View Full Version : Sticker shock on Mosin/Nagant rifles..whats up?
Straight Shooter
08-16-13, 13:28
Was in my favorite gs yesterday, walked back to look at their supply of
Mosin Nagants. Previously, these were in the $129 range. ALL of them were $299 now. Curious, I asked one of the salesmen why. He said 2-3 months ago Obama had stpped their importation. Not ammo, just guns. Is this correct? Has anyone here heard this, and can give me a link to an article on this? Ive checked around a bit befoe posting this, and could find nothing.
Ours locally were $89 & now they got bumped up to $129. Always though about picking one up, just never did.
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Unless confirmed I would mark it off as either fear mongering or misinformation. Wouldn't be the first time for either and sometimes gun shops are less well informed than the average gun owner. Mosin Nagants have actually dropped price around here with privates sales running sub $150 without issue at the moment. Still see a few running around trying to sell them for $300-500 but not nearly as often as before. The ones who are though are usually claiming they are rare, banned, or some other made up shit. Saw a local ad a couple weeks ago trying to sell Glock mags at $185 a piece claiming that new laws that the government was not releasing was going to make them illegal and get them before the ban. Pathetic in my opinion.
Straight Shooter
08-16-13, 14:09
I agree with you Kain, so far I cant find anything to confirm this.
And YES fixit69..these have long been on the C&R list...its one reason I got mine several years ago.
brickboy240
08-16-13, 14:25
Back in 1990, a minty Russian SKS was 75.00.
Seen the prices lately on ANY SKS?
When I was a kid...Dad bought a really nice 03 Springfield from Western Auto in downtown Houston for 65 dollars. What does a nice 03 gor for today?
Take a hint from history and buy now....get the ammo too because it is the only surplus round that is still cheap.
I agree with you Kain, so far I cant find anything to confirm this.
And YES fixit69..these have long been on the C&R list...its one reason I got mine several years ago.
What do you mean about the C&R list? What's the significance?
Curio & Relic
A classification that means it's more important/valuable as a piece of history than as a firearm. (The VERY abbreviated version.)
Spectre'sWrath
08-16-13, 21:58
We sold the M91/30s for around 130 or so for a while. A couple of months ago they jumped to 150, them to 169. They peaked at 200 recently and since NONE were selling, they have been bumped back to 169.99.
At this price point (200) they were just PW imports with no bayonet, sling or oil can/kit.
Straight Shooter
08-18-13, 15:23
Sorry Wake27, Im just seeing your question.
When you get a C&R license...you get a list of SPECIFIC weapons weapons you can buy, and the Nagant has been on there a long time.
I would indeed buy now, ammo too, cause they are drying up and one day they will truly be scarce.
decodeddiesel
08-19-13, 15:08
Was in my favorite gs yesterday, walked back to look at their supply of
Mosin Nagants. Previously, these were in the $129 range. ALL of them were $299 now. Curious, I asked one of the salesmen why. He said 2-3 months ago Obama had stpped their importation. Not ammo, just guns. Is this correct? Has anyone here heard this, and can give me a link to an article on this? Ive checked around a bit befoe posting this, and could find nothing.
Never pay any mind what-so-ever to this kind of nonsense from LGS employees. There is a humorous thread in the OT section covering this kind of garbage.
So what this guy is saying is that the President of the United States took on a personal crusade to somehow stop the importation of 80 year old surplus Soviet rifles, waving his magical tyranny wand and drying up the market. :rolleyes:
The truth of the matter is that like everything else that goes "bang", these rifles have seen price fluctuations to reflect the insanity that is the market these days. They are not at this time scarce, however they are charging the crazy prices for these rifles because people will pay it. If you don't feel like it's a fair price, vote with your wallet and don't buy it.
Grizzlyatoms
08-20-13, 04:04
My brother and I bought 2 for $89.00 each, IMHO your high on bat$hit if you pay more than $100.00. I think people are taking advantage of the situation, but nobody is forcing you to buy.
