View Full Version : Compensators
I have a dd mk18 10.3 barrel I'm looking for a comp I'm using it for lawenforcement I was looking at battlecomp , gunfighter, and noveski pig I want something that will shoot pretty flat and not kill people in stack or next to me.
I've not used it but this gets good reviews:
http://griffinarmament.com/accessories/centerfire-muzzle/m4sd-flash-comp/
ETA: Above is a comp with flash suppression properties. Here is a thread on a flash suppressor with comp properties:
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=122997
guitarist1993
05-20-13, 12:44
I have the Griffin M4SDII on my 16" middy and absolutely love it. I've never seen it run on an SBR, but it definitely keeps the muzzle flat for quick follow-up shots, and the concussion/ noise isn't bad at all. Not sure how well it would keep the flash down on a 10" barrel though.
Using the search button will reveal a few threads on this.
If you are not going suppressed, the gunfighter is the least offensive.
That griffins looks nice I guess I should have mentioned there is a chance of going suppressed that's why I was looking at the battlecomp I've even considered surefire but I've heard it's rough in a stack due to side blast I'm completly new to suppressed do I need to modify a dd mk18 upper or will it run suppressed from factory? And what do you guys think about the gentec halo
I'm running a Griffin on my 11.5 BCM and will be mounting it on my new 16" build. It works as advertised if not better and I get a kick of punishing my squad mates who are next to me on line. But I find the concussion to be to much if not distracting on my SBR and will be installing a BCM Mod 0. Take it with a grain of salt, if it works for you awesome, just my personal preference. Stay safe.
I know the BC is currently the Flavor of the Month but I like the Griffin Armament unit far better. I sold the BC1.0 shortly there after. Everyone I have talked to that has owned both all say they like the Griffin better. Spikes Dynacomp is also one that I want to try.
I know the BC is currently the Flavor of the Month but I like the Griffin Armament unit far better. I sold the BC1.0 shortly there after. Everyone I have talked to that has owned both all say they like the Griffin better. Spikes Dynacomp is also one that I want to try.
Both the BC and the GA are excellent, I also prefer the Griffin.
The Dynacomp is out classed by these 2 devices IMO.
Guns-up.50
05-27-13, 16:45
If your plans to go suppressed change the noveski pig is a good flash hider. Especially for stacks, most of the blast is projected foreward. It is a bit heavy but does an exclent job of controlling flash and blast for your team.
I've talked to the guys at battle comp they are all cops and are awesome guys they said its ideal for law enforcement that's what it was made for plus I'm looking at the gentec halo anyway so I ordered the 2.0 ill let you guys know what I think when it gets here if not it will be for sell and ill prolly check the griffin out lol
citizensoldier16
05-27-13, 19:11
I have a dd mk18 10.3 barrel I'm looking for a comp I'm using it for lawenforcement I was looking at battlecomp , gunfighter, and noveski pig I want something that will shoot pretty flat and not kill people in stack or next to me.
Lets be realistic here...how many times per week do you find yourself "in stack"? Be truthful here.
Because honestly, I've never been killed by a rifle's concussion. Just saying.
well for one I was not meaning for real kill, I was being sarcastic and im in a stack in training once a week so it is a big deal
saddlerocker
05-27-13, 20:39
I would get a Troy Claymore, Noveske PIG, or one of those BrakeShields for the AAC or YHM Brake.
Something that projects the blast forward.
The Battelcomp is still gonna piss off your buddies next to you.
This post is of interest to me because I'm currently trying to decide on a FH to pin to a SR-15 14.5 upper.
I've considered the following:
* KAC 5.56 MAMS (couple of month/indeterminate wait and a bit pricey)
* Griffin M4SD-II Flash Comp (seems fairly similar to the MAMS, inexpensive as compared to a MAMS and available)
* KAC NT4 FH (can get to 16.1 w/ just a shim, small and lightweight but also not in stock)
I would welcome any feedback regarding the above configurations....
Coal Dragger
05-27-13, 21:14
I've seen some Battle Comps and they seem to provide a good balance of muzzle control vs noise.
I can tell you with certainty not to use a Dreadnaught F2. At least not for an entry gun, mine has enough blast to scour the paint off of a wall (no joke) and is absurdly loud. Shoots nice and flat though, and allows me to spot my own hits at 15X magnification on a prairie dog town.
Just curious if your department allows the use of a suppressor, that would seem to be the ticket on an SBR.
If side blast is your utmost worry the Pig does a fantastic job of alleviating it. Last year my buddy stood beside me all day long at a carbine class with his 7.5" SBR w/the Pig mounted.
Didn't notice anything out of the ordinary the entire class. That impressed me as I had never been beside one while being fired until then.
