View Full Version : Need info on two suppressors
Howdy guys, so I am in the market for a 5.56 can and I am stuck between two suppressors. The suppressors are the KAC NT4 and the Surefire SOCOM 556-RC. I am planning to use it on a 10.3 DD MK18 upper. I am leaning towards the KAC because DD mentions that the FH on the factory upper is compatible with the NT4, the "deeper" tone that the can gives out, and the durability is legendary. But I have no idea of the POI shift on this can, no idea if it is repeatable POI shift. That is where the SF SOCOM seems better... repeatable POI shift, better db reduction, passed military's tests, and weights half a lb lighter. But I have no idea if I would like the tone of the SF SOCOM. If anyone who has experience with both cans or either on a 10in SBR please help me make good decision. I am new to suppressors and trying to find my way lol.
Pros & Cons of each suppressor ( chime in if I missed anything)
NT4:
PROS
-Deeper tone
-Legendary durability
-Compatible with DD FH
-Comes with KAC FH
CONS
-Heavier than SF SOCOM
-Louder than SF SOCOM in db
-Hard to find in stock
* Unknown POI shift/ repeatable POI shift??
Surefire SOCOM 556-RC:
PROS
-Great mounting
-lighter than NT4
-more db reduction
-SOCOM contract
-repeatable POI shift
-easier to find for sale
CONS
-Must buy new FH ( don't really like the long prong style FH)
-Not sure of pitch when fired
Both are pricey but worth it. I don't mind throwing down good money for a product that is going to last and I'm going to enjoy, but the surefire seems a little more expensive with the buying of the mount ( and cost for someone to do it) for little gain over the NT4. And lets also face it, the NT4 looks badass in taupe :D So if anyone can square me away on this, it would be greatly appreciated.
Both are ridiculously durable cans from reputable companies. I can never look past the 8oz weight difference to put the KAC units into consideration for my uses.
Another is the POI shift reduction - having to only shoot a verification group without adjusting anything else is the most attractive part of the SF line to me. I basically treat my OPS cans as thread-on units that are semi-permanent (removed only to be cleaned), just to not worry about the POI shift.
If you run it a bunch at a class, I figure the ability to simply doff the can and carry on would be quite useful, and if you find yourself going in a shoot house or somewhere the can would be beneficial, putting it back on.
Failure2Stop
06-07-13, 06:49
The NT4 is old-school.
It's a decent suppressor, and if you want a can that you know will last longer than you will, it's the one I recommend. Buuuuuut... it is comparatively heavy and can have some POI shift issues.
For very similar $$ I would direct you toward the QDC and QDC/CQB suppressors.
http://www.knightarmco.com/military/?term=556-rifle
For my first can I definitely want something that is going to be able take the beating from a novice as I figure my way through suppressors. What would you describe the POI shift as? I know it is kind of hard to say since that factors on so many things besides the suppressors itself, but what does KAC see on its test fires? Also, is it true that with the new line of suppressors coming out from KAC that the NT4 will be discontinued? That is another concern for me if I were to buy one; if I should need repair and then KAC won't repair it. As for the SOCOM it would still be in production and be repaired if need be by Surefire.
Failure2Stop
06-07-13, 14:29
For my first can I definitely want something that is going to be able take the beating from a novice as I figure my way through suppressors. What would you describe the POI shift as? I know it is kind of hard to say since that factors on so many things besides the suppressors itself, but what does KAC see on its test fires? Also, is it true that with the new line of suppressors coming out from KAC that the NT4 will be discontinued? That is another concern for me if I were to buy one; if I should need repair and then KAC won't repair it. As for the SOCOM it would still be in production and be repaired if need be by Surefire.
POI shift varies due to numerous variables, from barrel flex to ammunition, so when I say that a 4" shift is generally the worst case, it is with a specific set of input variables. What happens on one barrel will be different with another, so comparison is generally fruitless.
There is no current plan to discontinue the NT4, as there are tens of thousands of them in mil/gov hands with plenty of users and buyers.
That said, the new suppressors are an improvement.
I was issued an NT4. It was awesome and a tank, but it was very heavy. I like it more than my personally owned M4-2000.
If you're worried about POI shift and you're throwing it on a mk18 I don't think you've got a ton to worry about; but as said previously it can vary from weapon to weapon.
I feel myself leaning much more towards the NT4. I figure POI shift won't really matter all that much because most of my shooting is done within 100 yds since it's a 10in gun. Now I just have to find one for sale in taupe :mad:
I've owned several 5.56 suppressors over the years (Gemtech, AAC, SRT, YHM, Surefire and KAC) and the only one I have left for my 5.56 is the NT4. I run it on a Colt 6945, 10.3" upper. It is heavier than any of the other cans I've had, but the deeper tone, look, durability, flash hider that it comes with and proven track record surpassed the cons of this can. It took forever to get (ordered 11/11, dealer received 7/12, form 4 received 2/13). But IMHO, well worth the wait. All of this info is just my .02 so take it for what it's worth.
The NT4 is old-school.
