View Full Version : Heavy Buffers A5 buffers
http://www.heavybuffers.com/vltor.html
Just saw these on the where can I get it thread and was wondering if anyone has any experience with them.
I apologise if this has already been covered, I searched but only found stuff about the vltor ones.
Interesting. Their HS buffer costs $75?! My A5H4 was $56. Why is theirs worth $20 more?
So they're not VLTOR and they're not cheaper...what's my incentive?
Interesting. Their HS buffer costs $75?! My A5H4 was $56. Why is theirs worth $20 more?
So they're not VLTOR and they're not cheaper...what's my incentive?
I was thinking that you may actually be able to buy one. The Vltor a5 buffers are non existent at this point.
I've managed to conjure up a couple over the past few months...
I've heard that Vltor is correcting the supply issue on the buffers and they'll be ramping up over the next few months.
I guess it's only $20extra but I don't need a different buffer that badly.
Could be a nice alternative for someone who has to have one ASAP.
Wonder why their weight breakdowns are different than VLTORs?
Heavy Buffers:
H-4.0oz
H2-4.5oz
H3-5.5oz
HS-6.5oz
XH-10.0oz
VLTOR:
H0-3.8oz
H1-4.56oz
H2-5.3oz
H3-6.08oz
H4-6.83oz
These buffers ranger from $55 - $125 depending on weight
Sketchy looking website anyway... :confused:
These buffers ranger from $55 - $125 depending on weight
Right I was just trying to compare apples to apples.
A5H4 - 6.83oz and $56
HS - 6.5oz and $75
But they have Tactical Girls
http://www.heavybuffers.com/images/Products/2013girls.jpg
Wonder why their weight breakdowns are different than VLTORs?
Their buffer bodies are Stainless steel. No way to match the Vltor weights and keep internal and outer dimensions the same.
You can only mix/match buffer weights so much.
Slash makes good stuff. These should prove to be a good alternative for anyone wanting a buffer for many different applications without the wait.
Slash makes good stuff. These should prove to be a good alternative for anyone wanting a buffer for many different applications without the wait.
So this guy/business is legit?
I'm not trying to doo doo on it... just hard to trust new pop ups in this market. ;)
So this guy/business is legit?
I'm not trying to doo doo on it... just hard to trust new pop ups in this market. ;)
Yeah, they've been around for quite some time now. I bought their 9Q Heavy 9mm buffer from them back in '07 or so and several others since then. They've been advertising over in Arfcom for years which is where I first found them. Good company to deal with.
Slash makes those buffers with the powdered tungsten
I may try one. The is the last piece I need and I'm impatient. I have an A5H2 on b/o w/ Midway, but now is good.
Cool... yeah.. if I needed one now, I'd pay the price.
Cheapest shipping is $10. That puts it over the top as a no. $75 for the equivalent of something that's $47 shipped for the real deal is too much. I'll just keep swapping out the one I have.
I might try the h3 once I get my SBR upper back. It's being cut back to 11.5" and i have no idea how it'll function with the h4.
What size are you having the port opened up to?
I might try the h3 once I get my SBR upper back. It's being cut back to 11.5" and i have no idea how it'll function with the h4.
I've heard that Vltor is correcting the supply issue on the buffers and they'll be ramping up over the next few months.
Vltor has told us that the tungsten weights that they were outsourcing for were inconsistent in weight, they are working on bringing it in house so they can have better control.
But they have Tactical Girls
Ah Vanessa...
Vltor has told us that the tungsten weights that they were outsourcing for were inconsistent in weight, they are working on bringing it in house so they can have better control.
..
Hopefully soon, mines been back ordered with them for a while.
Hopefully soon, mines been back ordered with them for a while.
We have 100 complete kits on order since Shot Show and all we've received is receiver extensions.
Exiledviking
05-24-13, 18:43
Hopefully soon, mines been back ordered with them for a while.
+1. I'm also waiting.
What size are you having the port opened up to?
Leaving it as is for now. It's been at 12" and .067" + A5H4 buffet and runs 100% suppressed. Functions unsuppressed but won't lock back. If I have issues after cutting down to 11.5", I was thinking I would dial back buffer weight before changing the port. Upper will be suppressed all the time.
ETA: I've stated before port was around .062" but I mis measured.
I'm pretty sure that if you open that port up to around .074 it will run suppressed and unsuppressed 100%.