-Jax
You're running a 10.3 and you don't want to blow out the fillings in your buddies teeth? I think the Noveske may be your only option. A suppressor would obviously be the best answer here though. If your department has no issues with a 10.3" barrel they probably wouldn't care about a suppressor either.
If side blast is your utmost worry the Pig does a fantastic job of alleviating it.
That was my experience as well. I tried the BattleComp for a few weeks and didn't care for it...nor did those around me.
i would say you don't want a compensator at all. Your rifle is meant for work not gaming. Any muzzle brake you have substantial concussion even some to a degree like you said it can be defremential to you or some one in your team. i would say stick with a A2 or if your runnin a suppressor, a flash suppressor mount. also stay away from 4 and 3 prong "tunning" fork flash hiders. i promise you the little added recoil is worth not messing with your teammates consecration and attention.
That's pretty horrible advice.
The open end flash hiders are some of the most effective. Well, not some of, they are the most effective.
Brakes have a place on short barrels when used with a suppressor. The brake will take the brunt of the escaping gas, instead of you $1k suppressor, limiting the erosion on the baffles.
An AR15 with a 10.3" barrel fired close is going to suck no matter what, especially if its done indoors.
The Noveske was designed for added back pressure in the firing of short barrel AR15s.
DIRTMAN556
05-29-13, 01:44
Not to mention (for those who are pinning and welding) the potential for a comp to crack. I'm sure its a rare occurrence but I was not willing to take that chance with my pinned 14.5 incher. Besides the A2X in my case is more aesthetically pleasing.
I've never even heard of a comp cracking.
Just because its pinned doesn't mean you're forever married to it.
Regardless of if I choose a flash hider or a brake, it's going to say Surefire on it.
The last thing your bullet passes is your muzzle device. It absolutely needs to be concentric, well machined, and made of quality materials.
bullittmcqueen
05-29-13, 08:19
The DD MK18 10.3 with a Battlecomp 1.0 is the flattest shooting AR platform rifle I have shot. If you want to suppress it, you would obviously have to go with a 2.0 or a different muzzle device altogether, but I think this is a really good combination.
You're just going to have to take the muzzle blast with a grain of salt. Its an SBR after all. Comes with the package.
If you're using it on a team or indoors a lot then my guess is you wouldn't want a compensator at all. In that role it would be more effective to use a suppressor, or a Noveske KX3 (if you don't mind that much weight up front) which directs the blast forward and has less intrusive flash.
.
That's pretty horrible advice.
The open end flash hiders are some of the most effective. Well, not some of, they are the most effective.
Brakes have a place on short barrels when used with a suppressor. The brake will take the brunt of the escaping gas, instead of you $1k suppressor, limiting the erosion on the baffles.
An AR15 with a 10.3" barrel fired close is going to suck no matter what, especially if its done indoors.
The Noveske was designed for added back pressure in the firing of short barrel AR15s.
to you its horrible advice but to me with my experience my advice was sound. few years ago when the open end vortex type flash hiders were popular, we had them on all our carbines in assholistan. A guy on my team drop his rifle and it hit a rock at the right angle, can you guess the result? it bent the prong to a degree wear the shooter could not use his rifle because his bore was obstructed. that never would have happen if it had been a birdcage type hider. Not only that I have cut my leg doing dynamic movements over walls/berms because the edges of the prongs on the vortex and surefire prong flash hider are pretty sharp.
I find the dual port break argument to be mute. while yes it acts as a baffle to stop wear on your actual suppressor, in turn your saying you would have to dedicated run your suppressor (how many people actually do that?)
my advice for a straight up room clearing gun would be a bird cage type muzzle device if wanting to use a suppressor or if not wanting any need for suppression I would use the noveske PIG as others have stated.
You cut your leg on a flash hider doing "dynamic movements"?
Do you expect anyone to believe this dribble?
Wormydog1724
06-02-13, 13:17
.
Not only that I have cut my leg doing dynamic movements over walls/berms because the edges of the prongs on the vortex and surefire prong flash hider are pretty sharp.
Lol wut? :ph34r:
chose to believe me or not but I was trying to clear a grape berm in RC south my weapon was slung, my muzzle was pressed into my leg and got dragged pretty hard against my leg. my pants and leg hard about a 2 inch gash on it. at first I thought it was a vine, stick or rock that did it but I looked at my muzzle to make sure there wasn't dirt in it and sure enough there was a little blood and skin in my vortex.
Im just passing on my experience with prong type flash hiders. I don't know why people are acting like I called their momma a whore. I still have that flash hider.