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Straight Shooter
08-20-13, 05:47
Yeah...let me be clear and say I was just looking. Ive owned a few, have literally the nicest one Ive ever seen in my safe now, and am aware fully of their real value. Was simply asking if anyone had heard something I hadn't.
They went up a little but $299 for a run of the mill 91/30 is retarded. Around here they went up from $125 to $150.
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If it was an M38 or M44 it might not be too crazy high, as they go for mid-$200s around here.
Grizzlyatoms
08-20-13, 09:07
Yeah...let me be clear and say I was just looking. Ive owned a few, have literally the nicest one Ive ever seen in my safe now, and am aware fully of their real value. Was simply asking if anyone had heard something I hadn't.
I wasn't trying to come across as a Douche, if I did I apologize. The Russian's shit these thing out by millions, I honestly believe if you pay more than $100.00 it's not worth it.
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I wasn't trying to come across as a Douche, if I did I apologize. The Russian's shit these thing out by millions, I honestly believe if you pay more than $100.00 it's not worth it.
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Right, but they can't be had for less than that anymore. If someone wants one, they will have to pay more than $100. Times change, they're not $89 anymore...
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Grizzlyatoms
08-20-13, 09:47
Right, but they can't be had for less than that anymore. If someone wants one, they will have to pay more than $100. Times change, they're not $89 anymore...
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Sounds like I should sell mine.
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decodeddiesel
08-20-13, 09:59
Right, but they can't be had for less than that anymore. If someone wants one, they will have to pay more than $100. Times change, they're not $89 anymore...
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Agree. Reminds me of when you used to be able to buy Russian SKS's by the crate for peanuts.
Still I don't think I would pay much more than $200 for a really nice M38 or M44.
Right, but they can't be had for less than that anymore. If someone wants one, they will have to pay more than $100. Times change, they're not $89 anymore...
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While they have gone up on the used market I do see them for $100-125 on a semi regular basis. Though on local sites it isn't awfully uncommon to see one listed for $100 one day and then the next someone else is listing the same rifle, same pictures even, for $200+. I really should pick one up just to have, since I hear very good things about them and ammo can still be had for a reasonable price from online retailers. Ain't buying it local though, same shit as online but fifty cents a round.
SilverBullet432
08-20-13, 10:39
i bought mine on black friday of '12 at big 5 for $100. the previous year they were $88.00. i am sure they will have them again this year, anything past $130, no thanks! big 5 is rather expensive when compared to academy. i love my mosin, 1938 91/30 matching #s. shoots flawlesly, no stuck bolt, broken shells (knock on wood) to date.
Straight Shooter
08-20-13, 15:21
For what they are, they are way cool rifles, I think. Ive shot some amazing groups with 70+ year old ammo, out of 70+ year old guns!
I don't have unrealistic expectations, and I don't do anything to them except a DETAIL clean, and a trigger job. I picked up a Finnish
Nagant today, it was $379...the trigger on that thing was superb actually. Ive never shot new, modern brass cased ammo out of one yet, would like to see some groups fired with those one day.
Also...not to derail...but we bought SKS rifles back in the late eighties,early nineties for $59 a piece. If we only knew then.....:p
$130 is fair.
I bought two Mosins from my buddy at cost for $135. I say at cost because he got a crate and sold it them to me for the same price he paid.
I don't know from which company he ordered the crate. They were very nice rifles.
I've only shot one of these thus far, a '34 Tula with a clean bore. I got an honest 2"ish 5 shot group using Soviet light ball, vintage
'76 Silvertip.