Leaving it as is for now. It's been at 12" and .067" + A5H4 buffet and runs 100% suppressed. Functions unsuppressed but won't lock back. If I have issues after cutting down to 11.5", I was thinking I would dial back buffer weight before changing the port. Upper will be suppressed all the time.
ETA: I've stated before port was around .062" but I mis measured.
BufordTJustice
05-25-13, 03:05
I guess it's only $20extra but I don't need a different buffer that badly.
Could be a nice alternative for someone who has to have one ASAP.
Wonder why their weight breakdowns are different than VLTORs?
Heavy Buffers:
H-4.0oz
H2-4.5oz
H3-5.5oz
HS-6.5oz
XH-10.0oz
VLTOR:
H0-3.8oz
H1-4.56oz
H2-5.3oz
H3-6.08oz
H4-6.83oz
I had Clint (slash) make me a custom carbine buffer a long time ago. Machine work was first rate and shipping was fast. He actually made mine from scratch. Mine was an XH body machined out to accept 3 internal weights. My brother uses it now in his Rainier Arms complete lower with a springco White spring....it actually feels damn similar to the A5 system and is definitely smoother than an H3 in his lower.
As for the weight difference, he tips his hand with this text on the webpage:
"Total buffer weight can be adjusted from 4.0 to 6.5 ounces, or up to 10.0 ounces with the optional Tungsten inserts, sold below."
So all buffer weights have steel inserts (I'm assuming coupled with plastic or delrin spacers) to adjust weight, and the 10oz XH buffer has 4 tungsten weights, which is similar to the Vltor A5H4.
I wonder if the pressure spring is included. I'll state that the trigger disconnector spring from Brownells seems to be VERY similar to the Vltor spring in both spring rate and dimension....one could easily use a dremel to machine a cavity into the delrin tip to accept the spring. Just sayin....
wetidlerjr
05-25-13, 07:06
Heavy Buffers is, definitely, GTG. I used one of his anti-tilt piston buffers when I had an Adams Arms conversion and it was a quality piece that functioned flawlessly for the time I had it. Whether or not the price is right will depend on your situation but I wouldn't hesitate to go with him again if need be.
I'm pretty sure that if you open that port up to around .074 it will run suppressed and unsuppressed 100%.
Great thanks!
I've used two of his buffers in Armalite AR10 carbines, one in a piston gun and one in a 9mm carbine.
Recently had him do some machine work to an AR10 barrel. Clint, aka Slash, is good to go!
I have had a great interest In heavybuffers.com for some time now. Mostly for a maten 308 build I have comming up. But after hearing Bufordjustice's testimonials, I am starting to think that maybe they have a place in 556 cars and Middys as well...... If you are running a NiB bcg. Why not simply try an h3??........ What I am thinking about is getting vltor a5 type performance while running a ubr stock, and after reading several threads and listing to guys who are experimenting with theese buffers I think it is possible. The only thing that concerned me is that slash's heavy buffers don't have reciprocating wieghts? They are stationary? Wouldn't that be bad for bolt bounce? So may be going the way of a custom buffer from heavybuffers.com ( bufford justice style) is the only way to go? Any more info and experiance on the slash heavy buffers would be great. And thanks for all the pm info buffordjustice! Good thread.
Have a 14.5in LWRC M6A2 with the Vltor A5 H4 using a Colt rifle spring.
In contrast to the docile rate of fire noted with the A5 and a regular M4 upper, the LWRC upper has a super fast ROF, I guess about 1000 rpm.
I am about to try a Tubbs flat wire spring or a Wolf XP, but I would like to know if anyone here has tried the monster 10oz HeavyBuffer XH A5 buffer?
the LWRC upper has a super fast ROF, I guess about 1000 rpm.
Dump it on ARFcom's EE and don't look back. :rolleyes:
Dump it on ARFcom's EE and don't look back. :rolleyes:
Friends don't let friends make the same mistakes they did.
Here is junior demonstrating poor technique, and how to dump 20 bucks in three seconds.
http://youtu.be/6L5y_eo8X5o
wetidlerjr
05-27-13, 03:11
Friends don't let friends make the same mistakes they did.
Here is junior demonstrating poor technique, and how to dump 20 bucks in three seconds.
http://youtu.be/6L5y_eo8X5o
Your video shows as private.
BufordTJustice
05-27-13, 03:51
Have a 14.5in LWRC M6A2 with the Vltor A5 H4 using a Colt rifle spring.