I mean ive seen a lot weirder things happen, and when I say dynamic its just a fancy way of saying runnin around the desert in full kit. And to all you guys that think im being crazy or ridiculous PM me as im interested as to your real world experience with weapons and equipment.
SeriousStudent
06-02-13, 17:09
You cut your leg on a flash hider doing "dynamic movements"?
Do you expect anyone to believe this dribble?
I'm not calling anybody out here, just offering a thought.
Do a Google search on the phrase "Sua Sponte" and then think about the numbers like this: 1/75.
I have a pair of Vortex flash hiders, and they can be sharp.
So think about that, and consider cutting the man some slack.
Carry on.
SeriousStudent
06-02-13, 17:52
Really?
Yes, really. Is there something you want to share with me via a PM?
Really?
bp7178,
Why are you so but hurt over what I said. Everyone is entitled to their opinion, I respect yours even if I don't agree with it. Im not going to essentially call you a liar or bash you as this is the internet and that's not my style.
I think everyone wouldn't like being told that a experience that happen to them was a lie from some one on the internet. I'm serious, PM with your experience of how many deployments to Iraq and Afghanistan you have completed and with who, as that will give me a better gauge of who im talking to.
Andy
RLTW!
Wormydog1724
06-02-13, 18:33
I didn't know what I didn't know. Sorry for the previous post. I had just never heard of the vortex's being so sharp as to cut someone. The few I've had and handled didn't seem that sharp. Again sorry for the post.
SeriousStudent
06-02-13, 18:47
Hey Wormydog1724,
No worries.
The biggest challenge for most people with the Vortex is the "ping" that some people hear. I'm old and deaf as a post, and wear Surefire plugs and Sordins. I don't hear it. I know others do.
Other folks have had challenges with the tines breaking off. There have been several photos posted on here, I think, but it was years ago. Guys run, hit a barrier and fall, or the thing hits a curb and breaks. Anything can break, it's life. Stuff happens, you drive on.
Mine are pretty old, and they may have changed the design a little. I have one on a BCM 16" middy and had another on a LMT 16" carbine. I bet they were made at least 8 years ago, because they were old when I got them. It's entirely possible the folks at Smith have "dulled" them a bit.
They are definitely awesome at flash suppression, which is why they stayed on the weapons. My days of running at port arms are decades in the past, thank goodness.
How about a BCM Comp Mod 0 or 1?
Other folks have had challenges with the tines breaking off
I as well have heard of this problem
I put my vortex on my MK-12 type rifle that had a 18in stainless Steele barrel, when you charged the rifle the ping was so pronounced it felt like I was playing a musical instrument. I couldn't notic it when firing though.
bp7178,
Why are you so but hurt over what I said. Everyone is entitled to their opinion, I respect yours even if I don't agree with it. Im not going to essentially call you a liar or bash you as this is the internet and that's not my style.
I think everyone wouldn't like being told that a experience that happen to them was a lie from some one on the internet. I'm serious, PM with your experience of how many deployments to Iraq and Afghanistan you have completed and with who, as that will give me a better gauge of who im talking to.
Andy
RLTW!
Because I think you made it up to support your point. If not an outright lie, some degree of confabulation.
Not only that I have cut my leg doing dynamic movements over walls/berms because the edges of the prongs on the vortex and surefire prong flash hider are pretty sharp.
This statement is so ambiguous. You claim to have cut your leg on what you later state is a Vortex flash hider, but when you originally big up the point its "because the edges of the prongs on the vortex and surefire prong flash hider are pretty sharp".
Which one was it? How many open end flash hiders have cut you?
If I bust you in the shin with a hard object you're probably going to bleed, and it has nothing to do with sharp edges on a flash hider.
That point aside, the other points you made in your post were equally weak, which really makes me doubt everything you type.
I've met so many people in LE and the mil that have zero knowledge of the technical, or skill, side of firearms. Everyone in a gun forum was a hard core face shooter. No one ever cooked, drove a truck, or managed logistics.
I'm not going to PM you. I have no desire to converse with you. I'm going to edit my ignore list.
ok guy I see what your doing, you have insecurities so anything I say is wrong or unclear? what ever im sorry to hurt you feelings.
by the way everyone in the army has their place and does a needed job for the most part. But I guess more gun centric guys choose to go into combat arms for the very reason they like shooting and handling guns, so im not sure what your trying to say.
It was a vortex that cut my leg, I have no formal experience behind a surefire tuning fork but after handling one a couple of years ago I felt it was similar enough to the vortex to mention that it probably suffers from the same issues of the vortex. when we were issued our scars they had AAC blackouts that felt even more sharp than the vortex. Luckily I never had any issue with the AAC blackout.
danpass,
I have several friends who are special operation veterans that say they are very pleased with the BCM muzzle device, some say that the Battle comp does a little better a managing recoil. I have not gotten to shoot the BCM but I have a custom ak74 being made that is coming with a BCM 1.0. I am real interested to see how it does.
