View Full Version : Brand question: Elite Arms worth it?
anotherdaze1
05-14-13, 16:32
Here are two Elite Arms guns that are in the right price range. But I have never heard of the brand. I'm hearing mixed reviews about the brand and I tend to lead more towards the negative reviews... especially when I'm shooting a gun.
http://www.firearmsforsale.com/elite-arms-ar-15-rifle-m4-16-223-black-ffs/
http://www.firearmsforsale.com/elite-arms-ar-15-rifle-16-223-hbar-black-norsigh-ffs/
I hate to hack on anyone else's small business...but...they look sketchy and there really is NO way you can build a quality AR-15 for that price.
polymorpheous
05-14-13, 16:48
Given their posted specs, or lack thereof, I'd pass.
While I wish the best for ANY American born company (this one from North Carolina) I agree with Doug. I don't see anything that stands out in their product description.
"Features
1 in 9 twist barrels
No rear sight
Standard A2 front sight tower
Bayonet lug
M4 style forend
6 position collapsible stock
Moly coated premium bolt assembly
All guns test fired.
Includes hard case, owners manual, 1-30 round milspec mag.
Lifetime warranty
Made in Thomasville, North Carolina"
-Jax
anotherdaze1
05-14-13, 16:50
I hate to hack on anyone else's small business...but...they look sketchy and there really is NO way you can build a quality AR-15 for that price.
Which is too bad cause that would be the right price. I agree though.
Littlelebowski
05-14-13, 16:51
Would not do it, myself.
Look at it this way. We know, through the bid process, that Remington initially won the bid on the Army M-4 at $673 a copy. That is a bare bones milspec rifle for a contract of 120,000 rifles. I lost track of what was going on, but I think FN now has the contract at right around $642 a copy.
No way a small manufacturer is getting a quality AR to their dealers and to the street for less than a grand.
Littlelebowski
05-14-13, 17:10
Note that the rifle is advertised as .223.
In that price range, buy either an M&P 15 Sport or something from Palmetto State Armory. Or you can pay an extra few hundred dollars and get something that's proven from Colt, DD, BCM, etc and is probably a bit better. Be honest with yourself about how you will use the gun. If it's a range toy that you will shoot a few hundred rounds through, one of the cheaper guns will work just fine in all likelyhood. If you plan to shoot tens of thousands of rounds, the cost difference is negligible compared to the ammo cost and the proven reliability.
Either way, I believe you can spend your money more wisely than Elite Arms.
Sorry to resurrect an older thread, but I had the opportunity to disassemble an Elite Arms upper last night. Issues observed were as follows :
A2 FSB instead of an F marked FSB
1/9 twist barrel of unknown origin - not chromed
Barrel installed without anti seize
Forward assist roll pin was destroyed due to improper installation
Forward assist of unknown origin - 2 piece design?
There were a few other issues as well. I'll post up some pictures when I get a chance.
Tonyparson
07-10-13, 14:04
Sorry to resurrect an older thread, but I had the opportunity to disassemble an Elite Arms upper last night. Issues observed were as follows :
A2 FSB instead of an F marked FSB
1/9 twist barrel of unknown origin - not chromed
Barrel installed without anti seize
Forward assist roll pin was destroyed due to improper installation
Forward assist of unknown origin - 2 piece design?
There were a few other issues as well. I'll post up some pictures when I get a chance.
What did the bolt carrier group look like? Full-auto or Simi-auto and how did the staking look?
What is the intended purpose for the gun? If you have no purpose, buy whatever. If you have a serious purpose, buy a serious gun.
Tonyparson
07-10-13, 14:14
What is the intended purpose for the gun? If you have no purpose, buy whatever. If you have a serious purpose, buy a serious gun.
Good advice. 👍
What did the bolt carrier group look like? Full-auto or Simi-auto and how did the staking look?
I did not see the BCG. It was dropped off as an assembled upper only.
OK guys, I finally got a chance to get some pics uploaded. A friend of mine bought an Elite Arms upper a couple of months ago. He brought it to me to disassemble because he wanted to have the receiver refinished. Fortunately, he has been able to sell this off and has replaced it with a higher quality upper after I was able to inspect it and shed some light on what he had purchased. FYI, he called Elite Arms a couple of times and their phone number rings to an automotive / transmission shop. Soooo....
