View Full Version : Saiga 7.62 comp strikes
rapomstage3
08-12-13, 12:51
So I just got my first ak. It's a saiga conversion. Homegrown conversion. It was not threaded and had the normal barrel shroud. I cut the shroud and it was not threaded underneath. I took it to a local ak guy who threaded it for me and installed an ares effin a comp. it was just the cost of the threading and brake otherwise I would have installed it my self. Long story short I could not get a zero after because it shot so far left. I had changed the rear sight so I figured that's what it was and switched it back. Come to find out it still has the same result. Upon inspecting the brake. The rounds are striking the lower left inside. You can see the rifling in the opening. So I brought it back to the shop and the owner said hell have the guy who did it look at it. So my question is , what is a good possible outcome here? I don't just want the brake reamed out incase of future suppressor use. He can change the barrel but it certainly won't be an Itzsmash. I really don't know. Please let me know what you think.
justin_247
08-12-13, 13:40
So I just got my first ak. It's a saiga conversion. Homegrown conversion. It was not threaded and had the normal barrel shroud. I cut the shroud and it was not threaded underneath. I took it to a local ak guy who threaded it for me and installed an ares effin a comp. it was just the cost of the threading and brake otherwise I would have installed it my self. Long story short I could not get a zero after because it shot so far left. I had changed the rear sight so I figured that's what it was and switched it back. Come to find out it still has the same result. Upon inspecting the brake. The rounds are striking the lower left inside. You can see the rifling in the opening. So I brought it back to the shop and the owner said hell have the guy who did it look at it. So my question is , what is a good possible outcome here? I don't just want the brake reamed out incase of future suppressor use. He can change the barrel but it certainly won't be an Itzsmash. I really don't know. Please let me know what you think.
Call whoever made it. It might not have a concentric bore, or it may have been threaded incorrectly, or there could be other deformities with the barrel.
rapomstage3
08-12-13, 13:47
Call whoever made it. It might not have a concentric bore, or it may have been threaded incorrectly, or there could be other deformities with the barrel.
I have not heard of the concentric bore issue on a saiga before. I'm leaning towards the threading personally but I'm hoping he doesn't blame the barrel and pass the buck.
Was the barrel re-crowned when the threads were cut? I doubt the comp is the problem. Most likely the crown or threads on the barrel.
rapomstage3
08-12-13, 13:53
Was the barrel re-crowned when the threads were cut? I doubt the comp is the problem. Most likely the crown or threads on the barrel.
I'm assuming it was not recrowned and just threaded by hand with some tool you can order.
Closeup pics would help a lot. But by the description of your issue it sounds like the person who threaded it didn't use a tool to guide the die, the result of which is non-concentric threads.
rapomstage3
08-12-13, 14:09
I would post some but I dropped it off at the shop immediately. My question is also how do I disprove them if they blame the barrel or something other than they're mistake? It will be my word against there's right?
SpeedRacer
08-12-13, 14:17
Take it to a real gunsmith, they can give you hard data if the threads are off, which is where I'd place my bets.
I'm assuming it was not recrowned and just threaded by hand with some tool you can order.
It should have been re-crowned. The live center on the lathes tail stock could have damaged the crown when they barrel was threaded or they may have used a die to thread it. Ask them if the threads were single point cut or die cut.
Out of curiosity, how much were charged for the work?
rapomstage3
08-12-13, 15:00
$60 with me cutting the shroud off. It'll be a few days before I hear from them and I'll update the thread if anyone cares. I'm just not sure what to except as a plausible fix.
SpeedRacer
08-12-13, 15:21
$60 with me cutting the shroud off. It'll be a few days before I hear from them and I'll update the thread if anyone cares. I'm just not sure what to except as a plausible fix.
The best option: http://www.k-var.com/shop/AK-167B.html
rapomstage3
08-12-13, 15:25
I'm assuming you think that the shop should buy and install this for me? Should I turn down a new barrel?
For $60 it's highly unlikely that those threads were properly cut on a lathe. Sounds to me like they didn't use a die pilot. That can make some ugly threads, and a dangerous situation with canted muzzle devices.
rapomstage3
08-12-13, 15:57
Notice my sig yet? :l
CrazyFingers
08-12-13, 20:01
Notice my sig yet? :l
I noticed it on your first post, but I didn't say anything. Since you brought it up, however, you could have paid for this: http://www.k-var.com/shop/SAM7R.html and avoided all this.
:D
rapomstage3
08-12-13, 20:09
I noticed it on your first post, but I didn't say anything. Since you brought it up, however, you could have paid for this: http://www.k-var.com/shop/SAM7R.html and avoided all this.
