View Full Version : Thumbs Forward Killing Me on Sig
OK, so I've started to rekindle my love affair for my Sigs that have largely sat in my safe for the past decade. I love challenges and thought it would be fun to relearn the DA/SA trigger after 15 years of shooting Glocks and M&Ps (except on deployments).
However, I cannot for the life of me keep from depressing the slide release lever with my dominant thumb (right). I try and try to keep it to the left of my left thumb's MCP joint, but a few strings of fire causes it to migrate to the right and over the slide release. Thus, I lock the slide back only 20% of the time on the last round - not good if I'm going to shoot IDPA.
Unless I find a solution soon, I plan to amputate my right thumb at the IP joint. That should fix the problem.
When I was learning to shoot my P229 I was coming from the 1911 where my thumb rested on the safety. Needless to say this caused some identical issues. It took me some practice and now I keep that thumb in the same spot shooting my Sig, 1911 or Glock. I'm sure you'll get it but the re-learning curve sucks.
http://www.kyledefoor.com/2009/06/sig-sauer-secrets.html
I had the same issue when I first started shooting my PPQ. I haven't overcome it 100% yet, but I'm getting there.
ETA: Interestingly enough I eventually was able to figure out that I needed to make the exact same modification to my grip that Kyle Defoor uses in the link above and that Surf talks about below.
SmokinSigs357
08-05-13, 11:31
http://www.kyledefoor.com/2009/06/sig-sauer-secrets.html
Great link!
One reason I grew to dislike my Sig. I use to be able to run it quite well, but began shooting my Glocks more in my free time. I ended up doing what Defoor does in that link, which is also what my State Department firearms training buddies teach. Between that and the bore axis compared to the Glock, and my department allowing Glocks again, I switched away from the Sig.
It's something that can be overcome, I just didn't like having to conscientiously alter my grip depending on the weapon I was using. Granted a lot of great shooters can run multiple weapons, I'm just not that guy. It took me a lot of dry fire practice to draw and present the weapon with the proper grip that wouldn't hit the slide release.
The Sig Sauer P226 is my units primary pistol as of right now and I have been carrying it for 12 years. We teach as a default to roll the primary thumb outbound. We see that as a shooters thumbs forward grip gets more efficient or aggressive it starts to interfere more and more with the controls on the Sig from the slide stop to exerting downward pressure on the decocker with the heel of the support hands thumb which in turn can cause light primer strikes. Shooters that go from a Glock or shooting a Glock frequently tend to have a more pronounced or aggressive support hand grip due to the angle on the Glocks grip and they tend to have more issues when going back and forth from the Glock and Sig.
if you can find one (I forget the part number) the forward slide stop used on the pistols with a safety works pretty well, moving your thumb out further, or cutting down the slide stop to a small rounded nub worked well for me (like the picture below)
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y23/rathos/Sig%20226%209mm/Sig2269mm007.jpg
I had to abandon my favorite FN/Browning Hipower when I adopted some new techniques after updated training in the early 1990s.
I begrudgingly switched to Glocks and still miss my Hipowers but the timers and targets don't lie.
It might be time to go for a pistol that has smooth sides and plenty of surface area to rest your thumbs on the port and starboard sides.
I have had to do this because my department orders thier Glocks with the glock extended slide release. I thought I had a batch of junk ammo until I figured it out.
I have had to do this because my department orders thier Glocks with the glock extended slide release. I thought I had a batch of junk ammo until I figured it out.
Same here after installing the Vickers slide stop on my 19. No problem now after a few sessions with it.
I carried a P226 for the past 7 years, until we switched to Glocks this year, and had the same issue with inadvertent slide stop deactivation. I was able to find a extended slide stop (the pad is bent up to about 90 degrees out from the slide and ended up being just enough out of the way for my grip to work fine. The part was discontinued for a while, mine came off the gun of a guy who retired, but I think it is back in production.
Same here after installing the Vickers slide stop on my 19. No problem now after a few sessions with it.
I've been curious about the vickers slide stop. Is this common among other vickers users?
I have carried a p220 on duty since 1999. not the easiest gun to use.
