c was to small for my hands and the fullsize was two big for me to easily conceal year round. The magic however happened when I picked up a 45c. This is much closer to the G19 in size and I live the thing. Not sure if you would consider a different caliber but it made a lot of difference for me.

I have an M&P9 & M&P45, both fullsize. I'd LOVE a G19 sized M&P9.

[Psalms144.1]

If a M&P "midsize" 9mm or 40 existed, it might very well take the place of my G19/23 and P2000.

Alas, S&W has been hearing that call for YEARS, and made no move towards filling the demand...

[Snake_207]

Alas, S&W has been hearing that call for YEARS, and made no move towards filling the demand...

And I doubt they ever will.

With the exception of maybe a 1/4" of barrel and slightly smaller grip length, the Compact is the size of a G19. Not as small as a G26, but not quite as large as a 19.

http://i89.photobucket.com/albums/k228/au207usn/Comparisons%20pics/DSC_0636.jpg
http://i89.photobucket.com/albums/k228/au207usn/Comparisons%20pics/DSC_0635.jpg

If Smith, or Mec-Gar, or whoever were smart, what they should do is come out with either a new magazine, or magazine adapter. Instead of the pinky extension, replace it with a +2 and fill in the back of the grip. This would not only give you the extra capacity, but the same grip length as the 19.

http://i89.photobucket.com/albums/k228/au207usn/Comparisons%20pics/Untitled222.jpg

[rauchman]

And I doubt they ever will.

With the exception of maybe a 1/4" of barrel and slightly smaller grip length, the Compact is the size of a G19. Not as small as a G26, but not quite as large as a 19.


If Smith, or Mec-Gar, or whoever were smart, what they should do is come out with either a new magazine, or magazine adapter. Instead of the pinky extension, replace it with a +2 and fill in the back of the grip. This would not only give you the extra capacity, but the same grip length as the 19.


While this is not a bad idea for a "fix", I'd still get my fingers pinched during mag changes. I could deal with the shortened slide/barrel. Just want a grip length that I can get 3 fingers around.

[RogerinTPA]

M&P9c off duty all the time. Fits the bill year around with no concerns what so ever. 2K rounds no failures at all.

Same here, and felt quite comfortable during mid summers here in central FL. Concealability is more about the proper holster and attire. I've seen some pretty small guys conceal some pretty large full size 1911s, G17s, G22s, 357s and 44s. I've had my 9c for years and with over 12K+ without failure. The M&P series (I own four, FS45, FS40,FS9 &9c) is the most comfortable to shoot as far my own perception & perspective. My first was the M&P45. After doing some range time and a couple of classes with it, I traded all my other pistols for the M&P series. As far as ergonomics are concerned, I owned a G23 for many years and shot it quite well, but I could not get used to the grip angle, finger grooves or the trigger. It just didn't fill my hand as comfortable as the M&P. The Glock grip has always felt uncomfortable to shoot, especially when in a class. With my M&P45 & 40, I've shot some 500-1000 round classes in a day or weekend, and never experienced the discomfort I've experienced with the G23 after only 50-100 rounds. Some swear by it. I think the Glock grip angle was designed for european style one hand pistol marksmanship and not the two handed modern combat style of shooting. You'll find folks in both categories, some love and hate for the M&P and Glock. It's best to try each and decide for yourself.

[Psalms144.1]

And I doubt they ever will.

With the exception of maybe a 1/4" of barrel and slightly smaller grip length, the Compact is the size of a G19. Not as small as a G26, but not quite as large as a 19.

If Smith, or Mec-Gar, or whoever were smart, what they should do is come out with either a new magazine, or magazine adapter. Instead of the pinky extension, replace it with a +2 and fill in the back of the grip. This would not only give you the extra capacity, but the same grip length as the 19.

http://i89.photobucket.com/albums/k228/au207usn/Comparisons%20pics/Untitled222.jpg

With all respect - you're making my point for me. There is VERY little "size" savings in the M&Pc making it worth losing 1/2" of barrel and sight radius, and 20% magazine capacity, compared to the G19.

Instead of making magazine extenders or adapters (which I abhor) and keeping potential users in the category of needing to deal with "pinchy" reloads, I'd still rather see S&W make a "mid size" M&P - something with a "full" grip, 15 round capacity, and a full 4" barrel. If it was slightly longer in OAL than the G19, I wouldn't object - since barrel/slide length is the least important issue for overall concealment (all other things being equal).

