DMViergever
10-31-13, 21:09
It's no secret I am a big fan of my Adams Arms rifles but by far the biggest downfall has to be the selection of handguards. I have been running the Samson Evolution for several years now and was ready for a replacement. I was pretty excited when I saw that Fortis was coming out with their Rev line of rails in a extended and cut out version that would reach out and around the gas block and give a couple more inches of grip space.
I wasn't sure how well it would work on my rifle since I ran a pinned gas block so I made sure to call Fortis and was told it would work perfectly so I ordered one immediately. Rainier had it to my door a couple days later. As soon as I opened the box I was pretty stoked, these things look even better in person than they do in photos and the ergonomics are awesome. I already had my gas block pulled and upper waiting for this so I figured a couple minutes and I would be up running. I was wrong.
I will start by saying that the way these mount to the barrel nut is great and I always like using the standard barrel nut. What wasn't so awesome has to do with the way Fortis designed the front of the rail in the area where pins are driven. One side (ejection side) is cut out perfectly and that is the side that you drive the pins out from on my rifle. The bolt catch side is cut so that it completely blocks the pins and that causes you to have to remove the bottom part of the rail at the barrel nut and lift the rail and pull the bottom of the rail down and drive the front through the QD hole. The rear pin is blocked by one of the diagonally running pieces from the 9 O'clock rail. My rail has a large decent size groove from the pin going in twice and coming out once and has some dings where the punch slipped off. The part that is dinged up is pretty thin so be careful not to snap it The other down side to have the handguard loose is that it rubs the upper if you do not watch it. If I didn't run my stuff hard anyways I would be angry about this. When I contacted Fortis, knowing this was a new design and all, they told me that it was a situation where the graphic artists beat out the engineers and they knew this was an issue and it may be changed on the next version. This was the same person who told me it was designed to work with pinned FSB's. If you don't have pins it is a breeze to install, otherwise it is a pain.
Here is the side that is cut properly.
http://i702.photobucket.com/albums/ww27/DMViergever/CAM00168_zpsbdc9d32a.jpg (http://s702.photobucket.com/user/DMViergever/media/CAM00168_zpsbdc9d32a.jpg.html)
Here is the other side that is scarred up from the punch, you can also see the divot where the pin made a groove.
http://i702.photobucket.com/albums/ww27/DMViergever/CAM00166_zps8d81ee6e.jpg (http://s702.photobucket.com/user/DMViergever/media/CAM00166_zps8d81ee6e.jpg.html)
This is where it rubbed the upper during install.
http://i702.photobucket.com/albums/ww27/DMViergever/CAM00165_zpsd322191d.jpg (http://s702.photobucket.com/user/DMViergever/media/CAM00165_zpsd322191d.jpg.html)
As far as general use and ergonomics go it is ok. The feel in the hand is awesome and handled great and was very comfortable both with and without gloves in the recent advanced carbine class I took.
The cut off height where it is cleared for a gas block or front sight is perfect. It isn't too high or low and allowed for easy adjustment of the piston system, this was one thing I wasn't crazy about with the Evo, especially when wearing gloves. I don't mind the continuous lower rail on this handguard although that has been a complaint by others who have ran my rifle. What I don't like is that they do keymod all along the side except for out at the end where you are actually most likely to attach something. Out there they decided to but about two inches of rail at the 6 and 9 with a QD cup at the very end.
The QD cups are an awesome touch and there are a total of four. One on each side of the handguard right by the upper receiver and then one on each side at the end of the rail sections. All 4 are anti rotation, which is again a good touch. Where I feel they went wrong is putting a QD cup in front of a rail section. This means if you decide to mount a light at either of those points and want to run your 2pt sling at the end it blocks your light...if you can even access the cup. I run a 6PX Tactical on the rail section in a Thorntail mount that puts the light at 11. Even still the QD cup is so close to the mount that it is not possible to get the sling swivel in there, rendering it completely useless and still have to run a RSA.
Here is a photo of the cup that is blocked by the rail. It does not actually go all the way in but is just resting there so you can see how it hits the light mount.
http://i702.photobucket.com/albums/ww27/DMViergever/CAM00163_zpsdb8ecdee.jpg (http://s702.photobucket.com/user/DMViergever/media/CAM00163_zpsdb8ecdee.jpg.html)
When I mentioned that to them in the same conversation he informed me that he never used the furthest out QD cups on his rail and when choosing a handguard he went with a full keymod model and had a keymod sling swivel. Which means he isn't using a Fortis, which speaks volumes. He also said that they develop and design these things to fit the masses and that was the beauty of revisions and gen II models.
As much as I like the looks and ergonomics of this handguard it is honestly not what I was hoping for and left me wanting more. As nice as the guy running the phone and E-mail was some of the simple things that they could have changed would have made this particular model right from the start and knowing that function was given up for form, possibly multiple times, makes me wonder if it was given up in other areas. I don't mind answers like "We've had so much T&E with a lot of different sectors and departments that this was the general consensus" but at least provide a reason or why it would function better instead of a white washed generally bland answer.
In the end if you want a easy to install handguard with a pinned FSB I believe you will be waiting for a revised model. If cutouts aren't your thing and you run a low profile gas block then this may be a perfect option for you if the function problems I mentioned don't bother you.