In contrast to the docile rate of fire noted with a the A5 and a regular M4 upper, the LWRC upper has a super fast ROF, I guess about 1000 rpm.
I am about to try a Tubbs flat wire spring or a Wolf XP, but I would like to know if anyone here has tried the monster 10gr HeavyBuffer XH A5 buffer?
I'd say a heavier buffer would have to reduce the ROF. Going to a wolff XP would increase the ROF. A Tubbs might increase it a smidge.
I say that heavier buffer is worth trying in your case. 1000 rpm is really fuggin high for a 16" barrel.
Your video shows as private.
Fixed it.
Slash makes good stuff. These should prove to be a good alternative for anyone wanting a buffer for many different applications without the wait.
I second that. I have one of his anti-tilt buffers. Turn around time and customer service was excellent. Buffer works as advertised. No more chewed up buffer tubes in my piston driven MRP.
I have had a great interest In heavybuffers.com for some time now. Mostly for a maten 308 build I have comming up. But after hearing Bufordjustice's testimonials, I am starting to think that maybe they have a place in 556 cars and Middys as well...... If you are running a NiB bcg. Why not simply try an h3??........ What I am thinking about is getting vltor a5 type performance while running a ubr stock, and after reading several threads and listing to guys who are experimenting with theese buffers I think it is possible. The only thing that concerned me is that slash's heavy buffers don't have reciprocating wieghts? They are stationary? Wouldn't that be bad for bolt bounce? So may be going the way of a custom buffer from heavybuffers.com ( bufford justice style) is the only way to go? Any more info and experiance on the slash heavy buffers would be great. And thanks for all the pm info buffordjustice! Good thread.
Bolt bounce is a non-issue in semi auto ARs. My buffer does not have the typical sliding weights and I have had no issues of the bolt bouncing out of battery in the past couple thousand rounds, even with bumpfiring from my shoulder.
Bolt bounce is a non-issue in semi auto ARs. My buffer does not have the typical sliding weights and I have had no issues of the bolt bouncing out of battery in the past couple thousand rounds, even with bumpfiring from my shoulder.
It takes a high speed camera to see the problem. It doesn't cause stoppages in semi auto, but that doesn't make it acceptable.
And the fact that you're talking about bump firing pretty much lumps you into the ZERO credibility category.
agree. but man, i REALLY hope this thread doesn't derail.......
any one using a slash heavy buffer buffer in an carbine or middy.....please share your results and experience.
It takes a high speed camera to see the problem. It doesn't cause stoppages in semi auto, but that doesn't make it acceptable.
And the fact that you're talking about bump firing pretty much lumps you into the ZERO credibility category.
Lighten up Francis. Some of us aren't tier 1 mall ninjas, like yourself.
The bumpfiring was to see if I could induce a malfunction. It did not.
Hemoglobin
05-27-13, 10:34
^^ and here we go.
this was a interesting thread for a while. The buffer availability was the only thing keeping me from trying the A5 too.
This thread needs pics of the guts.
agree. but man, i REALLY hope this thread doesn't derail.......
any one using a slash heavy buffer buffer in an carbine or middy.....please share your results and experience.
Well...... shit.
Is Slash using the spring inside? Since that is the Voltr patented part, I imagine he's steering clear of it. I actually think the spring is the good part of the system. Since BCM is selling the RE/spring and buffer kits with the H2 buffer I will probably pick a couple up and use the buffers to build/test my own H3 and H4 buffers. Save the other parts for later builds.
It takes a high speed camera to see the problem. It doesn't cause stoppages in semi auto, but that doesn't make it acceptable.
Can accelerate bolt/chamber wear. Which obviously isn't immediate, but the bounce is indicative of other issues (over gassed, buffer weight under spec, etc).
BufordTJustice
05-27-13, 20:41
Bolt bounce is a non-issue in semi auto ARs. My buffer does not have the typical sliding weights and I have had no issues of the bolt bouncing out of battery in the past couple thousand rounds, even with bumpfiring from my shoulder.
Anything that puts MORE stress on the bolt is never a non-issue.
There is simply no reason to setup a gun to run like that. Period. End of story.
Anything that puts MORE stress on the bolt is never a non-issue.
There is simply no reason to setup a gun to run like that. Period. End of story.
Cite?
I have never read anything that says bolt bounce stresses the bolt in semi auto firing.
At a minimum you're accelerating wear on the lugs, Barrel extension, and gas rings... possibly the cam pin too.. depending on how bad the bounce is.