I've met so many people in LE and the mil that have zero knowledge of the technical, or skill, side of firearms. Everyone in a gun forum was a hard core face shooter. No one ever cooked, drove a truck, or managed logistics.
I'm not going to PM you. I have no desire to converse with you. I'm going to edit my ignore list.
I never said anything about being a tier 0 operator, i was just telling a story. Actually at that specific time I was just a regular light infantryman. Go firgue, A civilian that knows more about gun fighting than a soldier... Maybe im wrong but if I was you would have already PM me. Just stop please.
And if anyone including moderators think im out there please tell me.
*one alibi, the cut was on the meaty side of my thigh. it was a cut. Just due to the fact that you find this story so unbelievable and crazy says a lot of your experience with firearms.
Obscenejesster
06-02-13, 19:50
Came across this picture today. If flash suppression is important to you then I guess you should stay away from the Battle Comp.
http://i978.photobucket.com/albums/ae266/jrwingate6/46410e1c-5fe2-45f8-8c9f-3a8a11c39a2a_zpscf075600.jpg (http://s978.photobucket.com/user/jrwingate6/media/46410e1c-5fe2-45f8-8c9f-3a8a11c39a2a_zpscf075600.jpg.html)
Came across this picture today. If flash suppression is important to you then I guess you should stay away from the Battle Comp.
http://i978.photobucket.com/albums/ae266/jrwingate6/46410e1c-5fe2-45f8-8c9f-3a8a11c39a2a_zpscf075600.jpg (http://s978.photobucket.com/user/jrwingate6/media/46410e1c-5fe2-45f8-8c9f-3a8a11c39a2a_zpscf075600.jpg.html)
Neat pic, but isn't necessarily useful. What ammo is being used is important as not all have flash inhibitors in the powder.
Came across this picture today. If flash suppression is important to you then I guess you should stay away from the Battle Comp.
You came across a picture in which you have no context or framework of what is going on. In posting this, you are alluding to this being what the Battlecomps look like all the time when they are being fired. They don't, but that doesn't mean there can't be a large flash on occasion, especially with certain types of ammunition.
You then go on to make a comment which shows you are not familiar at all with the actual item, and please don't try saying you own one and this is what it looks like all the time when you shoot.
Neat pic, but isn't necessarily useful. What ammo is being used is important as not all have flash inhibitors in the powder.
Along with barrel length. BCM pretty well nailed it for me with their GUNFIGHTER Compensator. Here is what LAV had to say about the GUNFIGHTER Compensator after testing it last year.
Ok as promised I ran an informal test today with several students after the first day of my Vegas carbine class - the weapons used were a 16 inch M4 with A2 flash hider, a 16 inch M4 with a Battlecomp 1.0 , and a Bravo Company 14.5 with permanently attached BCMGunfighter comp
Ammo used was PMC Bronze
Tests were conducted to determine muzzle flash (at dusk and getting darker by the minute ) , muzzle blast to sides and rear angles, felt recoil mitigation, rapid fire controllability, and dust signature in the prone
Range was dusty, dry, and rocky
The A2 was always shot first to establish a baseline then the Battlecomp and lastly the BCMGunfighter comp
As expected the A2 had the least flash, slightly less dust signature ( down range vs to the sides ), least muzzle blast and provided the least control in the rapid fire test
In every test the BCMGunfighter was equal to or better than the Battlecomp - it had the same dust signature, slightly better flash reduction, dramatically better blast (concussion) than the Battlecomp and was picked as being preferrable in rapid fire due to the different 'feel' of the recoil ( highly subjective - nevertheless there was a consensus on the topic ) - when you factor in it is cheaper by $40 or so then it is a no brainer; every single person involved in the test felt it was superior 'tactical' comp than the Battlecomp and everyone stated if they were in the market to buy a comp they would purchase the Bravo Company over the Battlecomp
Make no mistake if you want a good flash suppressor buy one ; this ain't it - if you want the worlds best comp this ain't it
But it is perhaps the new industry standard in 'hybrid' devices that walk a fine line between the two diametrically opposing requirements - and it has the least muzzle blast by a large margin of any comp I have ever seen
So there you have it from an admitted opponent of muzzle comps in general - if you want one on your carbine, look at the Bravo Company offering first as it is, as far as I can tell, the new standard
Be safe
LAV
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Obscenejesster
06-02-13, 20:39
You came across a picture in which you have no context or framework of what is going on. In posting this, you are alluding to this being what the Battlecomps look like all the time when they are being fired. They don't, but that doesn't mean there can't be a large flash on occasion, especially with certain types of ammunition.