I still haven't taken the time to shoot the other one yet.
https://fbcdn-sphotos-c-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/581429_3292021476939_652115702_n.jpg
'34 Tula
https://fbcdn-sphotos-g-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/33955_3299206896570_556004300_n.jpg
'37 Tula, which I haven't shot yet. It's also in a decent condition.
decodeddiesel
08-21-13, 08:30
Nice rifles rojocorsa. I think I need to pick me up another Mosin. I haven't owned one since I was 19 :dirol:
I've paid higher then norm for some.Mosins but thise were rare Finn models like my Remington M91 or a Finn caoture M19/30. Prices though are going to go up due to supply and demand. Supply is running low and it will dry up at some point so if you do want one snag it before they become priced like M1903s.
alvincullumyork
08-26-13, 21:41
I need to get another one. I have the crazy urge to go elk hunting with one.
I need to get another one. I have the crazy urge to go elk hunting with one.
I've taken hogs with my Polish M44 in North Florida. Blasted the hell out of 'em. 7.62x54r sure is a good cartridge and the Mosin sure makes it fun.
bluejackets92fs
08-27-13, 01:19
I know they went up in price but have yet to see them exceed $199. I remember when I got into guns back in 2007 or so, they were around $119.
alvincullumyork
08-27-13, 07:48
I've taken hogs with my Polish M44 in North Florida. Blasted the hell out of 'em. 7.62x54r sure is a good cartridge and the Mosin sure makes it fun.
I think I remember reading somewhere that 7.62x54r is ballisticly similar to 30-06, so it should be capable for anything in North America except for maybe grizzly. The light surplus ball sure puts a good hole in 3/8 mild steel plate at 100 yard!
I'm looking to purchase another 91/30 within the next month. Is there any reason to purchase a Hex receiver over a standard round one?
I'm not a collector and I just like to shoot these rifles w/ my semiauto's. Bud's has the Hex 91/30's for $160 (+transfer fee to my FFL of course). But a Gander mountain close to me has the standard round receiver 91/30 for $180.
I'm inclined to just buy a standard 91/30 from GM. last time I went there they had about 12 on the rack and I can pick which one I want.
Hex tend to be older recycled receivers. Barrel could be say 40s but the receiver could be 20s, teens or pre 1900. This isnt a bad thing. Used up parts were pulled off and new ones added. I have a 1925 91/30 built on a 1914 receiver. The receiver date is stamped underneath the rear tang. To see it you'd have to disassemble the rifle and pull the stock off, something that takes 20 seconds to do. People like hex cause round receivers were cost and time saving for war production. Either one will serve you equally well.
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I'm looking to purchase another 91/30 within the next month. Is there any reason to purchase a Hex receiver over a standard round one?
I'm not a collector and I just like to shoot these rifles w/ my semiauto's. Bud's has the Hex 91/30's for $160 (+transfer fee to my FFL of course). But a Gander mountain close to me has the standard round receiver 91/30 for $180.
I'm inclined to just buy a standard 91/30 from GM. last time I went there they had about 12 on the rack and I can pick which one I want.
Hex receivers were stopped being made around 1936 so having one means nine out of ten times it is a pre WWII build. So they'll have better aesthetic qualities in their build.
Some hex receivers were used during the war since the Soviets recycled receivers from damaged rifles.
I have a Hex M91/30 that was an ex Dragoon rifle.
Some folks like the Tulas because of the cool star marking and there were somewhat fewer made than the Izhevsk models.
Last August I bought a M91/30 for $99.95 marked down from $119.95. The same store is now selling them for $149.99, marked down from $199.99. At 50% higher, that is a considerable price increase.
I guess now is a good time to sell my Finn Mo.
Got my Dragoon M91/30 '32 Tula Hex (arseneled in DDR!) for $199. I felt a bvit ripped off until I got her to the range with some PPU and Herter's brass rounds.
She did her part and I am getting new glasses on Wednesday so I can do mine and get her grouping better. On a bench sled she was 2" high @ 100m with 1.5" groups. Unassisted...well, like I said I need better specs as my groups widened up a bit. ;) I will add some wire insulation to the front post to get my shots down a little.
I feel I got a good deal on a good rifle. Did I spend too much? Possibly but I felt good when I got up today after putting 40 rounds down range yesterday with only a t-shirt between me and the .5 oz of Russian buttplate.