I realize that with my chosen set up there tends to be some give and take but in the mean time I will keep running the Rev Car9 as I prefer it to the Samson and hope one of these days a good company makes a version with function over form in mind.
http://i702.photobucket.com/albums/ww27/DMViergever/CAM00162_zpsd3621a74.jpg (http://s702.photobucket.com/user/DMViergever/media/CAM00162_zpsd3621a74.jpg.html)
I wasn't sure how well it would work on my rifle since I ran a pinned gas block so I made sure to call Fortis and was told it would work perfectly so I ordered one immediately. Rainier had it to my door a couple days later. As soon as I opened the box I was pretty stoked, these things look even better in person than they do in photos and the ergonomics are awesome. I already had my gas block pulled and upper waiting for this so I figured a couple minutes and I would be up running. I was wrong.
I will start by saying that the way these mount to the barrel nut is great and I always like using the standard barrel nut. What wasn't so awesome has to do with the way Fortis designed the front of the rail in the area where pins are driven. One side (ejection side) is cut out perfectly and that is the side that you drive the pins out from on my rifle. The bolt catch side is cut so that it completely blocks the pins and that causes you to have to remove the bottom part of the rail at the barrel nut and lift the rail and pull the bottom of the rail down and drive the front through the QD hole. The rear pin is blocked by one of the diagonally running pieces from the 9 O'clock rail. My rail has a large decent size groove from the pin going in twice and coming out once and has some dings where the punch slipped off. The part that is dinged up is pretty thin so be careful not to snap it The other down side to have the handguard loose is that it rubs the upper if you do not watch it. If I didn't run my stuff hard anyways I would be angry about this. When I contacted Fortis, knowing this was a new design and all, they told me that it was a situation where the graphic artists beat out the engineers and they knew this was an issue and it may be changed on the next version. This was the same person who told me it was designed to work with pinned FSB's. If you don't have pins it is a breeze to install, otherwise it is a pain.
Here is the side that is cut properly.
http://i702.photobucket.com/albums/ww27/DMViergever/CAM00168_zpsbdc9d32a.jpg (http://s702.photobucket.com/user/DMViergever/media/CAM00168_zpsbdc9d32a.jpg.html)
Here is the other side that is scarred up from the punch, you can also see the divot where the pin made a groove.
http://i702.photobucket.com/albums/ww27/DMViergever/CAM00166_zps8d81ee6e.jpg (http://s702.photobucket.com/user/DMViergever/media/CAM00166_zps8d81ee6e.jpg.html)
This is where it rubbed the upper during install.
http://i702.photobucket.com/albums/ww27/DMViergever/CAM00165_zpsd322191d.jpg (http://s702.photobucket.com/user/DMViergever/media/CAM00165_zpsd322191d.jpg.html)
As far as general use and ergonomics go it is ok. The feel in the hand is awesome and handled great and was very comfortable both with and without gloves in the recent advanced carbine class I took.
The cut off height where it is cleared for a gas block or front sight is perfect. It isn't too high or low and allowed for easy adjustment of the piston system, this was one thing I wasn't crazy about with the Evo, especially when wearing gloves. I don't mind the continuous lower rail on this handguard although that has been a complaint by others who have ran my rifle. What I don't like is that they do keymod all along the side except for out at the end where you are actually most likely to attach something. Out there they decided to but about two inches of rail at the 6 and 9 with a QD cup at the very end.
The QD cups are an awesome touch and there are a total of four. One on each side of the handguard right by the upper receiver and then one on each side at the end of the rail sections. All 4 are anti rotation, which is again a good touch. Where I feel they went wrong is putting a QD cup in front of a rail section. This means if you decide to mount a light at either of those points and want to run your 2pt sling at the end it blocks your light...if you can even access the cup. I run a 6PX Tactical on the rail section in a Thorntail mount that puts the light at 11. Even still the QD cup is so close to the mount that it is not possible to get the sling swivel in there, rendering it completely useless and still have to run a RSA.
Here is a photo of the cup that is blocked by the rail. It does not actually go all the way in but is just resting there so you can see how it hits the light mount.
http://i702.photobucket.com/albums/ww27/DMViergever/CAM00163_zpsdb8ecdee.jpg (http://s702.photobucket.com/user/DMViergever/media/CAM00163_zpsdb8ecdee.jpg.html)
When I mentioned that to them in the same conversation he informed me that he never used the furthest out QD cups on his rail and when choosing a handguard he went with a full keymod model and had a keymod sling swivel. Which means he isn't using a Fortis, which speaks volumes. He also said that they develop and design these things to fit the masses and that was the beauty of revisions and gen II models.
As much as I like the looks and ergonomics of this handguard it is honestly not what I was hoping for and left me wanting more. As nice as the guy running the phone and E-mail was some of the simple things that they could have changed would have made this particular model right from the start and knowing that function was given up for form, possibly multiple times, makes me wonder if it was given up in other areas. I don't mind answers like "We've had so much T&E with a lot of different sectors and departments that this was the general consensus" but at least provide a reason or why it would function better instead of a white washed generally bland answer.
In the end if you want a easy to install handguard with a pinned FSB I believe you will be waiting for a revised model. If cutouts aren't your thing and you run a low profile gas block then this may be a perfect option for you if the function problems I mentioned don't bother you.
I realize that with my chosen set up there tends to be some give and take but in the mean time I will keep running the Rev Car9 as I prefer it to the Samson and hope one of these days a good company makes a version with function over form in mind.
http://i702.photobucket.com/albums/ww27/DMViergever/CAM00162_zpsd3621a74.jpg (http://s702.photobucket.com/user/DMViergever/media/CAM00162_zpsd3621a74.jpg.html)