You then go on to make a comment which shows you are not familiar at all with the actual item, and please don't try saying you own one and this is what it looks like all the time when you shoot.
Nope, I don't own one. I said I came across this picture. From what I've read, the Battle Comp is not ideal if you don't want people seeing your flash from down range.
I found this video to be pretty informing regarding muzzle devices.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YqlikAdNoGo
The Battlecomp isn't the ideal flash suppressor, but the one I have only occasionally flares up and has never given me such a dramatic fireball in over 3k of Federal 5.56, even when shooting in the dark. The BABC mounted on an 18" Para FAL has even less of a flash signature using a variety of military 7.62x51 ammo. Both rifles have less muzzle rise with the Battlecomp than they do without. The side blast on the AR with the BC is a bit more than with an A2 birdcage, but feels softer- not as sharp.
I haven't tried the BCM yet.
I really like the BC, which is saying something as I hate muzzle brakes in general
RogerinTPA
06-02-13, 22:09
I have a BC1.0 on my DD MK18 and from a shooter's perspective, you won't even notice it. I have them on 4 guns and it really does tame the recoil, BUT, the guys to my left and right claim it has a pretty good concussion thump while being 90 degrees of the device. It's all about finding a compromise for me. No one device does everything you want it to do, but my primary concern is to get faster, accurate, and multiple hits. Flash and concussion comes in second and third.
The BCs do an adequate job with muzzle flash, and I have ones that do hide the flash really well, but doesn't provide me the stabilization of the BCs in multiple target engagements, failure and NSR drills. I think the BCs have a more tamer concussion than any other device I've tried before or have been exposed to during a carbine class, with most of the folks shooting around me in agreement. If you're really worried about being more courteous to your teammates, then I agree with the others that the Noveske Pig may be the better solution.
Obscenejesster
06-02-13, 23:03
@Rogerin or anyone else who wants to chime in. What comps in your opinion do the best job of keeping the concussion from the shooter? I'm not really concerned with others positioned at 90 degree angles. Just concerned with what I the shooter hears.
Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk 2
Based on reviews here and elsewhere, my next upper build will have a
Griffin Armament M4SD II Flash Comp-XHP556Flashcomp. Running a BC 1.0, and while effective, would like to reduce the muzzle flash some.
Mark
RogerinTPA
06-03-13, 17:25
@Rogerin or anyone else who wants to chime in. What comps in your opinion do the best job of keeping the concussion from the shooter? I'm not really concerned with others positioned at 90 degree angles. Just concerned with what I the shooter hears.
Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk 2
My use with the BCs or any other comp or flash hider I've used, I don't experience any, none, nada from a shooters perspective. Start moving within a 30-90 degree arc of the side blast, you'll start feeling it, at least I do when shooting next to people who use a comp. It will cause you enough annoyance to start to adjust your shooting position away from it. In a static position, it's not an issue. When you run online to the next position, and everyone is not online when you start to shoot, you'll notice it from their gun. Shoot a comp indoors in a shoot house and ooh mama the concussion will ring your bell, regardless of who has one.
Obscenejesster
06-03-13, 18:41
So you wouldn't recommend using a comp in an indoor range?
RogerinTPA
06-03-13, 19:07
So you wouldn't recommend using a comp in an indoor range?
Indoor ranges are fine. My 2 local ranges are indoor types and have used them in those for a long time. It may tick off the people in the stalls next to you, but I personally don't mind. I'm talking a confined area, like inside a house (Hallway, room, etc...).
Wormydog1724
06-03-13, 19:27
I've tried a few different comps and the two that really rattled my teeth were the old Spike's muzzle brake, and teh FSC556. Both of those were outdoors in teh wide open plains of God's Country. Keep in mind I have an AAC 51T Brake on a 10.3" and a Battle Comp 2.0 on a 11.5" (previously on the 10.3"). Neither one of those bother me near as bad as the FSC556. 3 mags with the FSC556 and it was off my gun and in the mail on to its next owner. I just couldn't handle it. At 3 Gun matches, the Nordic Corvette Comp, Mickulek Brake, and there's one other that just seem louder than the rest, as an observer not the shooter. This probably doesn't help anyone hear though. (Pun, get it... hear? instead of Here? Ha! I crack myself up.) :jester:
If flash suppression is your concern, the blackout and vortex are amazing.
You can train to shoot pretty fast with a FH. It just takes more work (skill maybe?)
A comp will be faster for more people. But, at what cost?