S&W's problem with grip length is tied to their use of the base of the grip at the backstrap for the holding area for their decocking "tool." Unless/until they find some other way of incorporating that piece, they're always going to have to eat 1/4" of grip length at the base of the backstrap - so they're fighting an uphill battle on the concealment front.

But, this is one man's opinion, and worth precisely what you paid for it!

Regards,

Kevin

[Five_Point_Five_Six]

I'd still rather see S&W make a "mid size" M&P - something with a "full" grip, 15 round capacity, and a full 4" barrel.

While not an M&P, their SD9 fits that criteria with a 16+1 capacity. I have one with the $20 Apex goodies, and I've tried to find a reason not to trust it for EDC and it hasn't given me one yet.

[Father of 3]

Mec-Gar does make a +2 extension you can add to a M&P. It may require slight fitting/trimming. Google it.

Also Google Chopped M&P. Can't remember who, but there's a company that will chop a FS M&P down to G19 grip height along with the mags. I think it has 14+1 capacity.

[BBS]

How do you edc your gun? I carry appendix and find that the gen 4 texture can be irritating to the skin. Even with the irritation I prefer the G19. The m&p9c with the pinky extension is pretty much the same grip length and grip length is the main factor to concealability.

[Sry0fcr]

I've owned and carried both. I gave up a Gen 3 G19 for an M&P9 Compact because I had issues reaching the mag release and riding the slide lock lever. Only to find out that even though I had resolved some of the ergonomic issues the 9C was slightly too small for me even with the extended baseplates and I shot my G19 better. This prompted a shift in the opposite direction to a full sized M&P9 which I shoot well with but is a bit harder to conceal.

Of the 2 you mentioned, I'd get the G19. If S&W ever makes a M&P45C sized gun in 9x19 I'd get that. You listening Smith?

[Bkostka]

I avoided the GLOCK wagon for a long time. But I finally purchased a 19 last year and love it. It has the most holster options available then any other pistol out there besides a 1911 of corse. Plus GLOCK only builds pistols and I like the thought that they specialize there business around one thing. Just food for thought.

[packinaglock]

With all respect - you're making my point for me. There is VERY little "size" savings in the M&Pc making it worth losing 1/2" of barrel and sight radius, and 20% magazine capacity, compared to the G19.

Instead of making magazine extenders or adapters (which I abhor) and keeping potential users in the category of needing to deal with "pinchy" reloads, I'd still rather see S&W make a "mid size" M&P - something with a "full" grip, 15 round capacity, and a full 4" barrel. If it was slightly longer in OAL than the G19, I wouldn't object - since barrel/slide length is the least important issue for overall concealment (all other things being equal).

S&W's problem with grip length is tied to their use of the base of the grip at the backstrap for the holding area for their decocking "tool." Unless/until they find some other way of incorporating that piece, they're always going to have to eat 1/4" of grip length at the base of the backstrap - so they're fighting an uphill battle on the concealment front.

But, this is one man's opinion, and worth precisely what you paid for it!

Regards,

Kevin

I would love the hell out of an M&P with the same length grip as a G19

[bighawk]

I own both a gen4 glock 19 and the m&p 9c and can honestly say you'd be we'll suited for CC with either and is hard to say which would be better however I tend to lean towards the m&p more during the summer months due to its slightly smaller size and my wardrobe.. However I carry the glock the other 8 months a year and have bad no problems with either after about 5k rounds through the glock and 3k rounds through the m&p. In my experience and the experiences of many friends who own either a g19 and m&p9c they have functioned flawlessly and we have all been very pleased with them.

[bighawk]

I would love the hell out of an M&P with the same length grip as a G19

I would definitely love if they would make one between the full size and compact too.. But if you're into 45's the m&p 45 c is almost the exact same size as the g19

[Bogart]

Same here, and felt quite comfortable during mid summers here in central FL. Concealability is more about the proper holster and attire. I've seen some pretty small guys conceal some pretty large full size 1911s, G17s, G22s, 357s and 44s. I've had my 9c for years and with over 12K+ without failure. The M&P series (I own four, FS45, FS40,FS9 &9c) is the most comfortable to shoot as far my own perception & perspective. My first was the M&P45. After doing some range time and a couple of classes with it, I traded all my other pistols for the M&P series. As far as ergonomics are concerned, I owned a G23 for many years and shot it quite well, but I could not get used to the grip angle, finger grooves or the trigger. It just didn't fill my hand as comfortable as the M&P. The Glock grip has always felt uncomfortable to shoot, especially when in a class. With my M&P45 & 40, I've shot some 500-1000 round classes in a day or weekend, and never experienced the discomfort I've experienced with the G23 after only 50-100 rounds. Some swear by it. I think the Glock grip angle was designed for european style one hand pistol marksmanship and not the two handed modern combat style of shooting. You'll find folks in both categories, some love and hate for the M&P and Glock. It's best to try each and decide for yourself.