:D
My local shop has one for 1300 or so. Thing is.. Mine was $450 a month ago so...
SpeedRacer
08-12-13, 20:09
I'm assuming you think that the shop should buy and install this for me? Should I turn down a new barrel?
No, I think the shop should buy it and pay for someone who knows what they're doing to install it. ;)
IMO it's really the only option I would consider if the threads are fudged. It's a nice upgrade as well, and would allow you to run the 74 style brake which works very well and would be correct for a current AKM.
CrazyFingers
08-13-13, 08:38
My local shop has one for 1300 or so. Thing is.. Mine was $450 a month ago so...
Which brings us back to your sig line...:D
A decent AK for $450 a couple of years ago? Quite possible.
A month ago? Eh, somewhat less likely. The market has changed significantly over the past several months. I spent $1350 a couple weeks ago for a SAM7r, which some might say was paying way too much. Maybe it was, but I got a damned good AK that should last a long time. Do I wish I could have paid $700 for an SGL-21 from 2011? Sure, but that's not the reality of the situation today.
Good luck on getting your rifle fixed, and I agree with the other posters, the shop needs to do something pronto to correct this issue.
rapomstage3
08-13-13, 08:57
I understand what you're saying and I definitely understand my Sigg and believe in it. But I paid $450 for a converted saiga In 100% working condition. I'm not saying that an Arsenal isn't better but I don't think any person here would walk on that deal.
CrazyFingers
08-13-13, 12:00
But I paid $450 for a converted saiga...I don't think any person here would walk on that deal.
Oh, not at all. Like I said, I wish I could still buy SGL-21s at $700 each, from back when people were complaining that was too much to pay for a quality AK.
RearwardAssist
08-13-13, 12:05
For $60 it's highly unlikely that those threads were properly cut on a lathe. Sounds to me like they didn't use a die pilot. That can make some ugly threads, and a dangerous situation with canted muzzle devices.
In my area threads cut on a lathe go for 45-60 if you bring a stripped barrel in. I don't think he's that far out of line in what he paid to expect quality work.
In my area threads cut on a lathe go for 45-60 if you bring a stripped barrel in. I don't think he's that far out of line in what he paid to expect quality work.
Stipped barrel, yes. But that's not what the OP situation was. ;)
rapomstage3
08-15-13, 12:19
Update. I talked to the owner and they haven't done anything but speculate that it must be the barrel because they use a thread guide. Tomorrow they'll get it to the range he said.
SpeedRacer
08-15-13, 12:49
Update. I talked to the owner and they haven't done anything but speculate that it must be the barrel because they use a thread guide. Tomorrow they'll get it to the range he said.
If they fight you on it, bring it to a different gunsmith. Have them put it on a lathe and they can use a dial indicator to see if the threads are concentric and give you exact readings.
rapomstage3
08-20-13, 10:45
Update for anyone who cares. Upon looking my rifle over and shooting it, They have come to the determination that the crown is messed up. It'll be 50 or 60 bucks to re crown I guess. They're saying that I did it when I cut the barrel shroud off. I'm pretty sure I went nowhere near the crown but I also did not inspect it before hand either.
Update for anyone who cares. Upon looking my rifle over and shooting it, They have come to the determination that the crown is messed up. It'll be 50 or 60 bucks to re crown I guess. They're saying that I did it when I cut the barrel shroud off. I'm pretty sure I went nowhere near the crown but I also did not inspect it before hand either.
Hmmm. That does sound a little odd. So they threaded the barrel with crown damage significant enough to cause a md strike and didn't bring this to your attention before? Pics would help, but I am guessing you don't have possession of the rifle. Maybe ask them for a pic of the crown before they perform the job?
rapomstage3
08-20-13, 11:13
Yeah they have it. I guess I'm going to have to just keep this one because I can't make a case to support my side.
Yeah they have it. I guess I'm going to have to just keep this one because I can't make a case to support my side.
hmmm...
get the rifle back.
inspect the muzzle & crown - what damage do you see?
shoot the rifle with no brake - does it still shoot radically to the side?
in the end you've got 3 choices:
take off the brake and live with a thread protector
get a second opinion on the thread job.
--depending on your relationship, you can give them the chance to fix if it's non-concentric.
pay the extra $60 now and be done
--with the caveat that they are now guaranteeing the result.
rapomstage3
08-21-13, 18:22
I sent an email that said to stop further service to my rifle and explained my stance on the situation. I got a call from them that they had already fixed it free if charge. Apparently it was recrowned and he throated the brake. I wish the brake wasn't throated but I'm sure it will zero now. So I guess the case of the fudged saiga is over for now.
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.5 Copyright © 2024 vBulletin Solutions, Inc. All rights reserved.