It's a decent suppressor, and if you want a can that you know will last longer than you will, it's the one I recommend. Buuuuuut... it is comparatively heavy and can have some POI shift issues.
For very similar $$ I would direct you toward the QDC and QDC/CQB suppressors.
http://www.knightarmco.com/military/?term=556-rifle
Jack
Any estimate on when the QDC line will be available?
Failure2Stop
06-08-13, 10:03
Jack
Any estimate on when the QDC line will be available?
I don't have anything firm yet, but we are eager to get these rolling.
Typos brought to you via Tapatalk and autocorrect.
ThePraetorian
06-08-13, 11:49
Personally own an M4-2000. Leaning towards adding the SOCOM 556 as well down the road. SF cans are durable, reliable, the repeatable POI shift makes it a very nice prospect and SF comps/hiders are incredibly good. Gotten to run a couple SF cans at various events so my experience is only good for around 150 rounds.
Haven't run the KAC QD I'm afraid. Can tell you running an AAC tuning fork gets a bit annoying when I don't have the can on...so an SF comp would be a welcome addition.
I thought that the Surefire prong flash hiders had the AAC "tuning fork" ring as well, is that not the case?
I don't have anything firm yet, but we are eager to get these rolling.
Typos brought to you via Tapatalk and autocorrect.
Jack, I heard from Kevin that the older taupe color (moly resin) of the NT4 is no longer produced and that they are now in a cerakote tan. Is this cerakote tan the same as the new QDC cans? Also, why the switch? the Moly Resin finish seems to hold up great according to users. Could you perhaps post a picture of the two different finishes? Definitely going with an NT4 just want it to look and perform as perfect as I know it will.
Failure2Stop
06-20-13, 06:31
Jack, I heard from Kevin that the older taupe color (moly resin) of the NT4 is no longer produced and that they are now in a cerakote tan. Is this cerakote tan the same as the new QDC cans? Also, why the switch? the Moly Resin finish seems to hold up great according to users. Could you perhaps post a picture of the two different finishes? Definitely going with an NT4 just want it to look and perform as perfect as I know it will.
I'll see what I can dig up for color comparison, but it's more of a grey tone than the taupe and more flat/matte. I like it better aesthetically.
Testing indicates that the Cerakote holds up to wear and heating better than the previous coating. I would have no reservation about buying an item that was properly Ceracoated.
Have any numbers been released yet on the QDC cans yet, specifically the mini?
I wouldn't buy anything that wasn't at my dealer's store. I'm not into paying for something for my grandchildren to use. Ordering a can or dealer to dealer? Forget it.
I wouldn't buy anything that wasn't at my dealer's store. I'm not into paying for something for my grandchildren to use. Ordering a can or dealer to dealer? Forget it.
Seconded. I made that mistake once... never again!
Seconded. I made that mistake once... never again!
I too speak from experience. And this was BEFORE the ATF went full retard.
You should see the last two shining examples of the imbeciles they employ. A guy I know had one approved with none of the backside of his form filled out or signed.... and one bounced for no Sch B. There is no Sch b. :rolleyes:
Then... the slap head handling his forms said he had a DD pending. He's waiting on 2 ****ing CANS! You can NOT get more retarded than a Federal Governmental Affirmative action hire.
I got lucky. My F3 from Silencer Shop to my local dealer was done end of year last year in about 2 weeks. SS seems to be quick compared to everyone else though...
Were you able to find anything, Jack? I've been looking through different picture threads to see if I can find someone who has bought one recently but the amount of picture threads/pages/ forums is damn near impossible, even with the search menu :( If anyone has a pic of one they recently acquired that was recently manufactured it would be a good start to see the difference in color.
steyrman13
06-24-13, 09:40
After this thread and the other one you were asking about....Are you asking for the best quality and usefulness or the best looking? Is the aesthetics more important to you than functionality?
Failure2Stop
06-24-13, 10:18
Were you able to find anything, Jack? I've been looking through different picture threads to see if I can find someone who has bought one recently but the amount of picture threads/pages/ forums is damn near impossible, even with the search menu :( If anyone has a pic of one they recently acquired that was recently manufactured it would be a good start to see the difference in color.
It's just a bit difficult to get a non-KAC color to compare them to for you at the moment. I'll try to not let this slide off my plate.
After this thread and the other one you were asking about....Are you asking for the best quality and usefulness or the best looking? Is the aesthetics more important to you than functionality?
It is a bit of both. I have read many user feedback of the NT4 and the major cons that they mention aren't major to me. I love the way it looks and it has a proven track record in our most recent and longest war to date. Since I am new to suppressors I definitely want a can that is simple and going to last with whatever I do to it. Not only will it complete the overall look of my MK18 Mod 1/ CQBR clone but it seems like a good can to get my feet wet, so to speak.
It's just a bit difficult to get a non-KAC color to compare them to for you at the moment. I'll try to not let this slide off my plate.
Also, thank you Jack. I appreciate the time you take out of your busy schedule to get information from the industry back to us.
Well, I guess this slipped off of Jack's plate after all. Does anyone know what the exact Cerekote color name is that KAC is using on their NT4s now? Is this something I can do my self?
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