You should be able to conceal either the M&P9c or G19 with a quality holster and belt set-up. I'm 5'9" with a 30" waist and conceal a P30 in a RCS Phantom and spare mag. Or if I'm carrying my duty gun, an M&P45mid, I carry it in a VG2 with a spare mag. 90% of the time I have no issues in concealability with either of these. YMMV.

[avengd7x]

I own both, and for me, carrying appendix, the M&P9C prints less with both magazines (especially the flush one). I'm a skinnier guy and for me the glock 19 doesn't work well in the summer

[zerocool]

I'm 6' 215lbs and carry a M&P9c in a PSS holster IWB daily... however, the OP is deciding between two highly regarded platforms. As others have said or implied, handle/shoot both and decide what works for you best. When seeking input on two or more proven weapon systems in a "versus scenario", the discussion is bound to become opinion driven (in the sense that everyone is going to chime in on what works for them and why... while valuable, this input has little actual meaning to the OP or others who are weighing a similar decision).

Sorry for seeming to rant, I don't mean it as such, just wanted to stress to the OP to get something and shoot the heck out of it. If it ends up not working for you, get something that does. I carry the 9c not because I have any illusions that it is "the best" and not necessarily even "the best for me." It's just that as I gain proficiency, it doesn't matter much what I have in my hand at this point. I need MUCH more trigger time (too much is never enough) before I feel I could truly determine if something isn't working. G19 and 9c will always outperform me. Get it, shoot it, carry it... :D

[Chefjon]

I chose the G19 for 3 reasons:

1. The biggest thing for me was the trigger. I rented a G19 to try it first and compared it to a P07-Duty. The P07 felt "better" in my hand, but I shot the Glock so much better. I only got to dry-fire the S&W, but the trigger was kind of goofy and I didn't like the lack of a hard re-set. I wasn't going to buy a >$500 gun that *instantly* needed a new $90 trigger. I'll go on about how many times S&W has broken my heart another time.

2. 3 more rounds on-board.

3. More options, accessories, and commonality.

My advice is shoot each one and whichever you are *more accurate* with wins.

Good luck.

[AKFAN]

I'm also trying to decide between the two. Shot both and I like both.

The biggest reason I'm leaning toward the MP9c is the option of having a thumb safety.

[77thNYSV]

I know this thread is a bit old but I'm facing this very question- go for a M&P9c or a G19.

I just wanted to add that the reason I'm leaning towards the G19 is availability of mags. I already own a fullsize M&P9 and finding even one spare 17 round mag has been a huge pain. Since the Connecticut shooting, it took me 6 months until I finally found one locally for the reasonable price of $50.

Even today, at all my local gunstores, both local stores and big chains, such as Cabela's, M&P mags are a rare sight. However, glock mags are all over the place. I love the ergonomics of my M&P9 but the G19 is fine in my hands. So for me, the slight difference in size is a non-issue when put up against magazine capacity and ability to find magazines.

[Steve S.]

Let me preface - I really love the M&P platform. On a timer, I'm always faster with a DCAEK'd M&P over a Glock. I think the M&P45c is the best choice for a carry .45ACP on the market, and I'm better with one than a full size 1911 generally.

Now that I'm an established non-M&P-hater...

There's two things that the M&P9C will never do that a G19 can. You can fix the M&P triggers to your liking, there's plenty of holster / sight options, and mags can be found in close to Glock mag price ranges.... but these two things are impossible. The first on all M&Ps, the second on the M&P9/40 Compact only.

1) You can't detail strip the weapon without taking off the rear sight.

2) The M&P9c will NOT TAKE AN X300! (or other full size WMLs)

There's not a real need to detail strip your pistol often, so #2 is the bigger issue. If you don't run a WML or run one of the compact offerings - this might not matter.

To me, it's not the capacity of the G19 (both can run full size mags as reloads) or the extra barrel length that sticks out when comparing the G19 vs M&P9c... it's the fact my weapon light of choice can not be put on the M&P compact under any circumstances. For me personally.... that's the deal breaker.

To solve this, I'm strongly considering chopping my Fullsize frame to Compact size. I also believe this is the model that S&W should be worried about offering.