SurplusShooter
09-09-13, 14:37
Sorry Wake27, Im just seeing your question.
When you get a C&R license...you get a list of SPECIFIC weapons weapons you can buy, and the Nagant has been on there a long time.
I would indeed buy now, ammo too, cause they are drying up and one day they will truly be scarce.
Only partially true, and common misconception:
A Firearm is automatically C&R if it is at-least 50 years old ("the firearm" in specific, not the style/type in general).
There is an "exception list" of specifically called-out Firearms that allows some firearms to be added even if they are not 50 years old yet.
Read it from the source here:
http://www.atf.gov/publications/firearms/curios-relics/index.html
Firearms automatically attain C&R status when they are 50 years old. Any firearm that is at least 50 years old, and in its original configuration, would qualify as a C&R firearm. It is not necessary for such firearms to be listed in ATF’s C&R list.
--------------------------------------
On a related note, C&R guns will come-and-go. Sometimes a gun will be hard to get for a while then something will happen and there will be a flood of them on the market, (Chinese Mosin 53's, and recent influx of Walther P1's and P38s, for example) but more often than not they slowly dry-up or the ammo for them dries-up and that's all there is.
It always amuses me when people say "These are drying up because ____". Its just the simple fact of the matter that these guns, by definition, are old and they don't make them anymore so of-course they run out eventually.
Also, regardless of Executive Orders or import bans or whatnot, C&R collecting in general is coming to an end because WW2 was the last great war where bolt-action and semi-auto weapons were made in great numbers. Starting in Vietnam, Cold War, and beyond, all the world's arsenals switched to full-auto or select-fire so us here in USA under current regulations we could never own those firearms as C&R weapons. After WW2 rifles dry-up we can maybe get Pistols as C&R but after that is is slim pickin'
[QUOTE=decodeddiesel;1724783]...So what this guy is saying is that the President of the United States took on a personal crusade to somehow stop the importation of 80 year old surplus Soviet rifles, waving his magical tyranny wand and drying up the market. :rolleyes:QUOTE]
In fact, the Obominator can and has waved his magical wand of tyranny to stop the importation of C&R weapons into the US. Awhile back, an importer was working on bringing Garands back that had been loaned/given/sold to South Korea but was stopped by the Whitehouse.
He has been a very busy little boy drafting and signing executive orders to reduce our access to overseas arms and munitions. He is also working with the BATF to further restrict firearms owners. One example is "closing the trust loop-hole".
Other past presidents have in the past done the same- We have not been able to bring certain self loading rifles into this country because the president signeds an executive order defining them as having no sporting purpose. We cannot bring in barrels of certain types of rifles for the very same reason. Neither of these bans are decreed by law
On a related note, C&R guns will come-and-go. Sometimes a gun will be hard to get for a while then something will happen and there will be a flood of them on the market, (Chinese Mosin 53's, and recent influx of Walther P1's and P38s, for example) but more often than not they slowly dry-up or the ammo for them dries-up and that's all there is.
It always amuses me when people say "These are drying up because ____". Its just the simple fact of the matter that these guns, by definition, are old and they don't make them anymore so of-course they run out eventually.
Also, regardless of Executive Orders or import bans or whatnot, C&R collecting in general is coming to an end because WW2 was the last great war where bolt-action and semi-auto weapons were made in great numbers. Starting in Vietnam, Cold War, and beyond, all the world's arsenals switched to full-auto or select-fire so us here in USA under current regulations we could never own those firearms as C&R weapons. After WW2 rifles dry-up we can maybe get Pistols as C&R but after that is is slim pickin'
Good points.
Another thing to consider is that there are a finite amount of these firearms, so when they run out that's it. Unlike AR/AK's that are still being made. I don't know how much longer Mosin's will last, but now is the time to buy. They will not be any cheaper than they are.
Market value for run of the mill refurb m91/30 are $160 to $200 otd. So many model variations and history make it fun to collect. Get one now while available.