Check out the latest episode of tac tv. Ken Hackthorn demonstrates a solution similar to that shown in Mr. Defoors article. Both will solve the problem
You can try the P226 X-5 slide release as well. I had the same issue with my P226 until I installed one. Note that I had E2 grips which require no modification, but if you have the standard full size grips, you may need to shave some of the top grip off.
http://www.topgunsupply.com/sig-slide-catch-lever-x-five-p226-p228-p229.html
Due to the size of my hands, Aggressive thumbs forward grip and my departments choice of the SIG 229 I have the same issue. I shoot the pistol incredibly well so I refuse to alter my grip and have become verry proficient in stoppage clearing drills as a result. I also rely on tactical mag exchanges more so I dont here that click at the end of a string of fire.
I instinctively tried to modify my grip in the manner described in the DeFoor article. I find that it works if I'm not under pressure and not firing more that 3 rounds. In other words, I have to consciously think about it with every presentation from the holster. Hopefully, I'll start to see some improvement in the next 500-1000 rounds and some dry fire practice.
Fortunately, I've rarely had this problem with other platforms. The Glock factory extended slide release was the other situation that would also cause the problem. Interestingly, I had the opposite problem with the Vickers Glock slide release whereby the thenar (base of thumb) portion of my support palm would occasionally push up the lever and cause premature slide lock-back. This phenomenon was much more rare and tended to occurs with my 40 caliber Glocks which caused me to attribute it to slight movements of my palm when using a snappy caliber.
LMT Shooter
08-06-13, 01:05
I have several SIG's, my old P226 grips do not cause this problem for me, nor my P228, but newer SIG's caused this ugly beast to rear it's head. I had to modify my grip as Mr. Defoor showed, I read about this in an article by Greg Rodriguez where he said he had this trouble.
I think SIG reduced the grip size on their guns, making this a problem when it wasn't one before, at least for me.
I was dumb enough that it took me a while to realize what was happening, I thought I had defective guns or mags. I felt pretty silly when the real problem was pointed out to me.
I experience the same problem with my Beretta and fail to achieve slide lock on an empty magazine because my thumb is on the slide release.
I am trying to teach myself out of it using KD's modified grip shown in the link, but its still a work in progress.
brickboy240
08-06-13, 15:13
I have three older SIGs and have never experienced that problem with those pistols.
I did have a friend borrow the P228 and he kept riding his thumb on the slide stop and it caused the slide to lock back with rounds still in the mag. An odd problem but probably due to his odd grip.
-brickboy240
Grip technique advised by KD are also good for HK P-series pistols with long slide releases. I use exactly same grip with my P30L, P2000SK and HK45C. It also prevents any support hand thumb interference with slide cycling and/or extending side pressure on pistol (that affect shot placement).
Some guy named Bruce Gray demonstrates his technique. He seems to know a lot about Sig's.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aiLuLKLQCMc
LMT Shooter
08-06-13, 21:03
I have three older SIGs and have never experienced that problem with those pistols.
I did have a friend borrow the P228 and he kept riding his thumb on the slide stop and it caused the slide to lock back with rounds still in the mag. An odd problem but probably due to his odd grip.
-brickboy240
I haven't measured any of them, but it looks & feels like the grips on newer SIG's are thinner and cause the problem, because I don
t have this happen with my older ones, either, but newer SIG's all caused me problems till I figured it out.
brickboy240
08-07-13, 10:25
I have actually never shot any of the US made SIG P-series guns...so I don't know about them.
However, my 2 W. German made guns (P220 and P228) and the little Swiss made P225 have been really stellar guns. in fact, the P225 is a really nice shooter that is very accurate. Who knew you could be so excited about an 8 shot 9mm but it is a really nice shooter.
I mostly carry a Glock 19 but I have to admit that my three older P-Series SIGs have been relatively trouble free in the many years I have owned them. Never had the "ride the slide release" issues, though...maybe I am lucky.
-brickboy240
You can try the P226 X-5 slide release as well. I had the same issue with my P226 until I installed one.
http://www.topgunsupply.com/sig-slide-catch-lever-x-five-p226-p228-p229.html
I had heard of the slide release difference on the X5 but was unaware you could purchase that part seperatly. Any idea where I could find one? I tried searching before, including Sigs site but came up empty handed.
ETA: Sorry, I completely skipped over the link lol it's past my bedtime.
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