I run a FH. But I would have no prob running a hybrid comp flashhider.
The vortex does have surprisingly sharp edges. With enough force you could slice yourself with the leading edge of the tines.
It may tick off the people in the stalls next to you, but I personally don't mind.
This one made me laugh. A gentleman in the lane next to me, the last time I was out at the range, was running a rifle with a BC... I just let him run through his mag, reloading as he shot, and shooting as he reloaded. He offered to let me run a few rounds through the rifle and I have to admit, the blast when you're behind the rifle is unnoticeable. When you're next to it, it's unbearable.
RogerinTPA
06-04-13, 10:19
If flash suppression is your concern, the blackout and vortex are amazing.
You can train to shoot pretty fast with a FH. It just takes more work (skill maybe?)
A comp will be faster for more people. But, at what cost?
I run a FH. But I would have no prob running a hybrid comp flashhider.
The vortex does have surprisingly sharp edges. With enough force you could slice yourself with the leading edge of the tines.
The same argument is made for short barreled rifles. Lots of people worried about shooting themselves in the thigh or foot. It's about an individual not using the weapon enough, whether training on the range, in a carbine class or training at home dry firing with snap caps, practicing manipulations. It's about being familiar & comfortable with your mindset in safety and weapons handling. Same can be said for any other dangerous sport or implement. Don't watch what you're doing, you get got. If you follow the 4 rules and stay muzzle aware like you're supposed to, all skeptical arguments become invalid.
I agree, the FSC just hurts. My boss has a FSC on both of his SCARs (16" and 10-11"-ish) and both are loud but the shorty is a migraine machine. The BC on my 12.5 pistol upper i had wasn't as bad as i thought it would be, and i want to try the BCM comp on a SBR and see how that is.
I've tried a few different comps and the two that really rattled my teeth were the old Spike's muzzle brake, and teh FSC556. Both of those were outdoors in teh wide open plains of God's Country. Keep in mind I have an AAC 51T Brake on a 10.3" and a Battle Comp 2.0 on a 11.5" (previously on the 10.3"). Neither one of those bother me near as bad as the FSC556. 3 mags with the FSC556 and it was off my gun and in the mail on to its next owner. I just couldn't handle it. At 3 Gun matches, the Nordic Corvette Comp, Mickulek Brake, and there's one other that just seem louder than the rest, as an observer not the shooter. This probably doesn't help anyone hear though. (Pun, get it... hear? instead of Here? Ha! I crack myself up.) :jester:
The same argument is made for short barreled rifles. Lots of people worried about shooting themselves in the thigh or foot. It's about an individual not using the weapon enough, whether training on the range, in a carbine class or training at home dry firing with snap caps, practicing manipulations. It's about being familiar & comfortable with your mindset in safety and weapons handling. Same can be said for any other dangerous sport or implement. Don't watch what you're doing, you get got. If you follow the 4 rules and stay muzzle aware like you're supposed to, all skeptical arguments become invalid.
I'm not saying its an issue. I'm simply confirming what the Mod said.
I do like my Battlecomps, Ops Inc, AAC brakes. I have to give those new KAC MAMS a go in the near future.
Wormydog1724
06-04-13, 19:01
I justo got a KAC Triple Tap!!!! :cool::cool::cool:
Haven't put it on yet.... :mad:
Yes this is a 'facebook-esque' post. :suicide:
If anyone is curious here are some pics of my not yet installed BCM Comp Mod 1
http://www.danpassaro.com/img/s4/v66/p1842510970-4.jpg
http://www.danpassaro.com/img/s9/v87/p1821017239-4.jpg
If you are running this on a 16 inch gun it works as advertised. I bought one for my 11.5 BCM upper and its a beast. Lots of flash still and the concussion is pretty big but reduces recoil pretty well. Tried it on a 16 inch gun first, and it worked much better. haven't tried a BC yet so I don't know how they compare.
Based on reviews here and elsewhere, my next upper build will have a
Griffin Armament M4SD II Flash Comp-XHP556Flashcomp. Running a BC 1.0, and while effective, would like to reduce the muzzle flash some.
Mark
the_0perator
06-05-13, 14:18
I agree, the FSC just hurts. My boss has a FSC on both of his SCARs (16" and 10-11"-ish) and both are loud but the shorty is a migraine machine. The BC on my 12.5 pistol upper i had wasn't as bad as i thought it would be, and i want to try the BCM comp on a SBR and see how that is.