An additional partial unlock EVERY time you fire a round will add up over the life of the weapon. There's just no reason to have an improperly functioning weapon.
At a minimum you're accelerating wear on the lugs, Barrel extension, and gas rings... possibly the cam pin too.. depending on how bad the bounce is.
An additional partial unlock EVERY time you fire a round will add up over the life of the weapon. There's just no reason to have an improperly functioning weapon.
I'll buy that.
Though the stresses on the bolt from firing and cycling have to be many times greater than the stresses from bouncing slightly out of battery. I find it hard to conclude that bolt bounce will cause significant wear over the typical lifetime of a bolt.
Just because it's rocket science, doesn't mean it's complicated.
Here's a free fish for ya- The carrier is bouncing because it is hitting the barrel extension so hard, the shock wave is reflected back to the carrier with enough energy to cause it to bounce, even against the damping of the buffer and the press of the spring. That means the carrier is closing with too much momentum. The carrier may not bounce enough to cause the bolt to unlock, however, this type of impact will cause long term damage to the action with peening and fracturing being the two most common affects.
Maybe the damage will be so slight as to be insignificant in a practical sense. Then again, it may not. Carrier bounce does mean something is out of balance and the AR is that much closer to failing
BufordTJustice
05-28-13, 12:25
Just because it's rocket science, doesn't mean it's complicated.
Here's a free fish for ya- The carrier is bouncing because it is hitting the barrel extension so hard, the shock wave is reflected back to the carrier with enough energy to cause it to bounce, even against the damping of the buffer and the press of the spring. That means the carrier is closing with too much momentum. The carrier may not bounce enough to cause the bolt to unlock, however, this type of impact will cause long term damage to the action with peening and fracturing being the two most common affects.
Maybe the damage will be so slight as to be insignificant in a practical sense. Then again, it may not. Carrier bounce does mean something is out of balance and the AR is that much closer to failing
afroney, MistWolf summed it up as well as I would have, if not better.
The Spikes powder buffer is the only non-carbine-weight buffer that allows for any meaningful amount of bolt bounce. Since the Vltor A5 system shoots smoother, there are zero legitimate reasons to set a gun up to have bolt bounce when one could have a gun that is more reliable and that shoots smoother WITHOUT bolt bounce.
You stated this earlier:
I have had no issues of the bolt bouncing out of battery in the past couple thousand rounds
The bolt does not bounce completely out of battery, the bolt comes out of full lockup with the lugs experiencing an additional shearing force against the barrel extension and also additional shock loading as they rotate back and forth against the barrel extension. The cam pin hole gets to share in this party with increased shock loading as well.
As I stated before, there is simply no benefit to configuring a gun to run like this. You would get less recoil with the Vltor A5 system AND more reliability. Hell, an H3 buffer would give the Spikes a run for its money in smoothness AND it would completely eliminate bolt bounce.
If you can't come to terms with the technical and practical reasons for not running a tungsten powder buffer like the spikes, then maybe this forum isn't for you.
I'm not knocking spikes. They're local to me....I use one of their lowers for my patrol carbine. But this buffer is equal parts buffoonery and gimmick. It is a classic example of unintended consequences.
afroney, MistWolf summed it up as well as I would , if not better.
The Spikes powder buffer is the only non-carbine-weight buffer that allows for any meaningful amount of bolt bounce. Since the Vltor A5 system shoots smoother, there are zero legitimate reasons to set a gun up to have bolt bounce when one could have a gun that is more reliable and that shoots smoother WITHOUT bolt bounce.
You stated this earlier:
The bolt does not bounce completely out of battery, the bolt comes out of full lockup with the lugs experiencing an additional shearing force against the barrel extension and also additional shock loading as they rotate back and forth against the barrel extension. The cam pin hole gets to share in this party with increased shock loading as well.
As I stated before, there is simply no benefit to configuring a gun to run like this. You would get less recoil with the Vltor A5 system AND more reliability. Hell, an H3 buffer would give the Spikes a run for its money in smoothness AND it would completely eliminate bolt bounce.
If you can't come to terms with the technical and practical reasons for not running a tungsten powder buffer like the spikes, then maybe this forum isn't for you.
I'm not knocking spikes. They're local to me....I use one of their lowers for my patrol carbine. But this buffer is equal parts buffoonery and gimmick. It is a classic example of unintended consequences.