[PatrioticDisorder]

And I doubt they ever will.

With the exception of maybe a 1/4" of barrel and slightly smaller grip length, the Compact is the size of a G19. Not as small as a G26, but not quite as large as a 19.

http://i89.photobucket.com/albums/k228/au207usn/Comparisons%20pics/DSC_0636.jpg
http://i89.photobucket.com/albums/k228/au207usn/Comparisons%20pics/DSC_0635.jpg

If Smith, or Mec-Gar, or whoever were smart, what they should do is come out with either a new magazine, or magazine adapter. Instead of the pinky extension, replace it with a +2 and fill in the back of the grip. This would not only give you the extra capacity, but the same grip length as the 19.

http://i89.photobucket.com/albums/k228/au207usn/Comparisons%20pics/Untitled222.jpg

Why not put the M&Pc with the flush fit grip in a pic against the 19? That pic is definitely unfair, it would be like putting a 26 with the pinky extender next to the 19. Hell, you could make the argument that a full size mag with the sleeve making the M&Pc 17+1 makes the G19 lack in capacity while giving you a comparable size grip.

It is true the M&Pc isn't as small as a 26, but it isn't as large as a 19 either and being that the mag capacity is right in the middle I'd say Smith did well with it. I actually prefer Smith's version of small medium and large (shield, compact & full size) to Glocks version of small, medium and large (all of which are chunkers in comparison to the shield).

I own M&P 40s, the compact was the first I bought and felt it was a good jack of all trade gun. Sits at home 99% of the time for me in favor of the Shield, which Glock currently doesn't have an answer to & my full size is my nightstand gun.

[Ranger45]

I have always been attracted to the M&P, but have never taken the plunge, largely because I didn't like what I heard and read about the trigger on that platform. I understand that M&P has improved their triggers, so that may be something to look into.

I picked up a Gen4 G19 a couple of years ago, and love it as a CCW pistol. I don't care for subcompacts, as I can conceal a compact about as easily due to my size/frame. In my opinion, the G19/G23 is about as perfect in size as it gets when it comes to carry guns. I also like the capacity advantage with the Glock as well.

In the end, its up to the user. Find what you are most comfortable with and get started on trying to wear it out!

[m4brian]

There is a thread here on the MecGar +2 baseplate.
http://m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=91220
This provides a 14 round magazine, and leaves the backstrap 'free', so you can actually drop the mag with no drag, and it is ALMOST as good as the G19.

You can also use 17 round mags with an extension - I would file off the back of the XGrip to be able to drop the mag.

The G19 gives me slide bite, but GripForce fixes this. The M&P platform is easier on thick-fingered folks or when using gloves by far.

[richiecotite]

Do yourself a favor and get the g19.

Though it's worth nothing, I own 2 m&p's (45's, fs and c)

[decodeddiesel]

I carry an M&P9c daily in a G-Code incog holster. I find the holster to be the best AIWB holster I have tried yet.

That said, I would probably recommend the G19.

Here's why: Before the incog holster I used a Comptac MTAC or a CCC Looper for appendix carry. I use the flush magazines in my M&P9c as I was afraid the extra butt length would compromise the "concealability" of the pistol. The trade off here was a compromised grip on the weapon due to giving up the "pinky real estate". This isn't that big of a deal, but it does reduce the controllability of the pistol slightly and it complicates magazine changes significantly. Having your pinky "floating" introduces an additional pinch point when inserting a new magazine, and you must loosen your grip on the pistol when ejecting the old magazine or it will "drag" on your pinky and fail to drop free. All of this is solved on the G19 with the additional grip length. YMMV and all, but this is what I found.

Also I do find the reset on the G19 to be a huge advantage over the M&P. I am using the Apex forward-set-sear and trigger in my M&P (no RAM as I have a thumb safety) and even with this $200 upgrade (had to upgrade the sear housing as well), I am still faster with a G19.

[mysak]

I usually go towards the m&p I really like the 9c but I went with a G19 for carry because I don't like how my finger hangs off 9c I think its stupid that s&w took up that much realstate with a pinky extension. Others will say you just need to train with it, yes thats true but I just don't want to. Side note the G19 has to have a grip angle mod for me. So stock for stock m&p9c but g19 with a little mod works for me.

[Tzook]

Its obviously different for everybody, but for me personally: I think the G19 offers a much easier package to shoot while being only slightly larger. I have medium to larger sized hands, and the M&Pc is just too small for me to shoot well.