Sometimes people look at the expensive price tag of a mosin and think the seller is nuts. But be open to it and find out if it's a collectible piece. It maybe worth while.
Watch out for mosinitis. It'll bite hard! ;)
WNY_Whitetailer
09-10-13, 01:06
I just ordered a Mosin online for $139 song with a 440 round can of Russian ammo...
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I wish I had held onto those SKS Rifles now!
decodeddiesel
09-10-13, 10:55
I just ordered a Mosin online for $139 song with a 440 round can of Russian ammo...
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Could you please PM me where you got it from? I'm in the market.
Here you go here's an article for you
http://www.examiner.com/article/obama-s-latest-executive-orders-highlight-need-for-serious-push-on-h-r-2247
alvincullumyork
09-10-13, 11:30
Could you please PM me where you got it from? I'm in the market.
Aim surplus. I'm thinking about doing the same thing but money is pretty tight right now.
Sorry Wake27, Im just seeing your question.
When you get a C&R license...you get a list of SPECIFIC weapons weapons you can buy, and the Nagant has been on there a long time.
I would indeed buy now, ammo too, cause they are drying up and one day they will truly be scarce.
Yes with a FFL03 you can buy guns declared curio relic and have them shipped to your doorstep. There is a buttload of guns that qualify. Very nice ones too. Also you can buy SKS, Tokarev, mosin nagant, the list is vast but availability is shrinking. Prices are going up and the nicest C&R'S are a little pricey. I had a c&r license but let it expire. I can get transfers for $20 plus when it was time to renew they wanted written permission from my landlord that it wAs ok to get shipment sent to me. So bye bye... I managed to snag a .303 enfield, ishy .308 enfield, MN and a couple cZ 52's. I do no think imports have been shut down. But they MN will surge and trickle for a while until they are gone. Managed to pick up a M38 that was sitting in a surplus barrel at loca Gs for $75 back in "06."
TriumphRat675
09-10-13, 14:33
$139 at the local Cabela's two weeks ago. They had piles of them.
With surplus guns you never pay too much, you just buy too soon. Buy it now and see what they cost in 20 years.
SurplusShooter
09-10-13, 14:49
With surplus guns you never pay too much, you just buy too soon. Buy it now and see what they cost in 20 years.
Be careful to account for inflation. After inflation effects not all of them gain value higher than other similar-risk investments.
(Edit to add: it not about money. really its the enjoyment of the hobby)
On the collectors forums, people often post old magazine ads saying "ah they were cheap back in the 60's" or whatever old magazine they dig-up... but it always bursts their bubble when you run the CPI inflation calculator and show the monetary value is similar to what it was today:
CPI Inflation Calculator
http://data.bls.gov/cgi-bin/cpicalc.pl
And collector's interests are fickle, what is hot now may loose interest in coming generations.
Never have thought of it like that but makes sense. I do believe we are in the proverbial "good days" of firearms hobby or collecting. A world with a "sure fire" import ban and restriction worse than Clinton would be no fun at all for enthusiast. I am pretty settled with what I have but the itch is still there.
TriumphRat675
09-10-13, 16:57
Be careful to account for inflation. After inflation effects not all of them gain value higher than other similar-risk investments.
Agree, but that's not my point. I've never seen an investment grade Mosin. My point is they aren't making any more and prices are just going to go up, absent deflation. If you want one bad enough, get it.
I have a bunch of surplus guns and I own them because they're neat and have historical value to me, not the value they would bring in a sale. Some of them are beat to hell and hardly worth anything, but I'll never get rid of them.
SurplusShooter
09-10-13, 17:06
Agree, but that's not my point....
I'm with you....yeah I didn't mean to sound business-like: it's really the enjoyment of collecting them. And you are correct "get 'em before they are gone" definitely.
Yeah, pretty sure Ivan the Ukrainian Farmer has dug up all the Dragoons that were burried on his property in Spring of '45. ;)
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