First up, the upper receiver. The upper's finish had a rough texture and appeared to be similar to powder coat, but I'm not sure exactly what it was. It may have been anodized, but it must have been bead blasted first.
http://i75.photobucket.com/albums/i287/mtdawg169/IMG_8447_zps804b6741.jpg
It may just be my eyes, but the gas tube hole looks off kilter to me:
http://i75.photobucket.com/albums/i287/mtdawg169/IMG_8471_zpsb84cfc39.jpg
http://i75.photobucket.com/albums/i287/mtdawg169/IMG_8469_zps9dfbad54.jpg
No anti seize was applied before installing the barrel nut. The threads were basically dry.
http://i75.photobucket.com/albums/i287/mtdawg169/IMG_8465_zps66ab57ca.jpg
The feedramps were M4 style, but were not very clean and looked like they might actually cause a failure to feed. They overhung the upper receiver slightly and did not fit flush as they should. The extension just looked cheaply made. Barrel is not chrome lined.
http://i75.photobucket.com/albums/i287/mtdawg169/IMG_8464_zps43a4e66f.jpg
http://i75.photobucket.com/albums/i287/mtdawg169/IMG_8461_zps87b86289.jpg
Alignment pin was ground down on the top. Again, just not very well done and half-assed looking.
http://i75.photobucket.com/albums/i287/mtdawg169/IMG_8460_zpsd6794bad.jpg
Takedown lug was marked F1 and had an odd channel cut on each side
http://i75.photobucket.com/albums/i287/mtdawg169/IMG_8441_zps17e19963.jpg
http://i75.photobucket.com/albums/i287/mtdawg169/IMG_8443_zpsc1191b76.jpg
Barrel was 1/9 twist. Front sight base was not F marked. When Elite was questioned about the FSB, they didn't know what an F marked FSB was. Unfortunately, he sold it before my 556 chamber gauge from Ned arrived, so I wasn't able to confirm the chamber dimensions.
http://i75.photobucket.com/albums/i287/mtdawg169/IMG_8446_zpsc1586c79.jpg
http://i75.photobucket.com/albums/i287/mtdawg169/IMG_8445_zps714e69ed.jpg
http://i75.photobucket.com/albums/i287/mtdawg169/IMG_8444_zps77947c6b.jpg
Forward assist was some two piece affair that I haven't seen before.
Clip on the port door pin appeared to be from a hardware store.
The forward assist roll pin was butchered due to improper assembly or the FA / upper receiver being out of spec.
http://i75.photobucket.com/albums/i287/mtdawg169/IMG_8456_zps92b5f62e.jpg
http://i75.photobucket.com/albums/i287/mtdawg169/IMG_8458_zpsa8f1eb96.jpg
http://i75.photobucket.com/albums/i287/mtdawg169/IMG_8449_zps5c03bd38.jpg
http://i75.photobucket.com/albums/i287/mtdawg169/IMG_8452_zps688b0967.jpg
Now for the icing on the cake. The BCG. Bolt was of unknown origin, except that it came from Elite. No MPI markings or markings of any kind on the bolt. The owner cut the box open, so there is no doubt that it came from Elite like this. The carrier appeared to be heavily used, was missing it's finish and rusting. The firing pin was some weird shade of pinkish brown. Elite said they didn't know why and that all of them had been coming that way for some reason. Makes me really wonder where in the hell they are getting parts from. In short, the entire upper was a complete POS from stem to stern.
http://i75.photobucket.com/albums/i287/mtdawg169/IMG_20130725_133109_027_zpsb2dcf149.jpg
http://i75.photobucket.com/albums/i287/mtdawg169/IMG_20130725_133131_496_zpsbf676762.jpg
http://i75.photobucket.com/albums/i287/mtdawg169/IMG_20130725_132949_077_zps60f1f17e.jpg
I kid you not, that BCG came out of a new upper in a sealed box from Elite Arms!
ETA:
I forgot to mention, the gas key was not staked properly either. It looked like someone took a dull chisel and just struck across the top of the screws. Carrier was auto profile but was NOT chromed inside the carrier or gas key.
NeoNeanderthal
07-27-13, 21:14
That is a WEIRD looking bcg. However i see it as a good thing. Most shitty ar parts look like plain greyish/black parts to the general public. It's a breath of fresh air when a piece of shit looks like it to anyone with an eyeball in their head.
This isn't even funny
and I'm not even joking...:suicide:
They literally answer the phone number on the website as an automotive shop, don't have a clue what an F marked FSB is and sent that POS BCG out in a new upper.
SilverBullet432
07-27-13, 21:44
everyonce in a while, some yahoo comes along that decides to start "making" (more like assembling) ar's.. ive been to a few gun shows where they had backyard ar's for sale which claimed to be used by america's "elite" :suicide:
That's scary, I had never heard of them....now I know why. I knew the proposed AWB was causing lower quality rifles/especially lower quality BCG's to be hurried, but that's unbelievable. They found a truckload of rusted BCG's in a trunk of a 65 Chevy at the auto shop and thought, "let's make some money!"
SilverBullet432
07-27-13, 22:05
i mean dont get me wrong, there have been a few companies (like DD and Noveske) that started from a garage and bam! now theyre here! but those guys actually use quality parts and do r&d. thats what makes their stuff great! not using inferior parts labeled as "elite"
Thanks for posting this. Hopefully it will be a learning lesson to some. This is by far the worst ARbortion I have seen in.....almost ever.
Thanks for posting this. Hopefully it will be a learning lesson to some. This is by far the worst ARbortion I have seen in.....almost ever.
My thoughts exactly.