I was actually talking about my experience with the anti-tilt buffer that Slash makes and my experience doing business with him. Believe me, I would have liked to have the sliding weights as per mil spec, but the buffers stainless construction does not allow for an H buffer to be made with the weights.
I'd like to run a regular H2 buffer, but I shoot underpowered commie ammo that would short stroke on anything heavier than H and I would destroy extention tubes without Slash's anti tilt buffer.
I have a new middy built but missing a NiB bcg buffer and spring. Already have a ubr so the vltor a5 is out. Now I need a ubr compatable alternative. Was originally going to go with 6.5oz. Hss buffer from heavybuffers.com just to experament a bit, but now considering the much cheaper bcm h3. I emailed Clint, he said the weights in the stainless slash buffer do reciprocate (ateast the 6.5 hss) So it functions just like a normal buffer. However if it is just too much for a middy And I some how can't NiB coat enough parts to make it run......then I am out some money, almost the same money can buy A bcm h2 and h3 ..... So I have a contingency plan. Really like the idea of a nice big 6.5 oz buffer though. I'm torn.
What I am thinking about is getting vltor a5 type performance while running a ubr stock
The rifle spring is what makes it perform like a rifle lower. Just run a standard carbine spring and the appropriate carbine buffer for your barrel if you want to run an UBR.
persona non grata
05-29-13, 02:00
Sketchy looking website anyway... :confused:
Fancy websites don't = Legitimacy
They do not. But they do help to legitimize a company...and assure a customer before they spend money. More often than not, the entity you pay and never receive product from, has a crappy website.
FYI, slash has been posting buffers for sale for years on www.sturmgewehr.com
Fancy websites don't = Legitimacy
I know... but in the current market with bottom feeders trying to get customers to finance their BCG scams.... I'm skeptical. ;)
wetidlerjr
05-29-13, 09:03
I know... but in the current market with bottom feeders trying to get customers to finance their BCG scams.... I'm skeptical. ;)
Heavy Buffers isn't a startup or a "bottom feeder" that is trying to scam anyone.
Yeah... we've cleared that up. People have experience with the guy.
Lol at you guys. It's not like some of you will have any ****ing choice. I was told last month by Vltor that they expected new buffers in approximately SIX MONTHS.
Figure they were wrong it was "only" four months (seriously, if it takes you four to make those buffers, something is up... let alone SIX MONTHS)... Plus a month ago, means I'd probably not expect to see any buffers at Midway or where ever until at least the middle or end of July.
If you need a buffer soon, buy a Clint buffer, get whatever one will allow you to replace the weights, add a little spring cup and spring yourself.
Figure they were wrong it was "only" four months (seriously, if it takes you four to make those buffers, something is up... let alone SIX MONTHS)... Plus a month ago, means I'd probably not expect to see any buffers at Midway or where ever until at least the middle or end of July.
Have you ever tooled up to produce an item like this? As I understand it, Vltor is taking the production in house. Their factory is HUGE and filled with machinery and finishing equipment that is tasked with other production.
No one knew the ****tardery of this panic buy was going to be so out of control and demand hysteria so high.
I have a feeling most people don't understand how large scale production works, especially when it involves CNC mills and lathes, anodizing, laser engraving, and so forth.
You have to understand that CNC mills/lathes are costing you money any time they aren't running due to overhead of staff, power costs, and lease for the industrial space to operate it. Plus, they're extremely expensive to begin with.
It also takes quite a bit of time (and thus, money) to change up a production line to handle something else. You have to re-tool, make new jigs, etc. If you need to machine 2,000 of one part, and 2,000 of another, you don't stop production at 1,000 units, and switch to the second. You finish the first 2,000 parts, and then move on to the next. It may be the case that Vltor simply has other parts in the pipeline, and while it might only take a few days to run those A5 buffers, they can't even start on them for a couple months.
Furthermore, if they don't do their own anodizing in-house, then they have to freight the parts off, get in queue with the anodizers, wait for them to do the work and mail them back, and then hope it didn't get screwed up somewhere along the way.
Part of my job involves smaller scale CNC production, and the best case scenario when my machinest has nothing else to run is usually a week for the parts to be cut, then two weeks for the anodizers, and another two weeks for the laser engravers. Only then do I have everything back, ready to be assembled and run through QC, which could take another week. That's 6 weeks start to finish, when everything is perfect. And let me tell you, it's never perfect when it involves 3-4 separate companies.
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