I just recently put an FSC556 on my 14.5 and was expecting to get my bell rung when I squeezed the trigger and honestly I was shocked that it was nothing like I expected. It was even outdoors underneath a 12 x 12 canvas tent (hot Texas sun was beating down on us) and it still was not terrible. I had originally put in ear plugs underneath my Peltors expecting something nasty, but by 3rd clip I had ditched the ear plugs. My brother in law, who was shooting his Wilson Recon, put a few down range with my AR and he even mentioned how smooth the it cycled and not one word about the sound.
I understand that the FSC556 is supposed to be one of the worst as far as concussion goes, but I must say I was expecting something much much worse. Maybe because the internets psyched me up a bit? Who knows, but as far as the muzzle control, it was very impressive.
Wormydog1724
06-05-13, 18:45
Put 80 rounds through the Triple Tap today. It does a great job at controlling the muzzle, I was able to put 4 consecutive rounds very quickly on to a 8x10" piece of steel at 50 yards, would have done more but my make-shift target stand fell over. :(
The concussion or blast seemed a bit less than my Battle Comp that was just on the same gun. I'm not sure it really was less, maybe just 'different' is a more better word. One thing is for sure, holy fireball batman. The Triple Tap threw a huge fireball every shot, noticeable to me, the shooter, in bright sunshine. The Battle Comp did it once or twice a mag. Same Tula ammo for both. 11.5" barrel. I'm happy with the Triple Tap. Can't wait to shoot with it some more.
That is all.
Thats awesome Wormy, I've always wanted a triple tap, but like most the cost is what has kept me away so far.
I just recently put an FSC556 on my 14.5 and was expecting to get my bell rung when I squeezed the trigger and honestly I was shocked that it was nothing like I expected. It was even outdoors underneath a 12 x 12 canvas tent (hot Texas sun was beating down on us) and it still was not terrible. I had originally put in ear plugs underneath my Peltors expecting something nasty, but by 3rd clip I had ditched the ear plugs. My brother in law, who was shooting his Wilson Recon, put a few down range with my AR and he even mentioned how smooth the it cycled and not one word about the sound.
I understand that the FSC556 is supposed to be one of the worst as far as concussion goes, but I must say I was expecting something much much worse. Maybe because the internets psyched me up a bit? Who knows, but as far as the muzzle control, it was very impressive.
I should have clarified in my post that to the shooter it's not bad, but to the bystanders is where the ouch time comes into play.
So you wouldn't recommend using a comp in an indoor range?
I shoot my 11.5 SBR with BattleComp 1.0 at the local indoor range all the time. I do wear plugs-under-muffs, but I do that for all carbines anyway. I don't find the noise or blast particularly intrusive. Maybe adjacent shooters are just too polite (this is Minnesota) but no one has complained to me about noise or blast including the range officers.
patrick0525
06-07-13, 05:28
How do you install the ares armor effin a compensator using the two crush washers supplied ?
Supposedly, its the following orientation: barrel )( compensator
Is this correct?
How do you install the ares armor effin a compensator using the two crush washers supplied ?
Supposedly, its the following orientation: barrel )( compensator
Is this correct?
No. You use one washer between barrel and comp (in '(' fashion). Second one goes between comp and thread protector at end of comp (also '('). Second one is not necessary if you will torque thread protector very tight. BTW those are not crush washers, but reusable spring washers.
patrick0525
06-07-13, 16:19
Thanks, so you are saying that if i torque the cap to the thread protector sufficiently I should be GTG. Some videos suggest using blue locitite. What are the + and - on this technique?
Neat pic, but isn't necessarily useful. What ammo is being used is important as not all have flash inhibitors in the powder.
I shot a Battle Comp at night, and on a 16" barrel flash is probably 30% more than A2 (and A2 was eye visible dull red flash about the size of a quarter). So BCE flash on the 16" was not enough to confuse or night blind, not messing with night vision etc. That's really neglidgable. It's a trade off- with a 3 prong you get total flash elimination, and no recoil control, so your target engagement speed is reduced. With the Battle Comp and similar devices (MAMS, TTB, Flash Comp) you increase engagement speed dramatically.
In my opinion I'll take negligible flash for dramatically faster precision shot placement. Speed and accuracy are as important as concealment, and those devices that accomodate sound suppressors allow the end user to mitigate flash better than a flash suppressor at night, giving the best of both worlds.
On the short guns unfortunately it's a can or a three prong or other hybrid flash suppressor, as they have enough flash to contend with that it is important to use a good flash suppressor.
BufordTJustice
08-11-13, 13:14
I just recently put an FSC556 on my 14.5 and was expecting to get my bell rung when I squeezed the trigger and honestly I was shocked that it was nothing like I expected. It was even outdoors underneath a 12 x 12 canvas tent (hot Texas sun was beating down on us) and it still was not terrible. I had originally put in ear plugs underneath my Peltors expecting something nasty, but by 3rd clip I had ditched the ear plugs. My brother in law, who was shooting his Wilson Recon, put a few down range with my AR and he even mentioned how smooth the it cycled and not one word about the sound.