What did the bolt carrier group look like? Full-auto or Simi-auto and how did the staking look?
I forgot to mention, the gas key was not staked properly either. It looked like someone took a dull chisel and just struck across the top of the screws. Carrier was auto profile but was NOT chromed inside the carrier or gas key.
SilverBullet432
07-28-13, 00:19
This is the biggest load of crap to hit the market since vulcan! :bad:
This is the biggest load of crap to hit the market since vulcan! :bad:
These things are apparently all over the Carolinas gun show circuit and are also being sold by dealers in GA.
These things are apparently all over the Carolinas gun show circuit and are also being sold by dealers in GA.
I bet. Just like Oly was up in Washington. More Olys than you could shake a stick at.
NeoNeanderthal
07-28-13, 11:04
Up here it is the same thing with Windham/bushmaster. Mainers have a huge local pride so they LOVE that it's made in maine.
Army Chief
07-28-13, 11:43
Let's keep this on-point, please.
The core issue here is that we have clear evidence of another substandard product, period. There is no need to denigrate Elite Arms or anyone else further. I suspect some good old boys simply saw a valid market opportunity, watched a few AR assembly videos, sourced some parts and went for it.
A for initiative. F for outcome.
Clearly, these rifles cannot be recommended. Not on the basis of component quality. Not on the basis of assembly standards. Not on the basis of the knowledge base necessary to build, service or troubleshoot a true service-grade weapon.
That pretty much tells the tale. No need to pile on.
AC
Here are two Elite Arms guns that are in the right price range. But I have never heard of the brand. I'm hearing mixed reviews about the brand and I tend to lead more towards the negative reviews... especially when I'm shooting a gun.
http://www.firearmsforsale.com/elite-arms-ar-15-rifle-m4-16-223-black-ffs/
http://www.firearmsforsale.com/elite-arms-ar-15-rifle-16-223-hbar-black-norsigh-ffs/
If a firearm is made by a new or unknown company, I would want to meet the seller at a range to examine the firearm and test fire it. If that is not an option, I would hold onto my money until something else came along.
This reminds me of Moore Machine's entry into the market. They were having problems keeping enough work in this crappy economy to keep everyone employed, and ARs were selling like pancakes after the current CIC was elected. Someone at the shop had an idea for that unused capacity. I sincerely wished MMC had approached it differently. I would love to see a NC mfr succeed and keep local folks employed. But it hasn't worked out so well, sadly.
Elite may well be in a similar situation, and I hate that. They may well be nice folks just trying to keep people employed. But what I see in the pics above is downright sad. I think mfrs need to better appreciate that their product may one day be the only thing standing between a home owner and a home invasion/rape/burglary, etc.
ToeTagger6552
10-06-14, 10:58
Again, hate to resurrect this and it's probably a non point since I can't find them doing business at all atm.....but, I bought one in 2012 right after obummer was elected....I ran the complete rifle for over a year with none of the above issues... I sold the upper and bought a BCM complete upper and still run the Elite lower extensively to this day. Guess I got lucky. Works flawlessly and the stock trigger is just as good as the ALG Combat trigger that I replaced it with.....For $650 I lucked out at the time right before things went CRAZY after SH...Just my .02.
This reminds me of Moore Machine's entry into the market. They were having problems keeping enough work in this crappy economy to keep everyone employed, and ARs were selling like pancakes after the current CIC was elected. Someone at the shop had an idea for that unused capacity. I sincerely wished MMC had approached it differently. I would love to see a NC mfr succeed and keep local folks employed. But it hasn't worked out so well, sadly.
Elite may well be in a similar situation, and I hate that. They may well be nice folks just trying to keep people employed. But what I see in the pics above is downright sad. I think mfrs need to better appreciate that their product may one day be the only thing standing between a home owner and a home invasion/rape/burglary, etc.
I think MMC, Elite and Bear Creek are all the same outfit. Bear Creek popped up during the panic for a short while, but I don't know their current status.
Again, hate to resurrect this and it's probably a non point since I can't find them doing business at all atm.....but, I bought one in 2012 right after obummer was elected....I ran the complete rifle for over a year with none of the above issues... I sold the upper and bought a BCM complete upper and still run the Elite lower extensively to this day. Guess I got lucky. Works flawlessly and the stock trigger is just as good as the ALG Combat trigger that I replaced it with.....For $650 I lucked out at the time right before things went CRAZY after SH...Just my .02.
I'm curious, during that year, how many rounds do you think you put through it? For $650 at the time, you got a plinker for plinker prices. Today, you can get a much better quality PSA for similar costs. What I saw when I inspected the gun last year, was not encouraging.
ToeTagger6552
10-06-14, 13:03
I would say in the neighborhood of 1100-1200 rounds... It was an m4gery 1:9 upper and I wanted something better but it wasn't due to performance, fit or finish... I'm not disputing they may have put out some junk, but like I say.... I got lucky. I had more than a couple knowledgeable guys check it out before I sold the upper...
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