I understand that the FSC556 is supposed to be one of the worst as far as concussion goes, but I must say I was expecting something much much worse. Maybe because the internets psyched me up a bit? Who knows, but as far as the muzzle control, it was very impressive.
This has been my experience as well. I run an FSC 556 on my BCM 14.5" middy and I'm VERY pleased with it.
I'm a patrol deputy so being "in stack" doesn't happen nearly as often as it does to a swat guy.
Recoil pulse is much smoother than with the BC. It feels a lot like the surefire brake for the shooter. Muzzle rise is non existent.
Sent from my SPH-D710 using Tapatalk 2
Anyone have experience with the Effin-A Compensator? I have one on my personal rifle but am restricted from modifying our rifles at work . I find it an excellent comp as far as controlling muzzle rise and target reacquisition after a shot.. As for the OP.s concerns I have no experience.....anyone?
I put a BC 2.0 on my personal weapon, because that's what Jersey wants, even though I'm LE. We can't have a flash hinder. Has to be sold as a compensatory. I was in the military (Army Light Inf) and have plenty of time using the A2 flash hinder, and I much prefer the A2. My weapon is a LE6920 with a 16" barrel.
My buddy and I went to the range. I took my M4 and he took his duty rifle (also a 6920) with the A2 on it. IMO, big difference in sound and flash. He was about 5 meters to my right and he later said that the concussion was annoying to the point of almost pissing him off. I could tell that there was a difference in the noise level and had him put a few roundst with it with me standing to the side. Very noticeable.
Performance wise, I'd would say its the same as the A2.
A MD review with some rock n roll AR style :dance3:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3_004H7tVgg
guitarist1993
09-29-13, 21:50
Anyone tried the Lantac Dragn yet? Looks cool, looks loud as **** too.
Boba Fett v2
09-30-13, 01:10
I've not used it but this gets good reviews:
http://griffinarmament.com/accessories/centerfire-muzzle/m4sd-flash-comp/
ETA: Above is a comp with flash suppression properties. Here is a thread on a flash suppressor with comp properties:
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=122997
I'm now running the M4QD/NT4 mount variant of the GA comp. No complaints.
http://griffinarmament.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/04/nt41.png
Anyone have experience with the Effin-A Compensator? I have one on my personal rifle but am restricted from modifying our rifles at work . I find it an excellent comp as far as controlling muzzle rise and target reacquisition after a shot..
I have it. It seem to be great at keeping muzzle at target IF properly tuned. However it is also big and heavy chunk of steel. I would gladly try light weight version (called Effin-B if I remember correctly). Also I had problem to properly torque it. I had tendency to unscrew even if I used Rocksett. Maybe I'm doing something wrong, but I have not had this problem with other brake/comps I installed on same rifle.
HuntingTime
09-30-13, 16:22
I just picked up the new EFFIN A called the MKII. It is much lighter than the first. They both work great to keep you on target if you tune it right, which doesn't take much work. I used four of the set screws on each I haven't had an issue with either comp working itself off yet.
Ned Christiansen
10-06-13, 17:47
I think I have mentioned elsewhere, our deal next year is going to be "no comps in class". We have heretofore discouraged their use, offered students to change out to A1 or A2 FH's for $5, and when they are permanently attached, put on temporary shrouds for the duration of the class to shut them up. We have dealt with the noise and blast hazard long enough. If it has a blast face in it, it comes off one way or another the first morning. Back to flash hiders or nothing at all.
Gratuitous 3-pronged flash hider pic. Hard to believe this worked eh?
http://i368.photobucket.com/albums/oo125/NedChristiansen/DSC02348.jpg
I have read several post from cops/ fellow members who say they run comp type muzzle devices. I read the excuse from one officer who said that because he is just a patrol officer that being "in a stack" is unlikely. I do not agree with this as I'm sure most agencies in this country train officers to at least wait for another if not more officers before clearing buildings/ structures. We know that more and more patrol officers are having to use their carbines, probably more so than SWAT members.
I think having a comp even like the BC will have a high potential to degrade the concentration and focus of fellow officers who are clearing rooms with you. Most patrol cops don't run around with peltors on their head or even keep them in the trunk. I had a upper with 14.5 in mid barrel with a BC and when doing some team based tactical training I was told that it q a little ridiculousness and keep in mind every one had peltors on.
Defensive/offensive fighting with a gun is different than shooting a competition or even taking fundamental basic carbine class that is conducted on a flat range.
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